(07-07-2017 09:31 AM)BearcatMan Wrote:  

(07-07-2017 08:50 AM)Hood-rich Wrote:  

(07-06-2017 08:38 PM)franzeal Wrote:  Student fees would be better compared per capita.

I actually agree with this. ECU has roughly half or less of some of the other schools here. When you have massive student bodies like UCF it's a lot easier to sustain via student fees because you can spread it out so much.

Here you go...Temple isn't listed despite them being public, which seems odd.

UConn:
Enrollment = 31,624
Subsidy per capita = $1,115.38

Memphis:
Enrollment = 21,480
Subsidy per capita =$854.98

ECU:
Enrollment = 27,511
Subsidy per capita =$686.93

Houston:
Enrollment = 42,704
Subsidy per capita = $589.01

Cincinnati:
Enrollment = 44,338
Subsidy per capita = $561.48

Wichita:
Enrollment = 14,495
Subsidy per capita = $504.25

USF:
Enrollment = 48,353
Subsidy per capita = $483.97

UCF:
Enrollment = 60,810
Subsidy per capita = $441.37

Conference AVG Per Capita Subsidy = $653.67/Student

Temple is not a public university. It is a state related public university. It is a little different. Temple only receives about 10% of their operating budget from the state. They operate as a private university but discount tuition to state students and also have some state employees that sit on the board. PSU and Pitt fall in to that category as well. PSU apparently releases their numbers because they make money. Pitt and Temple do not release their info publicly.

(07-07-2017 08:43 AM)CoastalJuan Wrote:  I'd like to see updated annual fund info to see if AAC membership has had an effect on donations. It would be interesting to get it for all FBS, not just our conference.

I'm more interested in that than TV revenue that I have zero control over.




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I've envied (in a nice way) and wish Memphis could emulate ECU's broad donor participation, but leaving out major donations presents an incomplete picture of actual donor funding IMO.

What happens to usf after they stop getting BE monies.

This shows that the big difference between us and p5 isn't tv revenue as most of us make bag up with student fees (for now). The difference is ticket sales and donations. That's something we can control and need to step up.

Ucf has really improved since joining the aac and hiring Danny white. We went from 48mil in 2014 (usf was 49mil then) to 59mil this year about a $10mil improvement. Usf down to 47mil this year and it'll go down when the 7+ mil BE exit fees dry up. Just using them as they are our closest peer institution in the conference in terms of size and location.

(07-07-2017 10:01 AM)Knights_of_UCF Wrote:  What happens to usf after they stop getting BE monies.

This shows that the big difference between us and p5 isn't tv revenue as most of us make bag up with student fees (for now). The difference is ticket sales and donations. That's something we can control and need to step up.

Ucf has really improved since joining the aac and hiring Danny white. We went from 48mil in 2014 (usf was 49mil then) to 59mil this year about a $10mil improvement. Usf down to 47mil this year and it'll go down when the 7+ mil BE exit fees dry up. Just using them as they are our closest peer institution in the conference in terms of size and location.

Gulfcoastgal has told us on MTO that Memphis is the only AAC program where ticket sales & donations exceed subsidies..........

(07-07-2017 09:57 AM)Tiger1983 Wrote:  

(07-07-2017 08:43 AM)CoastalJuan Wrote:  I'd like to see updated annual fund info to see if AAC membership has had an effect on donations. It would be interesting to get it for all FBS, not just our conference.

I'm more interested in that than TV revenue that I have zero control over.




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I've envied (in a nice way) and wish Memphis could emulate ECU's broad donor participation, but leaving out major donations presents an incomplete picture of actual donor funding IMO.

LOL, that 16K number includes the student pirate club.

(07-07-2017 11:10 AM)Atlanta Wrote:  

(07-07-2017 10:01 AM)Knights_of_UCF Wrote:  What happens to usf after they stop getting BE monies.

This shows that the big difference between us and p5 isn't tv revenue as most of us make bag up with student fees (for now). The difference is ticket sales and donations. That's something we can control and need to step up.

Ucf has really improved since joining the aac and hiring Danny white. We went from 48mil in 2014 (usf was 49mil then) to 59mil this year about a $10mil improvement. Usf down to 47mil this year and it'll go down when the 7+ mil BE exit fees dry up. Just using them as they are our closest peer institution in the conference in terms of size and location.

