The NCAA has now pulled all NCAA championship events from NC over HB2. There are many ACC championship events scheduled for NC, including the football championship in Charlotte and the men's basketball tournament in 2019 and 2020. What will the ACC do? The ball is in your court, John Swofford. It's too late to move the 2016 football championship game but not too late to move the 2017 women's basketball tournament, for instance. Should the ACC office stay in Greensboro? Protestations about "political correctness" won't make this go away.

Update: Swofford has released a statement. Things may happen soon. I'm reading speculation that the ACC football championship game could be moved THIS YEAR.

http://www.sbnation.com/college-basketba...mpionships

Includes statements from Duke and NCST.

Just abolish that stupid law already.

(09-13-2016 08:30 AM)Lenvillecards Wrote:  Just abolish that stupid law already.

Good luck with that. This is the final culmination of a battle between rural NC Republicans and the state's urban areas. The rural republicans have joined with out of state pubs that have moved into the Charlotte and Raleigh suburbs to form a governing coalition that is absolutely crazy. It's not real republicanism as most of you would know it. This crew have been at work taking the cities' airports, water systems, sewer systems, etc., and giving control of them to rural entities instead of the people who paid for these things. NC is a Dillon's Rule state - no home rule here.

These guys lose nothing personally from this stuff so they double and triple down. Traditional "business" republicans no longer exist in NC so there is no counterbalance to this in the party.

Everything that made NC great has been under attack - the University System, the Public Schools, the triple A rated Cities, etc., etc.

That Swofford and the entire UNC/Duke/UVa cabal have not been able to turn them should tell you all you need to know. Everyone is waiting for the 4th Circuit and Supreme Court to toss this thing. And the real issue is not the bathrooms - that's a red herring - the real issue is prevent people from suing for discrimination, and preventing cities from setting their own standards - something buried deeper in the bill.

I'm old enough to remember when Republicans were respectable, level-headed people in NC. Yes they were tight with a dollar and no they didn't particularly want to support a great deal of social change - but they weren't crazy.

(09-13-2016 08:51 AM)lumberpack4 Wrote:  

(09-13-2016 08:30 AM)Lenvillecards Wrote:  Just abolish that stupid law already.

Good luck with that. This is the final culmination of a battle between rural NC Republicans and the state's urban areas. The rural republicans have joined with out of state pubs that have moved into the Charlotte and Raleigh suburbs to form a governing coalition that is absolutely crazy. It's not real republicanism as most of you would know it. This crew have been at work taking the cities' airports, water systems, sewer systems, etc., and giving control of them to rural entities instead of the people who paid for these things. NC is a Dillon's Rule state - no home rule here.

These guys lose nothing personally from this stuff so they double and triple down. Traditional "business" republicans no longer exist in NC so there is no counterbalance to this in the party.

Everything that made NC great has been under attack - the University System, the Public Schools, the triple A rated Cities, etc., etc.

That Swofford and the entire UNC/Duke/UVa cabal have not been able to turn them should tell you all you need to know. Everyone is waiting for the 4th Circuit and Supreme Court to toss this thing. And the real issue is not the bathrooms - that's a red herring - the real issue is prevent people from suing for discrimination, and preventing cities from setting their own standards - something buried deeper in the bill.

I'm old enough to remember when Republicans were respectable, level-headed people in NC. Yes they were tight with a dollar and no they didn't particularly want to support a great deal of social change - but they weren't crazy.

Why hasn't the court tossed it yet? Has their control reached them to?

Not to get to political & not to get moved to the spin room but if you want to know what the condition is of the Republican Party nationally all you have to do is look at their presidential nominee. He's no Reagan.

(09-13-2016 08:51 AM)lumberpack4 Wrote:  

(09-13-2016 08:30 AM)Lenvillecards Wrote:  Just abolish that stupid law already.

Good luck with that. This is the final culmination of a battle between rural NC Republicans and the state's urban areas. The rural republicans have joined with out of state pubs that have moved into the Charlotte and Raleigh suburbs to form a governing coalition that is absolutely crazy. It's not real republicanism as most of you would know it. This crew have been at work taking the cities' airports, water systems, sewer systems, etc., and giving control of them to rural entities instead of the people who paid for these things. NC is a Dillon's Rule state - no home rule here.

These guys lose nothing personally from this stuff so they double and triple down. Traditional "business" republicans no longer exist in NC so there is no counterbalance to this in the party.

Everything that made NC great has been under attack - the University System, the Public Schools, the triple A rated Cities, etc., etc.

That Swofford and the entire UNC/Duke/UVa cabal have not been able to turn them should tell you all you need to know. Everyone is waiting for the 4th Circuit and Supreme Court to toss this thing. And the real issue is not the bathrooms - that's a red herring - the real issue is prevent people from suing for discrimination, and preventing cities from setting their own standards - something buried deeper in the bill.

I'm old enough to remember when Republicans were respectable, level-headed people in NC. Yes they were tight with a dollar and no they didn't particularly want to support a great deal of social change - but they weren't crazy.

