(09-08-2015 11:58 PM)Chef Owl Wrote:  The fact that Rice University Bands gets very little support is baffling to me. Doesn't Rice cultivate the image of diversity, uniqueness, and acceptance? Isn't that what "unconventional wisdom" is about.

Sadly, Rice's general lack of school spirit towards athletics (from the administration down) is what's unconventional.

(09-07-2015 05:06 PM)texowl2 Wrote:  

(09-06-2015 10:16 AM)Vegas Owl Wrote:  Although it was hot as a bear, it was a lot of fun out there in HRS yesterday. No complaints, because at least we don't have to wear suits like fans did in the 50's.

yeah but, the games in the 50's didn't start until mid-late September and kickoff was at 7pm until at least mid-October

Exactly, I really don't understand why RICE would allow scheduling of September / early October afternoon games?? I sit in the shade, but I really feel sorry for ALL the Players, Coaches and fans on the East side, which includes the MOB and Student Section, oddly. They should be able to sit on the West side during day games. Might get MORE STUDENTS to attend?

(09-09-2015 07:20 AM)OWLmanz Wrote:  

(09-07-2015 05:06 PM)texowl2 Wrote:  

(09-06-2015 10:16 AM)Vegas Owl Wrote:  Although it was hot as a bear, it was a lot of fun out there in HRS yesterday. No complaints, because at least we don't have to wear suits like fans did in the 50's.

yeah but, the games in the 50's didn't start until mid-late September and kickoff was at 7pm until at least mid-October

Exactly, I really don't understand why RICE would allow scheduling of September / early October afternoon games?? I sit in the shade, but I really feel sorry for ALL the Players, Coaches and fans on the East side, which includes the MOB and Student Section, oddly. They should be able to sit on the West side during day games. Might get MORE STUDENTS to attend?

silly you, scheduling of all college games is 100% a function of the whims of the TV god$. period end of story. Do you really think that any team (even the ESU's of the world) would say no to TV wanting a game on a Wednesday at 530am?

(09-09-2015 09:42 AM)texowl2 Wrote:  

(09-09-2015 07:20 AM)OWLmanz Wrote:  

(09-07-2015 05:06 PM)texowl2 Wrote:  

(09-06-2015 10:16 AM)Vegas Owl Wrote:  Although it was hot as a bear, it was a lot of fun out there in HRS yesterday. No complaints, because at least we don't have to wear suits like fans did in the 50's.

yeah but, the games in the 50's didn't start until mid-late September and kickoff was at 7pm until at least mid-October

Exactly, I really don't understand why RICE would allow scheduling of September / early October afternoon games?? I sit in the shade, but I really feel sorry for ALL the Players, Coaches and fans on the East side, which includes the MOB and Student Section, oddly. They should be able to sit on the West side during day games. Might get MORE STUDENTS to attend?

silly you, scheduling of all college games is 100% a function of the whims of the TV god$. period end of story. Do you really think that any team (even the ESU's of the world) would say no to TV wanting a game on a Wednesday at 530am?

But is it worth the small viewership on ASN? The games are not on the ESPN family or even FS1. I would rather build the fanbase at the stadium.

(09-09-2015 09:48 AM)WIowl Wrote:  

(09-09-2015 09:42 AM)texowl2 Wrote:  

(09-09-2015 07:20 AM)OWLmanz Wrote:  

(09-07-2015 05:06 PM)texowl2 Wrote:  

(09-06-2015 10:16 AM)Vegas Owl Wrote:  Although it was hot as a bear, it was a lot of fun out there in HRS yesterday. No complaints, because at least we don't have to wear suits like fans did in the 50's.

yeah but, the games in the 50's didn't start until mid-late September and kickoff was at 7pm until at least mid-October

Exactly, I really don't understand why RICE would allow scheduling of September / early October afternoon games?? I sit in the shade, but I really feel sorry for ALL the Players, Coaches and fans on the East side, which includes the MOB and Student Section, oddly. They should be able to sit on the West side during day games. Might get MORE STUDENTS to attend?

silly you, scheduling of all college games is 100% a function of the whims of the TV god$. period end of story. Do you really think that any team (even the ESU's of the world) would say no to TV wanting a game on a Wednesday at 530am?

