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In 1998, the Sun Belt contained 8 members with 4 travel pairings:

Florida International/South Alabama
Western Kentucky/Arkansas State
Little Rock/Louisiana Tech
Louisiana/New Orleans

Sun Belt then added Denver as a 9th.

Which of the 8 institutions did this benefit?

The following year, the Sun Belt added MTSU/UNT/NMSU so it wasn’t like today’s WAC where they were desperate for numbers.
(07-25-2018 05:14 PM)IWokeUpLikeThis Wrote: [ -> ]In 1998, the Sun Belt contained 8 members with 4 travel pairings:

Florida International/South Alabama
Western Kentucky/Arkansas State
Little Rock/Louisiana Tech
Louisiana/New Orleans

Sun Belt then added Denver as a 9th.

Which of the 8 institutions did this benefit?

The following year, the Sun Belt added MTSU/UNT/NMSU so it wasn’t like today’s WAC where they were desperate for numbers.

Denver was added for a bridge to California to form the Sun belch western wing
The Big West dropped fb shortly after. NMSU and North Texas were added the next year. Denver might have been added as to show openness to the west and future anticipated Big West schools like Idaho and Utah State, which later joined for fb only. Sun Belt Fb was very iffy then as many schools like La Tech wanted out.

At the time, Denver was said to have cable TV connections. Denver was a transitional DI then.
(07-25-2018 05:49 PM)NoDak Wrote: [ -> ]At the time, Denver was said to have cable TV connections. Denver was a transitional DI then.

That is what I remember. I don't have access to the details, but there was potential for a TV deal if Denver was brought aboard.

Denver is in a bit of a quandary. They're private (originally Methodist). If they were in California, they'd be a lock for the WCC. Their best sports are hockey and lacrosse. That fits well in any number of Eastern-based conferences, but not so much in the West or Midwest. (I know hockey has their own set of leagues, but there are very few Western hockey schools)

But Denver and the Sun Belt???? That was never a good match. I know they were new to D-1, but the Sun Belt was never the right place for them.
(07-25-2018 05:17 PM)billybobby777 Wrote: [ -> ]
(07-25-2018 05:14 PM)IWokeUpLikeThis Wrote: [ -> ]In 1998, the Sun Belt contained 8 members with 4 travel pairings:

Florida International/South Alabama
Western Kentucky/Arkansas State
Little Rock/Louisiana Tech
Louisiana/New Orleans

Sun Belt then added Denver as a 9th.

Which of the 8 institutions did this benefit?

The following year, the Sun Belt added MTSU/UNT/NMSU so it wasn’t like today’s WAC where they were desperate for numbers.

Denver was added for a bridge to California to form the Sun belch western wing

Utah St might have been their Olympic sports travel partner had this plan worked.
When NMSU was in, Denver made sense as a Sun Belt member. When NMSU left, Denver began to get serious flack.

Ironically, Denver didn’t have that many sports that the Sun Belt had. Mbb, Wbb, m soccer, w soccer, VB. Their marquee sports of hockey, m lax, w lax, M&W skiing, gymnastics.
I would look like this. How many schools can the SBC get if they decide to add more?

Denver, if they kept football, they would be there which Utah State and New Mexico State could be in for all sports along with Idaho.

Jacksonville dropped down putting their football in the Pioneer League. They used to give scholarships for football at one point.

Lamar, they could still be in when SBC added North Texas and then other schools in Texas. Is there hard feelings between the SBC members after Lamar left?

New Mexico State could be in for all sports. West Texas A&M could be a future member after they move up and play in FCS for a bit.

New Orleans was supposed to add football back in 2015. They pushed the start date up whenever they decide to start the program.

UTRGV wants to be in FBS again. They would give some bridge.

VCU, they would be plucked away anyways.

Idaho would have stayed in FBS if they could have a conference.

New Jersey Tech could add a northern presence to try and lure schools like James Madison, maybe a Stony Brook?

Utah State with Denver, but the MWC would still grab them.

Hartwick of D3 should move up to D2 and then D1.

Howard U. might go if a school like Florida A&M and Tennessee State moves up. They say the HBCUs might come up together to FBS to help keep some HBCU flavor in some of their games.

UTA should re-start their football program.

Little Rock should re-start their football.

