1. Vanderbilt announces that they aren't going to spend any more money on football.
2. Today the long term A.D. at Vanderbilt announces his retirement.
Could it be that Vanderbilt may be getting ready to step down from football participation in the SEC?
Could they become our first ever everything but football member?
Might they be ready to spend at ACC levels?
Could the timing be intentional? Might they be lining up to move to the ACC in 2023-4 and if so does that mean the the SEC might have room for Texas, Oklahoma and Oklahoma State? Or, perhaps it would be enough room for Texas, Texas Tech and Kansas?
I'm not saying it is anything yet, but they need to refurbish their campus stadium big time and refuse to do so. I find the talking points right now to be highly interesting.
Thoughts?
Maybe Vandy Steps down and Memphis moves into their spot would be a better move, with Memphis Investing and Improving big time..Plus Memphis is getting more and more state support nowadays and would be the Real Rival for UTK....But not saying that is gonna hapen if if Vandy Stepped down then it should be considered and Sure UTK, Oke Miss, MSU, Arkansas, and LSU would be speaking up if that were to Happen with Vandy..Just my Opinion though...
Vandy to the ACC makes total sense in every respect except for the payout check cut every year. Half of their true peers are already in the ACC, and Vandy is never going to rise to the level of Nashville's team, especially in football. Part of the stadium drama may be that Nashville is flush with entertainment venues, and the property upon which Vanderbilt stadium sits is prime, as in potential high rise prime. There were rumblings about Vandy partnering with the new MLS franchise to build a joint stadium at the Fairgrounds, which is still close but not nearly the value of campus property.
Add to that the CTE and other issues involved with a premier medical university participating in football after all the research that has been released, and Vandy will surely be among the first P5 schools to abandon our current form of CFB if/when alumni or political pressure set in. Really, half of the ACC would be in the same boat, and it would be much easier to accept such a path in that culture than the ACC. How many ACC schools would be devastated by losing football? Notre Dame, Florida State and Clemson? Va Tech and NC State would be a second tier, but the essence of all the other ACC schools would basically move on and operate like Villanova or Georgetown in terms of athletics.
Vanderbilt should be with Duke, Northwestern, and the UVA's of the P5. If most of the ACC sees the writing on the wall, the GOR expiration would be a good time for FSU and Clemson to go SEC and Vandy to move to the ACC. Of course, the rights deals for the ACC would drop dramatically, but if they de-emphasized football, there would be massive financial savings, especially if the profitable football schools were strongly encouraging their departures.
(09-11-2018 08:05 PM)tigerscane Wrote: [ -> ]Maybe Vandy Steps down and Memphis moves into their spot would be a better move, with Memphis Investing and Improving big time..Plus Memphis is getting more and more state support nowadays and would be the Real Rival for UTK....But not saying that is gonna hapen if if Vandy Stepped down then it should be considered and Sure UTK, Oke Miss, MSU, Arkansas, and LSU would be speaking up if that were to Happen with Vandy..Just my Opinion though...
The SEC would just leave that spot empty than add Memphis. As JR has explained well, Texas, Oklahoma, FSU, and Clemson to an extent add value to the SEC's bottom line. Without those schools involved, they are not adding.
(09-11-2018 05:54 PM)JRsec Wrote: [ -> ]1. Vanderbilt announces that they aren't going to spend any more money on football.
2. Today the long term A.D. at Vanderbilt announces his retirement.
Could it be that Vanderbilt may be getting ready to step down from football participation in the SEC?
Could they become our first ever everything but football member?
Might they be ready to spend at ACC levels?
Could the timing be intentional? Might they be lining up to move to the ACC in 2023-4 and if so does that mean the the SEC might have room for Texas, Oklahoma and Oklahoma State? Or, perhaps it would be enough room for Texas, Texas Tech and Kansas?
I'm not saying it is anything yet, but they need to refurbish their campus stadium big time and refuse to do so. I find the talking points right now to be highly interesting.
Thoughts?
Vanderbilt will transition into the ACC as that league's only school outside of the Eastern Time Zone.
Vanderbilt and Cincinnati will round out the ACC's membership at 16 full time members and Notre Dame that will remain an ACC member in all sports with the exception of football.
The SEC will with the departure of the Commodores, be able to add at least 3 teams to reach the magic number of 16.
