The core problem with our budget goes beyond our politicians, it's our people. We're so accustomed to the federal government being a part of our lives that a large proportion of our populace don't give a crap if they're heavily involved as long as they feel good; even the people who identify as 'fiscally conservative' in surveys mostly end up flipping when you ask them if they want to cut SS, Medicare, the military, etc. Politicians are SOBs, but unfortunately we've made it impossible for them to survive in DC if they ever laid a finger on any entitlement; only when we're willing to make cuts will they actually happen, and that won't occur until we're in dire straights and we're forced to.

(02-11-2018 10:22 PM)Love and Honor Wrote:  The core problem with our budget goes beyond our politicians, it's our people. We're so accustomed to the federal government being a part of our lives that a large proportion of our populace don't give a crap if they're heavily involved as long as they feel good; even the people who identify as 'fiscally conservative' in surveys mostly end up flipping when you ask them if they want to cut SS, Medicare, the military, etc. Politicians are SOBs, but unfortunately we've made it impossible for them to survive in DC if they ever laid a finger on any entitlement; only when we're willing to make cuts will they actually happen, and that won't occur until we're in dire straights and we're forced to.

and why would that be.....

you can only ride the numbers and the gravy train for so long.....

so yes, one day tough decisions will be made one way or the other.....

you either force deflation in certain sectors or start killing people once the USD becomes a BB rated entity.....

it doesn't matter if one can't handle reality......reality is a constant that has many a variable at OUR CURRENT CONTROL AND DISPOSAL......it's simply a matter of which path is chosen moving forward....

time is the only thing that will yield the end result......

#focusisalmostlost

#henceDJT

(02-10-2018 01:03 PM)Old Dominion Wrote:  Seems your the one with the platitudes and talking points.

Address my question please. Are you consistent in your disdain for government interference in our private lives? Or do you only object when you disagree with the situation at hand?

Oh, yes. Bigly.

No one needs to tell me what to eat, what size soda I can drink, what sport my kids can play, where he or she MUST attend a school, what hospital I have to report to, what Doctor I prefer for myself, wife or children, whether I can fish in my pond or in my Mothers lake, where I can walk my dog, who I prefer to assemble and associate with. perhaps a million other things.

You have any objection to being directed on any of that?

If not, great. Welcome aboard.

if so, yea part of the problem.

(02-11-2018 01:39 PM)Old Dominion Wrote:  

(02-11-2018 12:59 PM)Owl 69/70/75 Wrote:  

(02-11-2018 11:25 AM)Old Dominion Wrote:  Here's the problem with some people. They can't let go of the past long enough to see times are changing. The dollar aint worth what it used to be overseas. China is catching up if not equal to us in economic power. As someone else pointed out, Romans used mercenaries. Guess who else uses mercenaries?
You can't just assume because we've been on top for a few hundred years that it's destined to last. I'm not at all convinced isolationism is the way to go. The Chinese built their great wall to keep invaders out, much likes Trumps ill conceived hoped for wall, and all it did was put them a few thousand years behind the rest of the world.
The macho man "squeeze 'em by the balls" attitude probably makes folks feel good, but I sincerely doubt it's a long term answer.

The solution to the weakening dollar is to balance the federal budget and curtail the actions of the Fed. I’ve already laid out my proposed approach.

I’m definitely opposed to isolation, but I’m a believer in non-intervention. Here’s the difference: North Korea is isolationist, Switzerland is non-interventionist. Speak softly but carry a big stick. Maintain the strongest military in the world, by miles and miles, and never use it because nobody dares pick a fight with us, and we don’t go picking on them. Never fight a war that you don’t intend to win.

The problem with that is unwinding the commitment we made to protect the world’s trade routes at Bretton Woods 70 years ago. We took the lead in fighting the Cold War, but nobody planned what to do after we won. I think Trump is spot on asking Europe to bear more of the NATO burden. Another factor that I think could help is closer alliance with the British Commonwealth. Brexit is at least in part an approach for Britain to move closer to Commonwealth countries. There is a proposal for the Commonwealth countries to combine armed forces. Not sure how India/Pakistan would work, but if they could achieve that kind of alliance, we could transfer some responsibility to them. India is well on the way to being the strongest naval force in the Indian Ocean, which could facilitate our reducing our 5th Fleet, for example.

