Pease is out as OC (confirmed by UTEP) and rumor is that Brian Natkin, TE coach, will call plays. Announcement tomorrow during coach Kuglers regular noon presser. No run game so far by a team that is run oriented. Desperate move by desperate head coach.
I respect UTEP, that's a proud program and fanbase but every year I look at recruiting rankings UTEP is dead last and has single digit commits late in the recruiting cycle. Quality athletes just aren't attracted to El Paso. It's tough to build a consistent winner that way--for any coach not just Kugler. That's probably why I respect y'all, in general (excluding outliers like Jones or Hernandez) y'all land lower level athletes than the rest of CUSA but have still kicked our ass a couple of times and have had some respectable seasons.
(09-17-2017 03:11 PM)correcamino Wrote: I respect UTEP, that's a proud program and fanbase but every year I look at recruiting rankings UTEP is dead last and has single digit commits late in the recruiting cycle. Quality athletes just aren't attracted to El Paso. It's tough to build a consistent winner that way--for any coach not just Kugler. That's probably why I respect y'all, in general (excluding outliers like Jones or Hernandez) y'all land lower level athletes than the rest of CUSA but have still kicked our ass a couple of times and have had some respectable seasons.
Recruiting is tougher for UTEP due to distance from Texas and California recruiting areas. If you are a good FB player in the Dallas or Houston area, you have multiple choices close to home. Why go to school several hundred miles away. IMO, for UTEP to compete it will have to be innovative in style of offense or recruiting method. Wyoming is located in a hard to get to place but stays competitive and there are other examples. UTEP may need to do what the service academies do and run a form of the option. Something not seen every weekend. Another problem currently is that Kugler was never a head coach and really had no business getting the job. Stull used to coach him and that was enough to hire him even though he was always an O-line coach. 5 years down the drain.
(09-17-2017 04:07 PM)MinerInWisconsin Wrote: UTEP may need to do what the service academies do and run a form of the option.
There is a reason that only 6 programs run the option in IA, GA Tech, Army, Navy, Air Force, GA Southen and Kent State. In IA the DLines. LBs, CBs, and Safeties are all faster. Unless you get exceptional RBs, an option QB and great OLine you won't do well.
Marshall played Kent last night and they run a form of the option that doesn't mind throwing it at times. They had a total of 261 yards of total offense. 117 yards passing and 144 yards rushing.
Also GA Southern 0-2 are finding out its hard sledding as an option team in IA. They were only 5-7 last year.
(09-17-2017 04:07 PM)MinerInWisconsin Wrote: UTEP may need to do what the service academies do and run a form of the option.
There is a reason that only 6 programs run the option in IA, GA Tech, Army, Navy, Air Force, GA Southen and Kent State. In IA the DLines. LBs, CBs, and Safeties are all faster. Unless you get exceptional RBs, an option QB and great OLine you won't do well.
Marshall played Kent last night and they run a form of the option that doesn't mind throwing it at times. They had a total of 261 yards of total offense. 117 yards passing and 144 yards rushing.
Also GA Southern 0-2 are finding out its hard sledding as an option team in IA. They were only 5-7 last year.
GA Southern, UNM, Kent St, and Air Force all run it out of the shotgun.
GA Tech, Army, and Navy all run it from under center.
(09-17-2017 04:07 PM)MinerInWisconsin Wrote: UTEP may need to do what the service academies do and run a form of the option.
There is a reason that only 6 programs run the option in IA, GA Tech, Army, Navy, Air Force, GA Southen and Kent State. In IA the DLines. LBs, CBs, and Safeties are all faster. Unless you get exceptional RBs, an option QB and great OLine you won't do well.
Marshall played Kent last night and they run a form of the option that doesn't mind throwing it at times. They had a total of 261 yards of total offense. 117 yards passing and 144 yards rushing.
Also GA Southern 0-2 are finding out its hard sledding as an option team in IA. They were only 5-7 last year.
Georgia Southern may be a bad example to use here.
