(06-13-2017 06:52 AM)Smith Wrote: [ -> ] (06-08-2017 09:33 PM)Tiger1983 Wrote: [ -> ]The CA's story on the schedule follows:
http://www.commercialappeal.com/story/sp...381394001/
The article reminded me that our SMU defeat under Tubby was the worst in 70 years.
It reminded me of who was on that team that is not on this team. Addition by subtraction.
I assume you mean the Lawson kids and not all the transferred players (including the ones recruited and/or praised by Tubby). If so, Tubby aggravated Keelon by elevating his son, Saul and then failed (unsurprisingly) to adequately motivate and manage the Lawson's. Tubby's squandered opportunity is now KU's gain.
Subtraction results in less and we have less talent and less experience than last year and it all stems from Tubby's nepotism and from Tubby's failure to recruit at a high level last year and this year.
Tiger fans should brace for a rough year (eg, a losing conference record per CA writer), but it did not have to be that way. A coach making the right decisions and exhibiting drive and ambition could have had us looking forward to next basketball season in a similar manner we are looking forward to football season.
(06-12-2017 06:12 PM)memtigbb Wrote: [ -> ] (06-12-2017 03:57 PM)Tiger87 Wrote: [ -> ] (06-08-2017 10:51 PM)memtigbb Wrote: [ -> ] (06-08-2017 10:46 PM)bluebacker Wrote: [ -> ]14-17 (6-12)
No way... did you read the RPI's of most of those teams? We will win 20+ games easily. If not Tubby needs to be ran out of town.
Wow. So after putting down the coaches and recruits for months now, you think it's the best season in 4 years? Trending up!
It took an absolute collapse to not win 20 last season and that was with the Lawson's killing the team (as is said on this board over and over). I have said all along that there was no chance at all that we would have a losing season this year. I have said time and time again we should have a 20 win season with the crappy schedule we have, same as we should have had a 20 win season last year.
So compared to the end of Pastner's tenure...trending up!
I mean last year was a better record than the previous 2, and you're saying this year will be better than that.
So even with losing all these great players, and the mediocre recruiting and lack of a competent staff, we're getting better.
(06-12-2017 09:22 PM)memtigbb Wrote: [ -> ] (06-12-2017 03:57 PM)Tiger87 Wrote: [ -> ] (06-08-2017 10:51 PM)memtigbb Wrote: [ -> ] (06-08-2017 10:46 PM)bluebacker Wrote: [ -> ]14-17 (6-12)
No way... did you read the RPI's of most of those teams? We will win 20+ games easily. If not Tubby needs to be ran out of town.
Wow. So after putting down the coaches and recruits for months now, you think it's the best season in 4 years? Trending up!
Just out of curiosity, can you link where I have been "putting down" the recruits?
Maybe overall I have commented about the level of recruiting, but as far as putting down any individual recruit, I would be suprised.
Maybe I'm wrong. Haven't you made comments about the mediocre recruiting? The lack of high recruiting based on rankings? The underwhelming performance of the staff in recruiting?
Sorry, I didn't mean specific recruits. I meant you've just put down the recruits as a whole. But maybe I'm wrong.
As long as we don't get burnt by Siena...
(06-13-2017 02:45 PM)Tiger87 Wrote: [ -> ] (06-12-2017 06:12 PM)memtigbb Wrote: [ -> ] (06-12-2017 03:57 PM)Tiger87 Wrote: [ -> ] (06-08-2017 10:51 PM)memtigbb Wrote: [ -> ] (06-08-2017 10:46 PM)bluebacker Wrote: [ -> ]14-17 (6-12)
No way... did you read the RPI's of most of those teams? We will win 20+ games easily. If not Tubby needs to be ran out of town.
Wow. So after putting down the coaches and recruits for months now, you think it's the best season in 4 years? Trending up!
It took an absolute collapse to not win 20 last season and that was with the Lawson's killing the team (as is said on this board over and over). I have said all along that there was no chance at all that we would have a losing season this year. I have said time and time again we should have a 20 win season with the crappy schedule we have, same as we should have had a 20 win season last year.
So compared to the end of Pastner's tenure...trending up!
I mean last year was a better record than the previous 2, and you're saying this year will be better than that.
So even with losing all these great players, and the mediocre recruiting and lack of a competent staff, we're getting better.
This may be very difficult for you to understand so I will try and break it down in an example that you might can grasp...