This is where things could get interesting:
What is ESPN willing to do to keep some guaranteed B1G inventory for the ESPN networks without having to invest in the BTN or have to continue to overpay for B1G content? Some speculate that the SEC could accommodate the B1G by sending Missouri to the B1G to be joined by Kansas.
This will no free the SEC up to add four teams to get to 16 (replacing Vanderbilt and Missouri + 2)
This presents a huge dilemma for ESPN and the SEC. Texas or Oklahoma (can't have both)
The SEC opts for the only smart decision available.......Texas. The rest will follow form. The SEC takes the other remaining value of the old SWC by adding Texas Tech and TCU and West Virginia as #4.
The PAC then gets Iowa State, Oklahoma State, Kansas State and Oklahoma.
What this does is gives the PAC/B1G all of the old Big 8 schools and the SEC has all of the value of the old SWC.
Baylor moves to the American.
(09-11-2018 08:36 PM)XLance Wrote: [ -> ] (09-11-2018 05:54 PM)JRsec Wrote: [ -> ]1. Vanderbilt announces that they aren't going to spend any more money on football.
2. Today the long term A.D. at Vanderbilt announces his retirement.
Could it be that Vanderbilt may be getting ready to step down from football participation in the SEC?
Could they become our first ever everything but football member?
Might they be ready to spend at ACC levels?
Could the timing be intentional? Might they be lining up to move to the ACC in 2023-4 and if so does that mean the the SEC might have room for Texas, Oklahoma and Oklahoma State? Or, perhaps it would be enough room for Texas, Texas Tech and Kansas?
I'm not saying it is anything yet, but they need to refurbish their campus stadium big time and refuse to do so. I find the talking points right now to be highly interesting.
Thoughts?
Vanderbilt will transition into the ACC as that league's only school outside of the Eastern Time Zone.
Vanderbilt and Cincinnati will round out the ACC's membership at 16 full time members and Notre Dame that will remain an ACC member in all sports with the exception of football.
The SEC will with the departure of the Commodores, be able to add at least 3 teams to reach the magic number of 16.
This is where things could get interesting:
What is ESPN willing to do to keep some guaranteed B1G inventory for the ESPN networks without having to invest in the BTN or have to continue to overpay for B1G content? Some speculate that the SEC could accommodate the B1G by sending Missouri to the B1G to be joined by Kansas.
This will no free the SEC up to add four teams to get to 16 (replacing Vanderbilt and Missouri + 2)
This presents a huge dilemma for ESPN and the SEC. Texas or Oklahoma (can't have both)
The SEC opts for the only smart decision available.......Texas. The rest will follow form. The SEC takes the other remaining value of the old SWC by adding Texas Tech and TCU and West Virginia as #4.
The PAC then gets Iowa State, Oklahoma State, Kansas State and Oklahoma.
What this does is gives the PAC/B1G all of the old Big 8 schools and the SEC has all of the value of the old SWC.
Baylor moves to the American.
Actually X, what I would see happening should Vanderbilt depart for the ACC would be the additions of Texas, Texas Tech, and Kansas. Missouri would stay.
Then Oklahoma, Oklahoma State, Iowa State. and Kansas State could head to the PAC if the PAC wanted them.
West Virginia would join Vanderbilt in the ACC
(09-11-2018 08:36 PM)AllTideUp Wrote: [ -> ]Thought this was an interesting article about the rumblings over the stadium and fundraising...
Vandy has smallest opening crowd since 1981
I think they realize that as things ramp up in the P5 that they are looking more and more like Sewanee if they decide to stay. They can highlight basketball and baseball in the ACC and still play at Wake and Duke's level without a lot more investment.
(09-11-2018 08:52 PM)JRsec Wrote: [ -> ] (09-11-2018 08:36 PM)XLance Wrote: [ -> ] (09-11-2018 05:54 PM)JRsec Wrote: [ -> ]1. Vanderbilt announces that they aren't going to spend any more money on football.
2. Today the long term A.D. at Vanderbilt announces his retirement.
Could it be that Vanderbilt may be getting ready to step down from football participation in the SEC?
Could they become our first ever everything but football member?
Might they be ready to spend at ACC levels?
Could the timing be intentional? Might they be lining up to move to the ACC in 2023-4 and if so does that mean the the SEC might have room for Texas, Oklahoma and Oklahoma State? Or, perhaps it would be enough room for Texas, Texas Tech and Kansas?