I'd say that's a pretty fair assessment of the situation. The folks that have wrested control of the NC state government are trying to assert two things here, IMO. First, that the state's authority when it comes to discrimination should supersede the federal government's. Many of these folks, as individuals, believe they should be allowed to discriminate against anybody or anything that they want to, and that federal laws prohibiting discrimination are an overreach of their constitutional power. But second, they are asserting that municipal governments have no such power, either.

I expect that, if the ACC takes any action similar to the NCAA's, you will see a massive counterattack against the BOT's over which they have oversight and appointment authority. The state's GOP isn't going down without a fight on this, and they will view any effort by the courts to overturn this law as just more red meat to throw to their supporters.

I would imagine that, with the degree of interest that already exists among many ACC members to move championships and tournaments out of North Carolina for reasons having nothing to do with HB2, this will be an easy call.

(09-13-2016 09:41 AM)ken d Wrote:  I would imagine that, with the degree of interest that already exists among many ACC members to move championships and tournaments out of North Carolina for reasons having nothing to do with HB2, this will be an easy call.

+1. I was thinking the same thing.

Too bad about the football championship, though - Charlotte was a great venue.

(09-13-2016 10:04 AM)Hokie Mark Wrote:  

(09-13-2016 09:41 AM)ken d Wrote:  I would imagine that, with the degree of interest that already exists among many ACC members to move championships and tournaments out of North Carolina for reasons having nothing to do with HB2, this will be an easy call.

+1. I was thinking the same thing.

Too bad about the football championship, though - Charlotte was a great venue.

Charlotte was the only venue to have really great attendance. Atlanta may not be too bad. But The SEC could overshadow it depending on which ACC schools are playing.

(09-13-2016 09:16 AM)ken d Wrote:  

(09-13-2016 08:51 AM)lumberpack4 Wrote:  

(09-13-2016 08:30 AM)Lenvillecards Wrote:  Just abolish that stupid law already.

Good luck with that. This is the final culmination of a battle between rural NC Republicans and the state's urban areas. The rural republicans have joined with out of state pubs that have moved into the Charlotte and Raleigh suburbs to form a governing coalition that is absolutely crazy. It's not real republicanism as most of you would know it. This crew have been at work taking the cities' airports, water systems, sewer systems, etc., and giving control of them to rural entities instead of the people who paid for these things. NC is a Dillon's Rule state - no home rule here.

These guys lose nothing personally from this stuff so they double and triple down. Traditional "business" republicans no longer exist in NC so there is no counterbalance to this in the party.

Everything that made NC great has been under attack - the University System, the Public Schools, the triple A rated Cities, etc., etc.

That Swofford and the entire UNC/Duke/UVa cabal have not been able to turn them should tell you all you need to know. Everyone is waiting for the 4th Circuit and Supreme Court to toss this thing. And the real issue is not the bathrooms - that's a red herring - the real issue is prevent people from suing for discrimination, and preventing cities from setting their own standards - something buried deeper in the bill.

I'm old enough to remember when Republicans were respectable, level-headed people in NC. Yes they were tight with a dollar and no they didn't particularly want to support a great deal of social change - but they weren't crazy.

I'd say that's a pretty fair assessment of the situation. The folks that have wrested control of the NC state government are trying to assert two things here, IMO. First, that the state's authority when it comes to discrimination should supersede the federal government's. Many of these folks, as individuals, believe they should be allowed to discriminate against anybody or anything that they want to, and that federal laws prohibiting discrimination are an overreach of their constitutional power. But second, they are asserting that municipal governments have no such power, either.

I expect that, if the ACC takes any action similar to the NCAA's, you will see a massive counterattack against the BOT's over which they have oversight and appointment authority. The state's GOP isn't going down without a fight on this, and they will view any effort by the courts to overturn this law as just more red meat to throw to their supporters.

This is bullshat. I wish that every time legislation I disagreed with was passed that I could have holy hell rained down on the state. It is PC run amok. Either we're a democracy that respects human rights or we're not. I'm all for equal access but restrictions on all choices, behavior and free association need to be considered in the same light. These punitive actions are hypocritical and all flow in one direction.

Additionally all of the championships and events need to come to Louisville. It's centrally located, easy to get to, affordable and fun and anyone can piss anywhere they like.

(09-13-2016 09:16 AM)ken d Wrote:  

(09-13-2016 08:51 AM)lumberpack4 Wrote:  

(09-13-2016 08:30 AM)Lenvillecards Wrote:  Just abolish that stupid law already.

Good luck with that. This is the final culmination of a battle between rural NC Republicans and the state's urban areas. The rural republicans have joined with out of state pubs that have moved into the Charlotte and Raleigh suburbs to form a governing coalition that is absolutely crazy. It's not real republicanism as most of you would know it. This crew have been at work taking the cities' airports, water systems, sewer systems, etc., and giving control of them to rural entities instead of the people who paid for these things. NC is a Dillon's Rule state - no home rule here.

These guys lose nothing personally from this stuff so they double and triple down. Traditional "business" republicans no longer exist in NC so there is no counterbalance to this in the party.

