(03-22-2014 05:38 PM)jaminandjachin Wrote:  1) This is all about forcing a settlement which Maryland is desperately trying to do.
2) I mentioned bridge burning earlier because of the sheer number of schools that are being dragged into this along with ESPN. This "scorched earth" tactic will be bad for all parties involved. No one wants that.

1) So why is Maryland desperate? This case has been pending since 2012 and the more the ACC withholds the less Maryland has to loose.

2) The Affidavit stated ESPN was cooperating with Maryland to extent to where Maryland did not need to get the Court involved to compel discovery. That does not sound like "scorched earth" litigation to me.

(03-22-2014 09:43 PM)Lurker Above Wrote:  

(03-22-2014 05:38 PM)jaminandjachin Wrote:  1) This is all about forcing a settlement which Maryland is desperately trying to do.
2) I mentioned bridge burning earlier because of the sheer number of schools that are being dragged into this along with ESPN. This "scorched earth" tactic will be bad for all parties involved. No one wants that.

1) So why is Maryland desperate? This case has been pending since 2012 and the more the ACC withholds the less Maryland has to loose.

2) The Affidavit stated ESPN was cooperating with Maryland to extent to where Maryland did not need to get the Court involved to compel discovery. That does not sound like "scorched earth" litigation to me.

Because they need the money and they want this wrapped up before they leave for the B1G.

The fact they even brought ESPN into it speaks volumes. What was ESPN supposed to do, not comply with a court order??

Is there a reason why Maryland needs this settled before they enter the Big Ten?

(03-22-2014 11:17 PM)Dasville Wrote:  Is there a reason why Maryland needs this settled before they enter the Big Ten?

Not that I'm aware.

Maryland is leaving a burnt bridge!

(03-22-2014 03:40 PM)He1nousOne Wrote:  

(03-22-2014 03:26 PM)GTTiger Wrote:  Maryland is going the route of PR, because they have no actual case. The ACC is not dumb, they can easily get the Big 10 involved and prove how losing a team can lead to the loss of millions. Just ask the Big East. The Big 10/maryland is just as at risk of having their dirty laundry exposed as the ACC.

Just because the ACC managed to get a better replacement in Louisville than the team that left, doesn't get Maryland off the hook.

That's like my first car got totaled and then I bought a better one, am I still not entitled to the insurance?

Most of these cases are settled because the at risk conference Big East, Big 12 must clean it up in order to get back in the business of saving themselves, the ACC is at no such risk. If it gets settled it won't be for less than 35 million.

What a silly first post. Congrats.

There's nothing wrong w/ their post, only your $#!t reply...

(03-23-2014 01:35 AM)Crimsonelf Wrote:  

(03-22-2014 03:40 PM)He1nousOne Wrote:  

(03-22-2014 03:26 PM)GTTiger Wrote:  Maryland is going the route of PR, because they have no actual case. The ACC is not dumb, they can easily get the Big 10 involved and prove how losing a team can lead to the loss of millions. Just ask the Big East. The Big 10/maryland is just as at risk of having their dirty laundry exposed as the ACC.

Just because the ACC managed to get a better replacement in Louisville than the team that left, doesn't get Maryland off the hook.

That's like my first car got totaled and then I bought a better one, am I still not entitled to the insurance?

Most of these cases are settled because the at risk conference Big East, Big 12 must clean it up in order to get back in the business of saving themselves, the ACC is at no such risk. If it gets settled it won't be for less than 35 million.

What a silly first post. Congrats.

There's nothing wrong w/ their post, only your $#!t reply...

Whatever you say Louisville guy. Of course you think that in the world of Academia, you know...the people that make these choices, the folks in the ACC think they got the upgrade in Louisville over what Maryland is.

(03-22-2014 01:04 PM)Dasville Wrote:  What is Maryland's rush? If they have a slam dunk case against the ACC, they will get 3x the exit fee won't they? What is the time crunch? The State is fronting them the $ until they join the B1G so money shouldn't be a problem. If you read the article, these subpoenas they are referencing were issued in Jan & Feb and are asking the schools to go back 12 years. Can't really say the ACC is dragging its feet when you request info. from 12 years ago.

The interesting point about going back 12 years for documents--that would likely cover all the ACC's previous expansions and intentions--meaning all of that information could enter court proceedings.

(03-22-2014 02:22 PM)CrazyPaco Wrote:  

(03-22-2014 01:46 PM)Kaplony Wrote:  As I have said before Maryland has been involved in the decision making since 1953, so they know where the bodies are buried. The fact that the ACC has been ran like a small town country club is going to bite them in the end, and I highly doubt that even the corrupt NC judicial system can bail them out of this one. This case gets settled for significantly less than what the ACC has pushed for.

Sad thing is the ACC fanboys on this board will still try to claim a victory.