They went 10-3 and 9-4 their first two years in the Sun Belt. They've gone 5-9 since then because their goon for a head coach that arrived in 2016 tried to change the offense and get rid of the triple option, which they've run for decades. He took a lot of heat for it after last season, and he hired a guy from Georgia Tech as OC to bring the triple option back. The damage has already been done though.
(09-17-2017 08:56 PM)ExcitedOwl18 Wrote: GA Southern, UNM, Kent St, and Air Force all run it out of the shotgun.
GA Tech, Army, and Navy all run it from under center.
People think its easy to recruit players into an option system. They think you just recruit athletes and plug them in where you want them. At the IAA and DII level you may be able to do that. At the IA level not so much. For the most part of IA the DLines are bigger and stronger also the LBs, CBs, Safeties are much faster and usually can run side to side. Therefore the gap coverages are a lot better.
Kent State had 2 bigger pass plays than they did runs on us yesterday. During the whole game they only had 144 yards rushing. A true option team should be able to run 350-400 yards on an even matched day.
The best option QB outside of Navys Keenan Reynolds that Ive seen in the last 10 years didn't even play in an option program in college. And that is Blake Frohnapel who played behind Rakeem Cato then transferred to UMass and played for 2 years. Blake played in a Wing T option in HS where in 3 years he only threw the ball 22 times. But the thing is Blake could sling the ball to anyone when ask to.
(09-17-2017 04:07 PM)MinerInWisconsin Wrote: UTEP may need to do what the service academies do and run a form of the option.
There is a reason that only 6 programs run the option in IA, GA Tech, Army, Navy, Air Force, GA Southen and Kent State. In IA the DLines. LBs, CBs, and Safeties are all faster. Unless you get exceptional RBs, an option QB and great OLine you won't do well.
Marshall played Kent last night and they run a form of the option that doesn't mind throwing it at times. They had a total of 261 yards of total offense. 117 yards passing and 144 yards rushing.
Also GA Southern 0-2 are finding out its hard sledding as an option team in IA. They were only 5-7 last year.
Georgia Southern may be a bad example to use here.
They went 10-3 and 9-4 their first two years in the Sun Belt. They've gone 5-9 since then because their goon for a head coach that arrived in 2016 tried to change the offense and get rid of the triple option, which they've run for decades. He took a lot of heat for it after last season, and he hired a guy from Georgia Tech as OC to bring the triple option back. The damage has already been done though.
This is half true.
Fritz ran the option out of the gun (who was the coach for the 10-3 and 9-4 seasons), which is somewhat different than the Erk/PJ/Monken flexbone system. It's actually not that, that far off from what Auburn ran with Cam Newton.
The new OC at GSU is Bryan Cook, who's last job was QB/B-Back coach at GT. Prior to that, he had been OC at Cal Poly.
At Cal Poly, he ran the option of the gun. He is going back to that.
With regard to the second best QB being a person who didn't even run the option, did you catch Justin Thomas at GT from 2014-16? He lead Tech to an Orange Bowl W and a Gator Bowl Victory (with a disastrous season in between though they still beat #7 FSU that year).
(09-17-2017 04:07 PM)MinerInWisconsin Wrote: UTEP may need to do what the service academies do and run a form of the option.
There is a reason that only 6 programs run the option in IA, GA Tech, Army, Navy, Air Force, GA Southen and Kent State. In IA the DLines. LBs, CBs, and Safeties are all faster. Unless you get exceptional RBs, an option QB and great OLine you won't do well.
Marshall played Kent last night and they run a form of the option that doesn't mind throwing it at times. They had a total of 261 yards of total offense. 117 yards passing and 144 yards rushing.
Also GA Southern 0-2 are finding out its hard sledding as an option team in IA. They were only 5-7 last year.
I believe New Mexico has been very successful of late running the triple option from the shotgun, averaging 350 yards a game rushing last year.
(09-17-2017 11:30 PM)ExcitedOwl18 Wrote: With regard to the second best QB being a person who didn't even run the option, did you catch Justin Thomas at GT from 2014-16? He lead Tech to an Orange Bowl W and a Gator Bowl Victory (with a disastrous season in between though they still beat #7 FSU that year).
