Here’s my ideal Big Ten:
East: Pitt, Penn St, Maryland, Rutgers, ND
Central: Ohio St, Michigan, Mich St, Purdue, Indiana
North: Illinois, NW, Wisconsin, Iowa, Minnesota
West: Iowa St, Missouri, Kansas, Nebraska, Oklahoma
10 game schedule: 4-2-2-2
4 Division mates plus 2 from each of the other 3 divisions
This would allow you to cycle through everyone in a 3 year cycle.
Playoff Format: 4 division winners participate in the conference playoff
Alternatively, you could do pod style with a 9 game schedule. Each year pods would be paired off, functionally creating 2 10-team divisions with full round robin play. Playoff format Could be a little different. Maybe top 3 in Each division with first round byes for the top team in each division, or no playoff, just a CCG.
How would the SEC respond? They'd likely agree to take Texas Tech as a price for taking in Texas. Then, as the ACC gets opened, Florida State and Clemson join as they know there's no chance of that conference strengthening further. Virginia Tech and NC State follow them. Spot #20 might be between West Virginia and Louisville, leaning Louisville's way due to the market reach into the Midwestern states. A question of Vanderbilt's continued viability in that conference might come up. Should they decide to no longer play the game then there's a chance for that last coveted spot fought between Georgia Tech, TCU or West Virginia.
The ACC could end up looking like this:
Boston College, Syracuse, Temple, Virginia, North Carolina, Duke, Wake Forest, Georgia Tech (and/or Vanderbilt), Miami
They'd probably look into the following: Navy, Army, UConn, South Florida, Central Florida
It's also possible that UT may not be able to convince the SEC to take TT, so if ND joins a conference fully then UT would have no choice but to join the SEC by themselves. That may open the way for Georgia Tech to reunite with their former rivals in the SEC. The only other question is would Vanderbilt stay or go. If they do go then Miami takes their place.
Texas, Texas A&M, Arkansas, Louisiana State, Louisville
Ole Miss, Mississippi State, Alabama, Tennessee, Auburn
Georgia Tech, Miami, Georgia, Florida State, Florida
Kentucky, Clemson, South Carolina, Virginia Tech, NC State
The "new" ACC: Wake Forest, Vanderbilt, North Carolina, Duke, Virginia, Temple, Syracuse, Boston College, Navy, Army
Possible candidates: UConn, South Florida, Central Florida
I've posted in the main conference realignment thread that as a Penn State alum/fan I'd want the Big Ten to be more Eastern. I'm guessing many PSU fans don't agree but I'd want Penn State and Pitt to be in the Big Ten together. I'm old enough to remember the PSU/Pitt games at the end of the season. Certainly I'd love Notre Dame in the Big Ten as well, Penn State used to play them a lot too. I also remember Penn State vs. Syracuse too. In general the closer to Happy Valley the better. I hate Nebraska, especially after 1994 when they won the national championship instead of us.
Not a B1G fan (or hater) but I’d like:
West: Kansas, Missouri, Nebraska, Iowa, Iowa St, Minnesota, Wisconsin, Northwestern
North: Illinois, Indiana, Purdue, Michigan, Michigan St, Ohio St, Penn St, Maryland
East: Notre Dame, Pittsburgh, Rutgers, Syracuse, Boston College, Virginia, North Carolina, Duke
(05-18-2020 06:08 PM)schmolik Wrote: [ -> ]I've posted in the main conference realignment thread that as a Penn State alum/fan I'd want the Big Ten to be more Eastern. I'm guessing many PSU fans don't agree but I'd want Penn State and Pitt to be in the Big Ten together. I'm old enough to remember the PSU/Pitt games at the end of the season. Certainly I'd love Notre Dame in the Big Ten as well, Penn State used to play them a lot too. I also remember Penn State vs. Syracuse too. In general the closer to Happy Valley the better. I hate Nebraska, especially after 1994 when they won the national championship instead of us.
1994 Penn State was as good a team as I've ever seen.
There's one way to give the SEC and Big 10 a boost without upsetting either conference's internal balance, or giving one an advantage over the other:
Virginia and North Carolina to the Big 10 and N.C. State and Virginia Tech to the SEC.
Both stop at 16 and if Duke is required to make it work in the Big 10 then the Big 10 makes them a partial member incorporating their basketball. Otherwise Duke, Boston College, Syracuse, and Wake Forest join the Big East.
Louisville and Pitt join the Big 12 North and Clemson, Florida State, Georgia Tech and Miami become the Big 12 Southeast.
