(01-12-2017 10:01 AM)Tiger87 Wrote:  

(01-12-2017 09:54 AM)salukiblue Wrote:  

(01-12-2017 09:46 AM)Tiger87 Wrote:  

(01-11-2017 11:19 PM)salukiblue Wrote:  

(01-11-2017 11:05 PM)Tiger87 Wrote:  Gotta make a shot to call a to. We abandoned the offense in the last 2 minutes. I can't think of a time when a to would have mattered.

Memphis couldn't take a timeout when they had the ball?

Hmmmm. Must be some new rule.

Not to mention after dead balls, free throws, or Tulsa baskets...

I'm talking clock management. Only time a TO helps you is after a made basket or defensive rebound. We had zero of those during the last 2 minutes.

Sure, you could call it after we fouled and stopped the clock, or after Tulsa made a shot. That doesn't help with clock management though. You could setup a play. But the 2-minute drill is less about running plays, and more about clock management. Timeouts were available, but would not have helped the way it played out.

Plenty to criticize. Timeouts are way down the list.

Wut?

Can someone else help me with this one?

It's easy if you try. When you're managing the clock at end of game, the advantage comes by stopping the clock before additional seconds run off. If the clock is already stopped (dead balls, free throws - your suggestions), a TO gets you no clock advantage. And if you call it after their made basket, it gets you nothing because you're already inbounding the ball.

Go back and watch the last 2 minutes. How much clock would have been saved by any timeout we could have called? None. Zero.

Wow.

Do you understand what timeouts do outside of "saving the clock?"

This is getting more and more interesting as you continue.

I kinda like All or Gain, but I understand many people like Tide.

(01-12-2017 12:48 PM)BuccTiger Wrote:  I kinda like All or Gain, but I understand many people like Tide.

Gain is the shiz.

(01-12-2017 12:31 PM)gusrob Wrote:  

(01-12-2017 09:54 AM)TubbyTime Wrote:  

(01-12-2017 09:04 AM)gusrob Wrote:  Relax. All good. We beat several REALLY good teams. UTRVG, Millwaukee, Savannah St, McNeese, Jackson St, UAB, Incarnate Word. We lost to Providence, Monmouth and Ole Miss.

All this despite some solid talent. Talent better than Tubby recruited at TT and Minn and maybe even Kensucky. People have reason to gripe.

You're right, we should have never let wonder boy take his smiling azz to GT. Hiring Tubby is the worst decision in the history of Tiger basketball. I know, why don't you write a letter of recommendation to Rudd and Bowen on behalf of Tic Price. I'm sure we could get him in here. Good idea champ?

(01-12-2017 09:55 AM)Tiger87 Wrote:  

(01-12-2017 09:04 AM)gusrob Wrote:  Relax. All good. We beat several REALLY good teams. UTRVG, Millwaukee, Savannah St, McNeese, Jackson St, UAB, Incarnate Word. We lost to Providence, Monmouth and Ole Miss.

All this despite some solid talent. Talent better than Tubby recruited at TT and Minn and maybe even Kensucky. People have reason to gripe.

Nice of you to leave out Iowa, South Carolina, and at Oklahoma. We hear you clearly.

Sure, people have reason to gripe after a loss. I went to bed griping and woke up griping. Don't spin an agenda though, with selective facts like this.

Hard to have a decent convo here. Most posters are way too Sunshine Pumping or way too Debbie Downer. Impossible. Freggin clowns.

Intelligent retort.

Your initial post had no semblance of an intelligent discussion.

(01-12-2017 12:48 PM)BuccTiger Wrote:  I kinda like All or Gain, but I understand many people like Tide.

(01-12-2017 12:50 PM)tiger1016 Wrote:  

(01-12-2017 12:31 PM)gusrob Wrote:  

(01-12-2017 09:54 AM)TubbyTime Wrote:  

(01-12-2017 09:04 AM)gusrob Wrote:  Relax. All good. We beat several REALLY good teams. UTRVG, Millwaukee, Savannah St, McNeese, Jackson St, UAB, Incarnate Word. We lost to Providence, Monmouth and Ole Miss.

