(05-28-2014 11:01 AM)USAFMEDIC Wrote:  

(05-28-2014 07:58 AM)XLance Wrote:  

(05-28-2014 07:24 AM)vandiver49 Wrote:  

(05-28-2014 03:25 AM)USAFMEDIC Wrote:  In the end, Texas will decide what happens with realignment, especially in regards to the Big XII, which seems to be the wildcard conference . No other Big XII school will ever depart unless the Longhorns blow up the conference in the future. OU and the rest will stay if UT stays, and Kansas probably will stay as well, as the B1G won't take Kansas State. I also believe the ACC is much more viable as a conference than other folks tend to believe. They are a network away from being really solid. Great TV markets exist on the Atlantic Coast. The potential is there and the commish seems to have his head in the game. Texas, as usual, will have their way, and the final say in this all... JMHO of course.

A network really wouldn't help the ACC as issues the conference suffers from aren't strictly money related. Chances are, you and a large percentage of the SE would watch an Auburn/SCAR game on ESPN2. But would you tune into a NCST/SYR matchup? Or how about a an ISU/OKST tilt? Every conference has top and bottom teams, but demand in the middle is what really sustains a conference.

Perspective.
If you lived in North Carolina and northward you would be watching NCSU and Syracuse. Auburn may as well be on the moon, and .....well it's lil carolina.
When I watch sports on TV, I will ALWAYS watch a game where an ACC is involved over anything else. The only time that I ever see SEC teams play is when they are playing ACC opponents.

An ACC fan would probably, as you have said, choose the ACC game, just as the Big XII would probably choose a Big XII game. These games directly pertain to, and affect your school's place within the standings each week.

This is the reason that JR wants so desperately wants the SEC to have teams located in North Carolina and Virginia. Access to eyeballs, and subscriptions to the SEC network.
North Carolina is now the 9th most populous state and Virginia is not too far behind.

(05-28-2014 11:53 AM)XLance Wrote:  

(05-28-2014 11:01 AM)USAFMEDIC Wrote:  

(05-28-2014 07:58 AM)XLance Wrote:  

(05-28-2014 07:24 AM)vandiver49 Wrote:  

(05-28-2014 03:25 AM)USAFMEDIC Wrote:  In the end, Texas will decide what happens with realignment, especially in regards to the Big XII, which seems to be the wildcard conference . No other Big XII school will ever depart unless the Longhorns blow up the conference in the future. OU and the rest will stay if UT stays, and Kansas probably will stay as well, as the B1G won't take Kansas State. I also believe the ACC is much more viable as a conference than other folks tend to believe. They are a network away from being really solid. Great TV markets exist on the Atlantic Coast. The potential is there and the commish seems to have his head in the game. Texas, as usual, will have their way, and the final say in this all... JMHO of course.

A network really wouldn't help the ACC as issues the conference suffers from aren't strictly money related. Chances are, you and a large percentage of the SE would watch an Auburn/SCAR game on ESPN2. But would you tune into a NCST/SYR matchup? Or how about a an ISU/OKST tilt? Every conference has top and bottom teams, but demand in the middle is what really sustains a conference.

Perspective.
If you lived in North Carolina and northward you would be watching NCSU and Syracuse. Auburn may as well be on the moon, and .....well it's lil carolina.
When I watch sports on TV, I will ALWAYS watch a game where an ACC is involved over anything else. The only time that I ever see SEC teams play is when they are playing ACC opponents.

An ACC fan would probably, as you have said, choose the ACC game, just as the Big XII would probably choose a Big XII game. These games directly pertain to, and affect your school's place within the standings each week.

This is the reason that JR wants so desperately wants the SEC to have teams located in North Carolina and Virginia. Access to eyeballs, and subscriptions to the SEC network.
North Carolina is now the 9th most populous state and Virginia is not too far behind.

I believe your only problem is FSU sometimes trying to play the bully to get what they want out of the ACC. The ACC lived without them before, and could again I would imagine. Texas leaving the Big XII would start an exodus...