It sounds like a fishing expedition. An attempt to try to push a settlement by making cumbersome requests and/or a try at obfuscating the issues when you don't find the law so clearly on your side. I don't believe it is an uncommon tactic, and to me it reeks more of desperation than of knowing where any bodies are buried.

In court you can't just "know", you have to prove. Maryland probably knows many things about the inner working of the ACC when they took schools from other conferences or moved on their new buyout fees. They still have to prove everything in court though and that's why you would go after documents. Doesn't reflect any desperation, just sound legal maneuvers.

(03-23-2014 02:33 AM)Tbringer Wrote:  

(03-22-2014 02:22 PM)CrazyPaco Wrote:  

(03-22-2014 01:46 PM)Kaplony Wrote:  As I have said before Maryland has been involved in the decision making since 1953, so they know where the bodies are buried. The fact that the ACC has been ran like a small town country club is going to bite them in the end, and I highly doubt that even the corrupt NC judicial system can bail them out of this one. This case gets settled for significantly less than what the ACC has pushed for.

Sad thing is the ACC fanboys on this board will still try to claim a victory.

It sounds like a fishing expedition. An attempt to try to push a settlement by making cumbersome requests and/or a try at obfuscating the issues when you don't find the law so clearly on your side. I don't believe it is an uncommon tactic, and to me it reeks more of desperation than of knowing where any bodies are buried.

In court you can't just "know", you have to prove. Maryland probably knows many things about the inner working of the ACC when they took schools from other conferences or moved on their new buyout fees. They still have to prove everything in court though and that's why you would go after documents. Doesn't reflect any desperation, just sound legal maneuvers.

Maryland "knows" because Maryland has their own hands full of any "muck" people think will be uncovered during discovery.

It took part in all of these decisions and voted in favor of them along with all of the other Old Guard ACC schools.

Their hands are full of the same "blood" that other people want them to "expose".

None of that will help them with their legal case. They would have the same "unclean hands" as their court opponent.

(03-23-2014 09:10 AM)TerryD Wrote:  

(03-23-2014 02:33 AM)Tbringer Wrote:  

(03-22-2014 02:22 PM)CrazyPaco Wrote:  

(03-22-2014 01:46 PM)Kaplony Wrote:  As I have said before Maryland has been involved in the decision making since 1953, so they know where the bodies are buried. The fact that the ACC has been ran like a small town country club is going to bite them in the end, and I highly doubt that even the corrupt NC judicial system can bail them out of this one. This case gets settled for significantly less than what the ACC has pushed for.

Sad thing is the ACC fanboys on this board will still try to claim a victory.

It sounds like a fishing expedition. An attempt to try to push a settlement by making cumbersome requests and/or a try at obfuscating the issues when you don't find the law so clearly on your side. I don't believe it is an uncommon tactic, and to me it reeks more of desperation than of knowing where any bodies are buried.

In court you can't just "know", you have to prove. Maryland probably knows many things about the inner working of the ACC when they took schools from other conferences or moved on their new buyout fees. They still have to prove everything in court though and that's why you would go after documents. Doesn't reflect any desperation, just sound legal maneuvers.

Maryland "knows" because Maryland has their own hands full of any "muck" people think will be uncovered during discovery.

It took part in all of these decisions and voted in favor of them along with all of the other Old Guard ACC schools.

Their hands are full of the same "blood" that other people want them to "expose".

None of that will help them with their legal case. They would have the same "unclean hands" as their court opponent.

Agreed...Maryland just trying to sue for peace right now. I see this getting settled as no one wants to go through this except the media and curious fans.

it is funny the Big 10 says in their press release they will contact the conferences before they talk to a team....but of course they did no such thing in regards to the Big 12 and Nebraska and they had at least two discussions with Nebraska before the Big 12 ever knew and several other discussions about Nebraska before the Big 12 knew a specific team in their conference was under consideration

(03-23-2014 09:44 AM)TodgeRodge Wrote:  it is funny the Big 10 says in their press release they will contact the conferences before they talk to a team....but of course they did no such thing in regards to the Big 12 and Nebraska and they had at least two discussions with Nebraska before the Big 12 ever knew and several other discussions about Nebraska before the Big 12 knew a specific team in their conference was under consideration

Nothing new there...I don't blame the B1G either (despite the hypocrisy). You have to move stealth like...look at the bungled ACC raid in '03.

(03-23-2014 09:10 AM)TerryD Wrote:  

(03-23-2014 02:33 AM)Tbringer Wrote:  

(03-22-2014 02:22 PM)CrazyPaco Wrote:  

(03-22-2014 01:46 PM)Kaplony Wrote:  As I have said before Maryland has been involved in the decision making since 1953, so they know where the bodies are buried. The fact that the ACC has been ran like a small town country club is going to bite them in the end, and I highly doubt that even the corrupt NC judicial system can bail them out of this one. This case gets settled for significantly less than what the ACC has pushed for.

