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(11-03-2021 04:56 PM)EvanJ Wrote: [ -> ]
(11-02-2021 06:15 PM)geewizNU Wrote: [ -> ]I hope that he can turn into Adrian Martinez and value the basketball. And what I mean by that is in Coen’s first year in 2006, we didn’t have a true PG after JJB left. He had Martinez, who was a senior and a shooting guard mired on the bench as a backup the year before, play PG with Bobby Kelly and a freshman in Matt Janning at the other guards (I know there have been stories that Janning was the PG, but he really wasn’t).
Assists were close, with Martinez leading with 3.03, Janning with 2.81, Kelly with 2.38, and Bennet Davis with 2.22.

After leading the CAA with 5.6 assists, Hofstra fans are predicting Caleb Burgess won't start. Your third-to-last game is at Hofstra, and Hofstra ends with three home games, which are you, Elon, and W&M.

That's a nice position to be in. Is the fan favorite PG one of the newcomers?
Back to this for a minute. Interesting that it’s now a 9 team tourney with JMU’s departure down the road.

I think Delaware and NU are teams to beat

I think Elon has to make a move sometime and that they and JMU are the next in line

Hofstra and Charleston, who have a ton of new pieces, as well as Drexel (who lost depth) are in my next grouping

Then, Towson, WM and UNCW
I wonder who the surprise team will be this year. Seems like every year there is one. Can't argue with your groupings.
(11-09-2021 04:14 PM)NUGUY Wrote: [ -> ]I wonder who the surprise team will be this year. Seems like every year there is one. Can't argue with your groupings.

There really is. I bet it's going to be one of those teams in the bottom 3. We've seen both W&M and UNCW have great seasons over the past decade with trash pre-season expectations.
Ok, seriously, what is wrong with this team? I realize the obvious answers but even with all of those factored in, there is no way this team should be 0-8 and counting. There’s no way this team should be still turning the ball over 18 times in a game vs UNCW. There’s no way this team should be losing by 22 to Hofstra on its home court. I would have thought the upperclassmen on this team would have slowed the skid a bit by now. This team as constructed should win some games, not many but some. So where are the problems do you think? I’m at a total loss for how it could be this bad. And how did we get here in 6 long weeks?

2nd question. What are the long term ramifications of this disaster going to be? A few weeks ago I was worried, but now I’m terrified of the impact on recruiting/transfer capabilities/etc. An 0-18, 1-17 and 2-16 is going to cause anyone interested to do a double take at what they are getting into, especially in this climate of easy player movement.
(01-25-2022 09:27 AM)NUFan35 Wrote: [ -> ]Ok, seriously, what is wrong with this team? I realize the obvious answers but even with all of those factored in, there is no way this team should be 0-8 and counting. There’s no way this team should be still turning the ball over 18 times in a game vs UNCW. There’s no way this team should be losing by 22 to Hofstra on its home court. I would have thought the upperclassmen on this team would have slowed the skid a bit by now. This team as constructed should win some games, not many but some. So where are the problems do you think? I’m at a total loss for how it could be this bad. And how did we get here in 6 long weeks?

2nd question. What are the long term ramifications of this disaster going to be? A few weeks ago I was worried, but now I’m terrified of the impact on recruiting/transfer capabilities/etc. An 0-18, 1-17 and 2-16 is going to cause anyone interested to do a double take at what they are getting into, especially in this climate of easy player movement.

It’s easy to see why we’re struggling… we don’t have a point guard.

UNCW when they needed to put pressure on Walters and he turned it over. Even simple ball pressure he got careless with the rock. Honesty, even with TSG healthy I don’t know if it would’ve mattered because of the PG play all season.

Guard play is what this league and college hoops as a whole is all about and we don’t have it this year.

To your second question I wouldn’t worry about the ramifications if we have a god awful season. It can happen. NU under Coen doesn’t have that history. It shouldn’t impact our recruiting whatsoever IMO. All you have to do is look at our record the last 10 years.
So I agree with you. Clearly, the PG play is at the center of our problems. But there has to be something else at play, no? Last year is a tough comparison but that team fought like crazy and had a few excellent comebacks in conference play on top of playing very hard in a brutal non-conference schedule.

And I think you are right on the 10 year sample being a huge factor in us keeping our footing. The counter to that would be that kids only care about what the next 4 (in this world maybe 1-2) years look like. Either way, this staff is facing a very critical next 13 months.

