While the contractor is repairing the bathroom today (or how termites changed my $35 painting job into an $8000 remodel job) I decided to use a spreadsheet and see how hard it was to fix the CUSA schedule.
Well turns out not that hard, less than an hour. I did have to cancel one game to create home and road opponents for schools in the other division, and I had to move the dates of two UAB games (they wind up hosting and traveling the same dates, just opponents change), as I could only get 8 of the 12 required matches without moving games. But it wasn't hard, just mapped an "east" to a "west" division school that they didn't have on the schedule this year.
new games
11/25 FIU @ UAB
11/19 Rice @ FIU
11/12 UAB @ WKU // moved UAB @ UTEP to 10/29
11/12 Rice @ FAU // had to break up Rice @ LTU for this one
11/12 FIU @ LTU // had to break up Rice @ LTU for this one
10/29 LTU @ FAU
10/29 UTSA @ UNCC
10/29 MTSU @ UNT // moved UNT @ UAB to 10/8
10/22 MTSU @ UTEP
10/22 UNT @ WKU
10/15 UTEP @UNCC
10/8 MTSU @ LTU
moved games
10/8 UNT @ UAB // currently 10/29
10/29 UTEP @ UAB // currently 11/12
cancelled games
11/12 Rice @ LTU // seemed like a who cares "rivalry"
All new games above either fell on dates opened up by the departing SBC three or fell on a bye week for the school
(02-19-2022 03:01 PM)Stugray2 Wrote: [ -> ]While the contractor is repairing the bathroom today (or how termites changed my $35 painting job into an $8000 remodel job) I decided to use a spreadsheet and see how hard it was to fix the CUSA schedule.
Well turns out not that hard, less than an hour. I did have to cancel one game to create home and road opponents for schools in the other division, and I had to move the dates of two UAB games (they wind up hosting and traveling the same dates, just opponents change), as I could only get 8 of the 12 required matches without moving games. But it wasn't hard, just mapped an "east" to a "west" division school that they didn't have on the schedule this year.
new games
11/25 FIU @ UAB
11/19 Rice @ FIU
11/12 UAB @ WKU // moved UAB @ UTEP to 10/29
11/12 Rice @ FAU // had to break up Rice @ LTU for this one
11/12 FIU @ LTU // had to break up Rice @ LTU for this one
10/29 LTU @ FAU
10/29 UTSA @ UNCC
10/29 MTSU @ UNT // moved UNT @ UAB to 10/8
10/22 MTSU @ UTEP
10/22 UNT @ WKU
10/15 UTEP @UNCC
10/8 MTSU @ LTU
moved games
10/8 UNT @ UAB // currently 10/29
10/29 UTEP @ UAB // currently 11/12
cancelled games
11/12 Rice @ LTU // seemed like a who cares "rivalry"
All new games above either fell on dates opened up by the departing SBC three or fell on a bye week for the school
I'm pretty sure your math checks out, I have confidence in you.
I started by plagiarizing the AAC schedule, planning to swap out CUSA schools for AAC schools, then adjusting for the 4 OOC games scheduled after September. I had to do more productive things though, so I didn't get that far.
I tried to minimize the changes, kept all but one of the scheduled games between the remaining 11 in tact, although I did have to move the dates of two UAB games.
Some schools get a different bye week. Overall CUSA made it a bit easy because most of the November games were in Division. I trie dto leave the rivalry games on 11/26 alone. LTU has 11/26 open which is not ideal. The problem with 11 schools.
(02-19-2022 04:49 PM)Stugray2 Wrote: [ -> ]I tried to minimize the changes, kept all but one of the scheduled games between the remaining 11 in tact, although I did have to move the dates of two UAB games.
Some schools get a different bye week. Overall CUSA made it a bit easy because most of the November games were in Division. I trie dto leave the rivalry games on 11/26 alone. LTU has 11/26 open which is not ideal. The problem with 11 schools.