But is it worth the small viewership on ASN? The games are not on the ESPN family or even FS1. I would rather build the fanbase at the stadium.

Without the TV dollars, you don't get good enough to bring the fan base to the stadium.

With ASN? What TV dollars?

(09-08-2015 11:58 PM)Chef Owl Wrote:  

(09-08-2015 11:31 PM)KTOWL Wrote:  

(09-07-2015 05:39 PM)Almadenmike Wrote:  I haven't seen any mention of the MOB's Wagner game show/script. What was it? How well was it received (by students and/or alums/general fans?

I heard from a couple of friends that attended and said it was awful borderline embarrassing.

A couple of years ago this could be thought of as talking about the football team. Yet many people stuck with it and now, with the support of those people, the football program is on the rise again. I've never understood how anyone whose criticism is "embarrassing". Did you go out there and do anything? Did you put any time or effort into a creative endeavor? How can you be embarrassed by something you had nothing to do with? When the football team sucked, it was the MOB who was the majority of students cheering on the team providing support unconditionally. What made The MOB great is that it provided a creative outlet for a bunch of really smart, really geeky kids. It was a great place to blow off some steam and meet some like minded individuals, make friends, and hang out on a regular basis. It kind of pisses me off when members of the Rice community try to act like the cool kids and look down on the MOB. Sure, not every show is going to be gem. But I think the MOB's main function should be more about school spirit and support. The fact that Rice University Bands gets very little support is baffling to me. Doesn't Rice cultivate the image of diversity, uniqueness, and acceptance? Isn't that what "unconventional wisdom" is about.

This

Amen. No offense KT... as you didn't make the claim... but the MOB is a key attribute/feature of Rice. The 'odder' they are, the more I like referencing them. I'd love for them to be viewed as they have been in the past... as something crazy you just have to see.

(09-09-2015 12:17 AM)Almadenmike Wrote:  Sadly, Rice's general lack of school spirit towards athletics (from the administration down) is what's unconventional.

Without disagreeing with the tone, I think we have a situation where the administration is actually supportive of athletics, but they see it as an 'option' for the students rather than an integral part of the Rice culture. While it certainly beats where we have sometimes been, I'd contrast it with UH's posture which is an almost extreme 'all in' on athletics. I'm not advocating for that by any means, but we've seen what apathetic administrations can do, and I'm using it as an example of one that is perhaps overly-zealous.

Frankly, I think a little investment in the MOB would go a long way towards solving this effort... as I see the MOB as the key conduit to the students. Of course we want them supporting the team, and by doing so, they engage some of the students who might not otherwise be interested in sports to do so as well. Students who don't understand football still understand poking fun at other schools or politicians or other 'inside' jokes.

(09-09-2015 10:34 AM)Hambone10 Wrote:  

(09-08-2015 11:58 PM)Chef Owl Wrote:  

(09-08-2015 11:31 PM)KTOWL Wrote:  

(09-07-2015 05:39 PM)Almadenmike Wrote:  I haven't seen any mention of the MOB's Wagner game show/script. What was it? How well was it received (by students and/or alums/general fans?

I heard from a couple of friends that attended and said it was awful borderline embarrassing.

A couple of years ago this could be thought of as talking about the football team. Yet many people stuck with it and now, with the support of those people, the football program is on the rise again. I've never understood how anyone whose criticism is "embarrassing". Did you go out there and do anything? Did you put any time or effort into a creative endeavor? How can you be embarrassed by something you had nothing to do with? When the football team sucked, it was the MOB who was the majority of students cheering on the team providing support unconditionally. What made The MOB great is that it provided a creative outlet for a bunch of really smart, really geeky kids. It was a great place to blow off some steam and meet some like minded individuals, make friends, and hang out on a regular basis. It kind of pisses me off when members of the Rice community try to act like the cool kids and look down on the MOB. Sure, not every show is going to be gem. But I think the MOB's main function should be more about school spirit and support. The fact that Rice University Bands gets very little support is baffling to me. Doesn't Rice cultivate the image of diversity, uniqueness, and acceptance? Isn't that what "unconventional wisdom" is about.