I'm not saying it is anything yet, but they need to refurbish their campus stadium big time and refuse to do so. I find the talking points right now to be highly interesting.
Thoughts?
Vanderbilt will transition into the ACC as that league's only school outside of the Eastern Time Zone.
Vanderbilt and Cincinnati will round out the ACC's membership at 16 full time members and Notre Dame that will remain an ACC member in all sports with the exception of football.
The SEC will with the departure of the Commodores, be able to add at least 3 teams to reach the magic number of 16.
This is where things could get interesting:
What is ESPN willing to do to keep some guaranteed B1G inventory for the ESPN networks without having to invest in the BTN or have to continue to overpay for B1G content? Some speculate that the SEC could accommodate the B1G by sending Missouri to the B1G to be joined by Kansas.
This will no free the SEC up to add four teams to get to 16 (replacing Vanderbilt and Missouri + 2)
This presents a huge dilemma for ESPN and the SEC. Texas or Oklahoma (can't have both)
The SEC opts for the only smart decision available.......Texas. The rest will follow form. The SEC takes the other remaining value of the old SWC by adding Texas Tech and TCU and West Virginia as #4.
The PAC then gets Iowa State, Oklahoma State, Kansas State and Oklahoma.
What this does is gives the PAC/B1G all of the old Big 8 schools and the SEC has all of the value of the old SWC.
Baylor moves to the American.
Actually X, what I would see happening should Vanderbilt depart for the ACC would be the additions of Texas, Texas Tech, and Kansas. Missouri would stay.
Then Oklahoma, Oklahoma State, Iowa State. and Kansas State could head to the PAC if the PAC wanted them.
West Virginia would join Vanderbilt in the ACC
JR, in order for everyone to live happily ever-after (or 20 years) the B1G will have to be accommodated....Missouri is a small price to pay and they really don't "fit" in your conference (no offense to Medic).
(09-11-2018 09:04 PM)XLance Wrote: [ -> ] (09-11-2018 08:52 PM)JRsec Wrote: [ -> ] (09-11-2018 08:36 PM)XLance Wrote: [ -> ] (09-11-2018 05:54 PM)JRsec Wrote: [ -> ]1. Vanderbilt announces that they aren't going to spend any more money on football.
2. Today the long term A.D. at Vanderbilt announces his retirement.
Could it be that Vanderbilt may be getting ready to step down from football participation in the SEC?
Could they become our first ever everything but football member?
Might they be ready to spend at ACC levels?
Could the timing be intentional? Might they be lining up to move to the ACC in 2023-4 and if so does that mean the the SEC might have room for Texas, Oklahoma and Oklahoma State? Or, perhaps it would be enough room for Texas, Texas Tech and Kansas?
I'm not saying it is anything yet, but they need to refurbish their campus stadium big time and refuse to do so. I find the talking points right now to be highly interesting.
Thoughts?
Vanderbilt will transition into the ACC as that league's only school outside of the Eastern Time Zone.
Vanderbilt and Cincinnati will round out the ACC's membership at 16 full time members and Notre Dame that will remain an ACC member in all sports with the exception of football.
The SEC will with the departure of the Commodores, be able to add at least 3 teams to reach the magic number of 16.
This is where things could get interesting:
What is ESPN willing to do to keep some guaranteed B1G inventory for the ESPN networks without having to invest in the BTN or have to continue to overpay for B1G content? Some speculate that the SEC could accommodate the B1G by sending Missouri to the B1G to be joined by Kansas.
This will no free the SEC up to add four teams to get to 16 (replacing Vanderbilt and Missouri + 2)
This presents a huge dilemma for ESPN and the SEC. Texas or Oklahoma (can't have both)
The SEC opts for the only smart decision available.......Texas. The rest will follow form. The SEC takes the other remaining value of the old SWC by adding Texas Tech and TCU and West Virginia as #4.
The PAC then gets Iowa State, Oklahoma State, Kansas State and Oklahoma.
What this does is gives the PAC/B1G all of the old Big 8 schools and the SEC has all of the value of the old SWC.
Baylor moves to the American.
Actually X, what I would see happening should Vanderbilt depart for the ACC would be the additions of Texas, Texas Tech, and Kansas. Missouri would stay.
Then Oklahoma, Oklahoma State, Iowa State. and Kansas State could head to the PAC if the PAC wanted them.