With 11 teams someone was bound to. There’s also going to be a member of the 11 member AAC idle in week 13. Maybe a C-USA vs AAC OOC conference game could get moved to that week.
Seems like this would work.
Write all the games on a board. Go through and erase the SB3. Any games still standing stay on the schedule. ODU is at Marshall and neither play Southern Miss. so one game is gone completely. This leaves eleven “orphaned” home and eleven road games. Move them around and match them up and you are good to go.
I'm fairly certain both C-USA and the Sun Belt have 11-team and 14-team schedules in their back pocket, depending on how this all shakes out.
The point of the exercise, one guys spending less than two hours could come up with a schedule adjustment that could work, everyone keeping almost all their home dates, and those moved mostly in October. Certainly there might be some reason a particular week is idle (e.g., midterms, stadium rented out for some other use) and you might wind up swapping a few more dates than I had in a final marking. But my guess is only one or two such if that.
If I can fix it in a little over an hour, it;s an extremely weak claim that the schools leaving cause irreparable harm to the schedule. Maybe Louisiana Tech has some big trophy for hosting Rice that just wouldn't work for hosting Florida International, but somehow I doubt it. Also the NCAA pretty much automatically hands out 2 year waivers to hold a CCG because of intermediate position as a result of realignment. They gave the AAC one, and they'll give one to CUSA.
The damages are really hard for me to see. The need for special performance order is very dubious. Certainly an exit penalty can be negotiated as a remedy instead.
(02-19-2022 08:41 PM)Stugray2 Wrote: [ -> ]If I can fix it in a little over an hour, it;s an extremely weak claim that the schools leaving cause irreparable harm to the schedule. Maybe Louisiana Tech has some big trophy for hosting Rice that just wouldn't work for hosting Florida International, but somehow I doubt it. Also the NCAA pretty much automatically hands out 2 year waivers to hold a CCG because of intermediate position as a result of realignment. They gave the AAC one, and they'll give one to CUSA.
The damages are really hard for me to see. The need for special performance order is very dubious. Certainly an exit penalty can be negotiated as a remedy instead.
You keep acting like anyone has ever mentioned this as the problem here. There must be a dozen posts of you saying "it's not that hard to give everyone 8 games with 11 teams" but nobody has ever claimed otherwise.
So what?
Louisiana Tech can get to 8 games, sure. But where are you going to find the additional 12 games (in football) for CUSA?
It's not any one school short games it's the conference.
Frankly, I don't think the minimal effort (even one guy and a notepad and an hour) is worth letting them get out of the bylaws (without a fight to make it worth it financially). But this isn't at all why the conference is digging in. It's not about creating a schedule. As every other post on here says, they've almost certainly already got one saved on a hard drive already.
(02-19-2022 10:19 PM)inutech Wrote: [ -> ] (02-19-2022 08:41 PM)Stugray2 Wrote: [ -> ]If I can fix it in a little over an hour, it;s an extremely weak claim that the schools leaving cause irreparable harm to the schedule. Maybe Louisiana Tech has some big trophy for hosting Rice that just wouldn't work for hosting Florida International, but somehow I doubt it. Also the NCAA pretty much automatically hands out 2 year waivers to hold a CCG because of intermediate position as a result of realignment. They gave the AAC one, and they'll give one to CUSA.
The damages are really hard for me to see. The need for special performance order is very dubious. Certainly an exit penalty can be negotiated as a remedy instead.
You keep acting like anyone has ever mentioned this as the problem here. There must be a dozen posts of you saying "it's not that hard to give everyone 8 games with 11 teams" but nobody has ever claimed otherwise.
So what?
So that's the main claim CUSA has for damages. Marshall ain't showing up to play UAB or whoever, so UAB is out 2 home games. That's really all CUSA can put before a judge or an arbitrator to demonstrate harm from the SB3 breaking the bylaws.
Quote:It's not any one school short games it's the conference.