Chuck Stobart had 3 straight 6-5 seasons. In my opinion his 6-5 seasons were some of the best I have seen in football mainly because of the competition we face during those seasons. Now, he might have been able to win 8 or 9 games if he dumbed down his schedule and you probably would have thought he was the greatest coach of all time. Tubby is playing an incredibly weak schedule so winning 20 games is like winning 13 games vs a good schedule.
(06-13-2017 06:55 AM)Tiger1983 Wrote: [ -> ] (06-13-2017 12:46 AM)snowtiger Wrote: [ -> ] (06-12-2017 08:22 PM)bluebacker Wrote: [ -> ] (06-12-2017 06:54 PM)UofMemphis Wrote: [ -> ]LNov. 10 vs. Alabama (19-15; RPI: 82) in Annapolis, Md. as part of Veterans Classic
WNov. 14 vs. Arkansas-Little Rock (15-17; 241)
WNov. 21 vs. New Orleans (20-12; 161)
LNov. 25 vs. Northern Kentucky (24-11; 85)
WNov. 30 at UAB (17-16; 199)
WDec. 2 vs. Mercer (15-16; 196)
LDec. 16 vs. Louisville (25-9; 11) at Madison Square Garden
WDec. 28 vs. LSU (10-21; 195)
WTBA vs. Albany (21-14; 146)
WTBA vs. Bryant (12-20; 280)
WTBA vs. Siena (17-17; 129)
WTBA vs. Loyola (Md.) (16-17; 200)
WTBA vs. Samford (20-16; 170)
-----AAC PLAY-----
LTBA vs. Wichita State (31-5; 29)
LTBA vs. Houston (21-11; 62)
LTBA at SMU (30-5; 16)
LTBA at Temple (16-16; 134)
LTBA at Cincinnati (30-6; 12)
LTBA vs. Cincinnati
LTBA at UConn (16-17; 121)
LTBA vs. UConn
WTBA vs. UCF (24-12; 64)
LTBA at UCF
LTBA at Tulsa (15-17; 139)
WTBA vs. Tulsa
WTBA vs. USF (7-23; 317)
WTBA at USF
WTBA vs. ECU (15-18; 214)
WTBA at ECU
WTBA vs. Tulane (6-25; 292)
WTBA at Tulane
18-13 (8-10 AAC)...that's my guess.
Very reasonable. the 4 additional losses I have are New Orleans, @UAB, UCF, and @ECU. Otherwise the same.
Some losses are expected and respectable. I would really like to steal a victory.
I see three additional defeats - UCF, @UAB, Tulsa.
Do you see any additional wins?
Do you think we are going to lose to every top 100 RPI team we play and lose to 199 UAB?
(06-15-2017 11:07 PM)memtigbb Wrote: [ -> ] (06-13-2017 02:45 PM)Tiger87 Wrote: [ -> ] (06-12-2017 06:12 PM)memtigbb Wrote: [ -> ] (06-12-2017 03:57 PM)Tiger87 Wrote: [ -> ] (06-08-2017 10:51 PM)memtigbb Wrote: [ -> ]No way... did you read the RPI's of most of those teams? We will win 20+ games easily. If not Tubby needs to be ran out of town.
Wow. So after putting down the coaches and recruits for months now, you think it's the best season in 4 years? Trending up!
It took an absolute collapse to not win 20 last season and that was with the Lawson's killing the team (as is said on this board over and over). I have said all along that there was no chance at all that we would have a losing season this year. I have said time and time again we should have a 20 win season with the crappy schedule we have, same as we should have had a 20 win season last year.
So compared to the end of Pastner's tenure...trending up!
I mean last year was a better record than the previous 2, and you're saying this year will be better than that.
So even with losing all these great players, and the mediocre recruiting and lack of a competent staff, we're getting better.
This may be very difficult for you to understand so I will try and break it down in an example that you might can grasp...
Chuck Stobart had 3 straight 6-5 seasons. In my opinion his 6-5 seasons were some of the best I have seen in football mainly because of the competition we face during those seasons. Now, he might have been able to win 8 or 9 games if he dumbed down his schedule and you probably would have thought he was the greatest coach of all time. Tubby is playing an incredibly weak schedule so winning 20 games is like winning 13 games vs a good schedule.
Ah. So you're saying the improved record last year over the prior two, and your improving record forecast for next year - is a factor of "dumbing down the schedule".
So you're not optimistic. You're just wrong.
