http://espn.go.com/college-football/stor...-expansion

Luck's plan, which also had the support of Louisville athletic director Tom Jurich, was also to add UCF for a 12-team Big East divided into two divisions: West: Baylor, Kansas, Kansas State, Iowa State, TCU and Louisville; East: UConn, Cincinnati, Rutgers, West Virginia, South Florida and UCF.

And if only the Metro had started football...

"Luck's plan" --- how does that reflect on Memphis' chances and the Big 12's wants?

(06-11-2014 12:35 PM)UofMemphis Wrote:  And if only the Metro had started football...

Yep, we can blame Bobby Bowden for that. Or at least that's what I've read.

Raycom, in their heyday, was pushing for that.

(06-11-2014 12:21 PM)3601 Wrote:  http://espn.go.com/college-football/stor...-expansion

Luck's plan, which also had the support of Louisville athletic director Tom Jurich, was also to add UCF for a 12-team Big East divided into two divisions: West: Baylor, Kansas, Kansas State, Iowa State, TCU and Louisville; East: UConn, Cincinnati, Rutgers, West Virginia, South Florida and UCF.

So much for the WV's AD's plan.

(06-11-2014 12:42 PM)Tiger46 Wrote:  

(06-11-2014 12:35 PM)UofMemphis Wrote:  And if only the Metro had started football...

Yep, we can blame Bobby Bowden for that. Or at least that's what I've read.

Raycom, in their heyday, was pushing for that.

Schnellenberger too. All during my time in college, Florida State and South Carolina were "the bad guys" from keeping Metro football. Then they both announced departures in the fall of 1990.

Memphis and Cincinnati were going to stay in the Metro, but only if the football vote that they forced was approved. I believe it took a unanimous decision. So Captain Kangaroo's Collision Course with a National Title (or whatever) vetoed it. So we both left for that new hoops league ... in hindsight, that was a mistake in my opinion.

(06-11-2014 12:39 PM)TIGERCITY Wrote:  "Luck's plan" --- how does that reflect on Memphis' chances and the Big 12's wants?

Common sense tells you that if Luck and Jurich supported the plan then there is good chance it would have prevailed. After all, the Big XII chose WVU and Louisville would have been their likely next choice if the ACC did't take them.

I certainly think "Luck's plan" would have trumped "RC's plan."

Luck said he had three or four phone discussions with the Big 12 schools. Then-Big East commissioner John Marinatto was not involved in the discussions and no formal offer was extended, but the Big 12 schools -- if left behind by the schools headed to the Pac-12 -- were prepared for the merger.

"At that point in time, we were ready to flip the switch," Currie said.


*Currie is the Kansas State AD

(06-11-2014 01:15 PM)3601 Wrote:  Luck said he had three or four phone discussions with the Big 12 schools. Then-Big East commissioner John Marinatto was not involved in the discussions and no formal offer was extended, but the Big 12 schools -- if left behind by the schools headed to the Pac-12 -- were prepared for the merger.

"At that point in time, we were ready to flip the switch," Currie said.


*Currie is the Kansas State AD

OK - Sounds like an actual informal deal was in place - just in case. Maybe the idea was to keep the BCS status --- which would have certainly *excluded* Memphis at that time.

holy hell's bells!! We'd have still been in CUSA and our athletic dept would have been dead.

We've all heard the stories about the Big XII leftovers doing something to stay afloat if OU and Texas had bolted.

Turns out the stories were true...except for the part about Memphis being included in the plan?

(06-11-2014 01:58 PM)3601 Wrote:  We've all heard the stories about the Big XII leftovers doing something to stay afloat if OU and Texas had bolted.

Turns out the stories were true...except for the part about Memphis being included in the plan?

Totally unshocked -- considering the state of Memphis football at that time. I certainly wouldn't have added us --

(06-11-2014 01:58 PM)3601 Wrote:  We've all heard the stories about the Big XII leftovers doing something to stay afloat if OU and Texas had bolted.

Turns out the stories were true...except for the part about Memphis being included in the plan?

Not completely accurate. There were two different time frames. Luck is talking about the second one, and we WERE left out, in 2011. But there was an earlier one, in the spring of 2010.

Luck's version was simply one of several scenarios that were discussed at one point or another in 2010 and again in 2011, and no, it did not include us in 2011, but it doesn't negate the one we were discussing in 2010.

Actually, there were 3 versions of possible realignment scenarios involving the Big East, the B12, and/or us. Luck's was the last one, chronologically.

The first was in spring of 2010. Texas, TTU, Baylor, A&M, OU and OSU were threatening to go to the Pac 12. The Big East (Tranghese and Marinatto, not Oliver Luck), approached all the potential left behinds of the B12, and tried to get them to join the Big East. At that time, Missouri was theoretically being left behind, too.