This

Amen. No offense KT... as you didn't make the claim... but the MOB is a key attribute/feature of Rice. The 'odder' they are, the more I like referencing them. I'd love for them to be viewed as they have been in the past... as something crazy you just have to see.

(09-09-2015 12:17 AM)Almadenmike Wrote:  Sadly, Rice's general lack of school spirit towards athletics (from the administration down) is what's unconventional.

Without disagreeing with the tone, I think we have a situation where the administration is actually supportive of athletics, but they see it as an 'option' for the students rather than an integral part of the Rice culture. While it certainly beats where we have sometimes been, I'd contrast it with UH's posture which is an almost extreme 'all in' on athletics. I'm not advocating for that by any means, but we've seen what apathetic administrations can do, and I'm using it as an example of one that is perhaps overly-zealous.

Frankly, I think a little investment in the MOB would go a long way towards solving this effort... as I see the MOB as the key conduit to the students. Of course we want them supporting the team, and by doing so, they engage some of the students who might not otherwise be interested in sports to do so as well. Students who don't understand football still understand poking fun at other schools or politicians or other 'inside' jokes.

I know you have a romantic notion of the MOB, but the reality is that they do not represent the football team, athletic program or university well at this point, despite the hard work and good intentions of those involved. I would even argue that the existence of the MOB in its current form only contributes to the image of Rice being 'small-time'. Unconventional and a little quirky is great. Weird to the point that no one understands what's going on except those involved, and so small that it seems sad is not.

The best atmosphere I have seen for a Rice Athletic event in the recent past was the MBB game against Charlotte when they had the guest band of I think HS kids who were loud and excited and pumped up the crowd continuously. I'd rather have that, or rotating HS guest bands at this point.

(09-09-2015 11:38 AM)Middle Ages Wrote:  I know you have a romantic notion of the MOB, but the reality is that they do not represent the football team, athletic program or university well at this point, despite the hard work and good intentions of those involved. I would even argue that the existence of the MOB in its current form only contributes to the image of Rice being 'small-time'. Unconventional and a little quirky is great. Weird to the point that no one understands what's going on except those involved, and so small that it seems sad is not.

The best atmosphere I have seen for a Rice Athletic event in the recent past was the MBB game against Charlotte when they had the guest band of I think HS kids who were loud and excited and pumped up the crowd continuously. I'd rather have that, or rotating HS guest bands at this point.

Perhaps I wasn't clear... because you don't reference anything I said... romantic or not.

The Mob connects the STUDENTS with the team... not us (fans) or the players, but the students. That's not romantic... it's the reality. They are odd and quirky because the average Rice student enjoys odd and quirky.

I'd agree that the MOB could connect us better to the fans as you suggest, but that isn't (imo) our problem... at least not one that the Mob should be tasked with solving. Our problem (that the MOB could possibly address) is our students, not the administration and not the fans. If you want the administration in even more, then unless you're writing a check, the key is to have the STUDENTS demand more.

Are they sometimes (too often) even more odd than we'd like them to be? Absolutely. Because we give them few resources and it's a relatively small group of people essentially amusing themselves, at their own expense. Seriously, if the only 'reward' you get for being in the Mob is your own amusement, is it a surprise that this is exactly what happens? It's hard to motivate 'volunteers' for something they don't somehow find value in doing.... and get them to invest multiple hours in the sun (not just on game day) to this task.

Sure, we could go the other direction and copy UNT or UT or A&M's model... but we won't succeed there either without resources. We already have the quirky reputation, albeit a little stale now. I liken us to SNL. We've had some good casts and some very mediocre ones.

