(01-17-2014 12:55 PM)Crebman Wrote:  In all honesty, I'm not so against the illegal immigrants so long as they have a steady job and don't require any government aid - and tons of them do work hard and they do jobs that too many Americans find either too hard or distasteful or would rather mooch off the government teat.

Now, if we wanted to force them out of the country AND force all able bodied Americans to take those jobs or not get a dime of government services/money, I might be more inclined to push for their removal. However, we all know that our government, particularly Democrats with some Republicans thrown in, has neither the will, stomach or inclination to do the above. With that said, the illegals are filling jobs at the low end of the scale that too many of our slothful Americans don't want.

Exactly. That's all I've been saying.

Besides, removing all the "illegals" would cost too much money.

Isn't that what most people care about above all else? Money?

Because clearly, they couldn't care less if some starving families were attempting to make a living by crossing the border.

(01-17-2014 01:00 PM)Fitbud Wrote:  

(01-17-2014 12:55 PM)Crebman Wrote:  In all honesty, I'm not so against the illegal immigrants so long as they have a steady job and don't require any government aid - and tons of them do work hard and they do jobs that too many Americans find either too hard or distasteful or would rather mooch off the government teat.

Now, if we wanted to force them out of the country AND force all able bodied Americans to take those jobs or not get a dime of government services/money, I might be more inclined to push for their removal. However, we all know that our government, particularly Democrats with some Republicans thrown in, has neither the will, stomach or inclination to do the above. With that said, the illegals are filling jobs at the low end of the scale that too many of our slothful Americans don't want.

Exactly. That's all I've been saying.

Besides, removing all the "illegals" would cost too much money.

Isn't that what most people care about above all else? Money?

Because clearly, they couldn't care less if some starving families were attempting to make a living by crossing the border.

We can't even find the one's running around with outstanding warrants. If we can't even round up the one's that have committed crimes once they got here, how on earth does anyone expect us to catch all of them here illegally?

I actually have much more interest in stopping the flow from today going forward. We can't continue to add to the problem. Stop the flow first - then figure out what to do with the ones already here.

(01-17-2014 03:54 PM)Crebman Wrote:  

(01-17-2014 01:00 PM)Fitbud Wrote:  

(01-17-2014 12:55 PM)Crebman Wrote:  In all honesty, I'm not so against the illegal immigrants so long as they have a steady job and don't require any government aid - and tons of them do work hard and they do jobs that too many Americans find either too hard or distasteful or would rather mooch off the government teat.

Now, if we wanted to force them out of the country AND force all able bodied Americans to take those jobs or not get a dime of government services/money, I might be more inclined to push for their removal. However, we all know that our government, particularly Democrats with some Republicans thrown in, has neither the will, stomach or inclination to do the above. With that said, the illegals are filling jobs at the low end of the scale that too many of our slothful Americans don't want.

Exactly. That's all I've been saying.

Besides, removing all the "illegals" would cost too much money.

Isn't that what most people care about above all else? Money?

Because clearly, they couldn't care less if some starving families were attempting to make a living by crossing the border.

We can't even find the one's running around with outstanding warrants. If we can't even round up the one's that have committed crimes once they got here, how on earth does anyone expect us to catch all of them here illegally?

I actually have much more interest in stopping the flow from today going forward. We can't continue to add to the problem. Stop the flow first - then figure out what to do with the ones already here.

Well supposedly, our recent recession actually reversed the flow. According to some reports, the recession forced many undocumented immigrants to go back to their country of origin.

(01-17-2014 01:00 PM)Fitbud Wrote:  

(01-17-2014 12:55 PM)Crebman Wrote:  In all honesty, I'm not so against the illegal immigrants so long as they have a steady job and don't require any government aid - and tons of them do work hard and they do jobs that too many Americans find either too hard or distasteful or would rather mooch off the government teat.

Now, if we wanted to force them out of the country AND force all able bodied Americans to take those jobs or not get a dime of government services/money, I might be more inclined to push for their removal. However, we all know that our government, particularly Democrats with some Republicans thrown in, has neither the will, stomach or inclination to do the above. With that said, the illegals are filling jobs at the low end of the scale that too many of our slothful Americans don't want.

Exactly. That's all I've been saying.

Besides, removing all the "illegals" would cost too much money.

Isn't that what most people care about above all else? Money?

Because clearly, they couldn't care less if some starving families were attempting to make a living by crossing the border.