(05-28-2014 11:01 AM)USAFMEDIC Wrote:  

(05-28-2014 07:58 AM)XLance Wrote:  

(05-28-2014 07:24 AM)vandiver49 Wrote:  

(05-28-2014 03:25 AM)USAFMEDIC Wrote:  In the end, Texas will decide what happens with realignment, especially in regards to the Big XII, which seems to be the wildcard conference . No other Big XII school will ever depart unless the Longhorns blow up the conference in the future. OU and the rest will stay if UT stays, and Kansas probably will stay as well, as the B1G won't take Kansas State. I also believe the ACC is much more viable as a conference than other folks tend to believe. They are a network away from being really solid. Great TV markets exist on the Atlantic Coast. The potential is there and the commish seems to have his head in the game. Texas, as usual, will have their way, and the final say in this all... JMHO of course.

A network really wouldn't help the ACC as issues the conference suffers from aren't strictly money related. Chances are, you and a large percentage of the SE would watch an Auburn/SCAR game on ESPN2. But would you tune into a NCST/SYR matchup? Or how about a an ISU/OKST tilt? Every conference has top and bottom teams, but demand in the middle is what really sustains a conference.

Perspective.
If you lived in North Carolina and northward you would be watching NCSU and Syracuse. Auburn may as well be on the moon, and .....well it's lil carolina.
When I watch sports on TV, I will ALWAYS watch a game where an ACC is involved over anything else. The only time that I ever see SEC teams play is when they are playing ACC opponents.

An ACC fan would probably, as you have said, choose the ACC game, just as the Big XII would probably choose a Big XII game. These games directly pertain to, and affect your school's place within the standings each week.

Medic, the SEC draws 900,000 more viewers on average per game than the Big 10 which is 1,000,000 viewers per game ahead of the ACC. The SEC draws not quite 2,000,000 more viewers per game than the ACC, but the ACC has more potential viewers in their footprint than either the SEC or Big 10.

So what does that mean?
1. The SEC draws more viewers outside of its footprint than any other conference. And draws a higher percentage of viewers inside of its footprint than any other conference.

2. The Big 10 draws almost as high of a percentage of viewers inside its footprint as the SEC and about the same percentage as the Big 12 which has such a small footprint it hurts them.

3. There are many weeks each Fall where the SEC outdraws schools in North Carolina in large areas outside of the Research Triangle. So, I would say XLance's viewing preferences were in the minority for football fans within North Carolina. Now I'm sure we couldn't touch any of that state for a basketball game, but Vandiver's point is well taken. Once you cross into North Carolina you have entered the dividing line between football and basketball country. Virginia and North (outside of Blacksburg) is mostly basketball country and the SEC doesn't draw as well there.

4. One reason the ACC (and Xlance) is so desirous of Vanderbilt and South Carolina is because as long as South Carolina has SEC football then the Southern and Coastal part of North Carolina is going to watch the SEC. That's why ECU to the SEC has 136,000 hits on this board and has outlived two deaths of the SEC board. And he knows that in the late 70's and early 80's Florida toyed with the idea of moving to the ACC and all of it was over academics. If Vanderbilt left and we didn't replace them with another AAU school it could concern Florida. The SEC has only Florida in that State so if the Gators could be pulled it cuts us off from the best recruiting grounds in the South.

This is why ESPN is so damned frustrating to do business with. We could have had F.S.U. two years ago along with Clemson but ESPN refuses to pay for the move because those two schools are the only ones that add significant football value to the ACC. Without them the ACC couldn't even hang onto its basketball schools because the money disparity would be astronomic. Notre Dame is a great school with a great history, but much of their glory is now ancient history. They have a large fan base but if they stayed in the ACC and Clemson and Florida State left the value would still not hold. Notre Dame vs F.S.U. or Clemson everyone tunes into watch. Notre Dame vs N.C. State, Wake Forest, Virginia, North Carolina, and Louisville (even though it would be a great game) not so much. You would get better, but not SEC level audiences for Notre Dame vs B.C., Syracuse, Pitt, Georgia Tech and Miami. N.D. vs Virginia Tech would be a good game, but there is no history there to build upon as with Georgia Tech vs N.D.. But everyone would tune in for N.D. vs F.S.U. and ESPN knows that is their only ticket to build the ACC. That's why more than any other conference they need Texas.

5. At some point in the future the SEC needs to either acquire F.S.U. or add U.C.F. A second Florida school is essential for these reasons. It ensures our presence in Florida even though I do not believe the Gators are a flight risk any longer. It gives the SEC a presence in Orlando (a major vacation area, and the East coast center of Disney operations). It gives the SEC a presence in South Central Florida, an area very different from Northeast Florida and the Panhandle and keeps a more open line for recruiting to Southern Florida. It gives all other SEC school another scheduling opportunity in the Sunshine State and that would be big, especially for schools like Missouri.