Big 12:
Iowa State, Louisville, Pittsburgh, West Virginia
Kansas, Kansas State, Oklahoma, Oklahoma State
Baylor, Texas, T.C.U., Texas Tech
Clemson, Florida State, Georgia Tech, Miami
* Notre Dame keeps a partial and ESPN gains control of the conference and rolls the LHN into the Big 12N.
The PAC stays as is and it brings balance to the Big 10 and SEC while the 20 million of Virginia and North Carolina get double dipped by the 2 most watched conferences.
Kentucky, N.C. State, Tennessee, Virginia Tech
Florida, Georgia, South Carolina, Vanderbilt
Alabama, Auburn, Mississippi, Mississippi State
Arkansas, Louisiana State, Missouri, Texas A&M
Maryland, North Carolina, Penn State, Virginia
Indiana, Ohio State, Purdue, Rutgers
Illinois, Michigan, Michigan State, Northwestern
Iowa, Minnesota, Nebraska, Wisconsin
Why that division of schools? If we move to conference semi-finals you likely get these end of season match ups:
Tennessee or Virginia Tech
Florida or Georgia
Alabama or Auburn
L.S.U. or Texas A&M
Penn State
Ohio State
Michigan or Michigan State
Nebraska or Wisconsin or Iowa
All of those are solid draws.
Texas doesn't become anyone's problem and doesn't tip the balance of power and neither does Oklahoma. The SEC and Big 10 make more due to the markets and pro rata from the schools by the networks.
Texas and Oklahoma are enhanced in value with the ACC additions and now that conference can hang within 10 million of the SEC and Big 10 and everyone gets a raise.
The PAC stays the same because, well, they are the PAC and too damn far away.
(05-23-2020 11:59 PM)JRsec Wrote: [ -> ]There's one way to give the SEC and Big 10 a boost without upsetting either conference's internal balance, or giving one an advantage over the other:
Virginia and North Carolina to the Big 10 and N.C. State and Virginia Tech to the SEC.
Both stop at 16 and if Duke is required to make it work in the Big 10 then the Big 10 makes them a partial member incorporating their basketball. Otherwise Duke, Boston College, Syracuse, and Wake Forest join the Big East.
Louisville and Pitt join the Big 12 North and Clemson, Florida State, Georgia Tech and Miami become the Big 12 Southeast.
Big 12:
Iowa State, Louisville, Pittsburgh, West Virginia
Kansas, Kansas State, Oklahoma, Oklahoma State
Baylor, Texas, T.C.U., Texas Tech
Clemson, Florida State, Georgia Tech, Miami
* Notre Dame keeps a partial and ESPN gains control of the conference and rolls the LHN into the Big 12N.
The PAC stays as is and it brings balance to the Big 10 and SEC while the 20 million of Virginia and North Carolina get double dipped by the 2 most watched conferences.
Kentucky, N.C. State, Tennessee, Virginia Tech
Florida, Georgia, South Carolina, Vanderbilt
Alabama, Auburn, Mississippi, Mississippi State
Arkansas, Louisiana State, Missouri, Texas A&M
Maryland, North Carolina, Penn State, Virginia
Indiana, Ohio State, Purdue, Rutgers
Illinois, Michigan, Michigan State, Northwestern
Iowa, Minnesota, Nebraska, Wisconsin
Why that division of schools? If we move to conference semi-finals you likely get these end of season match ups:
Tennessee or Virginia Tech
Florida or Georgia
Alabama or Auburn
L.S.U. or Texas A&M
Penn State
Ohio State
Michigan or Michigan State
Nebraska or Wisconsin or Iowa
All of those are solid draws.
Texas doesn't become anyone's problem and doesn't tip the balance of power and neither does Oklahoma. The SEC and Big 10 make more due to the markets and pro rata from the schools by the networks.
Texas and Oklahoma are enhanced in value with the ACC additions and now that conference can hang within 10 million of the SEC and Big 10 and everyone gets a raise.
The PAC stays the same because, well, they are the PAC and too damn far away.
I like the idea of the Big Ten and SEC splitting the Virginia and North Carolina schools. I am not familiar with the SEC enough to comment on how you guys would split up your pods but I don't know how the Big Ten could do it and not upset multiple schools.
I see the logic in your breakdown so my response is not meant to be critical. Maryland absolutely should be with UNC and Virginia but Penn State should be playing Ohio State and Rutgers annually on top of Maryland. Indiana and Michigan State have played annually for like one hundred years or something so I would put the Michigan and Indiana schools together which reunites Ohio State and Illinois which is a little rivalry.