As you said, so what? CUSA's tv deal being short 18 football games out of 84 (if all 14 CUSA schools have 6 home games) isn't going to hurt the TV contract much, because the contract is already peanuts.
Quote:Frankly, I don't think the minimal effort (even one guy and a notepad and an hour) is worth letting them get out of the bylaws (without a fight to make it worth it financially).
They're out. They're gone. It's over. Big East went down this road with West Virginia in 2011. An injunction isn't happening.
Quote:But this isn't at all why the conference is digging in. It's not about creating a schedule.
No, it's about ego and muleheaded stubbornness. Which, in fairness, is probably also why they're jailbreaking the bylaws to leave early.
(02-19-2022 03:01 PM)Stugray2 Wrote: [ -> ]While the contractor is repairing the bathroom today (or how termites changed my $35 painting job into an $8000 remodel job) I decided to use a spreadsheet and see how hard it was to fix the CUSA schedule.
Well turns out not that hard, less than an hour. I did have to cancel one game to create home and road opponents for schools in the other division, and I had to move the dates of two UAB games (they wind up hosting and traveling the same dates, just opponents change), as I could only get 8 of the 12 required matches without moving games. But it wasn't hard, just mapped an "east" to a "west" division school that they didn't have on the schedule this year.
new games
11/25 FIU @ UAB
11/19 Rice @ FIU
11/12 UAB @ WKU // moved UAB @ UTEP to 10/29
11/12 Rice @ FAU // had to break up Rice @ LTU for this one
11/12 FIU @ LTU // had to break up Rice @ LTU for this one
10/29 LTU @ FAU
10/29 UTSA @ UNCC
10/29 MTSU @ UNT // moved UNT @ UAB to 10/8
10/22 MTSU @ UTEP
10/22 UNT @ WKU
10/15 UTEP @UNCC
10/8 MTSU @ LTU
moved games
10/8 UNT @ UAB // currently 10/29
10/29 UTEP @ UAB // currently 11/12
cancelled games
11/12 Rice @ LTU // seemed like a who cares "rivalry"
All new games above either fell on dates opened up by the departing SBC three or fell on a bye week for the school
Rice has to play La Tech so that there can be a CCG.
Schedule a second MTSU-WKU or FAU-FIU game.
(02-19-2022 08:41 PM)Stugray2 Wrote: [ -> ]The point of the exercise, one guys spending less than two hours could come up with a schedule adjustment that could work, everyone keeping almost all their home dates, and those moved mostly in October. Certainly there might be some reason a particular week is idle (e.g., midterms, stadium rented out for some other use) and you might wind up swapping a few more dates than I had in a final marking. But my guess is only one or two such if that.
If I can fix it in a little over an hour, it;s an extremely weak claim that the schools leaving cause irreparable harm to the schedule. Maybe Louisiana Tech has some big trophy for hosting Rice that just wouldn't work for hosting Florida International, but somehow I doubt it. Also the NCAA pretty much automatically hands out 2 year waivers to hold a CCG because of intermediate position as a result of realignment. They gave the AAC one, and they'll give one to CUSA.
The damages are really hard for me to see. The need for special performance order is very dubious. Certainly an exit penalty can be negotiated as a remedy instead.
So the NCAA is on this conspiracy as well?
(02-19-2022 10:47 PM)jimrtex Wrote: [ -> ] (02-19-2022 03:01 PM)Stugray2 Wrote: [ -> ]While the contractor is repairing the bathroom today (or how termites changed my $35 painting job into an $8000 remodel job) I decided to use a spreadsheet and see how hard it was to fix the CUSA schedule.