You obviously have given this a great deal of thought and I admit I'm not as well versed as you in foreign affairs or economics. I certainly don't have any major problems with what you propose. My question is always Why? What's holding this country back from doing what needs to be done? We piss and moan about the politicians, but we're so fractured as a nation we can't pull together as one people long enough to force the politicians to do something. It seems hopeless at times, but Maybe Trump was right. Maybe we need a true assault on our shores by an army to bring us all together. We saw signs of it after 9/11

Perhaps look inside your own response to find a solution

(02-11-2018 10:22 PM)Love and Honor Wrote:  The core problem with our budget goes beyond our politicians, it's our people. We're so accustomed to the federal government being a part of our lives that a large proportion of our populace don't give a crap if they're heavily involved as long as they feel good; even the people who identify as 'fiscally conservative' in surveys mostly end up flipping when you ask them if they want to cut SS, Medicare, the military, etc. Politicians are SOBs, but unfortunately we've made it impossible for them to survive in DC if they ever laid a finger on any entitlement; only when we're willing to make cuts will they actually happen, and that won't occur until we're in dire straights and we're forced to.

A lot of this is because we haven't rethought our conceptual approach, just added more and more focused programs to address this problem or that problem, and the the debate centers on whether to spend more or less on each one.

I'm talking about a totally different conceptual approach. We put a safety net out there for everybody and that's it. We don't go trying to micromanage every individual situation, and we don't need the army of bureaucrats to administer them. You get $X from the government. If you need more than $X to live, you get a job. If you're happy living on $X, you don't. And $X is enough to keep you alive at a subsistence level, but you're still poor until you get that job. And when you get that job, or a promotion or a raise, that $X doesn't go away. So there's no "poverty trap" disincentive for you not to get the job, or promotion, or raise.

Winners under this approach: Poor people who don't want to stay poor, and taxpayers who have been paying the cost of the over bloated bureaucracies.
Losers: Poor people who have manipulated the system, and the bureaucrats who have enabled them.

(02-12-2018 06:29 AM)Owl 69/70/75 Wrote:  

(02-11-2018 10:22 PM)Love and Honor Wrote:  The core problem with our budget goes beyond our politicians, it's our people. We're so accustomed to the federal government being a part of our lives that a large proportion of our populace don't give a crap if they're heavily involved as long as they feel good; even the people who identify as 'fiscally conservative' in surveys mostly end up flipping when you ask them if they want to cut SS, Medicare, the military, etc. Politicians are SOBs, but unfortunately we've made it impossible for them to survive in DC if they ever laid a finger on any entitlement; only when we're willing to make cuts will they actually happen, and that won't occur until we're in dire straights and we're forced to.

A lot of this is because we haven't rethought our conceptual approach, just added more and more focused programs to address this problem or that problem, and the the debate centers on whether to spend more or less on each one.

I'm talking about a totally different conceptual approach. We put a safety net out there for everybody and that's it. We don't go trying to micromanage every individual situation, and we don't need the army of bureaucrats to administer them. You get $X from the government. If you need more than $X to live, you get a job. If you're happy living on $X, you don't. And $X is enough to keep you alive at a subsistence level, but you're still poor until you get that job. And when you get that job, or a promotion or a raise, that $X doesn't go away. So there's no "poverty trap" disincentive for you to get the job, or promotion, or raise.

Winners under this approach: Poor people who don't want to stay poor, and taxpayers who have been paying the cost of the over bloated bureaucracies.
Losers: Poor people who have manipulated the system, and the bureaucrats who have enabled them.

Very few good people want to be politicians. So we've got incompetent, corrupt or just downright evil people running the country.

OD, don't lecture me on the Constitution. I, as well as oldsters like Owl went to (grammar and high) school at a time when we were REQUIRED to learn about government. We were quizzed on how many seats in Congress and Senate and the people that sat on them. Today as I hear it kids which I'm sure you're one of them (millennials) who don't even know who our vice president is. I'm aware that there is such a thing as amendments and they through time have been altered but if being aware of the Bible and that it says that not one word of the Bible can/should be changed is also truth. In reality: It's. Very. Simple.

It seems to me that the Libturds who post on this forum "think" that they're the smartest people in the world even though most of you have just graduated from college, (or living with mommy and daddy) if at all. In the words of Einstein, "you ain't all that".

