(12-15-2015 12:07 PM)UCF08 Wrote:  

(12-15-2015 12:03 PM)I45owl Wrote:  

(12-15-2015 12:00 PM)UCF08 Wrote:  

(12-15-2015 11:58 AM)shiftyeagle Wrote:  

(12-15-2015 11:38 AM)UCF08 Wrote:  Since when is complex pharmacology and embryology supposed to be common sense? If a clinically depressed woman gets pregnant, and taking her off antidepressants could lead to her falling into a deep depression and reverting to abusing drugs or suicide, then "common sense" would dictate the antidepressants are the better option.

Than increased chances of giving her child autism?

I don't know why people have had their heads buried in the sand for so long about this issue. Everyone knows damn well why autism rates are skyrocketing in the United States of Overmedication.

You really need to stop right here before you dig yourself a bigger hole.

Well, who needs proof when "everyone knows"?

Sad thing is, the biggest single reason for the increase in autism diagnoses is that they changed the diagnosis for autism in a way that inherently includes more people. It'd be like lowering the BMI standard for what counts as obese and then wondering a year later why our obesity rates skyrocketed so quickly.

It is more than just depression, it is hormones. Putting a fetus through a constant state of stress and pumping its system with cortisol is much more dangerous than the relatively minor risk of an SSRI. Without the right hormonal balance, the fetus will not develop properly. SSRIs are way overprescribed and depression causes are broadly misdiagnosed... this needs to be looked into and studied at length... but they are also addictive drugs and pregnancy is not a good time to try to wean off them. The time to work on weaning off them is when your hormones are normal and you are back into a normal life routine.

It's a wonder humanity perpetuated itself before the introduction of anti-depressants and opiods. I don't know how people dealt with life before that.

And then there's this:

https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/to-y...r-doctors/

Muh fibromyalgia!

(12-15-2015 12:37 PM)shiftyeagle Wrote:  It's a wonder humanity perpetuated itself before the introduction of anti-depressants and opiods. I don't know how people dealt with life before that.

And then there's this:

https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/to-y...r-doctors/

Muh fibromyalgia!

Humanity perpetuated itself long before antibiotics, and germ theory too. Your point is totally invalid.

(12-15-2015 12:55 PM)UCF08 Wrote:  

(12-15-2015 12:37 PM)shiftyeagle Wrote:  It's a wonder humanity perpetuated itself before the introduction of anti-depressants and opiods. I don't know how people dealt with life before that.

And then there's this:

https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/to-y...r-doctors/

Muh fibromyalgia!

Humanity perpetuated itself long before antibiotics, and germ theory too. Your point is totally invalid.

Because drugs that kill bacteria with limited side effects are the same as anti-depressants often associated with insane side effects, many being serious/severe, and links to autism in children.

Good comparison.

(12-15-2015 12:57 PM)shiftyeagle Wrote:  

(12-15-2015 12:55 PM)UCF08 Wrote:  

(12-15-2015 12:37 PM)shiftyeagle Wrote:  It's a wonder humanity perpetuated itself before the introduction of anti-depressants and opiods. I don't know how people dealt with life before that.

And then there's this:

https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/to-y...r-doctors/

Muh fibromyalgia!

Humanity perpetuated itself long before antibiotics, and germ theory too. Your point is totally invalid.

Because drugs that kill bacteria with limited side effects are the same as anti-depressants often associated with insane side effects, many being serious/severe, and links to autism in children.

Good comparison.

Looking past the fact that antibiotics have all sorts of serious side effects like acute allergic reactions, and their use to treat infections is one of the most common causes of septic shock, the comparison I made wasn't predicated on their relative safety and efficacy. Your absurd statement implied that since humans survived without antidepressants, we should deal with life without them. I outlined the absurdity of your statement by mentioning two things that are relatively uncontroversial and widely used that we survived without.

Honest question, what was your highest level course in the biological sciences?

I'm glad you mentioned that. Because people that are subject to said side effects don't take those antibiotics. Thus why your doctor will ask if you are allergic to certain antibiotics if you get an infection of some sort for instance. Woot woot common sense.

Now that science has proven a link between anti-depressants and autism, I wonder if doctors will accordingly inform patients not to take those medications because of severe side effects. And not even temporary side effects, mind you. Permanent, irreversible side effects.

My statement implied nothing of the sort actually. Hell, my dad was on that shiit for several years. I take opiods from time to time because I have severe sciatic nerve problems. What I meant to imply, however, is the obvious prescription drug epidemic we have in this country. The over-relied-upon, over-prescribed, abused medications......specifically anti-depressants and opiods (reference last article). It's a real problem in this country and unfortunately one that really isn't addressed by anyone because of muh fibromyalgia and muh attention-deficit.