I think adding one eastern school works so much better but that would really destroy the amazingly clean western pod of Nebraska, Iowa, Minnesota, and Wisconsin. I can't imagine separating one from that group to move to a pod with the Illinois schools plus someone else. Maybe move Wisconsin and Minnesota east and move Northwestern or Illinois west. This leads me to believe divisionless with fixed rivals is the way forward.
(05-18-2020 06:08 PM)schmolik Wrote: [ -> ]I've posted in the main conference realignment thread that as a Penn State alum/fan I'd want the Big Ten to be more Eastern. I'm guessing many PSU fans don't agree but I'd want Penn State and Pitt to be in the Big Ten together. I'm old enough to remember the PSU/Pitt games at the end of the season. Certainly I'd love Notre Dame in the Big Ten as well, Penn State used to play them a lot too. I also remember Penn State vs. Syracuse too. In general the closer to Happy Valley the better. I hate Nebraska, especially after 1994 when they won the national championship instead of us.
A couple thoughts: I agree that I don't want Pittsburgh in the Big Ten. I wouldn't mind playing them the last week of the regular season the years we'd play but that would throw off another Big Ten school's schedule (one of Michigan State, Maryland, or Rutgers) and the conference hasn't shown an inclination to let schools schedule non-conference games like that. And I certainly don't expect them to give Penn State any special preference.
I hate Nebraska but am glad they are in the conference. I want them to reach their former highs as that would only help the Big Ten. It burns me up the way Nebraska was celebrated by everyone when joining but Penn State was panned by many in the conference:
http://www.dailynebraskan.com/sports/pen...f1b1d.html
I think it is critical that Oklahoma is one of the next additions to help Nebraska assimilate into the conference more and to generally move the conference towards better recruiting territory. I understand the worry about Oklahoma being away from the state of Texas but they have a national following and recruiting profile and will continue to play the Red River Rivalry in Dallas.
Adding Oklahoma as #15 would be a home run and could push our revenues into a tier that makes Notre Dame rethink independence. Adding them as #16 would pretty much end realignment unless some seismic event occurred. Although we may be in the presence of one right now.
With all the change due to the virus, I've decided I don't like change all that much. I'm in the corner of no more expansion. With that said, I would be perfectly fine with North Carolina and Virginia. I'm just winging it here but do those two schools, as a whole, have more in common with a larger number of BIG schools than ACC schools?
Michigan
Maryland
Penn State
Wisconsin
Illinois
Northwestern
Indiana
These schools gel really good with North Carolina and Virginia, right?
Like I said, I'm not saying this is fact in any ways. I just don't see a solid faction between these two schools and...
Clemson
Florida State
Miami
Syracuse
Boston college
NC State
A post like this is easy to say I'm cherry picking, I'm truly not because this is simply personal observation and nothing else.
My biggest annoyance though is too much eastern expansion. The schools in the west are extremely valuable and need protected.
(05-23-2020 11:59 PM)JRsec Wrote: [ -> ]There's one way to give the SEC and Big 10 a boost without upsetting either conference's internal balance, or giving one an advantage over the other:
Virginia and North Carolina to the Big 10 and N.C. State and Virginia Tech to the SEC.
Both stop at 16 and if Duke is required to make it work in the Big 10 then the Big 10 makes them a partial member incorporating their basketball. Otherwise Duke, Boston College, Syracuse, and Wake Forest join the Big East.
Louisville and Pitt join the Big 12 North and Clemson, Florida State, Georgia Tech and Miami become the Big 12 Southeast.
Big 12:
Iowa State, Louisville, Pittsburgh, West Virginia
Kansas, Kansas State, Oklahoma, Oklahoma State
Baylor, Texas, T.C.U., Texas Tech
Clemson, Florida State, Georgia Tech, Miami
* Notre Dame keeps a partial and ESPN gains control of the conference and rolls the LHN into the Big 12N.
The PAC stays as is and it brings balance to the Big 10 and SEC while the 20 million of Virginia and North Carolina get double dipped by the 2 most watched conferences.
Kentucky, N.C. State, Tennessee, Virginia Tech
Florida, Georgia, South Carolina, Vanderbilt
Alabama, Auburn, Mississippi, Mississippi State
Arkansas, Louisiana State, Missouri, Texas A&M
Maryland, North Carolina, Penn State, Virginia
Indiana, Ohio State, Purdue, Rutgers
Illinois, Michigan, Michigan State, Northwestern
Iowa, Minnesota, Nebraska, Wisconsin
Why that division of schools? If we move to conference semi-finals you likely get these end of season match ups:
Tennessee or Virginia Tech
Florida or Georgia
Alabama or Auburn
L.S.U. or Texas A&M
Penn State
Ohio State
Michigan or Michigan State
Nebraska or Wisconsin or Iowa
All of those are solid draws.