All this despite some solid talent. Talent better than Tubby recruited at TT and Minn and maybe even Kensucky. People have reason to gripe.

You're right, we should have never let wonder boy take his smiling azz to GT. Hiring Tubby is the worst decision in the history of Tiger basketball. I know, why don't you write a letter of recommendation to Rudd and Bowen on behalf of Tic Price. I'm sure we could get him in here. Good idea champ?

(01-12-2017 09:55 AM)Tiger87 Wrote:  

(01-12-2017 09:04 AM)gusrob Wrote:  Relax. All good. We beat several REALLY good teams. UTRVG, Millwaukee, Savannah St, McNeese, Jackson St, UAB, Incarnate Word. We lost to Providence, Monmouth and Ole Miss.

All this despite some solid talent. Talent better than Tubby recruited at TT and Minn and maybe even Kensucky. People have reason to gripe.

Nice of you to leave out Iowa, South Carolina, and at Oklahoma. We hear you clearly.

Sure, people have reason to gripe after a loss. I went to bed griping and woke up griping. Don't spin an agenda though, with selective facts like this.

Hard to have a decent convo here. Most posters are way too Sunshine Pumping or way too Debbie Downer. Impossible. Freggin clowns.

Intelligent retort.

Your initial post had no semblance of an intelligent discussion.

The point is clear. You just didn't agree. We haven't done much of anything to write home about. We lose to teams in Top50. No major wins. No major losses. Typical Tubby team. We'll be 20-10. Hard to get overly excited or overly depressed. Posters are going nuts about other posters complaining about the loss. It's natural to be pissed. I am. You probably are. So chill. There's the point.

Every discussion doesn't need to become so polar. Somehow it usually does here. AS EVIDENCE BY YOU RIGHT NOW. It's not all or none. Pointing out that we're just as mediocre as many predicted does NOT mean we want Josh back. I love how pointing out the mediocrity equals spinning an agenda. Tubby is exactly what he's always been. Not even sure what agenda you think I do or should have.

Let's quit this stupid discussion based on your defense of......I don't know what....so you can get back to your career-which I'm sure involves higher thought.....since you're such an intellectual. LMAO

(01-12-2017 01:23 PM)gusrob Wrote:  

(01-12-2017 12:50 PM)tiger1016 Wrote:  

(01-12-2017 12:31 PM)gusrob Wrote:  

(01-12-2017 09:54 AM)TubbyTime Wrote:  

(01-12-2017 09:04 AM)gusrob Wrote:  Relax. All good. We beat several REALLY good teams. UTRVG, Millwaukee, Savannah St, McNeese, Jackson St, UAB, Incarnate Word. We lost to Providence, Monmouth and Ole Miss.

All this despite some solid talent. Talent better than Tubby recruited at TT and Minn and maybe even Kensucky. People have reason to gripe.

You're right, we should have never let wonder boy take his smiling azz to GT. Hiring Tubby is the worst decision in the history of Tiger basketball. I know, why don't you write a letter of recommendation to Rudd and Bowen on behalf of Tic Price. I'm sure we could get him in here. Good idea champ?

(01-12-2017 09:55 AM)Tiger87 Wrote:  

(01-12-2017 09:04 AM)gusrob Wrote:  Relax. All good. We beat several REALLY good teams. UTRVG, Millwaukee, Savannah St, McNeese, Jackson St, UAB, Incarnate Word. We lost to Providence, Monmouth and Ole Miss.

All this despite some solid talent. Talent better than Tubby recruited at TT and Minn and maybe even Kensucky. People have reason to gripe.

Nice of you to leave out Iowa, South Carolina, and at Oklahoma. We hear you clearly.

Sure, people have reason to gripe after a loss. I went to bed griping and woke up griping. Don't spin an agenda though, with selective facts like this.

Hard to have a decent convo here. Most posters are way too Sunshine Pumping or way too Debbie Downer. Impossible. Freggin clowns.

