(02-23-2018 12:53 PM)ericsrevenge76 Wrote:  for the consequences of the free choice you made.

There is no choice to make. I didn't make a choice not to believe in the same way I do not believe there's a dragon standing next to me and I don't think about the fact that there's no Allah and I don't think about the fact that I don't have four arms nor own a lightsabre. I just don't have any need to have a rigorous, fully-developed intellectual framework for not believing in things that I don't see any evidence for.

Sorry if I think someone else's nonsense is nonsense, but whether dragons or Jesus, nonsense is still nonsense. I find religion interesting and those following are deserving of some level of respect, but if I told you the that we didn't land on the moon, you'd likely have no problem snickering at that notion.

(02-23-2018 12:53 PM)ericsrevenge76 Wrote:  

(02-23-2018 12:35 PM)Lord Stanley Wrote:  

(02-23-2018 12:28 PM)umbluegray Wrote:  For those who waited until after death to fall to their knees and confess while in judgement, they'll hear, "Depart from Me. I never knew you."

Still doesn't seem like the nice loving guy ya'll want us to believe.

He's offering you eternal life and salvation as a FREE GIFT, just for genuinely believing in and putting your faith in Christ.

Sounds like an incredibly merciful Creator to me.

You want to reject His FREE GIFT of eternal life, but blame Him for the consequences of the free choice you made.

They want their cake and eat it too. Look, as an example, me. I am a sinful man. Every day sin is my drug. I have to fight it like people who want to stop doing drugs. I am thankful that EVEN THOUGH I still sin at least I KNOW that Jesus has given me a way out by FORGIVING my sins. I know God is real and I know that there is justice in Him. You can't break our earthly rules and get away with it so what makes you think that God because He is good will allow you to break His rules and still get away with it. That's why the Bible tells us that God is justice and we will see it at our death.

Remember one very important fact. God gives us FREE WILL. What we do with it is up to us. You can't blame God for what WE do. That's just being like the petulant child who throws a tantrum because his parents won't give in to his every whim.

(02-23-2018 12:35 PM)Lord Stanley Wrote:  

(02-23-2018 12:28 PM)umbluegray Wrote:  For those who waited until after death to fall to their knees and confess while in judgement, they'll hear, "Depart from Me. I never knew you."

Still doesn't seem like the nice loving guy ya'll want us to believe.

He stepped out of eternity into humanity as a sacrifice to take on everyone's guilt as an offer of absolution only asking each person accept that gift of absolution freely.

And you don't think He's a nice guy?

Hmm... interesting.

(02-23-2018 01:15 PM)Old Dominion Wrote:  You guys are a trip. Punishment? for what? hell a literal place where people go to burn?? Come on people. If you can't let yourself see these are metaphors I feel for you.

Jesus death and resurrection was a metaphor for all of us. We all have eternal life. There's no Pearly Gates, no angels with harps, no burning in hell. We don't live our lives just to obtain some cosmic award. There are no winners and losers.

Again, a very immature level of understanding, based on a child's view of life. Be good, get a cookie, be bad, go to bed without dessert. This is not a contest to try and make God pleased with us.

You are loved, completely and without conditions. Nothing you can do will ever change that. and the Creator did not and does not now require a blood sacrifice to buy our way into "heaven".

That's a really scary thought when you consider the implications in society if everyone adopted this belief.

So a mass murderer escapes punishment and is rewarded the same as Mother Theresa.


And people wonder why there's evil in the world?

Live for yourself for tomorrow you die!

By the Bibles definition anyone who tries to make you believe that God does not exist is an anti-Christ. So by definition if this "wise" man is trying to influence you not to believe in God then he is evil. See, evil does exist and if there is evil then it's common sensical that there is good. There is always an opposite to everything like the magnetic pull and push.

When someone is so intent on not believing sometimes not even having Jesus appearance would not faze them. Those people would blame it on something else, a drug for instance, not sleeping well the night before, etc.