Yes, because our govt is always concerned with how much something costs.

Pull your head out.

(01-17-2014 12:07 PM)GoApps70 Wrote:  

(01-16-2014 08:55 PM)dawgitall Wrote:  

(01-16-2014 08:23 PM)oklalittledixie Wrote:  

(01-16-2014 08:11 PM)dawgitall Wrote:  

(01-16-2014 08:04 PM)oklalittledixie Wrote:  He's also not telling the truth.

How do you know that? He doesn't have any reason to lie and I've known him all my life. He is an extremely honest and honorable man.

Because the unemployment numbers in rural areas are worse than urban counties. This myth that illegals are doing jobs Americans wont is a big lie generated by liberals and traitorous companies.

Your farmer friend is enjoying paying illegal labor way under the minimum wage bracket.

Did you read the post? He isn't a farmer, he is a home builder and he pays the going wage. Who said that they were illegals? He doesn't hire illegals. He hires the best framers, masons etc. that he can get and they are by and large Mexicans. If you don't have a good work ethic you have a hard time getting a job. If you have a good work ethic you have a much easier time getting a job. In the coastal county he works out of there were several dozen homebuilders prior to the recession, and now there are about a third of that number. With many less vacation homes being built there are a lot more construction workers than their are jobs. The reliable, hardworking and most skilled get the jobs, and the lazy, irresponsible and under skilled scrape by. His point was that the work ethic of the whites and blacks often wasn't too good and those of the Mexicans generally was. That isn't to say that there aren't hardworking whites and blacks, just from a numbers standpoint the Mexican Americans are making a better showing.

More baloney. I have been to these sites. Doesn't take long to realize that they are illegal aliens. Most cannot speak English more than a couple of words. He is basically using "slave labor". He may pay them such and such, but he may get a big cut of that back into his pocket. Works out well for the site foremen also, etc. In a group like that there is one that can speak English pretty well to interpret, and one that knows basic construction that continuously tells them what to do and how to do it. Quality of home construction has taken terrible hits the last several years. Many times inferior grade of materials being used by builders more also. No one to report them basically.

I'm glad to hear that you have had extensive worksite conversations to determine their legal status and English speaking abilities. But I'm perplexed as to how you know the business practices of one of my relatives you've never met? He builds high end, high quality custom homes and has been doing so for over a quarter century. Your comments are insulting.

(01-17-2014 10:38 PM)dawgitall Wrote:  

(01-17-2014 12:07 PM)GoApps70 Wrote:  

(01-16-2014 08:55 PM)dawgitall Wrote:  

(01-16-2014 08:23 PM)oklalittledixie Wrote:  

(01-16-2014 08:11 PM)dawgitall Wrote:  How do you know that? He doesn't have any reason to lie and I've known him all my life. He is an extremely honest and honorable man.

Because the unemployment numbers in rural areas are worse than urban counties. This myth that illegals are doing jobs Americans wont is a big lie generated by liberals and traitorous companies.

Your farmer friend is enjoying paying illegal labor way under the minimum wage bracket.

Did you read the post? He isn't a farmer, he is a home builder and he pays the going wage. Who said that they were illegals? He doesn't hire illegals. He hires the best framers, masons etc. that he can get and they are by and large Mexicans. If you don't have a good work ethic you have a hard time getting a job. If you have a good work ethic you have a much easier time getting a job. In the coastal county he works out of there were several dozen homebuilders prior to the recession, and now there are about a third of that number. With many less vacation homes being built there are a lot more construction workers than their are jobs. The reliable, hardworking and most skilled get the jobs, and the lazy, irresponsible and under skilled scrape by. His point was that the work ethic of the whites and blacks often wasn't too good and those of the Mexicans generally was. That isn't to say that there aren't hardworking whites and blacks, just from a numbers standpoint the Mexican Americans are making a better showing.

More baloney. I have been to these sites. Doesn't take long to realize that they are illegal aliens. Most cannot speak English more than a couple of words. He is basically using "slave labor". He may pay them such and such, but he may get a big cut of that back into his pocket. Works out well for the site foremen also, etc. In a group like that there is one that can speak English pretty well to interpret, and one that knows basic construction that continuously tells them what to do and how to do it. Quality of home construction has taken terrible hits the last several years. Many times inferior grade of materials being used by builders more also. No one to report them basically.