Intelligent retort.

Your initial post had no semblance of an intelligent discussion.

The point is clear. You just didn't agree. We haven't done much of anything to write home about. We lose to teams in Top50. No major wins. No major losses. Typical Tubby team. We'll be 20-10. Hard to get overly excited or overly depressed. Posters are going nuts about other posters complaining about the loss. It's natural to be pissed. I am. You probably are. So chill. There's the point.

Every discussion doesn't need to become so polar. Somehow it usually does here. AS EVIDENCE BY YOU RIGHT NOW. It's not all or none. Pointing out that we're just as mediocre as many predicted does NOT mean we want Josh back. I love how pointing out the mediocrity equals spinning an agenda. Tubby is exactly what he's always been. Not even sure what agenda you think I do or should have.

Let's quit this stupid discussion based on your defense of......I don't know what....so you can get back to your career-which I'm sure involves higher thought.....since you're such an intellectual. LMAO

Again...intelligent retort.

I only made one comment and you assumed a lot. Must be that higher level of intellect.

Re-read your initial post. If you wanted an intelligent discussion, you would have posted differently. But you wanted to flame away, so well done. Your follow up posts basically devolved into name calling as well.

I agree with your points btw but you could have gone about it differently. You should follow your own advice.

(01-12-2017 12:34 PM)salukiblue Wrote:  

(01-12-2017 10:01 AM)Tiger87 Wrote:  

(01-12-2017 09:54 AM)salukiblue Wrote:  

(01-12-2017 09:46 AM)Tiger87 Wrote:  

(01-11-2017 11:19 PM)salukiblue Wrote:  Memphis couldn't take a timeout when they had the ball?

Hmmmm. Must be some new rule.

Not to mention after dead balls, free throws, or Tulsa baskets...

I'm talking clock management. Only time a TO helps you is after a made basket or defensive rebound. We had zero of those during the last 2 minutes.

Sure, you could call it after we fouled and stopped the clock, or after Tulsa made a shot. That doesn't help with clock management though. You could setup a play. But the 2-minute drill is less about running plays, and more about clock management. Timeouts were available, but would not have helped the way it played out.

Plenty to criticize. Timeouts are way down the list.

Wut?

Can someone else help me with this one?

It's easy if you try. When you're managing the clock at end of game, the advantage comes by stopping the clock before additional seconds run off. If the clock is already stopped (dead balls, free throws - your suggestions), a TO gets you no clock advantage. And if you call it after their made basket, it gets you nothing because you're already inbounding the ball.

Go back and watch the last 2 minutes. How much clock would have been saved by any timeout we could have called? None. Zero.

Wow.

Do you understand what timeouts do outside of "saving the clock?"

This is getting more and more interesting as you continue.

You're trying too hard to tilt at windmills. There are plenty of things to complain about the game last night. Having timeouts at the end of the game is really not one of them. Maybe 10th on the list?

You still didn't answer the question - so I'll expand it to make it easier for you. Where could we have used those 2 timeouts at any point in the 2nd half that would have made a difference? Do you think we should have used them while we were making the run? Or maybe when the clock was already stopped after Tulsa had just made free throws?

(01-12-2017 12:56 PM)HoopDreams Wrote:  

(01-12-2017 12:48 PM)BuccTiger Wrote:  I kinda like All or Gain, but I understand many people like Tide.

We lost, not due to rebounding (no center), or free throws; but due to the equipment managers insistence on washing the team's uniforms and jock straps with Tide.

When one doesn't understand a given phenomenon, one grasps at superfluous items in order to explain the situation. So, I'm proposing laundry detergent for several posters.

(01-11-2017 10:25 PM)tiger2000 Wrote:  

(01-11-2017 10:20 PM)ItsDude Wrote:  I kind of thought Tubby gave us a chance in this game.

Agreed. Got killed on the glass, deep (albeit young) Tulsa team. The game plan against us was the right one, we are thin on the depth chart and everyone knows it.