Lumping opiates and antidepressants together in a discussion of drugs which are overprescribed and abused is where you lose anyone who have knowledge in the healthcare industry, pharmacology, or biology.

(12-15-2015 01:16 PM)UCF08 Wrote:  Lumping opiates and antidepressants together in a discussion of drugs which are overprescribed and abused is where you lose anyone who have knowledge in the healthcare industry, pharmacology, or biology.

They're both overprescribed and abused.

But by all means, let's keep our heads buried because some of the abusers' feels might get hurt.

(12-15-2015 01:18 PM)shiftyeagle Wrote:  

(12-15-2015 01:16 PM)UCF08 Wrote:  Lumping opiates and antidepressants together in a discussion of drugs which are overprescribed and abused is where you lose anyone who have knowledge in the healthcare industry, pharmacology, or biology.

They're both overprescribed and abused.

But by all means, let's keep our heads buried because some of the abusers' feels might get hurt.

Ok, let's try another route, which of the most commonly prescribed antidepressants do you think are 'abused'?

(12-15-2015 01:19 PM)UCF08 Wrote:  

(12-15-2015 01:18 PM)shiftyeagle Wrote:  

(12-15-2015 01:16 PM)UCF08 Wrote:  Lumping opiates and antidepressants together in a discussion of drugs which are overprescribed and abused is where you lose anyone who have knowledge in the healthcare industry, pharmacology, or biology.

They're both overprescribed and abused.

But by all means, let's keep our heads buried because some of the abusers' feels might get hurt.

Ok, let's try another route, which of the most commonly prescribed antidepressants do you think are 'abused'?

Well, let's consult Mr. Google Search.

It appears that the leaders in the clubhouse are Prozac, Paxil, Zoloft, and Lexapro.

Dude....you don't "abuse" those drugs....there aren't awesome amazing feelings you get after taking them that makes you want to take more....it flattens out all your senses, gives you night sweats and tremors, brain shocks, nausea, dizzyness, headaches, drowsiness....the list goes on and on.

People aren't going to street dealers trying to get a bump of Zoloft. You sound like a total fool in this thread.

(12-15-2015 01:38 PM)MonarchManiac Wrote:  Dude....you don't "abuse" those drugs....there aren't awesome amazing feelings you get after taking them that makes you want to take more....it flattens out all your senses, gives you night sweats and tremors, brain shocks, nausea, dizzyness, headaches, drowsiness....the list goes on and on.

People aren't going to street dealers trying to get a bump of Zoloft. You sound like a total fool in this thread.

Oh okay, so because you can't get "high" off them that means you can't abuse them?

Child, please.

(12-15-2015 01:26 PM)shiftyeagle Wrote:  

(12-15-2015 01:19 PM)UCF08 Wrote:  

(12-15-2015 01:18 PM)shiftyeagle Wrote:  

(12-15-2015 01:16 PM)UCF08 Wrote:  Lumping opiates and antidepressants together in a discussion of drugs which are overprescribed and abused is where you lose anyone who have knowledge in the healthcare industry, pharmacology, or biology.

They're both overprescribed and abused.

But by all means, let's keep our heads buried because some of the abusers' feels might get hurt.

Ok, let's try another route, which of the most commonly prescribed antidepressants do you think are 'abused'?

Well, let's consult Mr. Google Search.

It appears that the leaders in the clubhouse are Prozac, Paxil, Zoloft, and Lexapro.

You just googled the most common antidepressants when I asked you the most commonly abused antidepressants. Come on, if you want to be taken seriously about this sort of subject, show you have a vague understanding of the subject matter.

(12-15-2015 12:55 PM)UCF08 Wrote:  

(12-15-2015 12:37 PM)shiftyeagle Wrote:  It's a wonder humanity perpetuated itself before the introduction of anti-depressants and opiods. I don't know how people dealt with life before that.

And then there's this:

https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/to-y...r-doctors/

Muh fibromyalgia!

Humanity perpetuated itself long before antibiotics, and germ theory too. Your point is totally invalid.

Well one example of the pre/post introduction is increased life expectancy.

When antibiotics were first introduced in the late 1800s, life expectancy was 39 years. Fifty years later, life expectancy had increased to 65 years.

(12-15-2015 01:44 PM)UCF08 Wrote:  

(12-15-2015 01:26 PM)shiftyeagle Wrote:  

(12-15-2015 01:19 PM)UCF08 Wrote:  

(12-15-2015 01:18 PM)shiftyeagle Wrote:  

(12-15-2015 01:16 PM)UCF08 Wrote:  Lumping opiates and antidepressants together in a discussion of drugs which are overprescribed and abused is where you lose anyone who have knowledge in the healthcare industry, pharmacology, or biology.

They're both overprescribed and abused.

But by all means, let's keep our heads buried because some of the abusers' feels might get hurt.

Ok, let's try another route, which of the most commonly prescribed antidepressants do you think are 'abused'?