Gulfcoastgal has told us on MTO that Memphis is the only AAC program where ticket sales & donations exceed subsidies..........

Memphis gets great ticket sales and donations. Nice spike over previous years. Last year subsidies exceeded ticket sales and donations for Memphis.

Wichita state also gets more ticket sales and donations than subsidies

(07-07-2017 10:01 AM)Knights_of_UCF Wrote:  What happens to usf after they stop getting BE monies.

This shows that the big difference between us and p5 isn't tv revenue as most of us make bag up with student fees (for now). The difference is ticket sales and donations. That's something we can control and need to step up.

Ucf has really improved since joining the aac and hiring Danny white. We went from 48mil in 2014 (usf was 49mil then) to 59mil this year about a $10mil improvement. Usf down to 47mil this year and it'll go down when the 7+ mil BE exit fees dry up. Just using them as they are our closest peer institution in the conference in terms of size and location.

Don't worry about USF we are on our way back. If you look at those numbers you would see USF had more than a 3 million ticket drop when we started losing. That will go up. UCF is also benefited from a larger student body bringing in more student fees and their stadium which of course brings more revenue but is also expenses

(07-07-2017 08:02 AM)quo vadis Wrote:  

(07-06-2017 10:09 PM)KNIGHTTIME Wrote:  

(07-06-2017 04:32 PM)RobUCF Wrote:  USA Today published their latest school revenue numbers for 2015-2016.

http://sports.usatoday.com/ncaa/finances/

Some observations:

- Six out of the top ten non-P5 schools are from the AAC.

- Uconn is still on top by a sizeable margin, with UCF/Cincy then Houston/Memphis closely bunched behind them.

- The % revenue allocated back to the athletic department is where you really see the advantage of P-5 television contracts.

- I don't know much about James Madison, but it's a little surprising to me that they are just below Memphis and just above USF.

6 of 10 should be from the AAC since we are a P6. Is one of the other BYU? they don't count either. They get P6 status too.

It's nice to know that you are the one parceling out "Power" status to conferences instead of, you know, objective reality.

Nothing to see here.......

(07-07-2017 10:01 AM)Knights_of_UCF Wrote:  This shows that the big difference between us and p5 isn't tv revenue as most of us make bag up with student fees (for now). The difference is ticket sales and donations. That's something we can control and need to step up.

This is true. But, there is the counter-point that many P5 schools obtain better ticket revenue and donation numbers specifically because they get football kings in the stadium often and are directly affiliated with the power conferences.

Temple's attendance saw a nice bump when they played Notre Dame and Penn St. at home. I'm certain Temple's ticket revenue numbers would look very much like Purdue or NC State if the Owls had Notre Dame and Penn St. at home every other year and the B1G or ACC logo on their jerseys.

(07-07-2017 01:26 PM)Cubanbull Wrote:  

(07-07-2017 10:01 AM)Knights_of_UCF Wrote:  What happens to usf after they stop getting BE monies.

This shows that the big difference between us and p5 isn't tv revenue as most of us make bag up with student fees (for now). The difference is ticket sales and donations. That's something we can control and need to step up.

Ucf has really improved since joining the aac and hiring Danny white. We went from 48mil in 2014 (usf was 49mil then) to 59mil this year about a $10mil improvement. Usf down to 47mil this year and it'll go down when the 7+ mil BE exit fees dry up. Just using them as they are our closest peer institution in the conference in terms of size and location.

Don't worry about USF we are on our way back. If you look at those numbers you would see USF had more than a 3 million ticket drop when we started losing. That will go up. UCF is also benefited from a larger student body bringing in more student fees and their stadium which of course brings more revenue but is also expenses

Not to nitpick but I will anyway, usf had its second highest revenue year ever this year, only slightly lower than its highest ever just two seasons ago, so not sure the "on our way back" comment holds any water.

Additionally looks like the real ground to make up lies in the contributions section where USF gets only about 2.9M. The rights revenues of usf (and cinci and uconn) will decrease about 7mil this year. Not sure where usf can make that up though it does appear they've increased university support to pick up the ticket sale shortfall since entering the American, so further jacking that up could help offset lost revenue.