But those are the reasons that our ACC friend keeps talking about wanting South Carolina and Vanderbilt. And these are the reasons we aren't very likely to ever give them up. Now if Vanderbilt wanted out (and they don't it yields a lot less money) the only way the SEC would encourage it is if we were getting say Texas and Kansas (two more AAU schools that would please Florida).

JR, the simple solution is to trade Florida for Florida State. We would be happy to give up the 'noles for the Gators and both of our conferences would be better off.
Then we could go about our business in securing Texas and Notre Dame and call it a day.

And BTW you should be thankful to ESPN for keeping FSU and Clemson in check, because if the ACC had blown up or does blow up UVa and Carolina (despite what you have read of any message board) would be headed to the B1G. Then three conferences of 20-22 each would be likely. If that happens, nobody will be able to keep up with the B1G money wise. Slive is no dummy. He know that he needs the ACC to be a viable league to keep the monster in check.

(05-28-2014 04:11 PM)XLance Wrote:  JR, the simple solution is to trade Florida for Florida State. We would be happy to give up the 'noles for the Gators and both of our conferences would be better off.
Then we could go about our business in securing Texas and Notre Dame and call it a day.

And BTW you should be thankful to ESPN for keeping FSU and Clemson in check, because if the ACC had blown up or does blow up UVa and Carolina (despite what you have read of any message board) would be headed to the B1G. Then three conferences of 20-22 each would be likely. If that happens, nobody will be able to keep up with the B1G money wise. Slive is no dummy. He know that he needs the ACC to be a viable league to keep the monster in check.

Nah! The SEC has 6 of the top revenue generators in the Nation and almost half of the top twenty. When you talk T.V. contracts you are talking about 1/4 to 1/7 of the total revenue package. So even if they made 15 million more than we do on average the totals would get competitive but the balance would be about the same on earnings. (Ohio State, Penn State, and Michigan would still do quite well and maintain or increase their standing, but the rest would only close the gap.)

However, if the Big 10 took North Carolina and Virginia they will have done nada toward closing the gap on recruiting, talent, and on field performance. They would have succeeded in simply finding two more patsies for Ohio State and Michigan to play and on good years Wisconsin and Michigan State. Lots of TV sets and lots of potential viewers are not going to be sated by Northwestern vs North Carolina and Purdue vs Virginia. And interestingly enough at some point the Buckeye fans would be wanting them to move to the SEC where football is actually played. No it may be irksome that the Big 10 plants a flag in Virginia but it won't make their sagging product any better. As demographics change it is they that need to move South. And any Southern schools that associate with them will suffer decline in statewide prestige because sports are the face of the University. Besides North Carolina is having a hard time maintaining relevance in hoops now. Move to the Big 10 along with Cuse and Pitt and all you will become is a mid tier basketball program that stinks at football. Enjoy your TV revenue from two days of lacrosse coverage.

Slive wants U.N.C. and Virginia, but for the markets and the academics. We don't need football prowess thank goodness. Both are worth something to the SEC for what they are, not what they are not. But even if Delany got them as long as we land Virginia Tech, N.C. State, F.S.U. and Clemson nothing changes except that we get stronger and the Big 10 doesn't.

You guys would lose so much of your base if you moved North that watching the decline of U.N.C. would become a pass time of every Wolfpack and Pirate fan in the your state. It would be Aggie like joy painted on the face of those fan bases. And Chapel Hill would be a pain in the butt trip for Midwestern schools to play football and not much else.

So we'll keep the Gators and take the Noles when the time comes and you can either be a part of something better in the South or take your pride and move North to diminish. Have a good one.

(05-28-2014 05:24 PM)JRsec Wrote:  

(05-28-2014 04:11 PM)XLance Wrote:  JR, the simple solution is to trade Florida for Florida State. We would be happy to give up the 'noles for the Gators and both of our conferences would be better off.
Then we could go about our business in securing Texas and Notre Dame and call it a day.