West Virginia would join Vanderbilt in the ACC
JR, in order for everyone to live happily ever-after (or 20 years) the B1G will have to be accommodated....Missouri is a small price to pay and they really don't "fit" in your conference (no offense to Medic).
Nobody will cause us to break our protocol. If they want to leave that's a different matter. If they don't they won't be asked to. It's just that simple.
(09-11-2018 08:55 PM)JRsec Wrote: [ -> ] (09-11-2018 08:36 PM)AllTideUp Wrote: [ -> ]Thought this was an interesting article about the rumblings over the stadium and fundraising...
Vandy has smallest opening crowd since 1981
I think they realize that as things ramp up in the P5 that they are looking more and more like Sewanee if they decide to stay. They can highlight basketball and baseball in the ACC and still play at Wake and Duke's level without a lot more investment.
If they left for the ACC then do you think that would indicate a plan by the SEC to acquire another private school?
If protection from records requests are a big concern then you have a school like TCU that would be willing and able to spend at a much higher level.
(09-11-2018 09:09 PM)AllTideUp Wrote: [ -> ] (09-11-2018 08:55 PM)JRsec Wrote: [ -> ] (09-11-2018 08:36 PM)AllTideUp Wrote: [ -> ]Thought this was an interesting article about the rumblings over the stadium and fundraising...
Vandy has smallest opening crowd since 1981
I think they realize that as things ramp up in the P5 that they are looking more and more like Sewanee if they decide to stay. They can highlight basketball and baseball in the ACC and still play at Wake and Duke's level without a lot more investment.
If they left for the ACC then do you think that would indicate a plan by the SEC to acquire another private school?
If protection from records requests are a big concern then you have a school like TCU that would be willing and able to spend at a much higher level.
That's possible. I just don't see a 16 member SEC accepting a 4 member Texas voting block. I could easily see Texas and either Tech or T.C.U. and Kansas.
Let's forget about Missouri and Kansas to the Big 10 for a moment. It takes 8 votes to disband the conference and no votes if it happens after 2023. What I could see is Oklahoma, Oklahoma State, Kansas, and Kansas State to the PAC. Texas, Texas Tech, and maybe T.C.U. to the SEC with West Virginia to the ACC.
But Occam's razor tells me if Vanderbilt left that the SEC would likely take Texas, Kansas and Texas Tech. Oklahoma and Iowa State to the Big 10. West Virginia to the ACC and everyone else is scrambling.
Some would recommend keeping at least one private institution in the conference for various reasons. Unless I missed something, JR was the only one to mention one (TCU). That “requirement” might be overrated but I’m speculating that it’s important enough to give a candidate like TCU more of an inside track against somelike TxTech
(09-11-2018 09:50 PM)owl at the moon Wrote: [ -> ]Some would recommend keeping at least one private institution in the conference for various reasons. Unless I missed something, JR was the only one to mention one (TCU). That “requirement” might be overrated but I’m speculating that it’s important enough to give a candidate like TCU more of an inside track against somelike TxTech
Well the SEC is big on luxury boxes. Texas already has them. T.C.U. has gone way out of the way in the last two years to add more luxury seating and now so too is Kansas. I don't think that would be a requirement to the Big 10 or PAC so even though that is not substantive proof of anything it is nonetheless curious.
(09-11-2018 09:04 PM)XLance Wrote: [ -> ] (09-11-2018 08:52 PM)JRsec Wrote: [ -> ] (09-11-2018 08:36 PM)XLance Wrote: [ -> ] (09-11-2018 05:54 PM)JRsec Wrote: [ -> ]1. Vanderbilt announces that they aren't going to spend any more money on football.
2. Today the long term A.D. at Vanderbilt announces his retirement.
Could it be that Vanderbilt may be getting ready to step down from football participation in the SEC?
Could they become our first ever everything but football member?
Might they be ready to spend at ACC levels?
Could the timing be intentional? Might they be lining up to move to the ACC in 2023-4 and if so does that mean the the SEC might have room for Texas, Oklahoma and Oklahoma State? Or, perhaps it would be enough room for Texas, Texas Tech and Kansas?
I'm not saying it is anything yet, but they need to refurbish their campus stadium big time and refuse to do so. I find the talking points right now to be highly interesting.
Thoughts?
Vanderbilt will transition into the ACC as that league's only school outside of the Eastern Time Zone.
Vanderbilt and Cincinnati will round out the ACC's membership at 16 full time members and Notre Dame that will remain an ACC member in all sports with the exception of football.