This is a bad Tulsa team as indicated by their record thus far and what you will see in the future.

(01-12-2017 02:24 PM)Tiger87 Wrote:  

(01-12-2017 12:34 PM)salukiblue Wrote:  

(01-12-2017 10:01 AM)Tiger87 Wrote:  

(01-12-2017 09:54 AM)salukiblue Wrote:  

(01-12-2017 09:46 AM)Tiger87 Wrote:  I'm talking clock management. Only time a TO helps you is after a made basket or defensive rebound. We had zero of those during the last 2 minutes.

Sure, you could call it after we fouled and stopped the clock, or after Tulsa made a shot. That doesn't help with clock management though. You could setup a play. But the 2-minute drill is less about running plays, and more about clock management. Timeouts were available, but would not have helped the way it played out.

Plenty to criticize. Timeouts are way down the list.

Wut?

Can someone else help me with this one?

It's easy if you try. When you're managing the clock at end of game, the advantage comes by stopping the clock before additional seconds run off. If the clock is already stopped (dead balls, free throws - your suggestions), a TO gets you no clock advantage. And if you call it after their made basket, it gets you nothing because you're already inbounding the ball.

Go back and watch the last 2 minutes. How much clock would have been saved by any timeout we could have called? None. Zero.

Wow.

Do you understand what timeouts do outside of "saving the clock?"

This is getting more and more interesting as you continue.

You're trying too hard to tilt at windmills. There are plenty of things to complain about the game last night. Having timeouts at the end of the game is really not one of them. Maybe 10th on the list?

You still didn't answer the question - so I'll expand it to make it easier for you. Where could we have used those 2 timeouts at any point in the 2nd half that would have made a difference? Do you think we should have used them while we were making the run? Or maybe when the clock was already stopped after Tulsa had just made free throws?

Why are you so concerned about timeouts being used for the sole purpose of "stopping the clock?"

How many times are timeouts NOT used to stop the clock but to compose a team after a run of bad plays (hence the adage "Get a t.o. baby...!!"--not for the purpose of stopping the clock, right?).

Here are a couple places that came to mind watching the game:

With 4:40 in the game, Memphis was up 66-65.
In the next two minutes of play, the Tigers:
Turned the ball over and Tulsa scored a layup
Turned the ball over
Stole the ball and made 1-2 FT's
Turned the ball over and Tulsa scored a layup

At that point, there was 2:48 to go. Tulsa is now up 69-67. Memphis had made one basket in the last three minutes and turned the ball over three times. Four of the guys on the court had played at least 32 minutes at that point.

That might have been a good time to call a timeout. To refocus the team, set up a good play and reset assignments and to refocus on basics like boxing out.

If you don't like a timeout there, then:

The play after that Dedric scores, the Tulsa comes down, misses a shot and Edogi gets a rebound and slams the ball. What little crowd gets excited. 71-69 Tulsa with 2:02 to go.

Might be a good time then. Slow the momentum down after the dunk.

But, if you want to wait some more:

Next play, Dedric takes a quick shot, Tulsa takes the ball down and Dedric commits a foul and the Tulsa player gets an and-1. Makes the FT.

Now it's 74-69 Tulsa with 1:18 to go. Tigers have two timeouts. Surely this is a good time to call one. Try to decide whether to go for two or three. When to foul or keep playing defense after a miss or make?

Nope.

Martin comes down and gets stuffed. Rivers fouls, Tulsa makes FT and is now up 7.

Lawson misses a three with 1:08 to go. The Tigers go 20 seconds without fouling and finally foul with 12 seconds or so on the shot clock.

Memphis ended up making one basket in the last 5 minutes of the game (not counting Dedric's uncontested shot with :02 to go) and only 5 total points in the last 5:44 of the game. And 4 turnovers.

There were multiple opportunities to call a TO to refocus the team or to "draw up a play" but whatever.

Well, he answered the TO question.

I prefer All and Gain to Tide. Tide irritates my skin, may irritate the skin of the players, must be the reason for the poor rebounding? Yes, that is the ticket, irritating jock straps.