(02-23-2018 01:24 PM)Lord Stanley Wrote:  

(02-23-2018 12:53 PM)ericsrevenge76 Wrote:  for the consequences of the free choice you made.

There is no choice to make. I didn't make a choice not to believe in the same way I do not believe there's a dragon standing next to me and I don't think about the fact that there's no Allah and I don't think about the fact that I don't have four arms nor own a lightsabre. I just don't have any need to have a rigorous, fully-developed intellectual framework for not believing in things that I don't see any evidence for.

Sorry if I think someone else's nonsense is nonsense, but whether dragons or Jesus, nonsense is still nonsense. I find religion interesting and those following are deserving of some level of respect, but if I told you the that we didn't land on the moon, you'd likely have no problem snickering at that notion.

You can deny the sun rises in the east tomorrow, but the fact is when the hour rolls around it will rise in the east.

You can't wish judgement day away, and you can't wish God away.

Explain how the bible so perfectly predicted 2000+ years of history concerning the church age, Christ, the fall of Israel in 70 AD the return of modern Israel nearly 2000 years later in such stunning detail and accuracy, and why hasn't any other religion been able to do anything even remotely similar to that of its no big deal?

Can you give me another example of a nation that was totally destroyed and the survivors scatter into all nations across the earth for 2000 years, then return to the same land as a nation 2000 years later and flourish into a powerful and prosperous nation in the region?

Including one in which ALL of this was predicted in grand detail many centuries before it ever came to pass?

(02-23-2018 01:37 PM)olliebaba Wrote:  By the Bibles definition anyone who tries to make you believe that God does not exist is an anti-Christ. So by definition if this "wise" man is trying to influence you not to believe in God then he is evil. See, evil does exist and if there is evil then it's common sensical that there is good. There is always an opposite to everything like the magnetic pull and push.

When someone is so intent on not believing sometimes not even having Jesus appearance would not faze them. Those people would blame it on something else, a drug for instance, not sleeping well the night before, etc.

Well said

(02-23-2018 01:26 PM)umbluegray Wrote:  He stepped out of eternity into humanity as a sacrifice to take on everyone's guilt as an offer of absolution only asking each person accept that gift of absolution freely.

And you don't think He's a nice guy?

Yes, seems like a nice thing to do. But if I don't believe I get eternal damnation? Not such a nice guy thing to do.

Surely you see the dichotomy here?

(02-23-2018 01:48 PM)Lord Stanley Wrote:  

(02-23-2018 01:26 PM)umbluegray Wrote:  He stepped out of eternity into humanity as a sacrifice to take on everyone's guilt as an offer of absolution only asking each person accept that gift of absolution freely.

And you don't think He's a nice guy?

Yes, seems like a nice thing to do. But if I don't believe I get eternal damnation? Not such a nice guy thing to do.

Surely you see the dichotomy here?

Okay, so don't believe. God can play that game too. He'll tell you why would you want me to save you if I don't even exist?

Too bad, so sad, so late.

The bottom line is, everybody gets what they want. If you don't want to believe in God, then in death you will be totally separated from God. If you want to believe in God and accept Jesus Christ as your savior, then you get to spend eternity with him. Everybody gets what they want.

(02-23-2018 01:48 PM)Lord Stanley Wrote:  

(02-23-2018 01:26 PM)umbluegray Wrote:  He stepped out of eternity into humanity as a sacrifice to take on everyone's guilt as an offer of absolution only asking each person accept that gift of absolution freely.

And you don't think He's a nice guy?

Yes, seems like a nice thing to do. But if I don't believe I get eternal damnation? Not such a nice guy thing to do.

Surely you see the dichotomy here?

How selfish and stupid of a choice is it to not believe in the end?

You are being offered Life everlasting in an immortal, incorruptible body. Eternity as a literal God, as a Son of God. No more pain, death, suffering, unhappiness, only everlasting Joy and peace.