Sad thing is the ACC fanboys on this board will still try to claim a victory.

It sounds like a fishing expedition. An attempt to try to push a settlement by making cumbersome requests and/or a try at obfuscating the issues when you don't find the law so clearly on your side. I don't believe it is an uncommon tactic, and to me it reeks more of desperation than of knowing where any bodies are buried.

In court you can't just "know", you have to prove. Maryland probably knows many things about the inner working of the ACC when they took schools from other conferences or moved on their new buyout fees. They still have to prove everything in court though and that's why you would go after documents. Doesn't reflect any desperation, just sound legal maneuvers.

Maryland "knows" because Maryland has their own hands full of any "muck" people think will be uncovered during discovery.

It took part in all of these decisions and voted in favor of them along with all of the other Old Guard ACC schools.

Their hands are full of the same "blood" that other people want them to "expose".

None of that will help them with their legal case. They would have the same "unclean hands" as their court opponent.

Obviously if Maryland is presenting something in court the assumption would be they aren't materially involved in any wrongdoing.

Maryland may not have been directly involved in planning or determining how to take teams from other conferences. Their administration was doubtfully involved in direct meetings with media partners on things like increases or who would be valuable for example. Instead, the ACC office and probably a few members administrators (UNC, Duke?) were involved directly and then disseminated the information to the rest.

Also, reports say that the ACC knew Maryland was talking with the Big Ten, and others might be talking, when they raised the buyout fee a second time. Obviously Maryland wasn't involved in any discussions related to increasing the buyout fee, nor was FSU who also has been reported as being very suprised by it. Maryland has told the court they were unaware and the dissemination of information as required by the bylaws wasn't followed. Someone was involved in such decissions though, and that is the type of info that discovery will show to the court.

(03-23-2014 09:47 AM)TexanMark Wrote:  

(03-23-2014 09:44 AM)TodgeRodge Wrote:  it is funny the Big 10 says in their press release they will contact the conferences before they talk to a team....but of course they did no such thing in regards to the Big 12 and Nebraska and they had at least two discussions with Nebraska before the Big 12 ever knew and several other discussions about Nebraska before the Big 12 knew a specific team in their conference was under consideration

Nothing new there...I don't blame the B1G either (despite the hypocrisy). You have to move stealth like...look at the bungled ACC raid in '03.

I see fans of the ACC often posting things like "nothing new here".

New information in this latest court action though, shows that more schools than just Pitt have been subpoenaed, the ACCs media partners including ESPN have been, and only Virginia Tech and GT have complied so far.

It isn't common for media partners, especially a giant like ESPN to be subpoenaed in a case like this.

(03-23-2014 09:47 AM)TexanMark Wrote:  

(03-23-2014 09:44 AM)TodgeRodge Wrote:  it is funny the Big 10 says in their press release they will contact the conferences before they talk to a team....but of course they did no such thing in regards to the Big 12 and Nebraska and they had at least two discussions with Nebraska before the Big 12 ever knew and several other discussions about Nebraska before the Big 12 knew a specific team in their conference was under consideration

Nothing new there...I don't blame the B1G either (despite the hypocrisy). You have to move stealth like...look at the bungled ACC raid in '03.

I agree that at this point the Big 12 is probably not concerned about it, but Maryland (and the Big 10 by default) need to be really careful what they drag up from the dead here

if Maryland is trying to say that the ACC has no damages claims or should not have a claim to any damages because they themselves were trying to make a move on the Big 10 and had discussed that it might damage the Big 10

well you start opening up the "who damaged who and who planned to damage who" barn door and you better believe the Big East/AAC will want on on that action if it is shown there was known damages that were laughed off or blown off as "irrelevant" or "not our problem"......that are now suddenly being drug up as relevant because the ACC is claiming damages when they possibly tried to damage the Big 10

and if the Big East/AAC start down the "we were damaged" path well you know the ACC and Big 10 are in the sites and probably the Big 12 gets tossed in for the ride because of WVU and even TCU

and if the Big 12 has to shell out cash because of all that mess you can bet they are going to seek to get theirs back from the Big 10 and possibly the PAC 12 as well and the Big 10 has their "protocol" clearly published and the Nebraska AD is in the Omaha paper clearly laying out a timeline of both official and unofficial discussions with the Big 10 well before the Big 12 knew about it

at this point and time I can't believe the Big 10 has not told Maryland to shut up and pay something and move on....I say Maryland pays 34.1 million which is half of the 52.2 million + 8 million for lawyer and court fun money

no way they get out for the 20 million now and I doubt they get out for the 20 million + lawyer and court fun money

(03-23-2014 09:10 AM)TerryD Wrote:  

(03-23-2014 02:33 AM)Tbringer Wrote:  

(03-22-2014 02:22 PM)CrazyPaco Wrote:  

(03-22-2014 01:46 PM)Kaplony Wrote:  As I have said before Maryland has been involved in the decision making since 1953, so they know where the bodies are buried. The fact that the ACC has been ran like a small town country club is going to bite them in the end, and I highly doubt that even the corrupt NC judicial system can bail them out of this one. This case gets settled for significantly less than what the ACC has pushed for.