Texas doesn't become anyone's problem and doesn't tip the balance of power and neither does Oklahoma. The SEC and Big 10 make more due to the markets and pro rata from the schools by the networks.
Texas and Oklahoma are enhanced in value with the ACC additions and now that conference can hang within 10 million of the SEC and Big 10 and everyone gets a raise.
The PAC stays the same because, well, they are the PAC and too damn far away.
1. How much importance would Disney put on the Northeast markets?
- If not much then, yes, they'd be okay with some programs going to a Fox conference like the Big East
- If so then they might have to shore up the ACC in some fashion. But that's a bit complicated as the Big Ten holds a very key program and two programs that they hold in major markets.
2. How much importance would they put in the health of the Texas program?
- I would assume they would favor UT over UNC and UVa if it came to that but their preference may be to keep all three and Oklahoma as well
- But if it became a choice between UT and UNC/UVa then that is when your scenario may have legs
(05-24-2020 12:28 PM)cubucks Wrote: [ -> ]With all the change due to the virus, I've decided I don't like change all that much. I'm in the corner of no more expansion. With that said, I would be perfectly fine with North Carolina and Virginia. I'm just winging it here but do those two schools, as a whole, have more in common with a larger number of BIG schools than ACC schools?
Michigan
Maryland
Penn State
Wisconsin
Illinois
Northwestern
Indiana
These schools gel really good with North Carolina and Virginia, right?
Like I said, I'm not saying this is fact in any ways. I just don't see a solid faction between these two schools and...
Clemson
Florida State
Miami
Syracuse
Boston college
NC State
A post like this is easy to say I'm cherry picking, I'm truly not because this is simply personal observation and nothing else.
My biggest annoyance though is too much eastern expansion. The schools in the west are extremely valuable and need protected.
What schools in the west are you referring to? And you do realize if you're from Ohio any schools in the west will be further away from OSU/Columbus/Ohio than eastern schools.
(05-27-2020 10:43 AM)schmolik Wrote: [ -> ] (05-24-2020 12:28 PM)cubucks Wrote: [ -> ]With all the change due to the virus, I've decided I don't like change all that much. I'm in the corner of no more expansion. With that said, I would be perfectly fine with North Carolina and Virginia. I'm just winging it here but do those two schools, as a whole, have more in common with a larger number of BIG schools than ACC schools?
Michigan
Maryland
Penn State
Wisconsin
Illinois
Northwestern
Indiana
These schools gel really good with North Carolina and Virginia, right?
Like I said, I'm not saying this is fact in any ways. I just don't see a solid faction between these two schools and...
Clemson
Florida State
Miami
Syracuse
Boston college
NC State
A post like this is easy to say I'm cherry picking, I'm truly not because this is simply personal observation and nothing else.
My biggest annoyance though is too much eastern expansion. The schools in the west are extremely valuable and need protected.
What schools in the west are you referring to? And you do realize if you're from Ohio any schools in the west will be further away from OSU/Columbus/Ohio than eastern schools.
Yes, of course I realize the distances you mention. Those western teams are very valuable to this conference in many ways. Specifically to Ohio State is the history with them. Wisconsin (84), Illinois (102), Iowa (65), Northwestern (78),Minnesota (53) and Purdue (57). Throw in Nebraska (I know you hate them) and that's valuable.
Penn State never had multiple long running rivals other than Pitt and West Virginia. Throw in Temple as well. Obviously because they were independent it was not as easy to sustain such series. Maryland was close to a rival, right? and this conference added them mainly for Penn State.
I really dont understand your beef with the western schools? Penn State is in a nice compact eastern division so what's the problem with this setup?
Ohio State has had to sacrifice long running series with schools mentioned above due to expansion. I don't think I've ever said I'm totally against eastern expansion? I said let's not forget our western friends and their value. Let's not forget our roots, so to speak.
What about schools like Arizona, Colorado and Utah? 3 schools in the east, UNC, Virginia and pick a 3rd plus those 3 western schools. Puts it at 20 and call it a day. If population matters then those 3 western schools add that and growing.
(05-28-2020 12:31 PM)cubucks Wrote: [ -> ]What about schools like Arizona, Colorado and Utah? 3 schools in the east, UNC, Virginia and pick a 3rd plus those 3 western schools. Puts it at 20 and call it a day. If population matters then those 3 western schools add that and growing.