Option B is eternal damnation?



This is not a difficult choice.

(02-23-2018 01:53 PM)ericsrevenge76 Wrote:  

(02-23-2018 01:48 PM)Lord Stanley Wrote:  

(02-23-2018 01:26 PM)umbluegray Wrote:  He stepped out of eternity into humanity as a sacrifice to take on everyone's guilt as an offer of absolution only asking each person accept that gift of absolution freely.

And you don't think He's a nice guy?

Yes, seems like a nice thing to do. But if I don't believe I get eternal damnation? Not such a nice guy thing to do.

Surely you see the dichotomy here?

How selfish and stupid of a choice is it to not believe in the end?

You are being offered Life everlasting in an immortal, incorruptible body. Eternity as a literal God, as a Son of God.

Option B is eternal damnation?

This is not a difficult choice.

It is if you think the total sum of your existence consists of 75 to 85 years on this planet. It's not a difficult choice if you believe in eternity.

(02-23-2018 01:53 PM)geosnooker2000 Wrote:  The bottom line is, everybody gets what they want. If you don't want to believe in God, then in death you will be totally separated from God. If you want to believe in God and accept Jesus Christ as your savior, then you get to spend eternity with him. Everybody gets what they want.

Plain & simple TRUTH.

He gives us what we want in the end.

(02-23-2018 01:57 PM)ericsrevenge76 Wrote:  

(02-23-2018 01:53 PM)geosnooker2000 Wrote:  The bottom line is, everybody gets what they want. If you don't want to believe in God, then in death you will be totally separated from God. If you want to believe in God and accept Jesus Christ as your savior, then you get to spend eternity with him. Everybody gets what they want.

Plain & simple TRUTH.

He gives us what we want in the end.

What about the confused masses that don't know what they want?

(02-23-2018 01:39 PM)ericsrevenge76 Wrote:  

(02-23-2018 01:24 PM)Lord Stanley Wrote:  

(02-23-2018 12:53 PM)ericsrevenge76 Wrote:  for the consequences of the free choice you made.

There is no choice to make. I didn't make a choice not to believe in the same way I do not believe there's a dragon standing next to me and I don't think about the fact that there's no Allah and I don't think about the fact that I don't have four arms nor own a lightsabre. I just don't have any need to have a rigorous, fully-developed intellectual framework for not believing in things that I don't see any evidence for.

Sorry if I think someone else's nonsense is nonsense, but whether dragons or Jesus, nonsense is still nonsense. I find religion interesting and those following are deserving of some level of respect, but if I told you the that we didn't land on the moon, you'd likely have no problem snickering at that notion.

You can deny the sun rises in the east tomorrow, but the fact is when the hour rolls around it will rise in the east.

You can't wish judgement day away, and you can't wish God away.

Explain how the bible so perfectly predicted 2000+ years of history concerning the church age, Christ, the fall of Israel in 70 AD the return of modern Israel nearly 2000 years later in such stunning detail and accuracy, and why hasn't any other religion been able to do anything even remotely similar to that of its no big deal?

Can you give me another example of a nation that was totally destroyed and the survivors scatter into all nations across the earth for 2000 years, then return to the same land as a nation 2000 years later and flourish into a powerful and prosperous nation in the region?

Including one in which ALL of this was predicted in grand detail many centuries before it ever came to pass?

Self-fulfilling prophecy.

(02-23-2018 01:53 PM)ericsrevenge76 Wrote:  

(02-23-2018 01:48 PM)Lord Stanley Wrote:  

(02-23-2018 01:26 PM)umbluegray Wrote:  He stepped out of eternity into humanity as a sacrifice to take on everyone's guilt as an offer of absolution only asking each person accept that gift of absolution freely.

And you don't think He's a nice guy?

Yes, seems like a nice thing to do. But if I don't believe I get eternal damnation? Not such a nice guy thing to do.