I wonder if decreased ticket sales is due to losing games or due to big name programs leaving the big east? We'll know more next year when we see if usf can get back to the $6m in ticket revenue it had pre-AAC

Looking league wide it looks like most of us have a lot of ground to make up in the contributions section.

(07-07-2017 01:33 PM)YNot Wrote:  

(07-07-2017 10:01 AM)Knights_of_UCF Wrote:  This shows that the big difference between us and p5 isn't tv revenue as most of us make bag up with student fees (for now). The difference is ticket sales and donations. That's something we can control and need to step up.

This is true. But, there is the counter-point that many P5 schools obtain better ticket revenue and donation numbers specifically because they get football kings in the stadium often and are directly affiliated with the power conferences.

Temple's attendance saw a nice bump when they played Notre Dame and Penn St. at home. I'm certain Temple's ticket revenue numbers would look very much like Purdue or NC State if the Owls had Notre Dame and Penn St. at home every other year and the B1G or ACC logo on their jerseys.

Certainly a chicken or the egg scenario. Ticket sales and donations would certainly go up for any G5 team if they Joined a p5. Our schools job is to get those increases without joining a p5 since that door appears shut for foreseeable future

(07-07-2017 01:39 PM)Knights_of_UCF Wrote:  

(07-07-2017 01:26 PM)Cubanbull Wrote:  

(07-07-2017 10:01 AM)Knights_of_UCF Wrote:  What happens to usf after they stop getting BE monies.

This shows that the big difference between us and p5 isn't tv revenue as most of us make bag up with student fees (for now). The difference is ticket sales and donations. That's something we can control and need to step up.

Ucf has really improved since joining the aac and hiring Danny white. We went from 48mil in 2014 (usf was 49mil then) to 59mil this year about a $10mil improvement. Usf down to 47mil this year and it'll go down when the 7+ mil BE exit fees dry up. Just using them as they are our closest peer institution in the conference in terms of size and location.

Don't worry about USF we are on our way back. If you look at those numbers you would see USF had more than a 3 million ticket drop when we started losing. That will go up. UCF is also benefited from a larger student body bringing in more student fees and their stadium which of course brings more revenue but is also expenses

Not to nitpick but I will anyway, usf had its second highest revenue year ever this year, only slightly lower than its highest ever just two seasons ago, so not sure the "on our way back" comment holds any water.

Additionally looks like the real ground to make up lies in the contributions section where USF gets only about 2.9M. The rights revenues of usf (and cinci and uconn) will decrease about 7mil this year. Not sure where usf can make that up though it does appear they've increased university support to pick up the ticket sale shortfall since entering the American, so further jacking that up could help offset lost revenue.

I wonder if decreased ticket sales is due to losing games or due to big name programs leaving the big east? We'll know more next year when we see if usf can get back to the $6m in ticket revenue it had pre-AAC

Looking league wide it looks like most of us have a lot of ground to make up in the contributions section.

I think you are putting too much into these numbers.
1. So UCF increased 10 million in two years, but it wasn't from ticket sales or contributions. Yet they also increased 10 million in expenses in the "other" category.

I would be impressed if UCF increased 10 million in revenues and was actually making money.

2. As for USF the drop as many have stated here was two fold, dropping from a BCS league to the AAC with opponents not as attractive and also losing.

I think we will start to see our ticket numbers rise and our AD is putting a bigger push on increasing contributions which have been an issue for years and had been ignored by prior ADs

We have a long ways to go and it won't be an easy road, but I feel we are on the right track with coaches, programs on the rise and a good AD.

3. USF will not see a 7 million drop next year. The extra BE cash lasts as long as the current tv contract, so until we see what that brings in you can't say that.

As I said above is not just about what you bring in but how much you are also spending. If USF decides finally to build an OCS you will see its revenues increase as well as their expenses.

(07-07-2017 03:17 PM)Cubanbull Wrote:  

(07-07-2017 01:39 PM)Knights_of_UCF Wrote:  

(07-07-2017 01:26 PM)Cubanbull Wrote:  

(07-07-2017 10:01 AM)Knights_of_UCF Wrote:  What happens to usf after they stop getting BE monies.

This shows that the big difference between us and p5 isn't tv revenue as most of us make bag up with student fees (for now). The difference is ticket sales and donations. That's something we can control and need to step up.