Well turns out not that hard, less than an hour. I did have to cancel one game to create home and road opponents for schools in the other division, and I had to move the dates of two UAB games (they wind up hosting and traveling the same dates, just opponents change), as I could only get 8 of the 12 required matches without moving games. But it wasn't hard, just mapped an "east" to a "west" division school that they didn't have on the schedule this year.
new games
11/25 FIU @ UAB
11/19 Rice @ FIU
11/12 UAB @ WKU // moved UAB @ UTEP to 10/29
11/12 Rice @ FAU // had to break up Rice @ LTU for this one
11/12 FIU @ LTU // had to break up Rice @ LTU for this one
10/29 LTU @ FAU
10/29 UTSA @ UNCC
10/29 MTSU @ UNT // moved UNT @ UAB to 10/8
10/22 MTSU @ UTEP
10/22 UNT @ WKU
10/15 UTEP @UNCC
10/8 MTSU @ LTU
moved games
10/8 UNT @ UAB // currently 10/29
10/29 UTEP @ UAB // currently 11/12
cancelled games
11/12 Rice @ LTU // seemed like a who cares "rivalry"
All new games above either fell on dates opened up by the departing SBC three or fell on a bye week for the school
Rice has to play La Tech so that there can be a CCG.
Schedule a second MTSU-WKU or FAU-FIU game.
It would be divisionless and the top 2 teams would be the CCG participants- just like the AAC did in 2021.
(02-19-2022 08:20 PM)Michael in Raleigh Wrote: [ -> ]I'm fairly certain both C-USA and the Sun Belt have 11-team and 14-team schedules in their back pocket, depending on how this all shakes out.
How could the Sun Belt have a 14-team schedule without knowing Marshall, ODU, and USM preferences for home and away dates?
(02-19-2022 10:53 PM)jimrtex Wrote: [ -> ] (02-19-2022 08:20 PM)Michael in Raleigh Wrote: [ -> ]I'm fairly certain both C-USA and the Sun Belt have 11-team and 14-team schedules in their back pocket, depending on how this all shakes out.
How could the Sun Belt have a 14-team schedule without knowing Marshall, ODU, and USM preferences for home and away dates?
Because FBSchedules.com exists.
Conference revenue boils down to:
-NCAA tournament units. The departing three ain’t going to impact that.
-CFP distributions. The base distribution is based on 10 members so no change in that portion. Then you have the performance pool and CUSA has been running around four out of five so unless CUSA finishes five in 2022, there is no change in that revenue.
-Sponsorships. Unless someone backs out or demands to cut their payment because those three are leaving, that shouldn’t change. If they do then there are damages for the lost revenue.
-Television. If one or more of the TV partners cuts their payment for 2022-23 then there are damages.
I suspect CUSA’s damages for losing the three a year early are probably south of $750,000 maybe less than $500,000
(02-19-2022 10:40 PM)johnbragg Wrote: [ -> ] (02-19-2022 10:19 PM)inutech Wrote: [ -> ] (02-19-2022 08:41 PM)Stugray2 Wrote: [ -> ]If I can fix it in a little over an hour, it;s an extremely weak claim that the schools leaving cause irreparable harm to the schedule. Maybe Louisiana Tech has some big trophy for hosting Rice that just wouldn't work for hosting Florida International, but somehow I doubt it. Also the NCAA pretty much automatically hands out 2 year waivers to hold a CCG because of intermediate position as a result of realignment. They gave the AAC one, and they'll give one to CUSA.
The damages are really hard for me to see. The need for special performance order is very dubious. Certainly an exit penalty can be negotiated as a remedy instead.
You keep acting like anyone has ever mentioned this as the problem here. There must be a dozen posts of you saying "it's not that hard to give everyone 8 games with 11 teams" but nobody has ever claimed otherwise.
So what?
So that's the main claim CUSA has for damages. Marshall ain't showing up to play UAB or whoever, so UAB is out 2 home games. That's really all CUSA can put before a judge or an arbitrator to demonstrate harm from the SB3 breaking the bylaws.
Quote:It's not any one school short games it's the conference.
As you said, so what? CUSA's tv deal being short 18 football games out of 84 (if all 14 CUSA schools have 6 home games) isn't going to hurt the TV contract much, because the contract is already peanuts.