The SEC will with the departure of the Commodores, be able to add at least 3 teams to reach the magic number of 16.
This is where things could get interesting:
What is ESPN willing to do to keep some guaranteed B1G inventory for the ESPN networks without having to invest in the BTN or have to continue to overpay for B1G content? Some speculate that the SEC could accommodate the B1G by sending Missouri to the B1G to be joined by Kansas.
This will no free the SEC up to add four teams to get to 16 (replacing Vanderbilt and Missouri + 2)
This presents a huge dilemma for ESPN and the SEC. Texas or Oklahoma (can't have both)
The SEC opts for the only smart decision available.......Texas. The rest will follow form. The SEC takes the other remaining value of the old SWC by adding Texas Tech and TCU and West Virginia as #4.
The PAC then gets Iowa State, Oklahoma State, Kansas State and Oklahoma.
What this does is gives the PAC/B1G all of the old Big 8 schools and the SEC has all of the value of the old SWC.
Baylor moves to the American.
Actually X, what I would see happening should Vanderbilt depart for the ACC would be the additions of Texas, Texas Tech, and Kansas. Missouri would stay.
Then Oklahoma, Oklahoma State, Iowa State. and Kansas State could head to the PAC if the PAC wanted them.
West Virginia would join Vanderbilt in the ACC
JR, in order for everyone to live happily ever-after (or 20 years) the B1G will have to be accommodated....Missouri is a small price to pay and they really don't "fit" in your conference (no offense to Medic).
Let's see how that would look. I have thought in the past that the best division would be Old Big 8 to the North and SWC to the South. Substitute the West for part of the Old Big 8 and it has a logic.
SEC:
Texas, Texas A&M, T.C.U., Texas Tech
Arkansas, Louisiana State, Mississippi, Mississippi State
Alabama, Auburn, Kentucky, Tennessee
Florida, Georgia, South Carolina, West Virginia
ACC:
Boston College, Notre Dame, Pittsburgh, Syracuse
Louisville, Vanderbilt, Virginia, Virginia Tech
Duke, North Carolina, N.C. State, Wake Forest
Clemson, Florida State, Georgia Tech, Miami
Big 10:
Maryland, Ohio State, Penn State, Rutgers
Indiana, Michigan, Michigan State, Purdue
Illinois, Minnesota, Northwestern, Wisconsin
Iowa, Kansas, Missouri, Nebraska
PAC:
Iowa State, Kansas State, Oklahoma, Oklahoma State
Arizona, Arizona State, Colorado, Utah
California, Cal Los Angeles, Southern Cal, Stanford
Oregon, Oregon State, Washington, Washington State
And X, if this did happen Notre Dame would go all in because we would have a champs only format.
(09-11-2018 09:28 PM)JRsec Wrote: [ -> ] (09-11-2018 09:09 PM)AllTideUp Wrote: [ -> ] (09-11-2018 08:55 PM)JRsec Wrote: [ -> ] (09-11-2018 08:36 PM)AllTideUp Wrote: [ -> ]Thought this was an interesting article about the rumblings over the stadium and fundraising...
Vandy has smallest opening crowd since 1981
I think they realize that as things ramp up in the P5 that they are looking more and more like Sewanee if they decide to stay. They can highlight basketball and baseball in the ACC and still play at Wake and Duke's level without a lot more investment.
If they left for the ACC then do you think that would indicate a plan by the SEC to acquire another private school?
If protection from records requests are a big concern then you have a school like TCU that would be willing and able to spend at a much higher level.
That's possible. I just don't see a 16 member SEC accepting a 4 member Texas voting block. I could easily see Texas and either Tech or T.C.U. and Kansas.
Let's forget about Missouri and Kansas to the Big 10 for a moment. It takes 8 votes to disband the conference and no votes if it happens after 2023. What I could see is Oklahoma, Oklahoma State, Kansas, and Kansas State to the PAC. Texas, Texas Tech, and maybe T.C.U. to the SEC with West Virginia to the ACC.
But Occam's razor tells me if Vanderbilt left that the SEC would likely take Texas, Kansas and Texas Tech. Oklahoma and Iowa State to the Big 10. West Virginia to the ACC and everyone else is scrambling.
Allow me to postulate...
If Vanderbilt decides they'd rather compete in the ACC(with the caveat that they got some guaranteed match-ups with SEC schools in non-conference play) then it could be a part of a complex maneuver.