(01-11-2017 10:32 PM)roundhouse74 Wrote:  

(01-11-2017 10:19 PM)TigerBlue4Ever Wrote:  The sky is falling, the sky is falling!!!

Yeah, relax. It's only a basketball loss to Tulsa.

It was a bad loss, no doubt.

(01-12-2017 03:44 PM)BuccTiger Wrote:  I prefer All and Gain to Tide. Tide irritates my skin, may irritate the skin of the players, must be the reason for the poor rebounding? Yes, that is the ticket, irritating jock straps.

Are you happy or sad?

(01-12-2017 03:51 PM)TigerBlue4Ever Wrote:  

(01-11-2017 10:32 PM)roundhouse74 Wrote:  

(01-11-2017 10:19 PM)TigerBlue4Ever Wrote:  The sky is falling, the sky is falling!!!

Yeah, relax. It's only a basketball loss to Tulsa.

It was a bad loss, no doubt.

All losses are bad. I would rather win every game in a blow-out.

I think Tulsa might have done something similar. And we forgot to practice.

(01-12-2017 02:58 PM)salukiblue Wrote:  

(01-12-2017 02:24 PM)Tiger87 Wrote:  

(01-12-2017 12:34 PM)salukiblue Wrote:  

(01-12-2017 10:01 AM)Tiger87 Wrote:  

(01-12-2017 09:54 AM)salukiblue Wrote:  Wut?

Can someone else help me with this one?

It's easy if you try. When you're managing the clock at end of game, the advantage comes by stopping the clock before additional seconds run off. If the clock is already stopped (dead balls, free throws - your suggestions), a TO gets you no clock advantage. And if you call it after their made basket, it gets you nothing because you're already inbounding the ball.

Go back and watch the last 2 minutes. How much clock would have been saved by any timeout we could have called? None. Zero.

Wow.

Do you understand what timeouts do outside of "saving the clock?"

This is getting more and more interesting as you continue.

You're trying too hard to tilt at windmills. There are plenty of things to complain about the game last night. Having timeouts at the end of the game is really not one of them. Maybe 10th on the list?

You still didn't answer the question - so I'll expand it to make it easier for you. Where could we have used those 2 timeouts at any point in the 2nd half that would have made a difference? Do you think we should have used them while we were making the run? Or maybe when the clock was already stopped after Tulsa had just made free throws?

Why are you so concerned about timeouts being used for the sole purpose of "stopping the clock?"

How many times are timeouts NOT used to stop the clock but to compose a team after a run of bad plays (hence the adage "Get a t.o. baby...!!"--not for the purpose of stopping the clock, right?).

Here are a couple places that came to mind watching the game:

With 4:40 in the game, Memphis was up 66-65.
In the next two minutes of play, the Tigers:
Turned the ball over and Tulsa scored a layup
Turned the ball over
Stole the ball and made 1-2 FT's
Turned the ball over and Tulsa scored a layup

At that point, there was 2:48 to go. Tulsa is now up 69-67. Memphis had made one basket in the last three minutes and turned the ball over three times. Four of the guys on the court had played at least 32 minutes at that point.

That might have been a good time to call a timeout. To refocus the team, set up a good play and reset assignments and to refocus on basics like boxing out.

If you don't like a timeout there, then:

The play after that Dedric scores, the Tulsa comes down, misses a shot and Edogi gets a rebound and slams the ball. What little crowd gets excited. 71-69 Tulsa with 2:02 to go.

Might be a good time then. Slow the momentum down after the dunk.

But, if you want to wait some more:

Next play, Dedric takes a quick shot, Tulsa takes the ball down and Dedric commits a foul and the Tulsa player gets an and-1. Makes the FT.

Now it's 74-69 Tulsa with 1:18 to go. Tigers have two timeouts. Surely this is a good time to call one. Try to decide whether to go for two or three. When to foul or keep playing defense after a miss or make?

Nope.