KenPom SOS rankings:
2015 - 101
2016 - 98
2017 - 101
Sagarin SOS:
2015 - 111
2016 - 105
2017 - 93
RPI (can't find all SOS rankings, but the overall RPI is basically a SOS measurement):
2015 - 127
2016 - 138
2017 - 101
So Tubby's schedule last year was at worst similar to Pastner's last 2 years. At best, it was decently improved.
Now next year may be a step back in SOS rankings. But with the non-con announced, and the probable increase within conference, it probably continues to slightly increase in difficulty.
(06-16-2017 01:08 PM)Tiger87 Wrote: [ -> ] (06-15-2017 11:07 PM)memtigbb Wrote: [ -> ] (06-13-2017 02:45 PM)Tiger87 Wrote: [ -> ] (06-12-2017 06:12 PM)memtigbb Wrote: [ -> ] (06-12-2017 03:57 PM)Tiger87 Wrote: [ -> ]Wow. So after putting down the coaches and recruits for months now, you think it's the best season in 4 years? Trending up!
It took an absolute collapse to not win 20 last season and that was with the Lawson's killing the team (as is said on this board over and over). I have said all along that there was no chance at all that we would have a losing season this year. I have said time and time again we should have a 20 win season with the crappy schedule we have, same as we should have had a 20 win season last year.
So compared to the end of Pastner's tenure...trending up!
I mean last year was a better record than the previous 2, and you're saying this year will be better than that.
So even with losing all these great players, and the mediocre recruiting and lack of a competent staff, we're getting better.
This may be very difficult for you to understand so I will try and break it down in an example that you might can grasp...
Chuck Stobart had 3 straight 6-5 seasons. In my opinion his 6-5 seasons were some of the best I have seen in football mainly because of the competition we face during those seasons. Now, he might have been able to win 8 or 9 games if he dumbed down his schedule and you probably would have thought he was the greatest coach of all time. Tubby is playing an incredibly weak schedule so winning 20 games is like winning 13 games vs a good schedule.
Ah. So you're saying the improved record last year over the prior two, and your improving record forecast for next year - is a factor of "dumbing down the schedule".
So you're not optimistic. You're just wrong.
KenPom SOS rankings:
2015 - 101
2016 - 98
2017 - 101
Sagarin SOS:
2015 - 111
2016 - 105
2017 - 93
RPI (can't find all SOS rankings, but the overall RPI is basically a SOS measurement):
2015 - 127
2016 - 138
2017 - 101
So Tubby's schedule last year was at worst similar to Pastner's last 2 years. At best, it was decently improved.
Now next year may be a step back in SOS rankings. But with the non-con announced, and the probable increase within conference, it probably continues to slightly increase in difficulty.
Yeah, the correct phrasing might be a more balance schedule. I don't know. It's hard to really justify that its weaker.
(06-15-2017 11:07 PM)memtigbb Wrote: [ -> ] (06-13-2017 02:45 PM)Tiger87 Wrote: [ -> ] (06-12-2017 06:12 PM)memtigbb Wrote: [ -> ] (06-12-2017 03:57 PM)Tiger87 Wrote: [ -> ] (06-08-2017 10:51 PM)memtigbb Wrote: [ -> ]No way... did you read the RPI's of most of those teams? We will win 20+ games easily. If not Tubby needs to be ran out of town.
Wow. So after putting down the coaches and recruits for months now, you think it's the best season in 4 years? Trending up!
It took an absolute collapse to not win 20 last season and that was with the Lawson's killing the team (as is said on this board over and over). I have said all along that there was no chance at all that we would have a losing season this year. I have said time and time again we should have a 20 win season with the crappy schedule we have, same as we should have had a 20 win season last year.
So compared to the end of Pastner's tenure...trending up!
I mean last year was a better record than the previous 2, and you're saying this year will be better than that.
So even with losing all these great players, and the mediocre recruiting and lack of a competent staff, we're getting better.
This may be very difficult for you to understand so I will try and break it down in an example that you might can grasp...
Chuck Stobart had 3 straight 6-5 seasons. In my opinion his 6-5 seasons were some of the best I have seen in football mainly because of the competition we face during those seasons. Now, he might have been able to win 8 or 9 games if he dumbed down his schedule and you probably would have thought he was the greatest coach of all time. Tubby is playing an incredibly weak schedule so winning 20 games is like winning 13 games vs a good schedule.
Where have you been? The MBB schedule - especially the home OOC schedule, has been woefully weak through virtually the entire period since when JP began doing the scheduling. Some of you guys who are continually pounding on Tubby seem to have such a focus on 'all things are Tubby's fault', 'Tubby's the wrong guy', etc, etc that you don't seem to be able to look at any aspect of the MBB program objectively. Maybe another approach might work better for the program - support it, the players, the recruits & the coaching staff. I always thought that is what fans did - JMO.
