(06-22-2016 12:08 PM)Tom in Lazybrook Wrote:  

(06-22-2016 12:06 PM)SuperFlyBCat Wrote:  

(06-22-2016 12:01 PM)Tom in Lazybrook Wrote:  

(06-22-2016 11:44 AM)UTSAMarineVet09 Wrote:  

(06-22-2016 11:32 AM)Tom in Lazybrook Wrote:  First question I asked in the first post I made after the attack touched on this.

So was this internalized homophobia? radical Islamic terrorism? or just some crazy guy with access to military grade firearms?

military grade firearms?

I stand by my comment. The AR 15 isn't good for hunting or self defense.

Excellent for both.

Really? You gonna eat a deer shot up by 50 bullets? How about defending yourself in a crowded bar or movie theater with that weapon?

Why would anyone pull a trigger 50 times and blast a deer 50 times? With any gun?

Why would it be bad to have one as a back up in the event of some crazies,druggies breaking in to Your home. Hand gun for general protection, AR15 as the go to in case They are also well armed.

I prefer the AR15 over a handgun for home defense. The AR15 was designed for close quarters and I feel more comfortable handling the AR15 than any other weapon out there.

In the pre-AR-15 era, if you wanted a gun for shooting little groundhogs, a gun for shooting giant feral hogs, and a gun for home defense, you'd buy three different guns in three different calibers and configurations. With the AR platform, a person with absolutely no gunsmithing expertise can buy one gun and a bunch of accessories, and optimize that gun for the application at hand. You can even make an AR-15 into a pistol.

Indeed, anyone who tells you that the AR-15 is bad for hunting and home defense has absolutely no idea what they're talking about, because by definition an AR is a gun that can be exquisitely adapted for those niches and many others

http://www.vox.com/2016/6/20/11975850/ar...er-orlando

(06-22-2016 11:32 AM)Tom in Lazybrook Wrote:  First question I asked in the first post I made after the attack touched on this.

So was this internalized homophobia? radical Islamic terrorism? or just some crazy guy with access to military grade firearms?

I suspect it was a mix of the first two but ask to "military grade firearms"....

The Sig Sauer MCX is not a military grade rifle.

When people think self-defense, handguns most often come to mind. But with its versatile design, higher capacity and a wealth of great ammo options available, an AR just might be the only home defense gun you’ll ever need to own.

http://www.gundigest.com/tactical-gear/a...fense-guns

(06-22-2016 12:08 PM)Tom in Lazybrook Wrote:  

(06-22-2016 12:06 PM)SuperFlyBCat Wrote:  

(06-22-2016 12:01 PM)Tom in Lazybrook Wrote:  

(06-22-2016 11:44 AM)UTSAMarineVet09 Wrote:  

(06-22-2016 11:32 AM)Tom in Lazybrook Wrote:  First question I asked in the first post I made after the attack touched on this.

So was this internalized homophobia? radical Islamic terrorism? or just some crazy guy with access to military grade firearms?

military grade firearms?

I stand by my comment. The AR 15 isn't good for hunting or self defense.

Excellent for both.

Really? You gonna eat a deer shot up by 50 bullets? How about defending yourself in a crowded bar or movie theater with that weapon?

First off I'm not going to use an AR15 chambered in 5.56mm/.223 caliber to shoot deer because in my opinion (and the opinion of many, many others) it's simply inadequate as an effective hunting round because it's not powerful enough. The smallest round I personally will use to hunt deer is a .243 and it uses a bullet that is twice the size of the ones fired by the standard AR platform rifle. My main deer rifle is chambered in .30-06 Springfield and the bullet I uses is just shy of three times the size that our military issues to the troops.

Just as an aside there are a number of states that do not allow firearms chambered in the standard AR15 ammunition (5.56mm or .223 caliber) for deer hunting because it lacks the power to humanely kill deer sized animals. Humans are larger than deer.

Second, because I use an adequate caliber firearm and am proficient with my rifle 99% of the time it only takes me one shot to kill my deer.

Third, you don't use a rifle to defend yourself in bars or theaters. For those situation you need a handgun. You do, however, defend yourself at home with a long gun.


That being said an AR15 is excellent for certain types of hunting an home defense for the reasons why it is inadequate for deer hunting. It's great for varmint hunting and hunting smaller game because it's lightweight so you don't get as fatigued carrying it around all day on stalks and the large capacity magazines along with low recoil allow for quick follow up shots. It's great for home defense because you can easily customize the gun to fit your needs. With an adjustable stock you can fit the gun to whoever is shooting the gun at that time then back to the original configuration in seconds allowing for multiple people to comfortably use the same gun. My wife's arms are shorter than mine and she's substantially smaller than I am so the guns that are comfortable for me to shoot aren't for her. Instead of buying "his and her's" home defense weapons we can buy just one and in a matter of seconds it's a perfect fit. The light weight and low recoil also mean she isn't going to be as scared to shoot an AR compared to one of my other rifles. It takes me less than a minute to attach a flashlight to an AR while solidly attaching one to my deer rifle would take 30 minutes or more and involve a drill, etc.

so this wasn't ISIS?