Quote:Frankly, I don't think the minimal effort (even one guy and a notepad and an hour) is worth letting them get out of the bylaws (without a fight to make it worth it financially).
They're out. They're gone. It's over. Big East went down this road with West Virginia in 2011. An injunction isn't happening.
Quote:But this isn't at all why the conference is digging in. It's not about creating a schedule.
No, it's about ego and muleheaded stubbornness. Which, in fairness, is probably also why they're jailbreaking the bylaws to leave early.
If they're out then they've got what they want. Where's the problem?
(02-19-2022 03:04 PM)johnbragg Wrote: [ -> ] (02-19-2022 03:01 PM)Stugray2 Wrote: [ -> ]While the contractor is repairing the bathroom today (or how termites changed my $35 painting job into an $8000 remodel job) I decided to use a spreadsheet and see how hard it was to fix the CUSA schedule.
Well turns out not that hard, less than an hour. I did have to cancel one game to create home and road opponents for schools in the other division, and I had to move the dates of two UAB games (they wind up hosting and traveling the same dates, just opponents change), as I could only get 8 of the 12 required matches without moving games. But it wasn't hard, just mapped an "east" to a "west" division school that they didn't have on the schedule this year.
new games
11/25 FIU @ UAB
11/19 Rice @ FIU
11/12 UAB @ WKU // moved UAB @ UTEP to 10/29
11/12 Rice @ FAU // had to break up Rice @ LTU for this one
11/12 FIU @ LTU // had to break up Rice @ LTU for this one
10/29 LTU @ FAU
10/29 UTSA @ UNCC
10/29 MTSU @ UNT // moved UNT @ UAB to 10/8
10/22 MTSU @ UTEP
10/22 UNT @ WKU
10/15 UTEP @UNCC
10/8 MTSU @ LTU
moved games
10/8 UNT @ UAB // currently 10/29
10/29 UTEP @ UAB // currently 11/12
cancelled games
11/12 Rice @ LTU // seemed like a who cares "rivalry"
All new games above either fell on dates opened up by the departing SBC three or fell on a bye week for the school
I'm pretty sure your math checks out, I have confidence in you.
I started by plagiarizing the AAC schedule, planning to swap out CUSA schools for AAC schools, then adjusting for the 4 OOC games scheduled after September. I had to do more productive things though, so I didn't get that far.
Doesn't he have FIU playing 5 away games?
CUSA has to defend this rule. I think they settle eventually but they have to try and make it hurt as bad as they can.
If they don't what's to stop it from happening again? You can say it doesn't matter this time because there are still enough schools, but next time there might not be. So they can't just let this go.
I would prefer another year with 14, but money is probably going to be the end result. More than they'd have otherwise got would be enough, but hopefully it's enough to be a deterant going forward. You can't have 3 teams leave this quickly when we only have 9 teams (which I hope is the case for as long as Tech is one of them).
At any rate, nobody has ever argued that you can't schedule 8 games for everyone with 11 teams.
(02-19-2022 11:34 PM)inutech Wrote: [ -> ]CUSA has to defend this rule. I think they settle eventually but they have to try and make it hurt as bad as they can.
If they don't what's to stop it from happening again? You can say it doesn't matter this time because there are still enough schools, but next time there might not be. So they can't just let this go.
I would prefer another year with 14, but money is probably going to be the end result. More than they'd have otherwise got would be enough, but hopefully it's enough to be a deterant going forward. You can't have 3 teams leave this quickly when we only have 9 teams (which I hope is the case for as long as Tech is one of them).
At any rate, nobody has ever argued that you can't schedule 8 games for everyone with 11 teams.
I think realistically we see it go to court this week by CUSA to try to get an injunction and it'll get denied and Sun Belt will release their schedule on 3/1 as they were planning. So realistically what has C-USA achieved? Not much at all.