(06-16-2017 09:20 AM)macgar32 Wrote: [ -> ] (06-13-2017 06:55 AM)Tiger1983 Wrote: [ -> ] (06-13-2017 12:46 AM)snowtiger Wrote: [ -> ] (06-12-2017 08:22 PM)bluebacker Wrote: [ -> ] (06-12-2017 06:54 PM)UofMemphis Wrote: [ -> ]LNov. 10 vs. Alabama (19-15; RPI: 82) in Annapolis, Md. as part of Veterans Classic
WNov. 14 vs. Arkansas-Little Rock (15-17; 241)
WNov. 21 vs. New Orleans (20-12; 161)
LNov. 25 vs. Northern Kentucky (24-11; 85)
WNov. 30 at UAB (17-16; 199)
WDec. 2 vs. Mercer (15-16; 196)
LDec. 16 vs. Louisville (25-9; 11) at Madison Square Garden
WDec. 28 vs. LSU (10-21; 195)
WTBA vs. Albany (21-14; 146)
WTBA vs. Bryant (12-20; 280)
WTBA vs. Siena (17-17; 129)
WTBA vs. Loyola (Md.) (16-17; 200)
WTBA vs. Samford (20-16; 170)
-----AAC PLAY-----
LTBA vs. Wichita State (31-5; 29)
LTBA vs. Houston (21-11; 62)
LTBA at SMU (30-5; 16)
LTBA at Temple (16-16; 134)
LTBA at Cincinnati (30-6; 12)
LTBA vs. Cincinnati
LTBA at UConn (16-17; 121)
LTBA vs. UConn
WTBA vs. UCF (24-12; 64)
LTBA at UCF
LTBA at Tulsa (15-17; 139)
WTBA vs. Tulsa
WTBA vs. USF (7-23; 317)
WTBA at USF
WTBA vs. ECU (15-18; 214)
WTBA at ECU
WTBA vs. Tulane (6-25; 292)
WTBA at Tulane
18-13 (8-10 AAC)...that's my guess.
Very reasonable. the 4 additional losses I have are New Orleans, @UAB, UCF, and @ECU. Otherwise the same.
Some losses are expected and respectable. I would really like to steal a victory.
I see three additional defeats - UCF, @UAB, Tulsa.
Do you see any additional wins?
Do you think we are going to lose to every top 100 RPI team we play and lose to 199 UAB?
On paper the team is going to be horrible, and not this isn't a slam at the players for two reasons...
1. It's not their fault, they can only be expected to perform at their level of ranking.
2. It isn't just that we have only 2 players returning, it is the fact that none of the players are highly ranked, whenever you have all new faces it takes a while for players to get it, first year players take a long time to adjust and Juco players almost never play well their first season
I wouldn't be surprised if we win 10 games and I wouldn't be surprised if we win 20 games. On paper almost every team we play will be better than us.
(06-16-2017 03:39 PM)Atlanta Wrote: [ -> ] (06-15-2017 11:07 PM)memtigbb Wrote: [ -> ] (06-13-2017 02:45 PM)Tiger87 Wrote: [ -> ] (06-12-2017 06:12 PM)memtigbb Wrote: [ -> ] (06-12-2017 03:57 PM)Tiger87 Wrote: [ -> ]Wow. So after putting down the coaches and recruits for months now, you think it's the best season in 4 years? Trending up!
It took an absolute collapse to not win 20 last season and that was with the Lawson's killing the team (as is said on this board over and over). I have said all along that there was no chance at all that we would have a losing season this year. I have said time and time again we should have a 20 win season with the crappy schedule we have, same as we should have had a 20 win season last year.
So compared to the end of Pastner's tenure...trending up!
I mean last year was a better record than the previous 2, and you're saying this year will be better than that.
So even with losing all these great players, and the mediocre recruiting and lack of a competent staff, we're getting better.
This may be very difficult for you to understand so I will try and break it down in an example that you might can grasp...
Chuck Stobart had 3 straight 6-5 seasons. In my opinion his 6-5 seasons were some of the best I have seen in football mainly because of the competition we face during those seasons. Now, he might have been able to win 8 or 9 games if he dumbed down his schedule and you probably would have thought he was the greatest coach of all time. Tubby is playing an incredibly weak schedule so winning 20 games is like winning 13 games vs a good schedule.