So what did we all miss? I think we were all cautious when we saw projections of 1st/2nd but none of us saw even a bottom 4 finish (never mind last) as a real possibility.
(01-25-2022 01:09 PM)geewizNU Wrote: [ -> ]It’s easy to see why we’re struggling… we don’t have a point guard.
That could be the reason. Comparing you to Hofstra, here are the assists and turnovers for the top three players in total assists on each team sorted by A/TO:

Hofstra's Caleb Burgess: 41 assists, 12 turnovers, 3.42 A/TO
Hofstra's Aaron Estrada: 93 assists, 41 turnovers, 2.27 A/TO
Hofstra's Zach Cooks: 50 assists, 25 turnovers, 2.00 A/TO
Djogo: 35 assists, 26 turnovers, 1.35 A/TO
Doherty: 30 assists, 34 turnovers, 0.88 A/TO
Walters: 39 assists, 50 turnovers, 0.78 A/TO

Division I has 1.04 A/TO, and the CAA has 1.004.

Telfort (53 turnovers) and Walters (50 turnovers) have more turnovers than your assists leader has assists (Walters with 39). The last time Hofstra had two players with more turnovers than their assists leader had assists was in 2003-2004.

As a Hofstra fan, I root for you to beat first place UNCW. You made Hofstra look good by doing a margin of 16 points better hosting them than hosting Hofstra.
[quote='NUFan35' pid='18032691' dateline='1643141490']
So I agree with you. Clearly, the PG play is at the center of our problems. But there has to be something else at play, no? Last year is a tough comparison but that team fought like crazy and had a few excellent comebacks in conference play on top of playing very hard in a brutal non-conference schedule.



This is how I feel. Not having a true point guard/leader is big but something else is going on. Is it morale? Losing doesn't improve morale. I don't think I've seen Telfort smile all year. Is it lack of playing time as a unit? Neither the defense or the offense look crisp.

Watching the team is a little like watching Groundhog day....lazy passes being intercepted, overdribbling, too many threes when we're not a good three point shooting team, long stretches with no intensity on defense, etc. ....things that coaching should be fixing.
(11-08-2021 09:29 PM)NUFan35 Wrote: [ -> ]Back to this for a minute. Interesting that it’s now a 9 team tourney with JMU’s departure down the road.

I think Delaware and NU are teams to beat

I think Elon has to make a move sometime and that they and JMU are the next in line

Hofstra and Charleston, who have a ton of new pieces, as well as Drexel (who lost depth) are in my next grouping

Then, Towson, WM and UNCW

This post was very reasonable back in November. It shows that there is more than just the struggles of NU as a huge surprise. UNCW and Towson might be the best two teams in the league. W&M, while not great, is much better than last. I still think things are fairly wide open, although UNCW is starting to pull away. There is still time for NU to get things going in the right direction. 7th place gets you out of the play in game. That is still attainable with several teams including , Drexel, W&M, Elon,and Charleston still within striking distance. But, NU has to win more than they lose the right of the way to have a chance.
First off, there is no chance NU is getting out of the play-in game unless someone else leaves the conference tomorrow and gets removed from the tourney like JMU (yes, I'm kidding).

Another absolutely maddening night as NU kicked and threw the ball all over the beach (20 turnovers) and still managed to lose by only 5 to a UNCW team that is not as good as its record (though they are scrappy and I'd trade places in the standings in a heartbeat). This team has totally let go of the rope at this point. It really does not reflect well on the staff.

Which leads us to 2 questions. First, at 0-18, 1-17, 2-16, or 3-15 (take your pick), how far back do we have to go for a NU team this bad. 94 or 96 I guess but there aren't many candidates thankfully. Secondly, is Chase Cormier going to help solve this PG problem. If not, what other options do we have?
(01-27-2022 09:58 PM)NUFan35 Wrote: [ -> ]First off, there is no chance NU is getting out of the play-in game unless someone else leaves the conference tomorrow and gets removed from the tourney like JMU (yes, I'm kidding).

Another absolutely maddening night as NU kicked and threw the ball all over the beach (20 turnovers) and still managed to lose by only 5 to a UNCW team that is not as good as its record (though they are scrappy and I'd trade places in the standings in a heartbeat). This team has totally let go of the rope at this point. It really does not reflect well on the staff.