Surely you see the dichotomy here?

How selfish and stupid of a choice is it to not believe in the end?

You are being offered Life everlasting in an immortal, incorruptible body. Eternity as a literal God, as a Son of God. No more pain, death, suffering, unhappiness, only everlasting Joy and peace.

Option B is eternal damnation?



This is not a difficult choice.

God TRULY offers you what the Democrats do, a Utopia. But, God does come through in His promises.

(02-23-2018 01:39 PM)ericsrevenge76 Wrote:  

(02-23-2018 02:00 PM)NIU007 Wrote:  You can deny the sun rises in the east tomorrow, but the fact is when the hour rolls around it will rise in the east.

You can't wish judgement day away, and you can't wish God away.

Explain how the bible so perfectly predicted 2000+ years of history concerning the church age, Christ, the fall of Israel in 70 AD the return of modern Israel nearly 2000 years later in such stunning detail and accuracy, and why hasn't any other religion been able to do anything even remotely similar to that of its no big deal?

Can you give me another example of a nation that was totally destroyed and the survivors scatter into all nations across the earth for 2000 years, then return to the same land as a nation 2000 years later and flourish into a powerful and prosperous nation in the region?

Including one in which ALL of this was predicted in grand detail many centuries before it ever came to pass?

Self-fulfilling prophecy.

NOPE

The United Nations created the modern state of Israel, which is exactly what the OT prophets said would happen. GENTILE nations would reform the nation and help transport many of the Jews back there after a near 2000 year diaspora across the earth.

Exactly what happened following the holocaust of WW2.

Some 2600+ years after it was predicted in the OT.

(02-23-2018 01:48 PM)Lord Stanley Wrote:  

(02-23-2018 01:26 PM)umbluegray Wrote:  He stepped out of eternity into humanity as a sacrifice to take on everyone's guilt as an offer of absolution only asking each person accept that gift of absolution freely.

And you don't think He's a nice guy?

Yes, seems like a nice thing to do. But if I don't believe I get eternal damnation? Not such a nice guy thing to do.

Surely you see the dichotomy here?

Actually, I see false dichotomy.

If I force somebody to do something the accountability lies with me. Free will means the accountability lies with the individual who made the choice.

If you get angry and drive your car into the side of your house that has nothing to do with me.

However, if I offered to pay to have your car and house fixed, then I don't see why you would consider me to be a bad guy.

(02-23-2018 01:39 PM)ericsrevenge76 Wrote:  Explain how the bible so perfectly predicted 2000+ years of history concerning the church age, Christ, the fall of Israel in 70 AD the return of modern Israel nearly 2000 years later in such stunning detail and accuracy, and why hasn't any other religion been able to do anything even remotely similar to that of its no big deal?

Your evidence of perfect predictions is based on remarkably selective readings, biased interpretations, and looking for sentences to fit your desire. You believe in scripture and place value in the words because your already believe in the religious principles the text describes!

(02-23-2018 02:07 PM)umbluegray Wrote:  

(02-23-2018 01:48 PM)Lord Stanley Wrote:  

(02-23-2018 01:26 PM)umbluegray Wrote:  He stepped out of eternity into humanity as a sacrifice to take on everyone's guilt as an offer of absolution only asking each person accept that gift of absolution freely.

And you don't think He's a nice guy?

Yes, seems like a nice thing to do. But if I don't believe I get eternal damnation? Not such a nice guy thing to do.

Surely you see the dichotomy here?

Actually, I see false dichotomy.

If I force somebody to do something the accountability lies with me. Free will means the accountability lies with the individual who made the choice.

If you get angry and drive your car into the side of your house that has nothing to do with me.

However, if I offered to pay to have your car and house fixed, then I don't see why you would consider me to be a bad guy.

I think the analogy would be more appropriate if your offer was "I'll fix the house for you if you ask, but if not I'll burn it down."