Well, let's consult Mr. Google Search.

It appears that the leaders in the clubhouse are Prozac, Paxil, Zoloft, and Lexapro.

You just googled the most common antidepressants when I asked you the most commonly abused antidepressants.

What are you, the Eye of Sauron and Big Brother's love child? No, those are the most "commonly abused" antidepressants accordingly to multiple sites.

They may very well be the most common ones as well. 'Twould make sense, now wouldn't it?

(12-15-2015 01:39 PM)shiftyeagle Wrote:  

(12-15-2015 01:38 PM)MonarchManiac Wrote:  Dude....you don't "abuse" those drugs....there aren't awesome amazing feelings you get after taking them that makes you want to take more....it flattens out all your senses, gives you night sweats and tremors, brain shocks, nausea, dizzyness, headaches, drowsiness....the list goes on and on.

People aren't going to street dealers trying to get a bump of Zoloft. You sound like a total fool in this thread.

Oh okay, so because you can't get "high" off them that means you can't abuse them?

Child, please.

Have you taken anti-depressants? Do you know why people abuse drugs?

I'm sure a couple idiots are abusing them, but the vast majority won't get anything out of it. There's no motivator.

(12-15-2015 02:01 PM)shiftyeagle Wrote:  

(12-15-2015 01:44 PM)UCF08 Wrote:  

(12-15-2015 01:26 PM)shiftyeagle Wrote:  

(12-15-2015 01:19 PM)UCF08 Wrote:  

(12-15-2015 01:18 PM)shiftyeagle Wrote:  They're both overprescribed and abused.

But by all means, let's keep our heads buried because some of the abusers' feels might get hurt.

Ok, let's try another route, which of the most commonly prescribed antidepressants do you think are 'abused'?

Well, let's consult Mr. Google Search.

It appears that the leaders in the clubhouse are Prozac, Paxil, Zoloft, and Lexapro.

You just googled the most common antidepressants when I asked you the most commonly abused antidepressants.

What are you, the Eye of Sauron and Big Brother's love child? No, those are the most "commonly abused" antidepressants accordingly to multiple sites.

They may very well be the most common ones as well. 'Twould make sense, now wouldn't it?

Which sites?

EDIT: I don't ask that flippantly, I am asking because the first results on google are from HIGHLY questionable sources, and the first legitimate article I saw on the matter stated basically what I know from past education and personal experience. That some of the less prescribed antidepressants can be abused as they have a stimulant-like effect, but the SSRIs you're stating above are rarely abused, ostensibly because they don't have any effect that is desirable for abuse. I need to know what source you're pulling this from because those I've seen at a quick glance read like scientology fronts which are just patently anti-psychology.

(12-15-2015 01:15 PM)shiftyeagle Wrote:  Now that science has proven a link between anti-depressants and autism, I wonder if doctors will accordingly inform patients not to take those medications because of severe side effects. And not even temporary side effects, mind you. Permanent, irreversible side effects.

You keep using "link" and "side-effect" to mean the same thing, but they are not.

If you had actually read the article that you posted in the OP, you would have found that your answer is a decided and emphatic no, because the editorial published alongside the study in JAMA specifically cautioned against doing something so foolish and irrational.

Study finds link between autism and mother's antidepressant use - CBS News

http://www.cbsnews.com/news/is-there-a-l...ssant-use/ Wrote:"It makes no more sense to suggest that [antidepressants] should always be avoided than to say that they should never be stopped," King wrote in the editorial.

(12-15-2015 04:03 PM)I45owl Wrote:  

(12-15-2015 01:15 PM)shiftyeagle Wrote:  Now that science has proven a link between anti-depressants and autism, I wonder if doctors will accordingly inform patients not to take those medications because of severe side effects. And not even temporary side effects, mind you. Permanent, irreversible side effects.

You keep using "link" and "side-effect" to mean the same thing, but they are not.

If you had actually read the article that you posted in the OP, you would have found that your answer is a decided and emphatic no, because the editorial published alongside the study in JAMA specifically cautioned against doing something so foolish and irrational.

Study finds link between autism and mother's antidepressant use - CBS News

http://www.cbsnews.com/news/is-there-a-l...ssant-use/ Wrote:"It makes no more sense to suggest that [antidepressants] should always be avoided than to say that they should never be stopped," King wrote in the editorial.

I never said they should always be avoided.

But I did say that only an idiot would believe that a woman could take these drugs whilst pregnant with no risk of permanently damaging their child.

Now, that risk/link has been scientifically proven.

So yes, expectant mothers should think twice about their antidepressant regimen whilst pregnant. It would simply be selfish as **** otherwise.

(12-15-2015 03:24 PM)UCF08 Wrote:  Which sites?

If Lord Xenu comes up in this thread, you are bound by honor to take a shot of tequila.