Paul Johnson at GT runs the option though. He is one of two coaches that are HC in IA that cut his teeth at GA Southern when they were IAA. Jeff Monken at Army is the other
(09-17-2017 11:30 PM)ExcitedOwl18 Wrote: With regard to the second best QB being a person who didn't even run the option, did you catch Justin Thomas at GT from 2014-16? He lead Tech to an Orange Bowl W and a Gator Bowl Victory (with a disastrous season in between though they still beat #7 FSU that year).
Paul Johnson at GT runs the option though. He is one of two coaches that are HC in IA that cut his teeth at GA Southern when they were IAA. Jeff Monken at Army is the other
Yes, I'm extremely aware. Monken and Niumatolo at Navy are both PJ Protégés. As was former GSU HC Mike Sewak but he got fired and is now on the staff at GT.
My only point was that Fropenhal (sp?) was not the 2nd best option QB of the last ten years.
Anyhow, I don't mean to sound confrontational, just setting the record straight.
For what it's worth, the failing of Johnson's teams has never been the offense, but rather atrocious defense at times.
(09-17-2017 07:13 PM)Cardiff Wrote: Why'd they fire the OC but not the DC? The suckage has been epic on both sides of the scrimmage.
That's a good question and I believe the thinking is that the defense has been under tremendous pressure since the offense hasn't moved the ball enough for the defense to rest at all. This move will not likely provide any relief but I suppose something had to be tried. The end is near for coach Kugler.
Coach Kruger had to do something. I watched them on TV a couple of weeks or so ago. Their offense is more capable than what's transpiring, especially with that All-World Offensive Lineman (sorry his name escapes me, BIG guy!), the announcers couldn't stop talking about how great he's been and how he'll be playing on Sundays.
Kugs just wants to run the ball. I don't think he has the horsed to do what he wants. That's always been the problem. If you aren't getting the cream of the crop you shouldn't be trying to play smash mouth football.
UTEP should be playing a spread offense where they look for mismatches and exploit holes in the defense.
Why hire an OL coach for a Head Coaching job in the first place? Why not get a young, high-powered offensive coordinator from a P5 school. UTEP has the support when they're winning to be a great program. You could easily out-recruit New Mexico and anything in west Texas. Just have to get the right guy.
(09-20-2017 11:06 AM)EagNBran Wrote: Why hire an OL coach for a Head Coaching job in the first place? Why not get a young, high-powered offensive coordinator from a P5 school. UTEP has the support when they're winning to be a great program. You could easily out-recruit New Mexico and anything in west Texas. Just have to get the right guy.
I can give you a recent example of why to not do that.
(09-20-2017 11:06 AM)EagNBran Wrote: Why hire an OL coach for a Head Coaching job in the first place? Why not get a young, high-powered offensive coordinator from a P5 school. UTEP has the support when they're winning to be a great program. You could easily out-recruit New Mexico and anything in west Texas. Just have to get the right guy.
So you think going the Ellis Johnson route is the way to go all the time. As a Steelers fan I like Kugler on the Steelers staff. If I was picking a HC his name would have never been on my short list.
At the time I thought UTEP should have went after University Northern Arizona's HC Jerome Soures.
(09-20-2017 11:06 AM)EagNBran Wrote: Why hire an OL coach for a Head Coaching job in the first place? Why not get a young, high-powered offensive coordinator from a P5 school. UTEP has the support when they're winning to be a great program. You could easily out-recruit New Mexico and anything in west Texas. Just have to get the right guy.
So you think going the Ellis Johnson route is the way to go all the time. As a Steelers fan I like Kugler on the Steelers staff. If I was picking a HC his name would have never been on my short list.
At the time I thought UTEP should have went after University Northern Arizona's HC Jerome Soures.
At that time in 2011 a lot of people wanted Willie Fritz from San Houston St. Instead we got one of old Bob's good buddies. Last season was suppose to be our big breakout season instead we hobbled to four wins. Some of the big money boosters wanted Kugler out and were willing to pay his buyout. Needless to say Stull didn't pull the trigger resulting in losing some major players. That's why he will no longer be the AD. Our problem has been that our AD has been more loyal to his coaching hires than to the university.