Chattanooga, Eastern kentucky, North Alabama, Jacksonville State, Sam Houston State, SFA, James Madison, Delaware, Richmond, Youngstown State and some others could be options. There are schools that would love to be in FBS right now.

I bet Lamar is regretting of leaving the SBC back then because now they do not have an easy access to FBS like South Alabama did.
Idaho was planning on joining the sunbelt for all sports as well before the WAC opened up. The goal was for a western sun belt wing


http://m.govandals.com/mobile/ViewArticl..._ID=17100&
Utah St and Idaho stayed in the Big West for Olympics for a few years, before the Big West commish got the bright idea to become a bus league to save on cost. Utah St and especially Idaho had the good fortune that the WAC opened up. NMSU also left the Belt then, as they were a full member for a few years.
Big West could have been a bus league in college football.

UC-Davis
Cal. Poly
Long Beach State
Fullerton State
Pacific
University of San Diego
st. Mary's
UC-Riverside
CSU-LA.
UC-Santa Barbara
Hawaii for all sports
Sacramento State
Santa Clara
UNR until a spot opened up in the WAC for them.
UC-San Diego
UC-Irvine said they might look into adding the sport in the future.

All these big California schools without football is bad news.
Want a guess or the actual answer? :)

The actual answer is that the Sun Belt had been pursuing members who could make the league a football league and had no success. NIU had been part of the pact to form a football league but had returned to the MAC. CUSA and WAC had scooped up the regional independents.

Commissioner Craig Thompson advised the presidents that he did not believe they would be able to secure the needed schools and suggested that they consider adding non-football schools based on market size.

Texas Pan-American had "withdrawn" after learning the votes were there to expel. Jacksonville withdrew to join the TAAC/ASun and Lamar left to join the Southland.

The Sun Belt was down to 7 members.

The suggestion was to add Florida International and Denver, the Denver attraction was market, academics and the hope that having several major corporate people on the Denver board (United Airlines, Coors, and Coca Cola as I recall) would help gain some sponsorships.

Denver and FIU were added at the same time. The Sun Belt waived FIU's entry fee to permit the Panthers to pay the TAAC exit fee and allow them to enter immediately.
(07-25-2018 07:43 PM)DavidSt Wrote: [ -> ]Big West could have been a bus league in college football.

UC-Davis
Cal. Poly
Long Beach State
Fullerton State
Pacific
University of San Diego
st. Mary's
UC-Riverside
CSU-LA.
UC-Santa Barbara
Hawaii for all sports
Sacramento State
Santa Clara
UNR until a spot opened up in the WAC for them.
UC-San Diego
UC-Irvine said they might look into adding the sport in the future.

All these big California schools without football is bad news.

03-no
(07-26-2018 09:54 AM)BePcr07 Wrote: [ -> ]
(07-25-2018 07:43 PM)DavidSt Wrote: [ -> ]Big West could have been a bus league in college football.

UC-Davis
Cal. Poly
Long Beach State
Fullerton State
Pacific
University of San Diego
st. Mary's
UC-Riverside
CSU-LA.
UC-Santa Barbara
Hawaii for all sports
Sacramento State
Santa Clara
UNR until a spot opened up in the WAC for them.
UC-San Diego
UC-Irvine said they might look into adding the sport in the future.

All these big California schools without football is bad news.

03-no

I heard they're building a tunnel...
(07-25-2018 07:19 PM)DavidSt Wrote: [ -> ]I would look like this. How many schools can the SBC get if they decide to add more?

Denver, if they kept football, they would be there which Utah State and New Mexico State could be in for all sports along with Idaho.

Jacksonville dropped down putting their football in the Pioneer League. They used to give scholarships for football at one point.

Lamar, they could still be in when SBC added North Texas and then other schools in Texas. Is there hard feelings between the SBC members after Lamar left?

New Mexico State could be in for all sports. West Texas A&M could be a future member after they move up and play in FCS for a bit.

New Orleans was supposed to add football back in 2015. They pushed the start date up whenever they decide to start the program.

UTRGV wants to be in FBS again. They would give some bridge.

VCU, they would be plucked away anyways.

Idaho would have stayed in FBS if they could have a conference.

New Jersey Tech could add a northern presence to try and lure schools like James Madison, maybe a Stony Brook?