Administration, give them some resources and motivation. They need to engage the atypical student/fan without alienating the traditionalists. I think if we gave some sort of class credit for PE or 'arts' or theater (assuming Shep continued to stonewall them) and a budget for some pizza and beer and costumes... maybe even like we used to do years ago, getting HS students to come play the music with us or even for us, letting the MOB be more of a theater troupe that plays music, I think they could do that again.

But it's hard to expect more than we are getting when they only thing they are getting for their efforts is their own amusement.

(09-09-2015 12:31 PM)Hambone10 Wrote:  The Mob connects the STUDENTS with the team... not us (fans) or the players, but the students. That's not romantic... it's the reality. They are odd and quirky because the average Rice student enjoys odd and quirky.

I'd agree that the MOB could connect us better to the fans as you suggest, but that isn't (imo) our problem... at least not one that the Mob should be tasked with solving. Our problem (that the MOB could possibly address) is our students, not the administration and not the fans. If you want the administration in even more, then unless you're writing a check, the key is to have the STUDENTS demand more.

Are they sometimes (too often) even more odd than we'd like them to be? Absolutely. Because we give them few resources and it's a relatively small group of people essentially amusing themselves, at their own expense. Seriously, if the only 'reward' you get for being in the Mob is your own amusement, is it a surprise that this is exactly what happens? It's hard to motivate 'volunteers' for something they don't somehow find value in doing.... and get them to invest multiple hours in the sun (not just on game day) to this task.

Sure, we could go the other direction and copy UNT or UT or A&M's model... but we won't succeed there either without resources. We already have the quirky reputation, albeit a little stale now. I liken us to SNL. We've had some good casts and some very mediocre ones.

Administration, give them some resources and motivation. They need to engage the atypical student/fan without alienating the traditionalists. I think if we gave some sort of class credit for PE or 'arts' or theater (assuming Shep continued to stonewall them) and a budget for some pizza and beer and costumes... maybe even like we used to do years ago, getting HS students to come play the music with us or even for us, letting the MOB be more of a theater troupe that plays music, I think they could do that again.

But it's hard to expect more than we are getting when they only thing they are getting for their efforts is their own amusement.

Very well stated. Having participated in the alumni MOB several years, and having experienced the current ghastly home they have been exiled to, it should be no surprise that the MOB only tries to please themselves - nobody else seems to care. Maybe if an effort was made to connect the MOB more with the football team, since football games are the main stage they appear on - have the MOB show up at the event the football team holds for the international students, play the school songs, interact with their fellow students and the football team, enjoy some pizza, whatever. I'm sure there are other possibilities.

The MOB (even though it wasn't the "MOB" of today those 50 years ago) was a significant part of my experience at Rice and I would like to see it not just survive but thrive, to be available for others who value the experience.

I invite anyone who hasn't done so to drop by the current "band hall" and see for themselves the level of neglect the administration has shown towards Rice Bands (which includes Rice Symphonic Band and the jazz band program). Just step inside, clap your hands, and count how long it takes for it to stop echoing. It's around 12-15 seconds, by my count.

Yes, the MOB could and should do better. But attracting and retaining clever scriptwriters is difficult enough when you have to try to write clever things about the University of Northeastern Tajikistan. It's almost impossible when the band is homeless.

Thursday, when I went to go get my horn out of the instrument closet before heading to HRS, I nearly got clocked in the face with a badminton racquet by one of the random people playing badminton in our "band hall" during a MOB activity.

Every Monday afternoon and Tuesday evening The MOB has to practice without any air conditioning in our "band hall" because the A/C in the old gym makes too much noise.

You get the band that you pay for. Right now, Rice is paying for practically no band at all, and unless they change their mind, that's exactly what they're going to get. Don't blame the MOBsters. They're doing the best they can with what they've got.

Maybe the MOB needs a band hall built right by the stadium.

Maybe the Shep needs to stop stonewalling them and realize that marching bands are a part of music. It is nice to have symphonic and chamber music but that is only a small part of what music is being demanded today. I may be a music snob but not to the extent that the Shep does it.