Which leads us to 2 questions. First, at 0-18, 1-17, 2-16, or 3-15 (take your pick), how far back do we have to go for a NU team this bad. 94 or 96 I guess but there aren't many candidates thankfully. Secondly, is Chase Cormier going to help solve this PG problem. If not, what other options do we have?


Good questions. I'll leave the stat checking to others on the poor records question. As far as Cormier....I've seen five or six of this year's games this year and his strengths are defense and outside shooting. He doesn't handle the ball much but that's because the guy going to OSU is their point guard. On the other hand, Chase is really quick and after some steals he gets the ball to the hoop in a flash. Also, he's unselfish and has thrown some ptetty creative passes.

When I look at this year's "PGs".....we have one guy who can dribble, doesn't generate a lot of assists, isn't a scoring threat and seems to be a bit of a defensive liability. Our other guy is someone who should be playing the two guard but is our PG by default. So, the bar is not that high for Cormier.

I saw Tyson a bunch of his games in prep school and posted that he was the real thing. I'm not there with Chase but I'm pretty sure he will be an upgrade.

PS. I LOVE Jeremy but it looks like he's widening his turnover derby championship trophy lead.

PPS. I'm more worried about our big next year.
(01-28-2022 12:15 AM)NUGUY Wrote: [ -> ]
(01-27-2022 09:58 PM)NUFan35 Wrote: [ -> ]First off, there is no chance NU is getting out of the play-in game unless someone else leaves the conference tomorrow and gets removed from the tourney like JMU (yes, I'm kidding).

Another absolutely maddening night as NU kicked and threw the ball all over the beach (20 turnovers) and still managed to lose by only 5 to a UNCW team that is not as good as its record (though they are scrappy and I'd trade places in the standings in a heartbeat). This team has totally let go of the rope at this point. It really does not reflect well on the staff.

Which leads us to 2 questions. First, at 0-18, 1-17, 2-16, or 3-15 (take your pick), how far back do we have to go for a NU team this bad. 94 or 96 I guess but there aren't many candidates thankfully. Secondly, is Chase Cormier going to help solve this PG problem. If not, what other options do we have?


Good questions. I'll leave the stat checking to others on the poor records question. As far as Cormier....I've seen five or six of this year's games this year and his strengths are defense and outside shooting. He doesn't handle the ball much but that's because the guy going to OSU is their point guard. On the other hand, Chase is really quick and after some steals he gets the ball to the hoop in a flash. Also, he's unselfish and has thrown some ptetty creative passes.

When I look at this year's "PGs".....we have one guy who can dribble, doesn't generate a lot of assists, isn't a scoring threat and seems to be a bit of a defensive liability. Our other guy is someone who should be playing the two guard but is our PG by default. So, the bar is not that high for Cormier.

I saw Tyson a bunch of his games in prep school and posted that he was the real thing. I'm not there with Chase but I'm pretty sure he will be an upgrade.

PS. I LOVE Jeremy but it looks like he's widening his turnover derby championship trophy lead.

PPS. I'm more worried about our big next year.

I posted a ton of video here when Tyson played high school at Christ The King and he’s barely 6 feet tall. So obviously he’s a PG and a good one.

But honestly there’s no such thing as a true PG anymore and I think NUFan35 you’ve been scarred by this years horrible point guard play and you now think it’s going to be not much better next year.

Cormier can handle and run the point if needed. As NUGUY mentioned he’s not handling the rock right now because his prep school team has a really good combo guard going to Ohio State and they have him running the point. It’s not an indictment on Chase.

IMO all we need is another guard who can play the point (a transfer) and if it’s doable a transfer big.
So I'll tell you what scares me. Yes, the point guard situation definitely scares me. But I have faith somehow it will work itself out or at least not be this bad next year. What really scares me is the unknown. Better said what I can’t explain. As in what happened to this team and can we recapture the guys on this team at all (I’m talking about the guys coming back). My problem is I watched the games early in the year. For example, I watched the first half against Colorado State (exact team -Glen and +Vito) again last night and the ball movement was so good at times. And the defense was locked in. Now granted, we fell apart in the second half, but we were gassed to a certain degree and going up against a good team, a really good team also. I haven't seen that at all in nine conference games …. even for a moment in 9 games. So I'm really paranoid that we've lost this group of guys and it scares the hell out of me.
So my theory…again because I struggle to find answers to that which I cannot explain

We played the first 2 games after a 17 day pause and came out poorly. We regrouped a bit in game 2 and then thought we could coast before getting punched in the mouth and then throwing the W&M game into the stands (literally).