There aren't very many options in the Big 12 that would appeal to the ACC for geographical reasons if nothing else. West Virginia is intriguing although I'm not convinced there won't be a critical mass of schools against them. That and unlike Louisville, WVU doesn't really expand the footprint.
On the flip side, Nashville is very close to many ACC schools. Pushing into TN would be an overall positive for the ACC and probably preferable to taking another state school with potential. Vanderbilt also happens to be the weakest economic link in the SEC so Birmingham shouldn't mind losing them. With that said, it is probably better to have a private school in the ranks assuming you can find one that fits the bill.
TCU happens to fit the bill and bring other tangible benefits as well. TCU is rated by WSJ as having a $153.6M impact which is more than double the impact of Vanderbilt at $73.9M. Last year, TCU generated $105M in revenue while Vanderbilt made $80M. Let's also consider the Big 12's overall revenue is less than the SEC's and those numbers look a bit more stark when compared side by side. The switcheroo ups our averages a little bit and that's before any principal additions.
What would those additions be? I have to believe that a move including TCU would be at the behest of Texas. It's been said that UT likes their neighbors so that much makes sense.
But here's my question...is Texas influential enough to bring 2 partners or would they choose to protect TCU in place of Texas Tech? What about Kansas? What about Oklahoma? What about the ACC?
Is this all much ado about nothing? Because the easiest move to make is adding Texas, Texas Tech, and Kansas should a 3rd spot open up. It's very convenient actually.
Well, there's also the attractive qualities of TCU as an addition unto themselves. I'm a believer and defender of those so I won't go over it all again, but I think TCU is a good product to own.
What if the PAC 12 was willing to do something like this? Take Oklahoma, Oklahoma State, Texas Tech, and Houston? That would be a very solid 16 for them and it's entirely possible that the PAC would be humble enough to get it done this time given their financial difficulties.
Not sure if WVU would get another shot in the ACC or if Notre Dame would simply give up the ghost and join in full as number 16.
The Big Ten wouldn't have many options here.
The PAC might insist on the Horns or there would be no deal.
SEC:
Oklahoma, Texas A&M, Texas Christian, Oklahoma State
Arkansas, Louisiana State, Mississippi, Mississippi State
Alabama, Auburn, Kentucky, Tennessee
Florida, Georgia, South Carolina, West Virginia
ACC:
Boston College, Notre Dame, Pittsburgh, Syracuse
Louisville, Vanderbilt, Virginia, Virginia Tech
Duke, North Carolina, N.C. State, Wake Forest
Clemson, Florida State, Georgia Tech, Miami
Big 10:
Maryland, Ohio State, Penn State, Rutgers
Indiana, Michigan, Michigan State, Purdue
Illinois, Minnesota, Northwestern, Wisconsin
Iowa, Kansas, Missouri, Nebraska
PAC:
Iowa State, Kansas State, Texas, Texas Tech
Arizona, Arizona State, Colorado, Utah
California, Cal Los Angeles, Southern Cal, Stanford
Oregon, Oregon State, Washington, Washington State
SEC would, basically, shut out real competition from DFW, with only G-level programs sharing the market. PAC gets the bell cow but that would just help them absorb the programs no one else want.
(09-12-2018 12:02 AM)AllTideUp Wrote: [ -> ] (09-11-2018 09:28 PM)JRsec Wrote: [ -> ] (09-11-2018 09:09 PM)AllTideUp Wrote: [ -> ] (09-11-2018 08:55 PM)JRsec Wrote: [ -> ] (09-11-2018 08:36 PM)AllTideUp Wrote: [ -> ]Thought this was an interesting article about the rumblings over the stadium and fundraising...
Vandy has smallest opening crowd since 1981
I think they realize that as things ramp up in the P5 that they are looking more and more like Sewanee if they decide to stay. They can highlight basketball and baseball in the ACC and still play at Wake and Duke's level without a lot more investment.
If they left for the ACC then do you think that would indicate a plan by the SEC to acquire another private school?
If protection from records requests are a big concern then you have a school like TCU that would be willing and able to spend at a much higher level.
That's possible. I just don't see a 16 member SEC accepting a 4 member Texas voting block. I could easily see Texas and either Tech or T.C.U. and Kansas.