If we have to play them in men's/women's basketball and Olympic sports, no deal. What's the point of the Big Ten in the Mountain/Pacific Time Zone?
(05-28-2020 08:28 PM)schmolik Wrote: [ -> ] (05-28-2020 12:31 PM)cubucks Wrote: [ -> ]What about schools like Arizona, Colorado and Utah? 3 schools in the east, UNC, Virginia and pick a 3rd plus those 3 western schools. Puts it at 20 and call it a day. If population matters then those 3 western schools add that and growing.
If we have to play them in men's/women's basketball and Olympic sports, no deal. What's the point of the Big Ten in the Mountain/Pacific Time Zone?
Well, The BIG was once a Midwestern conference and now they are from the plains to the east coast. I say keep it at 14, if it goes higher, who the heck knows what's going to happen?
(05-28-2020 12:31 PM)cubucks Wrote: [ -> ]What about schools like Arizona, Colorado and Utah? 3 schools in the east, UNC, Virginia and pick a 3rd plus those 3 western schools. Puts it at 20 and call it a day. If population matters then those 3 western schools add that and growing.
I think Colorado would be a nice pair to bring with Oklahoma. They bring a nice pair of schools that Nebraska could use to better fit into the conference. If I remember correctly, Denver is the most heavily populated city with Big Ten alumni but isn't in the conference footprint, aside from Los Angeles. I really thought Colorado was turning a corner in football back in 2016 or 2017 when they had a breakout season but failed to capitalize on that success and are back to being a bottom dweller.
When Arizona State was looking for a hockey home and the Big Ten passed, I was very surprised. I don't think Arizona has what it takes either. Utah is solid but has even less ties to the Big Ten. I think there would have to be an unprecedented event to make the Big Ten make a run at those two.
Colorado is probably as far west we could do right now unless we bite bullet and merge partly with the PAC (which would require a scenario which I won't cover here in this thread).
Bring in Pitt and Iowa State to have year-end match-ups with Iowa and Penn State. Then add Oklahoma and Kansas. Finish with the two Virginia schools to have the year-end rivalry from that state. So you'll have these rivalries in the last week:
Nebraska-Oklahoma
Iowa-Iowa State
Illinois-Northwestern
Minnesota-Wisconsin
Purdue-Indiana
Michigan-Ohio State
Penn State-Pitt
Virginia Tech-Virginia
Michigan State, Rutgers, Kansas and Maryland would rotate among themselves.
If Iowa State is not acceptable to the brass then maybe Missouri could work. Just replace Iowa-Iowa State with Kansas-Missouri. Then have Iowa-Michigan State and Rutgers-Maryland as year-end games.
Nebraska-Oklahoma
Kansas-Missouri
Illinois-Northwestern
Minnesota-Wisconsin
Purdue-Indiana
Michigan-Ohio State
Iowa-Michigan State
Penn State-Pitt
Virginia Tech-Virginia
Rutgers-Maryland
(05-29-2020 09:57 PM)Transic_nyc Wrote: [ -> ]Nebraska-Oklahoma
Kansas-Missouri
Illinois-Northwestern
Minnesota-Wisconsin
Purdue-Indiana
Michigan-Ohio State
Iowa-Michigan State
Penn State-Pitt
Virginia Tech-Virginia
Rutgers-Maryland
Replace Virginia Tech with North Carolina and I'd take it. If divisions are still required, you'd have Virginia, North Carolina, and Pitt in the East and Missouri, Kansas, and Oklahoma in the West.
(05-30-2020 09:47 AM)schmolik Wrote: [ -> ] (05-29-2020 09:57 PM)Transic_nyc Wrote: [ -> ]Nebraska-Oklahoma
Kansas-Missouri
Illinois-Northwestern
Minnesota-Wisconsin
Purdue-Indiana
Michigan-Ohio State
Iowa-Michigan State
Penn State-Pitt
Virginia Tech-Virginia
Rutgers-Maryland
Replace Virginia Tech with North Carolina and I'd take it. If divisions are still required, you'd have Virginia, North Carolina, and Pitt in the East and Missouri, Kansas, and Oklahoma in the West.
I like substituting North Carolina for Virginia Tech in the above.
Divisions
South: Oklahoma, Kansas, Missouri, Nebraska, Iowa
West: Minnesota, Wisconsin, Illinois, Northwestern, Michigan St
North: Indiana, Purdue, Michigan, Ohio St, Penn St
East: Pittsburgh, Rutgers, Maryland, Virginia, North Carolina