Where have you been? The MBB schedule - especially the home OOC schedule, has been woefully weak through virtually the entire period since when JP began doing the scheduling. Some of you guys who are continually pounding on Tubby seem to have such a focus on 'all things are Tubby's fault', 'Tubby's the wrong guy', etc, etc that you don't seem to be able to look at any aspect of the MBB program objectively. Maybe another approach might work better for the program - support it, the players, the recruits & the coaching staff. I always thought that is what fans did - JMO.
This is the last time I am responding on this thread since it is clear you guys just want to argue...
We SHOULD HAVE WON 20 GAMES LAST SEASON!
WE SHOULD HAVE WON 20 GAMES THE SEASON BEFORE!
WE SHOULD WIN 20 GAMES THIS SEASON!
The past handful of schedules have been AWFUL!
I am not saying this scedule is WORSE THAN THE PAST HANDFUL!!! (QUOTE ME ON WHERE I COMPARED THIS SCHEDULE TO ANY OTHER SCHEDULE) NOT ONE TIME DID I SAY THAT. I SAID THIS YEAR'S SCHEDULE IS TERRIBLE! THAT IS COMPLETELY INDEPENDANT OF ANY OTHER YEAR'S SCHEDULE! But you 3 guys are so busy trying so hard to argue every little thing to show your undying love for all things TUBBY (IN TUBBY WE TRUST) that you are just making up things to argue and attack posters about.
IN FACT, if you actually do go back and read my posts, I HAVE DEFENDED TUBBY ABOUT THE SCHEDULE. This crap schedule is NOT HIS FAULT. This is needing 18 home games, and this is Pastner doing his best to ensure 20 wins. A lot of games and deals are made years in advance, Tubby hasn't had time to really affect the schedule. But carry on with your attacking and arguing.
(06-16-2017 04:35 PM)memtigbb Wrote: [ -> ] (06-16-2017 03:39 PM)Atlanta Wrote: [ -> ] (06-15-2017 11:07 PM)memtigbb Wrote: [ -> ] (06-13-2017 02:45 PM)Tiger87 Wrote: [ -> ] (06-12-2017 06:12 PM)memtigbb Wrote: [ -> ]It took an absolute collapse to not win 20 last season and that was with the Lawson's killing the team (as is said on this board over and over). I have said all along that there was no chance at all that we would have a losing season this year. I have said time and time again we should have a 20 win season with the crappy schedule we have, same as we should have had a 20 win season last year.
So compared to the end of Pastner's tenure...trending up!
I mean last year was a better record than the previous 2, and you're saying this year will be better than that.
So even with losing all these great players, and the mediocre recruiting and lack of a competent staff, we're getting better.
This may be very difficult for you to understand so I will try and break it down in an example that you might can grasp...
Chuck Stobart had 3 straight 6-5 seasons. In my opinion his 6-5 seasons were some of the best I have seen in football mainly because of the competition we face during those seasons. Now, he might have been able to win 8 or 9 games if he dumbed down his schedule and you probably would have thought he was the greatest coach of all time. Tubby is playing an incredibly weak schedule so winning 20 games is like winning 13 games vs a good schedule.
Where have you been? The MBB schedule - especially the home OOC schedule, has been woefully weak through virtually the entire period since when JP began doing the scheduling. Some of you guys who are continually pounding on Tubby seem to have such a focus on 'all things are Tubby's fault', 'Tubby's the wrong guy', etc, etc that you don't seem to be able to look at any aspect of the MBB program objectively. Maybe another approach might work better for the program - support it, the players, the recruits & the coaching staff. I always thought that is what fans did - JMO.
This is the last time I am responding on this thread since it is clear you guys just want to argue...
We SHOULD HAVE WON 20 GAMES LAST SEASON!
WE SHOULD HAVE WON 20 GAMES THE SEASON BEFORE!
WE SHOULD WIN 20 GAMES THIS SEASON!
The past handful of schedules have been AWFUL!
I am not saying this scedule is WORSE THAN THE PAST HANDFUL!!! (QUOTE ME ON WHERE I COMPARED THIS SCHEDULE TO ANY OTHER SCHEDULE) NOT ONE TIME DID I SAY THAT. I SAID THIS YEAR'S SCHEDULE IS TERRIBLE! THAT IS COMPLETELY INDEPENDANT OF ANY OTHER YEAR'S SCHEDULE! But you 3 guys are so busy trying so hard to argue every little thing to show your undying love for all things TUBBY (IN TUBBY WE TRUST) that you are just making up things to argue and attack posters about.