Let's forget about Missouri and Kansas to the Big 10 for a moment. It takes 8 votes to disband the conference and no votes if it happens after 2023. What I could see is Oklahoma, Oklahoma State, Kansas, and Kansas State to the PAC. Texas, Texas Tech, and maybe T.C.U. to the SEC with West Virginia to the ACC.
But Occam's razor tells me if Vanderbilt left that the SEC would likely take Texas, Kansas and Texas Tech. Oklahoma and Iowa State to the Big 10. West Virginia to the ACC and everyone else is scrambling.
Allow me to postulate...
If Vanderbilt decides they'd rather compete in the ACC(with the caveat that they got some guaranteed match-ups with SEC schools in non-conference play) then it could be a part of a complex maneuver.
There aren't very many options in the Big 12 that would appeal to the ACC for geographical reasons if nothing else. West Virginia is intriguing although I'm not convinced there won't be a critical mass of schools against them. That and unlike Louisville, WVU doesn't really expand the footprint.
On the flip side, Nashville is very close to many ACC schools. Pushing into TN would be an overall positive for the ACC and probably preferable to taking another state school with potential. Vanderbilt also happens to be the weakest economic link in the SEC so Birmingham shouldn't mind losing them. With that said, it is probably better to have a private school in the ranks assuming you can find one that fits the bill.
TCU happens to fit the bill and bring other tangible benefits as well. TCU is rated by WSJ as having a $153.6M impact which is more than double the impact of Vanderbilt at $73.9M. Last year, TCU generated $105M in revenue while Vanderbilt made $80M. Let's also consider the Big 12's overall revenue is less than the SEC's and those numbers look a bit more stark when compared side by side. The switcheroo ups our averages a little bit and that's before any principal additions.
What would those additions be? I have to believe that a move including TCU would be at the behest of Texas. It's been said that UT likes their neighbors so that much makes sense.
But here's my question...is Texas influential enough to bring 2 partners or would they choose to protect TCU in place of Texas Tech? What about Kansas? What about Oklahoma? What about the ACC?
Is this all much ado about nothing? Because the easiest move to make is adding Texas, Texas Tech, and Kansas should a 3rd spot open up. It's very convenient actually.
Well, there's also the attractive qualities of TCU as an addition unto themselves. I'm a believer and defender of those so I won't go over it all again, but I think TCU is a good product to own.
What if the PAC 12 was willing to do something like this? Take Oklahoma, Oklahoma State, Texas Tech, and Houston? That would be a very solid 16 for them and it's entirely possible that the PAC would be humble enough to get it done this time given their financial difficulties.
Not sure if WVU would get another shot in the ACC or if Notre Dame would simply give up the ghost and join in full as number 16.
The Big Ten wouldn't have many options here.
I'd be fine with Texas, T.C.U. and Kansas. Two of them have already spent or planned to spend millions on luxury boxes. T.C.U.'s A.D. is the new A.D. at Texas. And Kansas is no threat to them. If we lost Vanderbilt we would still be plus one on AAU schools if Kansas and Texas joined. T.C.U. in the SEC at that point would hamper OU recruiting in DFW a wee bit.
So Texas Tech, Kansas State, Oklahoma, and Oklahoma State would be decent grab for the PAC. I really don't see Houston or Cincinnati getting a promotion. Baylor is a lost cause. But with A&M's presence in Houston and T.C.U. in Dallas and Texas giving us Austin and between the three the rest of the state that would just about be ideal. And we would still have 1 private school.
(09-11-2018 05:54 PM)JRsec Wrote: [ -> ]1. Vanderbilt announces that they aren't going to spend any more money on football.
2. Today the long term A.D. at Vanderbilt announces his retirement.
Could it be that Vanderbilt may be getting ready to step down from football participation in the SEC?
Could they become our first ever everything but football member?
Might they be ready to spend at ACC levels?
Could the timing be intentional? Might they be lining up to move to the ACC in 2023-4 and if so does that mean the the SEC might have room for Texas, Oklahoma and Oklahoma State? Or, perhaps it would be enough room for Texas, Texas Tech and Kansas?
I'm not saying it is anything yet, but they need to refurbish their campus stadium big time and refuse to do so. I find the talking points right now to be highly interesting.
Thoughts?
Not seeing any recent articles about Vanderbilt saying they won’t spend any further money on football; I’ll need a link.
The AD is at or beyond retirement age. He’s probably lifted that athletic department higher than it has been in decades. No problem retiring now.