(06-22-2016 12:01 PM)Tom in Lazybrook Wrote:  

(06-22-2016 11:44 AM)UTSAMarineVet09 Wrote:  

(06-22-2016 11:32 AM)Tom in Lazybrook Wrote:  First question I asked in the first post I made after the attack touched on this.

So was this internalized homophobia? radical Islamic terrorism? or just some crazy guy with access to military grade firearms?

military grade firearms?

I stand by my comment. The AR 15 isn't good for hunting or self defense.

You are the village idiot if you really believe that.

(06-22-2016 12:35 PM)Kaplony Wrote:  First off I'm not going to use an AR15 chambered in 5.56mm/.223 caliber to shoot deer because in my opinion (and the opinion of many, many others) it's simply inadequate as an effective hunting round because it's not powerful enough. The smallest round I personally will use to hunt deer is a .243 and it uses a bullet that is twice the size of the ones fired by the standard AR platform rifle. My main deer rifle is chambered in .30-06 Springfield and the bullet I uses is just shy of three times the size that our military issues to the troops.

Just as an aside there are a number of states that do not allow firearms chambered in the standard AR15 ammunition (5.56mm or .223 caliber) for deer hunting because it lacks the power to humanely kill deer sized animals. Humans are larger than deer.

Second, because I use an adequate caliber firearm and am proficient with my rifle 99% of the time it only takes me one shot to kill my deer.

Third, you don't use a rifle to defend yourself in bars or theaters. For those situation you need a handgun. You do, however, defend yourself at home with a long gun.


That being said an AR15 is excellent for certain types of hunting an home defense for the reasons why it is inadequate for deer hunting. It's great for varmint hunting and hunting smaller game because it's lightweight so you don't get as fatigued carrying it around all day on stalks and the large capacity magazines along with low recoil allow for quick follow up shots. It's great for home defense because you can easily customize the gun to fit your needs. With an adjustable stock you can fit the gun to whoever is shooting the gun at that time then back to the original configuration in seconds allowing for multiple people to comfortably use the same gun. My wife's arms are shorter than mine and she's substantially smaller than I am so the guns that are comfortable for me to shoot aren't for her. Instead of buying "his and her's" home defense weapons we can buy just one and in a matter of seconds it's a perfect fit. The light weight and low recoil also mean she isn't going to be as scared to shoot an AR compared to one of my other rifles. It takes me less than a minute to attach a flashlight to an AR while solidly attaching one to my deer rifle would take 30 minutes or more and involve a drill, etc.

As a hunter and owner of a .223 semi-automatic, I have to agree with this.

(06-22-2016 12:40 PM)rath v2.0 Wrote:  

(06-22-2016 12:01 PM)Tom in Lazybrook Wrote:  

(06-22-2016 11:44 AM)UTSAMarineVet09 Wrote:  

(06-22-2016 11:32 AM)Tom in Lazybrook Wrote:  First question I asked in the first post I made after the attack touched on this.

So was this internalized homophobia? radical Islamic terrorism? or just some crazy guy with access to military grade firearms?

military grade firearms?

I stand by my comment. The AR 15 isn't good for hunting or self defense.

You are the village idiot if you really believe that.

The only gun Tom owns fires "blanks"

(06-22-2016 12:18 PM)Paul M Wrote:  

(06-22-2016 12:08 PM)Tom in Lazybrook Wrote:  

(06-22-2016 12:06 PM)SuperFlyBCat Wrote:  

(06-22-2016 12:01 PM)Tom in Lazybrook Wrote:  

(06-22-2016 11:44 AM)UTSAMarineVet09 Wrote:  military grade firearms?

I stand by my comment. The AR 15 isn't good for hunting or self defense.

Excellent for both.

Really? You gonna eat a deer shot up by 50 bullets? How about defending yourself in a crowded bar or movie theater with that weapon?

Why would anyone pull a trigger 50 times and blast a deer 50 times? With any gun?

This is how unhinged liberals get themselves all worked up into a fantastic panic over things they have no facts about.

Why do people keep talking about the AR15 with this guy? He didn't even use an AR15.