And BTW you should be thankful to ESPN for keeping FSU and Clemson in check, because if the ACC had blown up or does blow up UVa and Carolina (despite what you have read of any message board) would be headed to the B1G. Then three conferences of 20-22 each would be likely. If that happens, nobody will be able to keep up with the B1G money wise. Slive is no dummy. He know that he needs the ACC to be a viable league to keep the monster in check.

Nah! The SEC has 6 of the top revenue generators in the Nation and almost half of the top twenty. When you talk T.V. contracts you are talking about 1/4 to 1/7 of the total revenue package. So even if they made 15 million more than we do on average the totals would get competitive but the balance would be about the same on earnings. (Ohio State, Penn State, and Michigan would still do quite well and maintain or increase their standing, but the rest would only close the gap.)

However, if the Big 10 took North Carolina and Virginia they will have done nada toward closing the gap on recruiting, talent, and on field performance. They would have succeeded in simply finding two more patsies for Ohio State and Michigan to play and on good years Wisconsin and Michigan State. Lots of TV sets and lots of potential viewers are not going to be sated by Northwestern vs North Carolina and Purdue vs Virginia. And interestingly enough at some point the Buckeye fans would be wanting them to move to the SEC where football is actually played. No it may be irksome that the Big 10 plants a flag in Virginia but it won't make their sagging product any better. As demographics change it is they that need to move South. And any Southern schools that associate with them will suffer decline in statewide prestige because sports are the face of the University. Besides North Carolina is having a hard time maintaining relevance in hoops now. Move to the Big 10 along with Cuse and Pitt and all you will become is a mid tier basketball program that stinks at football. Enjoy your TV revenue from two days of lacrosse coverage.

Slive wants U.N.C. and Virginia, but for the markets and the academics. We don't need football prowess thank goodness. Both are worth something to the SEC for what they are, not what they are not. But even if Delany got them as long as we land Virginia Tech, N.C. State, F.S.U. and Clemson nothing changes except that we get stronger and the Big 10 doesn't.

You guys would lose so much of your base if you moved North that watching the decline of U.N.C. would become a pass time of every Wolfpack and Pirate fan in the your state. It would be Aggie like joy painted on the face of those fan bases. And Chapel Hill would be a pain in the butt trip for Midwestern schools to play football and not much else.

So we'll keep the Gators and take the Noles when the time comes and you can either be a part of something better in the South or take your pride and move North to diminish. Have a good one.

You took the words right out of my mouth Jr.

(05-28-2014 05:24 PM)JRsec Wrote:  

(05-28-2014 04:11 PM)XLance Wrote:  JR, the simple solution is to trade Florida for Florida State. We would be happy to give up the 'noles for the Gators and both of our conferences would be better off.
Then we could go about our business in securing Texas and Notre Dame and call it a day.

And BTW you should be thankful to ESPN for keeping FSU and Clemson in check, because if the ACC had blown up or does blow up UVa and Carolina (despite what you have read of any message board) would be headed to the B1G. Then three conferences of 20-22 each would be likely. If that happens, nobody will be able to keep up with the B1G money wise. Slive is no dummy. He know that he needs the ACC to be a viable league to keep the monster in check.

Nah! The SEC has 6 of the top revenue generators in the Nation and almost half of the top twenty. When you talk T.V. contracts you are talking about 1/4 to 1/7 of the total revenue package. So even if they made 15 million more than we do on average the totals would get competitive but the balance would be about the same on earnings. (Ohio State, Penn State, and Michigan would still do quite well and maintain or increase their standing, but the rest would only close the gap.)

However, if the Big 10 took North Carolina and Virginia they will have done nada toward closing the gap on recruiting, talent, and on field performance. They would have succeeded in simply finding two more patsies for Ohio State and Michigan to play and on good years Wisconsin and Michigan State. Lots of TV sets and lots of potential viewers are not going to be sated by Northwestern vs North Carolina and Purdue vs Virginia. And interestingly enough at some point the Buckeye fans would be wanting them to move to the SEC where football is actually played. No it may be irksome that the Big 10 plants a flag in Virginia but it won't make their sagging product any better. As demographics change it is they that need to move South. And any Southern schools that associate with them will suffer decline in statewide prestige because sports are the face of the University. Besides North Carolina is having a hard time maintaining relevance in hoops now. Move to the Big 10 along with Cuse and Pitt and all you will become is a mid tier basketball program that stinks at football. Enjoy your TV revenue from two days of lacrosse coverage.