I'm glad to hear that you have had extensive worksite conversations to determine their legal status and English speaking abilities. But I'm perplexed as to how you know the business practices of one of my relatives you've never met? He builds high end, high quality custom homes and has been doing so for over a quarter century. Your comments are insulting.

Yep. He's using illegal labor. Home builders are some of the worst offenders. They tear up beautifil countryside to build their cookie-cutter homes using illegal aliens -getting rich. They could care less about our country. They just abuse our capitalistic system. Traitors.

(01-17-2014 11:42 PM)oklalittledixie Wrote:  

(01-17-2014 10:38 PM)dawgitall Wrote:  

(01-17-2014 12:07 PM)GoApps70 Wrote:  

(01-16-2014 08:55 PM)dawgitall Wrote:  

(01-16-2014 08:23 PM)oklalittledixie Wrote:  Because the unemployment numbers in rural areas are worse than urban counties. This myth that illegals are doing jobs Americans wont is a big lie generated by liberals and traitorous companies.

Your farmer friend is enjoying paying illegal labor way under the minimum wage bracket.

Did you read the post? He isn't a farmer, he is a home builder and he pays the going wage. Who said that they were illegals? He doesn't hire illegals. He hires the best framers, masons etc. that he can get and they are by and large Mexicans. If you don't have a good work ethic you have a hard time getting a job. If you have a good work ethic you have a much easier time getting a job. In the coastal county he works out of there were several dozen homebuilders prior to the recession, and now there are about a third of that number. With many less vacation homes being built there are a lot more construction workers than their are jobs. The reliable, hardworking and most skilled get the jobs, and the lazy, irresponsible and under skilled scrape by. His point was that the work ethic of the whites and blacks often wasn't too good and those of the Mexicans generally was. That isn't to say that there aren't hardworking whites and blacks, just from a numbers standpoint the Mexican Americans are making a better showing.

More baloney. I have been to these sites. Doesn't take long to realize that they are illegal aliens. Most cannot speak English more than a couple of words. He is basically using "slave labor". He may pay them such and such, but he may get a big cut of that back into his pocket. Works out well for the site foremen also, etc. In a group like that there is one that can speak English pretty well to interpret, and one that knows basic construction that continuously tells them what to do and how to do it. Quality of home construction has taken terrible hits the last several years. Many times inferior grade of materials being used by builders more also. No one to report them basically.

I'm glad to hear that you have had extensive worksite conversations to determine their legal status and English speaking abilities. But I'm perplexed as to how you know the business practices of one of my relatives you've never met? He builds high end, high quality custom homes and has been doing so for over a quarter century. Your comments are insulting.

Yep. He's using illegal labor. Home builders are some of the worst offenders. They tear up beautifil countryside to build their cookie-cutter homes using illegal aliens -getting rich. They could care less about our country. They just abuse our capitalistic system. Traitors.

That's me

(01-17-2014 11:42 PM)oklalittledixie Wrote:  

(01-17-2014 10:38 PM)dawgitall Wrote:  

(01-17-2014 12:07 PM)GoApps70 Wrote:  

(01-16-2014 08:55 PM)dawgitall Wrote:  

(01-16-2014 08:23 PM)oklalittledixie Wrote:  Because the unemployment numbers in rural areas are worse than urban counties. This myth that illegals are doing jobs Americans wont is a big lie generated by liberals and traitorous companies.

Your farmer friend is enjoying paying illegal labor way under the minimum wage bracket.

Did you read the post? He isn't a farmer, he is a home builder and he pays the going wage. Who said that they were illegals? He doesn't hire illegals. He hires the best framers, masons etc. that he can get and they are by and large Mexicans. If you don't have a good work ethic you have a hard time getting a job. If you have a good work ethic you have a much easier time getting a job. In the coastal county he works out of there were several dozen homebuilders prior to the recession, and now there are about a third of that number. With many less vacation homes being built there are a lot more construction workers than their are jobs. The reliable, hardworking and most skilled get the jobs, and the lazy, irresponsible and under skilled scrape by. His point was that the work ethic of the whites and blacks often wasn't too good and those of the Mexicans generally was. That isn't to say that there aren't hardworking whites and blacks, just from a numbers standpoint the Mexican Americans are making a better showing.