Utah State with Denver, but the MWC would still grab them.

Hartwick of D3 should move up to D2 and then D1.

Howard U. might go if a school like Florida A&M and Tennessee State moves up. They say the HBCUs might come up together to FBS to help keep some HBCU flavor in some of their games.

UTA should re-start their football program.

Little Rock should re-start their football.

Chattanooga, Eastern kentucky, North Alabama, Jacksonville State, Sam Houston State, SFA, James Madison, Delaware, Richmond, Youngstown State and some others could be options. There are schools that would love to be in FBS right now.

I bet Lamar is regretting of leaving the SBC back then because now they do not have an easy access to FBS like South Alabama did.


What is a Hartwick, and where is it located? I will bet the house Hartwick is never D1.


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk
(07-26-2018 11:48 AM)Jjoey52 Wrote: [ -> ]What is a Hartwick, and where is it located? I will bet the house Hartwick is never D1.
Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk

Hartwick College is a small liberal arts school (1,100 students) in central New York state. For a while in the 1970s and 80s they were a power in soccer (won a natty in 1977). They were a division 3 school grandfathered into division 1 for men's soccer and women's water polo. They hosted the National Soccer Hall of Fame from 1979-2010. They've recently been playing in the Sun Belt Conference and have been doing OK.

But in March they decided to put men's soccer in d3 and drop water polo.
A money thing, you know.

*small world: I knew a guy a couple years ahead of me in high school who went to Hartwick to play soccer. I had the same reaction: "What's Hartwick?"
Richmond would not be an option to go FBS. Their stadium is only 8,000 seats, and that is after they left the old and dilapidated City Stadium which seats around 20-22k. So they went from a stadium that has the size to be FBS eligible to one that is very far from it. Doesn't seem to be the type of thing an administration would do if they had FBS ambitions.
(07-26-2018 11:48 AM)Jjoey52 Wrote: [ -> ]
(07-25-2018 07:19 PM)DavidSt Wrote: [ -> ]I would look like this. How many schools can the SBC get if they decide to add more?

Denver, if they kept football, they would be there which Utah State and New Mexico State could be in for all sports along with Idaho.

Jacksonville dropped down putting their football in the Pioneer League. They used to give scholarships for football at one point.

Lamar, they could still be in when SBC added North Texas and then other schools in Texas. Is there hard feelings between the SBC members after Lamar left?

New Mexico State could be in for all sports. West Texas A&M could be a future member after they move up and play in FCS for a bit.

New Orleans was supposed to add football back in 2015. They pushed the start date up whenever they decide to start the program.

UTRGV wants to be in FBS again. They would give some bridge.

VCU, they would be plucked away anyways.

Idaho would have stayed in FBS if they could have a conference.

New Jersey Tech could add a northern presence to try and lure schools like James Madison, maybe a Stony Brook?

Utah State with Denver, but the MWC would still grab them.

Hartwick of D3 should move up to D2 and then D1.

Howard U. might go if a school like Florida A&M and Tennessee State moves up. They say the HBCUs might come up together to FBS to help keep some HBCU flavor in some of their games.

UTA should re-start their football program.

Little Rock should re-start their football.

Chattanooga, Eastern kentucky, North Alabama, Jacksonville State, Sam Houston State, SFA, James Madison, Delaware, Richmond, Youngstown State and some others could be options. There are schools that would love to be in FBS right now.

I bet Lamar is regretting of leaving the SBC back then because now they do not have an easy access to FBS like South Alabama did.


What is a Hartwick, and where is it located? I will bet the house Hartwick is never D1.


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk

D3 school in Oneonta, NY. They had D1 soccer in the Sun Belt until this year when they dropped it to D3 due to costs. Again David doesn't know what he's talking about
(07-26-2018 02:20 PM)seaking4steel Wrote: [ -> ]
(07-26-2018 11:48 AM)Jjoey52 Wrote: [ -> ]
(07-25-2018 07:19 PM)DavidSt Wrote: [ -> ]I would look like this. How many schools can the SBC get if they decide to add more?

Denver, if they kept football, they would be there which Utah State and New Mexico State could be in for all sports along with Idaho.

Jacksonville dropped down putting their football in the Pioneer League. They used to give scholarships for football at one point.