Slive wants U.N.C. and Virginia, but for the markets and the academics. We don't need football prowess thank goodness. Both are worth something to the SEC for what they are, not what they are not. But even if Delany got them as long as we land Virginia Tech, N.C. State, F.S.U. and Clemson nothing changes except that we get stronger and the Big 10 doesn't.

You guys would lose so much of your base if you moved North that watching the decline of U.N.C. would become a pass time of every Wolfpack and Pirate fan in the your state. It would be Aggie like joy painted on the face of those fan bases. And Chapel Hill would be a pain in the butt trip for Midwestern schools to play football and not much else.

So we'll keep the Gators and take the Noles when the time comes and you can either be a part of something better in the South or take your pride and move North to diminish. Have a good one.

(05-28-2014 04:11 PM)XLance Wrote:  JR, the simple solution is to trade Florida for Florida State. We would be happy to give up the 'noles for the Gators and both of our conferences would be better off.
Then we could go about our business in securing Texas and Notre Dame and call it a day.

And BTW you should be thankful to ESPN for keeping FSU and Clemson in check, because if the ACC had blown up or does blow up UVa and Carolina (despite what you have read of any message board) would be headed to the B1G. Then three conferences of 20-22 each would be likely. If that happens, nobody will be able to keep up with the B1G money wise. Slive is no dummy. He know that he needs the ACC to be a viable league to keep the monster in check.

How does trading FSU for UF (not that it would ever happen) make the ACC better? And while the ACC is a nice check to block the B1G, I don't think anyone is scared that Delany's conference will be able to drive TV demand if they set up shop in NC or VA.

(06-02-2014 10:43 AM)vandiver49 Wrote:  

(05-28-2014 04:11 PM)XLance Wrote:  JR, the simple solution is to trade Florida for Florida State. We would be happy to give up the 'noles for the Gators and both of our conferences would be better off.
Then we could go about our business in securing Texas and Notre Dame and call it a day.

And BTW you should be thankful to ESPN for keeping FSU and Clemson in check, because if the ACC had blown up or does blow up UVa and Carolina (despite what you have read of any message board) would be headed to the B1G. Then three conferences of 20-22 each would be likely. If that happens, nobody will be able to keep up with the B1G money wise. Slive is no dummy. He know that he needs the ACC to be a viable league to keep the monster in check.

How does trading FSU for UF (not that it would ever happen) make the ACC better? And while the ACC is a nice check to block the B1G, I don't think anyone is scared that Delany's conference will be able to drive TV demand if they set up shop in NC or VA.

Well for one thing it would get those "pain in the butt" 'noles out of the ACC and put them into a conference more like themselves. No offense to the SEC.
And although Florida is too big to fit the ACC mold, they (and Vanderbilt) would fit very well into ACC culture.

(06-02-2014 12:55 PM)XLance Wrote:  

(06-02-2014 10:43 AM)vandiver49 Wrote:  

(05-28-2014 04:11 PM)XLance Wrote:  JR, the simple solution is to trade Florida for Florida State. We would be happy to give up the 'noles for the Gators and both of our conferences would be better off.
Then we could go about our business in securing Texas and Notre Dame and call it a day.

And BTW you should be thankful to ESPN for keeping FSU and Clemson in check, because if the ACC had blown up or does blow up UVa and Carolina (despite what you have read of any message board) would be headed to the B1G. Then three conferences of 20-22 each would be likely. If that happens, nobody will be able to keep up with the B1G money wise. Slive is no dummy. He know that he needs the ACC to be a viable league to keep the monster in check.

How does trading FSU for UF (not that it would ever happen) make the ACC better? And while the ACC is a nice check to block the B1G, I don't think anyone is scared that Delany's conference will be able to drive TV demand if they set up shop in NC or VA.

Well for one thing it would get those "pain in the butt" 'noles out of the ACC and put them into a conference more like themselves. No offense to the SEC.
And although Florida is too big to fit the ACC mold, they (and Vanderbilt) would fit very well into ACC culture.

The jorts wearing, 4x4 with the 12" lift kits driving Gator's would fit into the ACC culture?