More baloney. I have been to these sites. Doesn't take long to realize that they are illegal aliens. Most cannot speak English more than a couple of words. He is basically using "slave labor". He may pay them such and such, but he may get a big cut of that back into his pocket. Works out well for the site foremen also, etc. In a group like that there is one that can speak English pretty well to interpret, and one that knows basic construction that continuously tells them what to do and how to do it. Quality of home construction has taken terrible hits the last several years. Many times inferior grade of materials being used by builders more also. No one to report them basically.

I'm glad to hear that you have had extensive worksite conversations to determine their legal status and English speaking abilities. But I'm perplexed as to how you know the business practices of one of my relatives you've never met? He builds high end, high quality custom homes and has been doing so for over a quarter century. Your comments are insulting.

Yep. He's using illegal labor. Home builders are some of the worst offenders. They tear up beautifil countryside to build their cookie-cutter homes using illegal aliens -getting rich. They could care less about our country. They just abuse our capitalistic system. Traitors.

You don't know what you are talking about. You stereotype everybody and try to make everything fit neatly into your preconceived notions. But if that makes you feel more secure that is your problem.

(01-17-2014 11:58 PM)dawgitall Wrote:  

(01-17-2014 11:42 PM)oklalittledixie Wrote:  

(01-17-2014 10:38 PM)dawgitall Wrote:  

(01-17-2014 12:07 PM)GoApps70 Wrote:  

(01-16-2014 08:55 PM)dawgitall Wrote:  Did you read the post? He isn't a farmer, he is a home builder and he pays the going wage. Who said that they were illegals? He doesn't hire illegals. He hires the best framers, masons etc. that he can get and they are by and large Mexicans. If you don't have a good work ethic you have a hard time getting a job. If you have a good work ethic you have a much easier time getting a job. In the coastal county he works out of there were several dozen homebuilders prior to the recession, and now there are about a third of that number. With many less vacation homes being built there are a lot more construction workers than their are jobs. The reliable, hardworking and most skilled get the jobs, and the lazy, irresponsible and under skilled scrape by. His point was that the work ethic of the whites and blacks often wasn't too good and those of the Mexicans generally was. That isn't to say that there aren't hardworking whites and blacks, just from a numbers standpoint the Mexican Americans are making a better showing.

More baloney. I have been to these sites. Doesn't take long to realize that they are illegal aliens. Most cannot speak English more than a couple of words. He is basically using "slave labor". He may pay them such and such, but he may get a big cut of that back into his pocket. Works out well for the site foremen also, etc. In a group like that there is one that can speak English pretty well to interpret, and one that knows basic construction that continuously tells them what to do and how to do it. Quality of home construction has taken terrible hits the last several years. Many times inferior grade of materials being used by builders more also. No one to report them basically.

I'm glad to hear that you have had extensive worksite conversations to determine their legal status and English speaking abilities. But I'm perplexed as to how you know the business practices of one of my relatives you've never met? He builds high end, high quality custom homes and has been doing so for over a quarter century. Your comments are insulting.

Yep. He's using illegal labor. Home builders are some of the worst offenders. They tear up beautifil countryside to build their cookie-cutter homes using illegal aliens -getting rich. They could care less about our country. They just abuse our capitalistic system. Traitors.

You don't know what you are talking about. You stereotype everybody and try to make everything fit neatly into your preconceived notions. But if that makes you feel more secure that is your problem.

Oh stop. The problem has gotten so bad because people like yourself want to play the stereotyping game. It's clear what your family member is doing. There are countless companies doing the same.

(01-17-2014 12:19 PM)HeartOfDixie Wrote:  The "anchor baby" issue is one that will be nearly impossible to change through political action, it's a constitutional provision that creates it.

The political action should be a constitutional amendment if necessary.

(01-18-2014 12:14 AM)oklalittledixie Wrote:  

(01-17-2014 11:58 PM)dawgitall Wrote:  

(01-17-2014 11:42 PM)oklalittledixie Wrote:  

(01-17-2014 10:38 PM)dawgitall Wrote:  

(01-17-2014 12:07 PM)GoApps70 Wrote:  More baloney. I have been to these sites. Doesn't take long to realize that they are illegal aliens. Most cannot speak English more than a couple of words. He is basically using "slave labor". He may pay them such and such, but he may get a big cut of that back into his pocket. Works out well for the site foremen also, etc. In a group like that there is one that can speak English pretty well to interpret, and one that knows basic construction that continuously tells them what to do and how to do it. Quality of home construction has taken terrible hits the last several years. Many times inferior grade of materials being used by builders more also. No one to report them basically.