Lamar, they could still be in when SBC added North Texas and then other schools in Texas. Is there hard feelings between the SBC members after Lamar left?

New Mexico State could be in for all sports. West Texas A&M could be a future member after they move up and play in FCS for a bit.

New Orleans was supposed to add football back in 2015. They pushed the start date up whenever they decide to start the program.

UTRGV wants to be in FBS again. They would give some bridge.

VCU, they would be plucked away anyways.

Idaho would have stayed in FBS if they could have a conference.

New Jersey Tech could add a northern presence to try and lure schools like James Madison, maybe a Stony Brook?

Utah State with Denver, but the MWC would still grab them.

Hartwick of D3 should move up to D2 and then D1.

Howard U. might go if a school like Florida A&M and Tennessee State moves up. They say the HBCUs might come up together to FBS to help keep some HBCU flavor in some of their games.

UTA should re-start their football program.

Little Rock should re-start their football.

Chattanooga, Eastern kentucky, North Alabama, Jacksonville State, Sam Houston State, SFA, James Madison, Delaware, Richmond, Youngstown State and some others could be options. There are schools that would love to be in FBS right now.

I bet Lamar is regretting of leaving the SBC back then because now they do not have an easy access to FBS like South Alabama did.


What is a Hartwick, and where is it located? I will bet the house Hartwick is never D1.


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk

D3 school in Oneonta, NY. They had D1 soccer in the Sun Belt until this year when they dropped it to D3 due to costs. Again David doesn't know what he's talking about


Back before the split in sports, they were considered one of the major football schools in the early 1900s with MIT and the others who left for D3. Mount Ida was another school that was a major football team back then. The reason they dropped to D3 and dropped water polo because they are in a budget crisis as well. They could not keep D1 sports anymore.

As for Hawaii, I did not say for them to be bused. They could be in the Big West for all sports including football because they do not have to travel outside of the two states except for OOC games. More for them to do for budget reasons.
(07-26-2018 03:03 PM)DavidSt Wrote: [ -> ]Back before the split in sports, they were considered one of the major football schools in the early 1900s with MIT and the others who left for D3. Mount Ida was another school that was a major football team back then. The reason they dropped to D3 and dropped water polo because they are in a budget crisis as well. They could not keep D1 sports anymore.

They haven't been relevant in any sport in 40 years. The college has an enrollment of only 1,200 students. You admit they have a budget problem which caused them to drop their last D1 sports yet you still think they have D1 potential.
(07-26-2018 11:48 AM)Jjoey52 Wrote: [ -> ]
(07-25-2018 07:19 PM)DavidSt Wrote: [ -> ]I would look like this. How many schools can the SBC get if they decide to add more?

Denver, if they kept football, they would be there which Utah State and New Mexico State could be in for all sports along with Idaho.

Jacksonville dropped down putting their football in the Pioneer League. They used to give scholarships for football at one point.

Lamar, they could still be in when SBC added North Texas and then other schools in Texas. Is there hard feelings between the SBC members after Lamar left?

New Mexico State could be in for all sports. West Texas A&M could be a future member after they move up and play in FCS for a bit.

New Orleans was supposed to add football back in 2015. They pushed the start date up whenever they decide to start the program.

UTRGV wants to be in FBS again. They would give some bridge.

VCU, they would be plucked away anyways.

Idaho would have stayed in FBS if they could have a conference.

New Jersey Tech could add a northern presence to try and lure schools like James Madison, maybe a Stony Brook?

Utah State with Denver, but the MWC would still grab them.

Hartwick of D3 should move up to D2 and then D1.

Howard U. might go if a school like Florida A&M and Tennessee State moves up. They say the HBCUs might come up together to FBS to help keep some HBCU flavor in some of their games.

UTA should re-start their football program.

Little Rock should re-start their football.

Chattanooga, Eastern kentucky, North Alabama, Jacksonville State, Sam Houston State, SFA, James Madison, Delaware, Richmond, Youngstown State and some others could be options. There are schools that would love to be in FBS right now.

I bet Lamar is regretting of leaving the SBC back then because now they do not have an easy access to FBS like South Alabama did.


What is a Hartwick, and where is it located? I will bet the house Hartwick is never D1.


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk

Hartwick at least exists. One can't say the same for "New Jersey Tech."
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