(05-28-2014 03:25 AM)USAFMEDIC Wrote:  In the end, Texas will decide what happens with realignment, especially in regards to the Big XII, which seems to be the wildcard conference . No other Big XII school will ever depart unless the Longhorns blow up the conference in the future. OU and the rest will stay if UT stays, and Kansas probably will stay as well, as the B1G won't take Kansas State. I also believe the ACC is much more viable as a conference than other folks tend to believe. They are a network away from being really solid. Great TV markets exist on the Atlantic Coast. The potential is there and the commish seems to have his head in the game. Texas, as usual, will have their way, and the final say in this all... JMHO of course.

(06-02-2014 03:41 PM)XLance Wrote:  

(05-28-2014 03:25 AM)USAFMEDIC Wrote:  In the end, Texas will decide what happens with realignment, especially in regards to the Big XII, which seems to be the wildcard conference . No other Big XII school will ever depart unless the Longhorns blow up the conference in the future. OU and the rest will stay if UT stays, and Kansas probably will stay as well, as the B1G won't take Kansas State. I also believe the ACC is much more viable as a conference than other folks tend to believe. They are a network away from being really solid. Great TV markets exist on the Atlantic Coast. The potential is there and the commish seems to have his head in the game. Texas, as usual, will have their way, and the final say in this all... JMHO of course.

OU has the same power to kill the conference, just less options on their own (due to lacking AAU and being in a state with only 4M people), and they are the least pleased school with the current B12. OU would have left for the SEC or PAC if they had taken on the OSU anchor in 2011. OU would leave for another conference in the right circumstances. They get great money for their T3 network, but not the insane numbers Texas gets. The B1G, SEC, and maybe the PAC will make similar amounts to OU, eventually, through their networks, so OU (or KU too) would not take a pay cut (or only a small one) if they left. They would love to stick with Texas, but they will do what is best for their university in the end and that might not be the same as what is best for Texas (see A&M leaving).

OU and UT can both kill the conference. KU can wound it, but not kill it outright because FB >> BB. I think OU is more likely than UT to have blood on it's hands if the B12 dies.

I think that both the ACC and B12 are solid conferences, but have flaws. The ACC has great markets, but not great penetration and Swafford really screwed them on their contract so they are stuck being underpaid for quite awhile. It is also hard for them to get a network up since they required Raycom be involved so ESPN sold a bunch of T3 stuff to them, FOX regional, and others. Raycom needs the ACC T3 stuff to survive. It has been dwindling for awhile and the ACC T3 keeps it alive. It has no incentive to sell it back. The ACC network is going nowhere until they can buy that T3 back from sellers who have no motivation to do so (Raycom would die and FOX is not helping create a network for a rival conference). The ACC needs expansion to get that network (extra content) or a change of heart by the holders of its T3 that ESPN sold. However, the ACC has a core of schools who love their conference and want it too survive and are rich enough that they might be able to wait for a decade to get paid fairly.

The B12 is has a small footprint, but great penetration of it's markets. It's FB is consistently #2 to the SEC and basketball is competitive; however, it is right in the middle of 3 stronger competitors (PAC is arguable, but safe due to geography) which makes it vulnerable. It has schools coveted by all four major conferences. It's schools are not strongly held together through mutual like as much as a money band-aid. Texas is the glue that holds it together with it's immense value. If Texas bails, or OU does which would cause UT to as well, the B12 is dead.

Since 2 or 4 conferences make the most sense (and money for schools) at least one, if not both, of these conferences is likely to come to a premature end. Probably the B12 will die, if it is only one, since money, not respect or love for the conference, holds it together, unfortunately.

Jorts......Maybe it's just a thing in the state of Florida.

(06-03-2014 02:11 AM)jhawkmvp Wrote:  

(06-02-2014 03:41 PM)XLance Wrote:  

(05-28-2014 03:25 AM)USAFMEDIC Wrote:  In the end, Texas will decide what happens with realignment, especially in regards to the Big XII, which seems to be the wildcard conference . No other Big XII school will ever depart unless the Longhorns blow up the conference in the future. OU and the rest will stay if UT stays, and Kansas probably will stay as well, as the B1G won't take Kansas State. I also believe the ACC is much more viable as a conference than other folks tend to believe. They are a network away from being really solid. Great TV markets exist on the Atlantic Coast. The potential is there and the commish seems to have his head in the game. Texas, as usual, will have their way, and the final say in this all... JMHO of course.