(09-09-2015 12:31 PM)Hambone10 Wrote:  

(09-09-2015 11:38 AM)Middle Ages Wrote:  I know you have a romantic notion of the MOB, but the reality is that they do not represent the football team, athletic program or university well at this point, despite the hard work and good intentions of those involved. I would even argue that the existence of the MOB in its current form only contributes to the image of Rice being 'small-time'. Unconventional and a little quirky is great. Weird to the point that no one understands what's going on except those involved, and so small that it seems sad is not.

The best atmosphere I have seen for a Rice Athletic event in the recent past was the MBB game against Charlotte when they had the guest band of I think HS kids who were loud and excited and pumped up the crowd continuously. I'd rather have that, or rotating HS guest bands at this point.

Perhaps I wasn't clear... because you don't reference anything I said... romantic or not.

The Mob connects the STUDENTS with the team... not us (fans) or the players, but the students. That's not romantic... it's the reality. They are odd and quirky because the average Rice student enjoys odd and quirky.

I'd agree that the MOB could connect us better to the fans as you suggest, but that isn't (imo) our problem... at least not one that the Mob should be tasked with solving. Our problem (that the MOB could possibly address) is our students, not the administration and not the fans. If you want the administration in even more, then unless you're writing a check, the key is to have the STUDENTS demand more.

Are they sometimes (too often) even more odd than we'd like them to be? Absolutely. Because we give them few resources and it's a relatively small group of people essentially amusing themselves, at their own expense. Seriously, if the only 'reward' you get for being in the Mob is your own amusement, is it a surprise that this is exactly what happens? It's hard to motivate 'volunteers' for something they don't somehow find value in doing.... and get them to invest multiple hours in the sun (not just on game day) to this task.

Sure, we could go the other direction and copy UNT or UT or A&M's model... but we won't succeed there either without resources. We already have the quirky reputation, albeit a little stale now. I liken us to SNL. We've had some good casts and some very mediocre ones.

Administration, give them some resources and motivation. They need to engage the atypical student/fan without alienating the traditionalists. I think if we gave some sort of class credit for PE or 'arts' or theater (assuming Shep continued to stonewall them) and a budget for some pizza and beer and costumes... maybe even like we used to do years ago, getting HS students to come play the music with us or even for us, letting the MOB be more of a theater troupe that plays music, I think they could do that again.

But it's hard to expect more than we are getting when they only thing they are getting for their efforts is their own amusement.

(09-09-2015 03:37 PM)75src Wrote:  Maybe the MOB needs a band hall built right by the stadium.

Maybe the mods should split this extended tangent on the state of the MOB into its own thread so the integrity of the Wagner game thread can be preserved.

Still waiting for some Valkyrie to ride around...

She's sweet on Wagner
I think she'd die for Beethoven
She loves the way Puccini lays down a tune
And Verdi's always creepin from her room

There's a story online tonight that UT is charging the Texas Tech band members $100 per member for tickets when they play each other this year on Thanksgiving. Are they charging the MOB this year? Is the MOB going to Austin?

Yes, they're charging The MOB too. Consequently, The MOB isn't going to Austin this weekend. The only planned away game for The MOB is UNT next week.

(09-10-2015 06:01 AM)KBROwl Wrote:  Yes, they're charging The MOB too. Consequently, The MOB isn't going to Austin this weekend. The only planned away game for The MOB is UNT next week.

Is this standard operating procedure? I understand that a school's band takes up seats, but sheesh, doing that just seems cheap.

(09-09-2015 12:31 PM)Hambone10 Wrote:  ... letting the MOB be more of a theater troupe that plays music...

This is actually how I describe The MOB to some of our potential students. The concept attracts more student interest than anything else I've tried.

(09-09-2015 12:31 PM)Hambone10 Wrote:  But it's hard to expect more than we are getting when they only thing they are getting for their efforts is their own amusement.

Thank you for saying this.

It shouldn't be surprising that I have a LOT of thoughts about everyone's comments. I would like it if this part of the thread could be split off. Starting a new thread would lose the previous comments, and that would diminish our discussion.

Chuck Throckmorton
Director of Bands