I can't help but think I'm really hitting a nerve with some of you. I wonder why? If I'm so far off base why don't you just ignore me? I suspect it's because you know I'm right more often than wrong. Why so intolerant? Are you scarred?

(02-12-2018 03:49 PM)olliebaba Wrote:  OD, don't lecture me on the Constitution. I, as well as oldsters like Owl went to (grammar and high) school at a time when we were REQUIRED to learn about government. We were quizzed on how many seats in Congress and Senate and the people that sat on them. Today as I hear it kids which I'm sure you're one of them (millennials) who don't even know who our vice president is. I'm aware that there is such a thing as amendments and they through time have been altered but if being aware of the Bible and that it says that not one word of the Bible can/should be changed is also truth. In reality: It's. Very. Simple.

It seems to me that the Libturds who post on this forum "think" that they're the smartest people in the world even though most of you have just graduated from college, (or living with mommy and daddy) if at all. In the words of Einstein, "you ain't all that".

(02-12-2018 04:03 PM)Old Dominion Wrote:  I can't help but think I'm really hitting a nerve with some of you. I wonder why? If I'm so far off base why don't you just ignore me? I suspect it's because you know I'm right more often than wrong. Why so intolerant? Are you scarred?

Irony.

(02-12-2018 04:03 PM)Old Dominion Wrote:  I can't help but think I'm really hitting a nerve with some of you. I wonder why? If I'm so far off base why don't you just ignore me? I suspect it's because you know I'm right more often than wrong. Why so intolerant? Are you scarred?

Nah, no nerve with me, anyway.

I primarily read your childish ramblings for entertainment value, and a good chuckle.

Don’t flatter yourself...

I agree with you folks. I don’t know what the federal government’s problem is...How dare they think they need to be involved in everything. I mean we really don’t need paved roads, stop signs/stoplights, fire departmemts, police departs, armies, laws etc.

The nerve of those people...Just let everyone do exactly what they want to do.

(02-12-2018 01:56 AM)JMUDunk Wrote:  

(02-10-2018 01:03 PM)Old Dominion Wrote:  Seems your the one with the platitudes and talking points.

Address my question please. Are you consistent in your disdain for government interference in our private lives? Or do you only object when you disagree with the situation at hand?

Oh, yes. Bigly.

No one needs to tell me what to eat, what size soda I can drink, what sport my kids can play, where he or she MUST attend a school, what hospital I have to report to, what Doctor I prefer for myself, wife or children, whether I can fish in my pond or in my Mothers lake, where I can walk my dog, who I prefer to assemble and associate with. perhaps a million other things.

You have any objection to being directed on any of that?

If not, great. Welcome aboard.

if so, yea part of the problem.

Pretty serious overstatement wouldn't you say? When people use this type of wild hyperbole it tells me they are very emotional.
If you are principled, then you should have no problem with abortion rights, correct?

(02-12-2018 04:44 PM)Bearcats#1 Wrote:  

(02-12-2018 01:56 AM)JMUDunk Wrote:  [quote='Old Dominion' pid='15063422' dateline='1518285809']
Seems your the one with the platitudes and talking points.

Address my question please. Are you consistent in your disdain for government interference in our private lives? Or do you only object when you disagree with the situation at hand?

Oh, yes. Bigly.

No one needs to tell me what to eat, what size soda I can drink, what sport my kids can play, where he or she MUST attend a school, what hospital I have to report to, what Doctor I prefer for myself, wife or children, whether I can fish in my pond or in my Mothers lake, where I can walk my dog, who I prefer to assemble and associate with. perhaps a million other things.

You have any objection to being directed on any of that?

If not, great. Welcome aboard.

if so, yea part of the problem.

Agree

I mean ‘the man’ has no need to tell me anything, brother! If I want to kill or rape somebody, who is the government to tell me I can’t do it! It’s my right as a human being to do whatever I want to do, In fact Jesus telled me this hisself.

(02-12-2018 04:39 PM)Bearcats#1 Wrote:  I agree with you folks. I don’t know what the federal government’s problem is...How dare they think they need to be involved in everything. I mean we really don’t need paved roads, stop signs/stoplights, fire departmemts, police departs, armies, laws etc.

The nerve of those people...Just let everyone do exactly what they want to do.

Yea, and aside from "armies" whatever that is, ALL those functions are much better well addressed at the State and local levels.