I'm glad to hear that you have had extensive worksite conversations to determine their legal status and English speaking abilities. But I'm perplexed as to how you know the business practices of one of my relatives you've never met? He builds high end, high quality custom homes and has been doing so for over a quarter century. Your comments are insulting.

Yep. He's using illegal labor. Home builders are some of the worst offenders. They tear up beautifil countryside to build their cookie-cutter homes using illegal aliens -getting rich. They could care less about our country. They just abuse our capitalistic system. Traitors.

You don't know what you are talking about. You stereotype everybody and try to make everything fit neatly into your preconceived notions. But if that makes you feel more secure that is your problem.

Oh stop. The problem has gotten so bad because people like yourself want to play the stereotyping game. It's clear what your family member is doing. There are countless companies doing the same.

Your problem is that you never seem to be able to see any issue from any angle but your party line. Issues are more complex than that and real life doesn't fit neatly into the little boxes you try to put everything into. You say, "people like yourself" but you don't know me at all, or my family member, or his business yet you insist that you do.

(01-18-2014 03:48 PM)dawgitall Wrote:  

(01-18-2014 12:14 AM)oklalittledixie Wrote:  

(01-17-2014 11:58 PM)dawgitall Wrote:  

(01-17-2014 11:42 PM)oklalittledixie Wrote:  

(01-17-2014 10:38 PM)dawgitall Wrote:  I'm glad to hear that you have had extensive worksite conversations to determine their legal status and English speaking abilities. But I'm perplexed as to how you know the business practices of one of my relatives you've never met? He builds high end, high quality custom homes and has been doing so for over a quarter century. Your comments are insulting.

Yep. He's using illegal labor. Home builders are some of the worst offenders. They tear up beautifil countryside to build their cookie-cutter homes using illegal aliens -getting rich. They could care less about our country. They just abuse our capitalistic system. Traitors.

You don't know what you are talking about. You stereotype everybody and try to make everything fit neatly into your preconceived notions. But if that makes you feel more secure that is your problem.

Oh stop. The problem has gotten so bad because people like yourself want to play the stereotyping game. It's clear what your family member is doing. There are countless companies doing the same.

Your problem is that you never seem to be able to see any issue from any angle but your party line. Issues are more complex than that and real life doesn't fit neatly into the little boxes you try to put everything into. You say, "people like yourself" but you don't know me at all, or my family member, or his business yet you insist that you do.

My party has nothing to do with how I feel about illegal immigration.

There is no other angle. There are those who acknowledge the problem, and there are those who exploit the problem. There is no gray area.

Think it's really fascinating that some people never see any harm in having somewhere between 11,000,000 and 35,000,000 people illegally in this country. Seems as if because some Americans built up this country before they were even born that we can afford to
be as altruistic as any of them want us to be toward people literally running away from their country.

(01-18-2014 05:36 PM)oklalittledixie Wrote:  

(01-18-2014 03:48 PM)dawgitall Wrote:  

(01-18-2014 12:14 AM)oklalittledixie Wrote:  

(01-17-2014 11:58 PM)dawgitall Wrote:  

(01-17-2014 11:42 PM)oklalittledixie Wrote:  Yep. He's using illegal labor. Home builders are some of the worst offenders. They tear up beautifil countryside to build their cookie-cutter homes using illegal aliens -getting rich. They could care less about our country. They just abuse our capitalistic system. Traitors.

You don't know what you are talking about. You stereotype everybody and try to make everything fit neatly into your preconceived notions. But if that makes you feel more secure that is your problem.

Oh stop. The problem has gotten so bad because people like yourself want to play the stereotyping game. It's clear what your family member is doing. There are countless companies doing the same.

Your problem is that you never seem to be able to see any issue from any angle but your party line. Issues are more complex than that and real life doesn't fit neatly into the little boxes you try to put everything into. You say, "people like yourself" but you don't know me at all, or my family member, or his business yet you insist that you do.

My party has nothing to do with how I feel about illegal immigration.

There is no other angle. There are those who acknowledge the problem, and there are those who exploit the problem. There is no gray area.

But you think that anyone that works construction and speaks Spanish is illegal and they aren't.