Ucf has really improved since joining the aac and hiring Danny white. We went from 48mil in 2014 (usf was 49mil then) to 59mil this year about a $10mil improvement. Usf down to 47mil this year and it'll go down when the 7+ mil BE exit fees dry up. Just using them as they are our closest peer institution in the conference in terms of size and location.

Don't worry about USF we are on our way back. If you look at those numbers you would see USF had more than a 3 million ticket drop when we started losing. That will go up. UCF is also benefited from a larger student body bringing in more student fees and their stadium which of course brings more revenue but is also expenses

Not to nitpick but I will anyway, usf had its second highest revenue year ever this year, only slightly lower than its highest ever just two seasons ago, so not sure the "on our way back" comment holds any water.

Additionally looks like the real ground to make up lies in the contributions section where USF gets only about 2.9M. The rights revenues of usf (and cinci and uconn) will decrease about 7mil this year. Not sure where usf can make that up though it does appear they've increased university support to pick up the ticket sale shortfall since entering the American, so further jacking that up could help offset lost revenue.

I wonder if decreased ticket sales is due to losing games or due to big name programs leaving the big east? We'll know more next year when we see if usf can get back to the $6m in ticket revenue it had pre-AAC

Looking league wide it looks like most of us have a lot of ground to make up in the contributions section.

I think you are putting too much into these numbers.
1. So UCF increased 10 million in two years, but it wasn't from ticket sales or contributions. Yet they also increased 10 million in expenses in the "other" category.

I would be impressed if UCF increased 10 million in revenues and was actually making money.

2. As for USF the drop as many have stated here was two fold, dropping from a BCS league to the AAC with opponents not as attractive and also losing.

I think we will start to see our ticket numbers rise and our AD is putting a bigger push on increasing contributions which have been an issue for years and had been ignored by prior ADs

We have a long ways to go and it won't be an easy road, but I feel we are on the right track with coaches, programs on the rise and a good AD.

3. USF will not see a 7 million drop next year. The extra BE cash lasts as long as the current tv contract, so until we see what that brings in you can't say that.

As I said above is not just about what you bring in but how much you are also spending. If USF decides finally to build an OCS you will see its revenues increase as well as their expenses.

True I am curious to see what the "other" column represents.

Big east money dries up after the next fiscal year. That's a fact and a minus $7mil from what usf currently gets. If the new tv contract gives us a huge raise the whole league will get it, so relative to everyone else usf will lose 7mil (and cinci and uconn).

It does matter how much you spend and that generally equates to winning on the field, hence the focus on increased revenues/budgets.

(07-07-2017 08:15 PM)Knights_of_UCF Wrote:  

(07-07-2017 03:17 PM)Cubanbull Wrote:  

(07-07-2017 01:39 PM)Knights_of_UCF Wrote:  

(07-07-2017 01:26 PM)Cubanbull Wrote:  

(07-07-2017 10:01 AM)Knights_of_UCF Wrote:  What happens to usf after they stop getting BE monies.

This shows that the big difference between us and p5 isn't tv revenue as most of us make bag up with student fees (for now). The difference is ticket sales and donations. That's something we can control and need to step up.

Ucf has really improved since joining the aac and hiring Danny white. We went from 48mil in 2014 (usf was 49mil then) to 59mil this year about a $10mil improvement. Usf down to 47mil this year and it'll go down when the 7+ mil BE exit fees dry up. Just using them as they are our closest peer institution in the conference in terms of size and location.

Don't worry about USF we are on our way back. If you look at those numbers you would see USF had more than a 3 million ticket drop when we started losing. That will go up. UCF is also benefited from a larger student body bringing in more student fees and their stadium which of course brings more revenue but is also expenses

Not to nitpick but I will anyway, usf had its second highest revenue year ever this year, only slightly lower than its highest ever just two seasons ago, so not sure the "on our way back" comment holds any water.

Additionally looks like the real ground to make up lies in the contributions section where USF gets only about 2.9M. The rights revenues of usf (and cinci and uconn) will decrease about 7mil this year. Not sure where usf can make that up though it does appear they've increased university support to pick up the ticket sale shortfall since entering the American, so further jacking that up could help offset lost revenue.