This also was occurring at a time when the B12 leftovers were not sure they could stay together as the B12, and still retain their AQ status. At some point in those negotiations, Kansas and the other B12 teams discovered they could rebuild the B12 and still retain AQ, so that squashed the Big East merger idea, for the first time.

Right after that, the B12 first approached us, in May or early June of 2010. Kansas, KSU, ISU, Baylor and Missouri contacted Louisville, Cincinnati, Memphis and UCF about joining the rebuilt B12. All the ADs of those schools met in Miami at an admin conference to discuss reforming the B12. They discussed building to 12 teams, but I never knew who the other 3 candidates were.

This was the plan that was in place, if Texas and the others bolted for the Pac 10, and was what got RC and Fred Smith and Shirley Raines so excited. Then at the last minute, Texas didn't jump, and that killed it.

Then, Scenario #2, we started talking to the Big East about joining there, along with UCF, in late June/early July of 2010. We were assured by Tranghese that they had the votes to admit us. At the last minute, somebody changed their vote, and it was tabled. A few weeks later, in September, the BE added TCU, instead.

Then, late the next summer, in 2011, is the scenario Oliver Luck is referring to. This time, Texas Oklahoma, OSU, and TTU were trying to head to the Pac 12 again. A&M was talking to the SEC. Can't recall where Missouri was at that point.

Anyway, Luck apparently had contacted the B12 schools who could get left out, to merge with the Big East, but again, nobody ever moved west. He's right, Memphis was not included in this version, and UCF was. I recall Pitino talking about it, but not to the extent that Luck revealed. It also was odd that Marinatto was left out of the discussions.

After that, TCU and WVU soon went to the B12, and then the Big East started inviting Boise, SDSU, etc. Then we got invited to the BE in February of 2012.

So, both versions actually happened, one year apart.

I'm glad that fell through. Can you imagine where we would be today?

I prefer the version where Texas left.

(06-11-2014 02:47 PM)TripleA Wrote:  

(06-11-2014 01:58 PM)3601 Wrote:  We've all heard the stories about the Big XII leftovers doing something to stay afloat if OU and Texas had bolted.

Turns out the stories were true...except for the part about Memphis being included in the plan?

Not completely accurate. There were two different time frames. Luck is talking about the second one, and we WERE left out, in 2011. But there was an earlier one, in the spring of 2010.

Luck's version was simply one of several scenarios that were discussed at one point or another in 2010 and again in 2011, and no, it did not include us in 2011, but it doesn't negate the one we were discussing in 2010.

Actually, there were 3 versions of possible realignment scenarios involving the Big East, the B12, and/or us. Luck's was the last one, chronologically.

The first was in spring of 2010. Texas, TTU, Baylor, A&M, OU and OSU were threatening to go to the Pac 12. The Big East (Tranghese and Marinatto, not Oliver Luck), approached all the potential left behinds of the B12, and tried to get them to join the Big East. At that time, Missouri was theoretically being left behind, too.

This also was occurring at a time when the B12 leftovers were not sure they could stay together as the B12, and still retain their AQ status. At some point in those negotiations, Kansas and the other B12 teams discovered they could rebuild the B12 and still retain AQ, so that squashed the Big East merger idea, for the first time.

Right after that, the B12 first approached us, in May or early June of 2010. Kansas, KSU, ISU, Baylor and Missouri contacted Louisville, Cincinnati, Memphis and UCF about joining the rebuilt B12. All the ADs of those schools met in Miami at an admin conference to discuss reforming the B12. They discussed building to 12 teams, but I never knew who the other 3 candidates were.

This was the plan that was in place, if Texas and the others bolted for the Pac 10, and was what got RC and Fred Smith and Shirley Raines so excited. Then at the last minute, Texas didn't jump, and that killed it.

Then, Scenario #2, we started talking to the Big East about joining there, along with UCF, in late June/early July of 2010. We were assured by Tranghese that they had the votes to admit us. At the last minute, somebody changed their vote, and it was tabled. A few weeks later, in September, the BE added TCU, instead.

Then, late the next summer, in 2011, is the scenario Oliver Luck is referring to. This time, Texas Oklahoma, OSU, and TTU were trying to head to the Pac 12 again. A&M was talking to the SEC. Can't recall where Missouri was at that point.

Anyway, Luck apparently had contacted the B12 schools who could get left out, to merge with the Big East, but again, nobody ever moved west. He's right, Memphis was not included in this version, and UCF was. I recall Pitino talking about it, but not to the extent that Luck revealed. It also was odd that Marinatto was left out of the discussions.

After that, TCU and WVU soon went to the B12, and then the Big East started inviting Boise, SDSU, etc. Then we got invited to the BE in February of 2012.