OU has the same power to kill the conference, just less options on their own (due to lacking AAU and being in a state with only 4M people), and they are the least pleased school with the current B12. OU would have left for the SEC or PAC if they had taken on the OSU anchor in 2011. OU would leave for another conference in the right circumstances. They get great money for their T3 network, but not the insane numbers Texas gets. The B1G, SEC, and maybe the PAC will make similar amounts to OU, eventually, through their networks, so OU (or KU too) would not take a pay cut (or only a small one) if they left. They would love to stick with Texas, but they will do what is best for their university in the end and that might not be the same as what is best for Texas (see A&M leaving).

OU and UT can both kill the conference. KU can wound it, but not kill it outright because FB >> BB. I think OU is more likely than UT to have blood on it's hands if the B12 dies.

I think that both the ACC and B12 are solid conferences, but have flaws. The ACC has great markets, but not great penetration and Swafford really screwed them on their contract so they are stuck being underpaid for quite awhile. It is also hard for them to get a network up since they required Raycom be involved so ESPN sold a bunch of T3 stuff to them, FOX regional, and others. Raycom needs the ACC T3 stuff to survive. It has been dwindling for awhile and the ACC T3 keeps it alive. It has no incentive to sell it back. The ACC network is going nowhere until they can buy that T3 back from sellers who have no motivation to do so (Raycom would die and FOX is not helping create a network for a rival conference). The ACC needs expansion to get that network (extra content) or a change of heart by the holders of its T3 that ESPN sold. However, the ACC has a core of schools who love their conference and want it too survive and are rich enough that they might be able to wait for a decade to get paid fairly.

The B12 is has a small footprint, but great penetration of it's markets. It's FB is consistently #2 to the SEC and basketball is competitive; however, it is right in the middle of 3 stronger competitors (PAC is arguable, but safe due to geography) which makes it vulnerable. It has schools coveted by all four major conferences. It's schools are not strongly held together through mutual like as much as a money band-aid. Texas is the glue that holds it together with it's immense value. If Texas bails, or OU does which would cause UT to as well, the B12 is dead.

Since 2 or 4 conferences make the most sense (and money for schools) at least one, if not both, of these conferences is likely to come to a premature end. Probably the B12 will die, if it is only one, since money, not respect or love for the conference, holds it together, unfortunately.

jhawkmvp,
As a Kansas fan, where would you like to end up assuming that the Big 12 does die?
I don't think that Texas, Oklahoma or Kansas will have trouble finding a soft spot to land if it becomes necessary.

(06-03-2014 09:07 PM)XLance Wrote:  

Jorts......Maybe it's just a thing in the state of Florida.

How or why were your eyes drawn to that pair of shorts when there are four lovely smiles and 4 nice racks in the picture?

XLance & JayhawkMVP, I don't think Oklahoma or Texas or Kansas will blow apart the Big 12. I think the networks will eventually blow it apart. They are overpaying for the total value of the conference to keep tabs on 3 or 4 schools they want to maximize profits elsewhere. In the end the networks will broker out the other 5 or 6 schools in order to garner content value in the placement of Kansas, Oklahoma, Texas, and possibly Oklahoma State.

(06-04-2014 04:54 PM)JRsec Wrote:  

(06-03-2014 09:07 PM)XLance Wrote:  

Jorts......Maybe it's just a thing in the state of Florida.

How or why were your eyes drawn to that pair of shorts when there are four lovely smiles and 4 nice racks in the picture?

Because the Florida State photo looked a lot better than the Florida one.
Those Jorts must be an epidemic in Florida.

https://www.google.com/search?q=jorts&rl...24&bih=677

Here you go the whole enchilada.

(06-04-2014 04:04 PM)XLance Wrote:  jhawkmvp,
As a Kansas fan, where would you like to end up assuming that the Big 12 does die?
I don't think that Texas, Oklahoma or Kansas will have trouble finding a soft spot to land if it becomes necessary.

Honestly, it would depend on where Texas and OU end up. I really love being partners with them in the B12. I think they would all like to stay together, but have little brothers to take care of that might not make that possible (more OU and UT than KU because Kansas is too small and the KSU brand too weak to piggyback to another conference with KU). The PAC, SEC, and B1G all have former Big 8/12 schools that we have strong ties too. Our greatest rival, Missouri, is in the SEC now and unless we end up in the same conference with them down the road that is a dead rivalry unless things change dramatically (primarily due to it being in our best interest to keep their exposure in Kansas City to a minimum IMO).