If Vandy steps down from SEC football, I don’t see them staying a FBS level football program. The ACC makes sense competitively, just not financially.
If Vandy does go, I see the SEC getting some early feelers from Kansas, West Virginia and Florida State. Ideally, Texas or Oklahoma or Virginia Tech would be ideal candidates from what the Slive era expansion mindset was, not sure what Sankey would look for.
(09-11-2018 10:13 PM)JRsec Wrote: [ -> ] (09-11-2018 09:04 PM)XLance Wrote: [ -> ] (09-11-2018 08:52 PM)JRsec Wrote: [ -> ] (09-11-2018 08:36 PM)XLance Wrote: [ -> ] (09-11-2018 05:54 PM)JRsec Wrote: [ -> ]1. Vanderbilt announces that they aren't going to spend any more money on football.
2. Today the long term A.D. at Vanderbilt announces his retirement.
Could it be that Vanderbilt may be getting ready to step down from football participation in the SEC?
Could they become our first ever everything but football member?
Might they be ready to spend at ACC levels?
Could the timing be intentional? Might they be lining up to move to the ACC in 2023-4 and if so does that mean the the SEC might have room for Texas, Oklahoma and Oklahoma State? Or, perhaps it would be enough room for Texas, Texas Tech and Kansas?
I'm not saying it is anything yet, but they need to refurbish their campus stadium big time and refuse to do so. I find the talking points right now to be highly interesting.
Thoughts?
Vanderbilt will transition into the ACC as that league's only school outside of the Eastern Time Zone.
Vanderbilt and Cincinnati will round out the ACC's membership at 16 full time members and Notre Dame that will remain an ACC member in all sports with the exception of football.
The SEC will with the departure of the Commodores, be able to add at least 3 teams to reach the magic number of 16.
This is where things could get interesting:
What is ESPN willing to do to keep some guaranteed B1G inventory for the ESPN networks without having to invest in the BTN or have to continue to overpay for B1G content? Some speculate that the SEC could accommodate the B1G by sending Missouri to the B1G to be joined by Kansas.
This will no free the SEC up to add four teams to get to 16 (replacing Vanderbilt and Missouri + 2)
This presents a huge dilemma for ESPN and the SEC. Texas or Oklahoma (can't have both)
The SEC opts for the only smart decision available.......Texas. The rest will follow form. The SEC takes the other remaining value of the old SWC by adding Texas Tech and TCU and West Virginia as #4.
The PAC then gets Iowa State, Oklahoma State, Kansas State and Oklahoma.
What this does is gives the PAC/B1G all of the old Big 8 schools and the SEC has all of the value of the old SWC.
Baylor moves to the American.
Actually X, what I would see happening should Vanderbilt depart for the ACC would be the additions of Texas, Texas Tech, and Kansas. Missouri would stay.
Then Oklahoma, Oklahoma State, Iowa State. and Kansas State could head to the PAC if the PAC wanted them.
West Virginia would join Vanderbilt in the ACC
JR, in order for everyone to live happily ever-after (or 20 years) the B1G will have to be accommodated....Missouri is a small price to pay and they really don't "fit" in your conference (no offense to Medic).
Let's see how that would look. I have thought in the past that the best division would be Old Big 8 to the North and SWC to the South. Substitute the West for part of the Old Big 8 and it has a logic.
SEC:
Texas, Texas A&M, T.C.U., Texas Tech
Arkansas, Louisiana State, Mississippi, Mississippi State
Alabama, Auburn, Kentucky, Tennessee
Florida, Georgia, South Carolina, West Virginia
ACC:
Boston College, Notre Dame, Pittsburgh, Syracuse
Louisville, Vanderbilt, Virginia, Virginia Tech
Duke, North Carolina, N.C. State, Wake Forest
Clemson, Florida State, Georgia Tech, Miami
Big 10:
Maryland, Ohio State, Penn State, Rutgers
Indiana, Michigan, Michigan State, Purdue
Illinois, Minnesota, Northwestern, Wisconsin
Iowa, Kansas, Missouri, Nebraska
PAC:
Iowa State, Kansas State, Oklahoma, Oklahoma State
Arizona, Arizona State, Colorado, Utah
California, Cal Los Angeles, Southern Cal, Stanford
Oregon, Oregon State, Washington, Washington State
And X, if this did happen Notre Dame would go all in because we would have a champs only format.
That's worthy of contemplation, JR.