So, both versions actually happened, one year apart.

For 50 years my Dad would tell me that one day Texas would be in (then) the PAC8.

(06-11-2014 03:50 PM)80sTiger Wrote:  I prefer the version where Texas left.

There were 2 versions where Texas left.

In 2010, we got in.

In 2011, according to Oliver Luck, we didn't. The only thing I knew about that one was that UCF was involved, and we weren't.

(06-11-2014 04:12 PM)Tiger46 Wrote:  

(06-11-2014 02:47 PM)TripleA Wrote:  

(06-11-2014 01:58 PM)3601 Wrote:  We've all heard the stories about the Big XII leftovers doing something to stay afloat if OU and Texas had bolted.

Turns out the stories were true...except for the part about Memphis being included in the plan?

Not completely accurate. There were two different time frames. Luck is talking about the second one, and we WERE left out, in 2011. But there was an earlier one, in the spring of 2010.

Luck's version was simply one of several scenarios that were discussed at one point or another in 2010 and again in 2011, and no, it did not include us in 2011, but it doesn't negate the one we were discussing in 2010.

Actually, there were 3 versions of possible realignment scenarios involving the Big East, the B12, and/or us. Luck's was the last one, chronologically.

The first was in spring of 2010. Texas, TTU, Baylor, A&M, OU and OSU were threatening to go to the Pac 12. The Big East (Tranghese and Marinatto, not Oliver Luck), approached all the potential left behinds of the B12, and tried to get them to join the Big East. At that time, Missouri was theoretically being left behind, too.

This also was occurring at a time when the B12 leftovers were not sure they could stay together as the B12, and still retain their AQ status. At some point in those negotiations, Kansas and the other B12 teams discovered they could rebuild the B12 and still retain AQ, so that squashed the Big East merger idea, for the first time.

Right after that, the B12 first approached us, in May or early June of 2010. Kansas, KSU, ISU, Baylor and Missouri contacted Louisville, Cincinnati, Memphis and UCF about joining the rebuilt B12. All the ADs of those schools met in Miami at an admin conference to discuss reforming the B12. They discussed building to 12 teams, but I never knew who the other 3 candidates were.

This was the plan that was in place, if Texas and the others bolted for the Pac 10, and was what got RC and Fred Smith and Shirley Raines so excited. Then at the last minute, Texas didn't jump, and that killed it.

Then, Scenario #2, we started talking to the Big East about joining there, along with UCF, in late June/early July of 2010. We were assured by Tranghese that they had the votes to admit us. At the last minute, somebody changed their vote, and it was tabled. A few weeks later, in September, the BE added TCU, instead.

Then, late the next summer, in 2011, is the scenario Oliver Luck is referring to. This time, Texas Oklahoma, OSU, and TTU were trying to head to the Pac 12 again. A&M was talking to the SEC. Can't recall where Missouri was at that point.

Anyway, Luck apparently had contacted the B12 schools who could get left out, to merge with the Big East, but again, nobody ever moved west. He's right, Memphis was not included in this version, and UCF was. I recall Pitino talking about it, but not to the extent that Luck revealed. It also was odd that Marinatto was left out of the discussions.

After that, TCU and WVU soon went to the B12, and then the Big East started inviting Boise, SDSU, etc. Then we got invited to the BE in February of 2012.

So, both versions actually happened, one year apart.

For 50 years my Dad would tell me that one day Texas would be in (then) the PAC8.

I still think they will. It has to be killing UTex that A&m is in the sec and experiencing
the success it has and they are stuck in a diluted b12.

(06-11-2014 05:57 PM)kapsig tgr Wrote:  I still think they will. It has to be killing UTex that A&m is in the sec and experiencing
the success it has and they are stuck in a diluted b12.

I don't know. Texas has probably one of the easiest paths to a championship than almost anyone. Beat up on the the lower teams in the conference and beat OK, and they are pretty much guaranteed a playoff spot every time. They have all the power in the conference, and they ain't hurtin for money at all.

A&M has to get through a much tougher conference and the chances for them to win the SEC is pretty hard. Hell they have to get past LSU just to win their division. Then they gotta get past whoever is coming out of the SEC East. But on the other side of the coin, they are out from under Texas shadow and they are making a lot more money.

Probably why Texas doesn't wanna expand the Big 12. No championship game to have to worry about, and usually only one team that can challenge them in the conference.

(06-11-2014 04:52 PM)TripleA Wrote:  

(06-11-2014 03:50 PM)80sTiger Wrote:  I prefer the version where Texas left.

There were 2 versions where Texas left.

In 2010, we got in.

In 2011, according to Oliver Luck, we didn't. The only thing I knew about that one was that UCF was involved, and we weren't.

That's all I need to know. Thanks Andy.

We have mucho work to do………..pronto!