I can talk pretty openly about all the conferences because I could see KU in all of them depending on how things play out and they all have some good to great points. I think KU is in a second tier of schools that would be a valued asset to any conference, but will have to wait on schools like Texas, UVA, OU, and UNC, that have better markets and/or FB helmet programs, to pass on or accept invites to certain conferences to get our landing spot, most likely. Which schools end up where could change things dramatically financially and competitively in sports, so a conference that is behind now, could vault to the top, or close to the top, with the right schools/markets/brands.

My quick thoughts off the top of my head on the conferences from my perspective as a KU fan (Phog and other KU fans might add to these):

ACC
Pros: Huge footprint. Academically strong. Lot of KU/UNC ties. Basketball season would be insanely entertaining. KU/UNC, KU/Duke, KU/Syracuse, KU/Louisville, etc. That would be basketball nirvana. Football would be easier and less competitive than the B12 so KU would see better results on the gridiron I think. GA/FL FB recruiting opens up. If it happens, most likely the ACC added at least Texas, and more likely, 4 or more other B12 schools.
Cons:Swofford currently runs it. I worry about fit there as some ACC fans can be extremely condescending to schools and fan bases from rural states. Maybe that is just an internet thing. Maybe not. Travel would be a hassle due to distance.

B1G
Pros: Best fit culturally and academically. Academically stellar. Almost exclusively AAU, with the CIC bonus. NU is already there. Financially it is the most powerful conference and will probably remain there for the foreseeable future. Basketball would be great. Match ups with Indiana, MSU, Michigan and others would be great. KU BB recruiting would get great exposure in NY, Chicago, D.C. and other hoops hotbeds. If the B1G goes past 16, then there is a good shot OU and Texas are there as well. Football should be competitive and improve as the current B1G is not as strong in FB as the B12 and IMO is the weakest currently. Shortest travel of the four.
Cons: Football recruiting in Texas would dry to a trickle (though to be honest KU did well under Mason in the 90s recruiting a lot of B1G states) unless UT and OU come as well. Worst FB recruiting grounds of the major conferences (which is showing on the field lately). Colder weather than the B12.

PAC
Pros:Better academically than the B12 by quite a bit. Warmer weather for fall and spring sports. California recruiting for everything. CU is there. KU basketball would probably have the best chance to have the same success as it has in the B12, while still getting UCLA and Arizona on the schedule each year. Would probably be 4-8 other B12 schools as well.
Cons:Worst time zone for games (PST). Travel would be a major hassle due to distance and time zone issues. Fans can be apathetic. Least exposure of all the conferences again related to time zone.

SEC
Pros:Best overall sports conference going IMO. Basketball would square off mostly with Kentucky, and sometimes Florida, for supremacy. KU BB should win similarly to the B12. Gains SE football recruiting to go with Texas. Missouri our greatest rival is there and the rivalry would be reignited. Texas A&M is there and we have some history from the B12 with them. Warm weather for spring and fall sports. Rabid fans. Probably means the SEC is going big and there would be additional B12 schools added as well. Football schedule would see some big name programs every year in Lawrence.
Cons:Not a step up academically from the B12, unless Texas or other AAU type schools are added as well. KU football would eternally struggle to be competitive, most likely, even if they were better just because of all the great schools at the top. Perceived cutthroat recruiting/eligibility issues (real or not).

If conferences only went to 16, and I had a gun against my head, I would probably pick the B1G primarily due to fit/travel and KU FB being more competitive there. But, I would be fine with any of them if the B12 falls apart and all have there good points.

(06-04-2014 05:13 PM)JRsec Wrote:  XLance & JayhawkMVP, I don't think Oklahoma or Texas or Kansas will blow apart the Big 12. I think the networks will eventually blow it apart. They are overpaying for the total value of the conference to keep tabs on 3 or 4 schools they want to maximize profits elsewhere. In the end the networks will broker out the other 5 or 6 schools in order to garner content value in the placement of Kansas, Oklahoma, Texas, and possibly Oklahoma State.

Good chance of that being true. This is mostly about money and the networks control the chunk of money that this is happening for mostly.