Then, we had another 8 days off and lost a tough game vs Towson before just coming out with zero focus against JMU.

Then, we played hard and lost two tough ones to Drexel and UD.

Then, we just came out and let Hofstra walk all over us, looking like a team that felt sorry for itself.

Then, we lost 2 tough ones to UNCW where the focus was in and out at best.

Long story short, if you don’t come out pissed off about being 0-3 or 0-6, you’ll find yourself 0-9.

I have no idea if I am right but I do think this team has totally gone off the reservation and has yet to play a game where they truly look desperate. Maybe we don’t have the right mix of personalities.
(01-28-2022 09:50 PM)NUFan35 Wrote: [ -> ]So my theory…again because I struggle to find answers to that which I cannot explain

We played the first 2 games after a 17 day pause and came out poorly. We regrouped a bit in game 2 and then thought we could coast before getting punched in the mouth and then throwing the W&M game into the stands (literally).

Then, we had another 8 days off and lost a tough game vs Towson before just coming out with zero focus against JMU.

Then, we played hard and lost two tough ones to Drexel and UD.

Then, we just came out and let Hofstra walk all over us, looking like a team that felt sorry for itself.

Then, we lost 2 tough ones to UNCW where the focus was in and out at best.

Long story short, if you don’t come out pissed off about being 0-3 or 0-6, you’ll find yourself 0-9.

I have no idea if I am right but I do think this team has totally gone off the reservation and has yet to play a game where they truly look desperate. Maybe we don’t have the right mix of personalities.

Honestly, how many Coen teams have had that alpha dog that can rally the troops when times are tough? Tyson? Maybe. Vasa? Eh. This team doesn’t have that. It really should be Telfort, but it doesn’t seem to be his nature, although I can see he’s frustrated by the current losing.

We’ll just have to see who stays and who goes once the season is over and re-evaluate from their IMO.
So how do you figure we played so well in brief stretches earlier in the season but never now? Asking for a friend

Maybe I got spoiled again but the last decade I think we had a lot of guys who played some of their best basketball when their best was needed. Not sure if that = alpha but basketball tough guys. Ford, Stahl, Walker, Eatherton, Vasa
(01-28-2022 10:17 PM)NUFan35 Wrote: [ -> ]So how do you figure we played so well in brief stretches earlier in the season but never now? Asking for a friend

OOC games sometimes don’t show your true weaknesses that your conference opponents know how expose. They know your team and you know theirs.

Look, if TSG were healthy and playing right now we’d have some wins. But once the team announced he was done for the season, so was NU.

He was another guy who can handle the ball giving Shaq and Telfort breaks in bringing up the ball and getting into the offense. TSG and Shaq were capable of creating havoc defensively, leading to turnovers and points in transition. You can’t overlook that. Losing TSG on top of not having Pridgen all year wasn’t in the plans for this season.
(01-28-2022 10:17 PM)NUFan35 Wrote: [ -> ]So how do you figure we played so well in brief stretches earlier in the season but never now? Asking for a friend

Maybe I got spoiled again but the last decade I think we had a lot of guys who played some of their best basketball when their best was needed. Not sure if that = alpha but basketball tough guys. Ford, Stahl, Walker, Eatherton, Vasa

Having watched the last two games against UNCW, it sure looks to me like NU is clearly better than your conference record indicates. Did you guys take care of the ball better in your nonconference schedule?
(01-28-2022 09:50 PM)NUFan35 Wrote: [ -> ]So my theory…again because I struggle to find answers to that which I cannot explain

We played the first 2 games after a 17 day pause and came out poorly. We regrouped a bit in game 2 and then thought we could coast before getting punched in the mouth and then throwing the W&M game into the stands (literally).

Then, we had another 8 days off and lost a tough game vs Towson before just coming out with zero focus against JMU.

Then, we played hard and lost two tough ones to Drexel and UD.

Then, we just came out and let Hofstra walk all over us, looking like a team that felt sorry for itself.

Then, we lost 2 tough ones to UNCW where the focus was in and out at best.

Long story short, if you don’t come out pissed off about being 0-3 or 0-6, you’ll find yourself 0-9.

I have no idea if I am right but I do think this team has totally gone off the reservation and has yet to play a game where they truly look desperate. Maybe we don’t have the right mix of personalities.

Telfort's body language reminds me of how Gresham and Occeus looked in their last year with the team.
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