I don't need some nameless, faceless, unelected, unaccountable bureaucrat in DeeCee telling me where I can and can't build my fence. Nor does the V-DOT need some Fed dictating what pothole to fix next and when.

You know the McMaryland and Va. suburbs of DC are the some of the wealthiest in the entire nation? Something like 7 or 8 of the wealthiest 12 in the Country. Now how's that?

You know who's paying that fat fare?

You and me. Not good.

(02-12-2018 04:41 PM)Old Dominion Wrote:  

(02-12-2018 01:56 AM)JMUDunk Wrote:  

(02-10-2018 01:03 PM)Old Dominion Wrote:  Seems your the one with the platitudes and talking points.

Address my question please. Are you consistent in your disdain for government interference in our private lives? Or do you only object when you disagree with the situation at hand?

Oh, yes. Bigly.

No one needs to tell me what to eat, what size soda I can drink, what sport my kids can play, where he or she MUST attend a school, what hospital I have to report to, what Doctor I prefer for myself, wife or children, whether I can fish in my pond or in my Mothers lake, where I can walk my dog, who I prefer to assemble and associate with. perhaps a million other things.

You have any objection to being directed on any of that?

If not, great. Welcome aboard.

if so, yea part of the problem.

Pretty serious overstatement wouldn't you say? When people use this type of wild hyperbole it tells me they are very emotional.
If you are principled, then you should have no problem with abortion rights, correct?

More juvenile platitudes. Which part of the bolded above is "emotional", or hyperbole? You don't think those things happen, everyday all across this Country?


Specifically, which of the above do you claim as "overstatement"? How many properties or encounters with Federal Do-Gooders have you ever experienced?
What Federal program or Agency was Sooooo wildly successful that it was eventually ended and/or disbanded entirely? Just one?

(02-12-2018 04:45 PM)Bearcats#1 Wrote:  

(02-12-2018 04:44 PM)Bearcats#1 Wrote:  

(02-12-2018 01:56 AM)JMUDunk Wrote:  [quote='Old Dominion' pid='15063422' dateline='1518285809']
Seems your the one with the platitudes and talking points.

Address my question please. Are you consistent in your disdain for government interference in our private lives? Or do you only object when you disagree with the situation at hand?

Oh, yes. Bigly.

No one needs to tell me what to eat, what size soda I can drink, what sport my kids can play, where he or she MUST attend a school, what hospital I have to report to, what Doctor I prefer for myself, wife or children, whether I can fish in my pond or in my Mothers lake, where I can walk my dog, who I prefer to assemble and associate with. perhaps a million other things.

You have any objection to being directed on any of that?

If not, great. Welcome aboard.

if so, yea part of the problem.

Agree

I mean ‘the man’ has no need to tell me anything, brother! If I want to kill or rape somebody, who is the government to tell me I can’t do it! It’s my right as a human being to do whatever I want to do, In fact Jesus telled me this hisself.

What on earth are you babbling about? Kill? Rape?!? What the F%^$ is wrong with you? Who said anything about Jesus? Is he your Hispanic neighbor or something?

You went from roads and Fire Departments to full retard in one short post.

Why not just go back to your finger pointing and race baiting?

(02-12-2018 04:39 PM)Bearcats#1 Wrote:  I agree with you folks. I don’t know what the federal government’s problem is...How dare they think they need to be involved in everything. I mean we really don’t need paved roads, stop signs/stoplights, fire departmemts, police departs, armies, laws etc.

Hey look at that kids! a reductio ad absurdum...

That's right... No state or county is capable of paving a road, or putting up a stop sign. That's the kind of thing you need Washington for!

And all those federal fire / police departments are totally needed! Wait where are they now?

That's right kids. If you don't want to hand all power to Washington then you hate law, all law..

(02-12-2018 04:45 PM)Bearcats#1 Wrote:  I mean ‘the man’ has no need to tell me anything, brother! If I want to kill or rape somebody,

Hey even more.... reductio ad absurdum let me get the popcorn out before he compares "wanting a very limited federal government" to Somolia... It's where the lefties usually goes.

Quote:In fact Jesus telled me this hisself.

And this is the very funny bart Bearcats... Most of the libertarians around here are not Christians.... But yup, got to get that dig in at people of faith and present the case that wanting a small government is something only believed by bucktoothed people from deliverance.

Well I see Im a big hit in here. We got off on the wrong foot fellas, really.