(01-18-2014 07:15 PM)GoApps70 Wrote:  Think it's really fascinating that some people never see any harm in having somewhere between 11,000,000 and 35,000,000 people illegally in this country. Seems as if because some Americans built up this country before they were even born that we can afford to
be as altruistic as any of them want us to be toward people literally running away from their country.

if you want to prevent illegal immigration punish the people that hire them.

(01-18-2014 08:45 PM)dawgitall Wrote:  

(01-18-2014 07:15 PM)GoApps70 Wrote:  Think it's really fascinating that some people never see any harm in having somewhere between 11,000,000 and 35,000,000 people illegally in this country. Seems as if because some Americans built up this country before they were even born that we can afford to
be as altruistic as any of them want us to be toward people literally running away from their country.

if you want to prevent illegal immigration punish the people that hire them.

That may already be taking effect. My cleaning lady (legal), says folks in her hometown in Mexico have lost interest in coming to work here. Not enough folks are hiring them (except in Oklahoma, apparently).

2 of my closest friends are also Border Patrol supervising agents. They also say the flow has dramatically decreased.

In the end, if someone is dirt poor and has children lacking food, clothing, education, or housing, they will care little about laws, borders, patriotism, etc., and will do what it takes to provide those items to their wife and kids...... I would, and assume most if not all would do the same.

I'm a proud American, but it wouldn't mean a thing to me if my kids needed me to provide.

We had a very interesting conversation about this just this past Thursday in a class I'm enrolled in. The main reason that illegal immigrants come here is the search of the American Dream, to provide for their families in poor nations, and to make a better life. Honestly, that's where our roots are from regardless of race/ethnicity. That's why you move to America.

Another key point that was quite true is the lack of a real number of illegals in the nation. How do you scientifically factually say that number? You can't go based on deportations, as that is too low, and it seems both sets of estimates -- high and low -- are extremely biased. Perhaps the true number is somewhere in the median of all that but still, estimation of illegal immigrants in America is a very inexact science.

(01-18-2014 09:21 PM)Ole Blue Wrote:  We had a very interesting conversation about this just this past Thursday in a class I'm enrolled in. The main reason that illegal immigrants come here is the search of the American Dream, to provide for their families in poor nations, and to make a better life. Honestly, that's where our roots are from regardless of race/ethnicity. That's why you move to America.

Another key point that was quite true is the lack of a real number of illegals in the nation. How do you scientifically factually say that number? You can't go based on deportations, as that is too low, and it seems both sets of estimates -- high and low -- are extremely biased. Perhaps the true number is somewhere in the median of all that but still, estimation of illegal immigrants in America is a very inexact science.

Kind of like economics?

(01-18-2014 09:24 PM)dawgitall Wrote:  

(01-18-2014 09:21 PM)Ole Blue Wrote:  We had a very interesting conversation about this just this past Thursday in a class I'm enrolled in. The main reason that illegal immigrants come here is the search of the American Dream, to provide for their families in poor nations, and to make a better life. Honestly, that's where our roots are from regardless of race/ethnicity. That's why you move to America.

Another key point that was quite true is the lack of a real number of illegals in the nation. How do you scientifically factually say that number? You can't go based on deportations, as that is too low, and it seems both sets of estimates -- high and low -- are extremely biased. Perhaps the true number is somewhere in the median of all that but still, estimation of illegal immigrants in America is a very inexact science.

Kind of like economics?

Yeah, that´s true, I guess. Haha.

(01-18-2014 09:21 PM)Ole Blue Wrote:  We had a very interesting conversation about this just this past Thursday in a class I'm enrolled in. The main reason that illegal immigrants come here is the search of the American Dream, to provide for their families in poor nations, and to make a better life. Honestly, that's where our roots are from regardless of race/ethnicity. That's why you move to America.

Another key point that was quite true is the lack of a real number of illegals in the nation. How do you scientifically factually say that number? You can't go based on deportations, as that is too low, and it seems both sets of estimates -- high and low -- are extremely biased. Perhaps the true number is somewhere in the median of all that but still, estimation of illegal immigrants in America is a very inexact science.

People have lived and made a living where they are, and fed their families, for hundreds if not thousands of years.
There is no necessity of their sneaking into this country. Greed may make them do it. The chance to make more money,
but has little to do with eating.
Besides, the left will send them every dime we can borrow from China to help them in their original countries.

Say what you will but we are not getting the rocket scientists illegally invading our country. Most of those people have been able
to build lives where they are and do something with those lives. This invasion of foreigners will only diminish us.