I wonder if decreased ticket sales is due to losing games or due to big name programs leaving the big east? We'll know more next year when we see if usf can get back to the $6m in ticket revenue it had pre-AAC

Looking league wide it looks like most of us have a lot of ground to make up in the contributions section.

I think you are putting too much into these numbers.
1. So UCF increased 10 million in two years, but it wasn't from ticket sales or contributions. Yet they also increased 10 million in expenses in the "other" category.

I would be impressed if UCF increased 10 million in revenues and was actually making money.

2. As for USF the drop as many have stated here was two fold, dropping from a BCS league to the AAC with opponents not as attractive and also losing.

I think we will start to see our ticket numbers rise and our AD is putting a bigger push on increasing contributions which have been an issue for years and had been ignored by prior ADs

We have a long ways to go and it won't be an easy road, but I feel we are on the right track with coaches, programs on the rise and a good AD.

3. USF will not see a 7 million drop next year. The extra BE cash lasts as long as the current tv contract, so until we see what that brings in you can't say that.

As I said above is not just about what you bring in but how much you are also spending. If USF decides finally to build an OCS you will see its revenues increase as well as their expenses.

True I am curious to see what the "other" column represents.

Big east money dries up after the next fiscal year. That's a fact and a minus $7mil from what usf currently gets. If the new tv contract gives us a huge raise the whole league will get it, so relative to everyone else usf will lose 7mil (and cinci and uconn).

It does matter how much you spend and that generally equates to winning on the field, hence the focus on increased revenues/budgets.

As I said the BE money is scheduled to end at the same time as our tv contract. as I said those numbers are funny because whatever you raise, you are spending and you have no idea what the spending is on.

I'm not concerned about USF's ability to compete or raise the revenue it needs to be competitive with anyone in this league

By the way it would be interesting to find why their numbers don't add up to what the school's reported

Here is a link
https://ope.ed.gov/athletics/#/institution/details

You can see that the number in both sites are different, but the ones on the link above are suppose to be the official school reports.

As for the USF vs UCF difference. It's easily the football stadium

Look at facilities expenses
USF 5.9 million
UCF. 16.6 million

It's not only paying maintaining the stadium but the cost of financing it. As I said earlier UCF will gain more revenues from their stadium but also have more overhead expenses.

As for the Big East money, the reality is that UC,UConn and USF are NOT getting 7 million more than the others.

You can go back and look it up.

(07-07-2017 09:10 PM)Cubanbull Wrote:  By the way it would be interesting to find why their numbers don't add up to what the school's reported

Here is a link
https://ope.ed.gov/athletics/#/institution/details

You can see that the number in both sites are different, but the ones on the link above are suppose to be the official school reports.

Correct

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(07-07-2017 12:56 PM)Knights_of_UCF Wrote:  

(07-07-2017 11:10 AM)Atlanta Wrote:  

(07-07-2017 10:01 AM)Knights_of_UCF Wrote:  What happens to usf after they stop getting BE monies.

This shows that the big difference between us and p5 isn't tv revenue as most of us make bag up with student fees (for now). The difference is ticket sales and donations. That's something we can control and need to step up.

Ucf has really improved since joining the aac and hiring Danny white. We went from 48mil in 2014 (usf was 49mil then) to 59mil this year about a $10mil improvement. Usf down to 47mil this year and it'll go down when the 7+ mil BE exit fees dry up. Just using them as they are our closest peer institution in the conference in terms of size and location.

Gulfcoastgal has told us on MTO that Memphis is the only AAC program where ticket sales & donations exceed subsidies..........

Memphis gets great ticket sales and donations. Nice spike over previous years. Last year subsidies exceeded ticket sales and donations for Memphis.

Wichita state also gets more ticket sales and donations than subsidies

I might be missing something but just doing some rough math for Memphis for 2016: ticket sales and donations were approx 20M and subsidies roughly 18M.

Are UCF's stadium expenses due to debt? I assumed those costs were associated with upgrades to the facility like added chair backs, the addition of the beach club, and some tweeks to the luxury tower.

(07-07-2017 09:10 PM)Cubanbull Wrote:  By the way it would be interesting to find why their numbers don't add up to what the school's reported

Here is a link
https://ope.ed.gov/athletics/#/institution/details

You can see that the number in both sites are different, but the ones on the link above are suppose to be the official school reports.

My answer: one school's _ budget is not equal to another school's _budget.