Martin comes down and gets stuffed. Rivers fouls, Tulsa makes FT and is now up 7.

Lawson misses a three with 1:08 to go. The Tigers go 20 seconds without fouling and finally foul with 12 seconds or so on the shot clock.

Memphis ended up making one basket in the last 5 minutes of the game (not counting Dedric's uncontested shot with :02 to go) and only 5 total points in the last 5:44 of the game. And 4 turnovers.

There were multiple opportunities to call a TO to refocus the team or to "draw up a play" but whatever.

Gotta give Saluki the win on this one - well done!

With our short bench

Win or lose

We should end the game with zero timeouts

(01-12-2017 07:15 PM)hsvtiger Wrote:  

(01-12-2017 02:58 PM)salukiblue Wrote:  

(01-12-2017 02:24 PM)Tiger87 Wrote:  

(01-12-2017 12:34 PM)salukiblue Wrote:  

(01-12-2017 10:01 AM)Tiger87 Wrote:  It's easy if you try. When you're managing the clock at end of game, the advantage comes by stopping the clock before additional seconds run off. If the clock is already stopped (dead balls, free throws - your suggestions), a TO gets you no clock advantage. And if you call it after their made basket, it gets you nothing because you're already inbounding the ball.

Go back and watch the last 2 minutes. How much clock would have been saved by any timeout we could have called? None. Zero.

Wow.

Do you understand what timeouts do outside of "saving the clock?"

This is getting more and more interesting as you continue.

You're trying too hard to tilt at windmills. There are plenty of things to complain about the game last night. Having timeouts at the end of the game is really not one of them. Maybe 10th on the list?

You still didn't answer the question - so I'll expand it to make it easier for you. Where could we have used those 2 timeouts at any point in the 2nd half that would have made a difference? Do you think we should have used them while we were making the run? Or maybe when the clock was already stopped after Tulsa had just made free throws?

Why are you so concerned about timeouts being used for the sole purpose of "stopping the clock?"

How many times are timeouts NOT used to stop the clock but to compose a team after a run of bad plays (hence the adage "Get a t.o. baby...!!"--not for the purpose of stopping the clock, right?).

Here are a couple places that came to mind watching the game:

With 4:40 in the game, Memphis was up 66-65.
In the next two minutes of play, the Tigers:
Turned the ball over and Tulsa scored a layup
Turned the ball over
Stole the ball and made 1-2 FT's
Turned the ball over and Tulsa scored a layup

At that point, there was 2:48 to go. Tulsa is now up 69-67. Memphis had made one basket in the last three minutes and turned the ball over three times. Four of the guys on the court had played at least 32 minutes at that point.

That might have been a good time to call a timeout. To refocus the team, set up a good play and reset assignments and to refocus on basics like boxing out.

If you don't like a timeout there, then:

The play after that Dedric scores, the Tulsa comes down, misses a shot and Edogi gets a rebound and slams the ball. What little crowd gets excited. 71-69 Tulsa with 2:02 to go.

Might be a good time then. Slow the momentum down after the dunk.

But, if you want to wait some more:

Next play, Dedric takes a quick shot, Tulsa takes the ball down and Dedric commits a foul and the Tulsa player gets an and-1. Makes the FT.

Now it's 74-69 Tulsa with 1:18 to go. Tigers have two timeouts. Surely this is a good time to call one. Try to decide whether to go for two or three. When to foul or keep playing defense after a miss or make?

Nope.

Martin comes down and gets stuffed. Rivers fouls, Tulsa makes FT and is now up 7.

Lawson misses a three with 1:08 to go. The Tigers go 20 seconds without fouling and finally foul with 12 seconds or so on the shot clock.

Memphis ended up making one basket in the last 5 minutes of the game (not counting Dedric's uncontested shot with :02 to go) and only 5 total points in the last 5:44 of the game. And 4 turnovers.

There were multiple opportunities to call a TO to refocus the team or to "draw up a play" but whatever.

Gotta give Saluki the win on this one - well done!

Totally agree. That post is a spot on.