Sad thing is the ACC fanboys on this board will still try to claim a victory.

It sounds like a fishing expedition. An attempt to try to push a settlement by making cumbersome requests and/or a try at obfuscating the issues when you don't find the law so clearly on your side. I don't believe it is an uncommon tactic, and to me it reeks more of desperation than of knowing where any bodies are buried.

In court you can't just "know", you have to prove. Maryland probably knows many things about the inner working of the ACC when they took schools from other conferences or moved on their new buyout fees. They still have to prove everything in court though and that's why you would go after documents. Doesn't reflect any desperation, just sound legal maneuvers.

Maryland "knows" because Maryland has their own hands full of any "muck" people think will be uncovered during discovery.

It took part in all of these decisions and voted in favor of them along with all of the other Old Guard ACC schools.

Their hands are full of the same "blood" that other people want them to "expose".

None of that will help them with their legal case. They would have the same "unclean hands" as their court opponent.

TerryD, I think you and most of the posters on here are a little off course with the contention Maryland's strategy is nothing more than churn up "muck" and "blood". What is legally significant in this case as it pertains to antitrust and unfair business practices is defining the "market" of schools that the ACC competes.

As for going back 12 years in its discovery requests, I believe Maryland's purpose for doing so is to show the ACC and the B1G compete in the same market for schools in the northeast. It will be hard for the ACC to deny this when they have added VT, BC, Syracuse, and Pitt, while the B1G has added PSU, Rutgers and most significantly, Maryland from the ACC.

Maryland does not need muck or blood from ESPN or the Big East raids to win its case. Maryland needs information to show market, value and competition for schools. It does not need to show ESPN induced any school to move, only that ESPN, if asked, gave honest assessments they would pay more. That is the all important line that ESPN has consistently stated it does not cross, most recently just this weekend, and it would be highly unlikely for ESPN, in my opinion, to have crossed that line. That is corporate business 101.

The only muck Maryland needs is the penal exit fee. The contention the ACC violated its own Bylaws is gravy, albeit delicious gravy for the stuffing Maryland is about to knock out of the ACC.

Its way too early to say who can get out for what.

Seems Maryland has some legitimate information they are attempting to present to the courts. It will be interesting to see what does come out from this discovery.

As far as the Big East, that conference doesn't exist anymore, not sure why the BE didn't push for legal remedies from the ACC in the latest round, but individual schools did sue when the earlier realignment happened. They didn't win much other than legal fees and some games though. Don't really think any of that will have anything to do with the present case other than possibly showing the hypocritical nature of the ACC suing Maryland for leaving when the ACC has a long history of poaching schools from other conferences.

(03-23-2014 12:38 PM)Tbringer Wrote:  Its way too early to say who can get out for what.

Seems Maryland has some legitimate information they are attempting to present to the courts. It will be interesting to see what does come out from this discovery.

As far as the Big East, that conference doesn't exist anymore, not sure why the BE didn't push for legal remedies from the ACC in the latest round, but individual schools did sue when the earlier realignment happened. They didn't win much other than legal fees and some games though. Don't really think any of that will have anything to do with the present case other than possibly showing the hypocritical nature of the ACC suing Maryland for leaving when the ACC has a long history of poaching schools from other conferences.

The American Athletic Conference is the legal successor to the original Big East - all the conference did was sell the name and intellectual property to a group if schools who withdrew from the conference.

(03-23-2014 02:13 PM)chargeradio Wrote:  

(03-23-2014 12:38 PM)Tbringer Wrote:  Its way too early to say who can get out for what.

Seems Maryland has some legitimate information they are attempting to present to the courts. It will be interesting to see what does come out from this discovery.

As far as the Big East, that conference doesn't exist anymore, not sure why the BE didn't push for legal remedies from the ACC in the latest round, but individual schools did sue when the earlier realignment happened. They didn't win much other than legal fees and some games though. Don't really think any of that will have anything to do with the present case other than possibly showing the hypocritical nature of the ACC suing Maryland for leaving when the ACC has a long history of poaching schools from other conferences.

The American Athletic Conference is the legal successor to the original Big East - all the conference did was sell the name and intellectual property to a group if schools who withdrew from the conference.

Actually, the Big East is now a basketball conference HQd in Providence RI.

The AAC is a new conference that happens to have a few members from the old Big East conference.