Piecing it all together, simply sounds like he was raised in a strict Islamic household with a Taliban dad, which he supported. But Mateen went years living a hidden gay lifestyle. He still married a woman (and beat her) to keep the charade going, and resenting other gay guys who were out and carefree.

So he was a walking self-loathing conflict every single day, and the only thing he knew how to deal with it was be violent.

One day a gay lover upset him somehow, like the article says, and that pushed him completely over to Taliban dad - maybe he began to realize the old man was right all along. So to go out with a bang, he pledged full support to ISIS and their nutjob leaders, and to take out some Latino gay people.

Yes, ISIS and the teachings of warped, fundie Islam influenced this situation. But let's be honest here, it's a different set of circumstances than we're used to seeing.

(06-22-2016 12:44 PM)TheEagleWay Wrote:  

(06-22-2016 12:35 PM)Kaplony Wrote:  First off I'm not going to use an AR15 chambered in 5.56mm/.223 caliber to shoot deer because in my opinion (and the opinion of many, many others) it's simply inadequate as an effective hunting round because it's not powerful enough. The smallest round I personally will use to hunt deer is a .243 and it uses a bullet that is twice the size of the ones fired by the standard AR platform rifle. My main deer rifle is chambered in .30-06 Springfield and the bullet I uses is just shy of three times the size that our military issues to the troops.

Just as an aside there are a number of states that do not allow firearms chambered in the standard AR15 ammunition (5.56mm or .223 caliber) for deer hunting because it lacks the power to humanely kill deer sized animals. Humans are larger than deer.

Second, because I use an adequate caliber firearm and am proficient with my rifle 99% of the time it only takes me one shot to kill my deer.

Third, you don't use a rifle to defend yourself in bars or theaters. For those situation you need a handgun. You do, however, defend yourself at home with a long gun.


That being said an AR15 is excellent for certain types of hunting an home defense for the reasons why it is inadequate for deer hunting. It's great for varmint hunting and hunting smaller game because it's lightweight so you don't get as fatigued carrying it around all day on stalks and the large capacity magazines along with low recoil allow for quick follow up shots. It's great for home defense because you can easily customize the gun to fit your needs. With an adjustable stock you can fit the gun to whoever is shooting the gun at that time then back to the original configuration in seconds allowing for multiple people to comfortably use the same gun. My wife's arms are shorter than mine and she's substantially smaller than I am so the guns that are comfortable for me to shoot aren't for her. Instead of buying "his and her's" home defense weapons we can buy just one and in a matter of seconds it's a perfect fit. The light weight and low recoil also mean she isn't going to be as scared to shoot an AR compared to one of my other rifles. It takes me less than a minute to attach a flashlight to an AR while solidly attaching one to my deer rifle would take 30 minutes or more and involve a drill, etc.

As a hunter and owner of a .223 semi-automatic, I have to agree with this.

Could I kill deer with a 5.56mm/.223 rifle? Of course I could. I've both shot and hunted enough that I feel I could be very effective killing deer with one the majority of the time. However it would mean that I be willing to accept that there will be more times that I wound a deer and not recover it because something wasn't just right. I strive to drop my deer where they stand with absolutely no suffering and as little blood trailing as possible because it's the humane thing to do. With the small caliber bullet you are going to have more run off and take longer to die than they will with a larger caliber bullet. I know people who use an AR to deer hunt and they kill deer, but it almost always involves having to blood trail them. I prefer to just drive the four wheeler up to where they fell in their tracks. I'm getting older and I'm beat up from a career of crawling down dark, smoky hallways. Time to give these old bones a rest!

How does one become a gay Muslim?

(06-22-2016 12:08 PM)Tom in Lazybrook Wrote:  

(06-22-2016 12:06 PM)SuperFlyBCat Wrote:  

(06-22-2016 12:01 PM)Tom in Lazybrook Wrote:  

(06-22-2016 11:44 AM)UTSAMarineVet09 Wrote:  

(06-22-2016 11:32 AM)Tom in Lazybrook Wrote:  First question I asked in the first post I made after the attack touched on this.

So was this internalized homophobia? radical Islamic terrorism? or just some crazy guy with access to military grade firearms?

military grade firearms?

I stand by my comment. The AR 15 isn't good for hunting or self defense.

Excellent for both.

Really? You gonna eat a deer shot up by 50 bullets? How about defending yourself in a crowded bar or movie theater with that weapon?

Look, you really don't know anything about firearms. Please stop, you're embarrassing yourself.

I guess you are born that way.

(06-22-2016 01:32 PM)Fitbud Wrote:  How does one become a gay Muslim?

And who drinks too much.

Anyone who needs an ar15 to go hunting should consider another hobby