Everything that made NC great has been under attack - the University System, the Public Schools, the triple A rated Cities, etc., etc.

That Swofford and the entire UNC/Duke/UVa cabal have not been able to turn them should tell you all you need to know. Everyone is waiting for the 4th Circuit and Supreme Court to toss this thing. And the real issue is not the bathrooms - that's a red herring - the real issue is prevent people from suing for discrimination, and preventing cities from setting their own standards - something buried deeper in the bill.

I'm old enough to remember when Republicans were respectable, level-headed people in NC. Yes they were tight with a dollar and no they didn't particularly want to support a great deal of social change - but they weren't crazy.

I'd say that's a pretty fair assessment of the situation. The folks that have wrested control of the NC state government are trying to assert two things here, IMO. First, that the state's authority when it comes to discrimination should supersede the federal government's. Many of these folks, as individuals, believe they should be allowed to discriminate against anybody or anything that they want to, and that federal laws prohibiting discrimination are an overreach of their constitutional power. But second, they are asserting that municipal governments have no such power, either.

I expect that, if the ACC takes any action similar to the NCAA's, you will see a massive counterattack against the BOT's over which they have oversight and appointment authority. The state's GOP isn't going down without a fight on this, and they will view any effort by the courts to overturn this law as just more red meat to throw to their supporters.

These guys are all on the wrong side of history, political opinion, demographics and the legal system, among other things.

They may piss and moan and try to hold on to and wield political power in rural North Carolina, but will soon find themselves crushed between the national (Federal) and the local governments and the overall political opinion of the country.

It takes time for these cases to wind their way through the court system, but these laws will all ultimately be struck down.

I find it ironic that folks who complain about Federal power and overreach have no problems at all overriding the will of the people and the elected officials in the cities and local governments.

As far as I can tell, they favor only narrow political power on the state level that they can control and try to use to force their increasingly unpopular and unsupported political beliefs on everyone else.

When big business, of all things, is against you for economic reasons, then you have to question your official status as a Republican based upon your discriminatory belief systems.

Easy fix for the football championship is to let the higher seed host. I don't know what the contract with Charlotte looks like. It could possibly prevent it. It seems highly unlikely event a NC team makes it to the championship much less winds up as the higher seed.

(09-13-2016 11:04 AM)Wolfman Wrote:  ...It seems highly unlikely event a NC team makes it to the championship much less winds up as the higher seed.

Truth!

UNC could still repeat as Coastal champs, but won't be higher seed than the Atlantic champ.

It is way too early for the ACC to consider a physical move. I believe they own the building in Greensboro. If the courts were to uphold the law then it would be time to look at options.

(09-13-2016 11:07 AM)Wolfman Wrote:  It is way too early for the ACC to consider a physical move. I believe they own the building in Greensboro. If the courts were to uphold the law then it would be time to look at options.

The logistics of a physical move are daunting. That's a lot of people to relocate. And it's one thing to move tournaments around. But what other single location makes more sense for the conference offices than the one we have?

(09-13-2016 06:39 AM)Dasville Wrote:  http://www.sbnation.com/college-basketba...mpionships

Includes statements from Duke and NCST.

State's comments were much more neutral than Duke's. I'm sure they are aware of the NC legislature's ability to punish them - a problem Duke doesn't have.

The pressure is building on the state government in North Carolina. If i were a hotel or restaurant or retail store owner in North Carolina, i would be furious with the state government. The state government has to realize that bankrupting other businesses in the state is not good. Doing things intentionally to remove jobs from the state usually doesn't go over well with the voters. I don't know of the situation in North Carolina but I wonder whether the state government will start to feel the heat from the various business lobby groups.

Keep the events in North Carolina. The ACC needs to standby the state.

I'm on a college campus. They've changed some of the men's rooms to "all-genders" and leave the women's room alone. It's super awkward.

But there's really no issue here. It shouldn't be legislated one way or another. Nobody gave a sh@t before about who used which bathroom.

(09-13-2016 11:44 AM)OrangeCrush22 Wrote:  Keep the events in North Carolina. The ACC needs to standby the state.

I'm on a college campus. They've changed some of the men's rooms to "all-genders" and leave the women's room alone. It's super awkward.

But there's really no issue here. It shouldn't be legislated one way or another. Nobody gave a sh@t before about who used which bathroom.

As lumberpack pointed out (correctly, IMO) the bathroom part of this bill, which gets all the attention, is really just a red herring, and has little practical impact. It isn't now, and never was, a problem in NC or anywhere else. But it does get the troops fired up, and provides fodder for campaign commercials. State Republicans want their supporters angry, and debate about the so-called "Dillon Rule" doesn't do that well enough.

(09-13-2016 11:44 AM)OrangeCrush22 Wrote:  Keep the events in North Carolina. The ACC needs to standby the state.

I'm on a college campus. They've changed some of the men's rooms to "all-genders" and leave the women's room alone. It's super awkward.

But there's really no issue here. It shouldn't be legislated one way or another. Nobody gave a sh@t before about who used which bathroom.

As Lumber pointed out this is about more than which bathroom you use. The events need to be removed from NC.