I've looked at the KenPom SOS numbers from 2005-2017. You might be disappointed.
We pretty much are anywhere between 50 - 130. I think the hardest schedule was 2012 or 2013.
(06-16-2017 04:39 PM)FlyingTiger2016 Wrote: [ -> ] (06-16-2017 04:35 PM)memtigbb Wrote: [ -> ]This is the last time I am responding on this thread since it is clear you guys just want to argue...
We SHOULD HAVE WON 20 GAMES LAST SEASON!
WE SHOULD HAVE WON 20 GAMES THE SEASON BEFORE!
WE SHOULD WIN 20 GAMES THIS SEASON!
The past handful of schedules have been AWFUL!
I am not saying this scedule is WORSE THAN THE PAST HANDFUL!!! (QUOTE ME ON WHERE I COMPARED THIS SCHEDULE TO ANY OTHER SCHEDULE) NOT ONE TIME DID I SAY THAT. I SAID THIS YEAR'S SCHEDULE IS TERRIBLE! THAT IS COMPLETELY INDEPENDANT OF ANY OTHER YEAR'S SCHEDULE! But you 3 guys are so busy trying so hard to argue every little thing to show your undying love for all things TUBBY (IN TUBBY WE TRUST) that you are just making up things to argue and attack posters about.
I've looked at the KenPom SOS numbers from 2005-2017. You might be disappointed.
We pretty much are anywhere between 50 - 130. I think the hardest schedule was 2012 or 2013.
I would've thought 2014 was the toughest SOS because of our changing leagues and actually beating a few Top 25 teams, but you're right. 2014's SOS, per Pomeroy, was 53, but 2012's was 51. I had forgotten that we played plenty of Top 25 teams -- we just never won! That year we played Michigan, Louisville, and Georgetown twice because of a pre-season tournament. Of course, we lost them all, but hey, our OOC SOS was 5 -- better than any Cal year.
But that was not the norm. Under Cal, the OOC (the part you can control) SOS averaged 29.4 for his last seven years. Under Pastner for the same period, it averaged 116.5, and we got way worse after 2015. Before that, our worst in 15 years was 2010's 186 non-con SOS. The last two years were 247 and 283. That's going to have to change, and it doesn't matter nearly as much who we play as it does THAT we play teams with a respectable RPI. SEC, G5 -- whoever will play us that can improve our chances of an at large needs to be on the schedule starting right now.
(06-16-2017 05:35 PM)MTigerBlue Wrote: [ -> ] (06-16-2017 04:39 PM)FlyingTiger2016 Wrote: [ -> ] (06-16-2017 04:35 PM)memtigbb Wrote: [ -> ]This is the last time I am responding on this thread since it is clear you guys just want to argue...
We SHOULD HAVE WON 20 GAMES LAST SEASON!
WE SHOULD HAVE WON 20 GAMES THE SEASON BEFORE!
WE SHOULD WIN 20 GAMES THIS SEASON!
The past handful of schedules have been AWFUL!
I am not saying this scedule is WORSE THAN THE PAST HANDFUL!!! (QUOTE ME ON WHERE I COMPARED THIS SCHEDULE TO ANY OTHER SCHEDULE) NOT ONE TIME DID I SAY THAT. I SAID THIS YEAR'S SCHEDULE IS TERRIBLE! THAT IS COMPLETELY INDEPENDANT OF ANY OTHER YEAR'S SCHEDULE! But you 3 guys are so busy trying so hard to argue every little thing to show your undying love for all things TUBBY (IN TUBBY WE TRUST) that you are just making up things to argue and attack posters about.
I've looked at the KenPom SOS numbers from 2005-2017. You might be disappointed.
We pretty much are anywhere between 50 - 130. I think the hardest schedule was 2012 or 2013.
I would've thought 2014 was the toughest SOS because of our changing leagues and actually beating a few Top 25 teams, but you're right. 2014's SOS, per Pomeroy, was 53, but 2012's was 51. I had forgotten that we played plenty of Top 25 teams -- we just never won! That year we played Michigan, Louisville, and Georgetown twice because of a pre-season tournament. Of course, we lost them all, but hey, our OOC SOS was 5 -- better than any Cal year.
But that was not the norm. Under Cal, the OOC (the part you can control) SOS averaged 29.4 for his last seven years. Under Pastner for the same period, it averaged 116.5, and we got way worse after 2015. Before that, our worst in 15 years was 2010's 186 non-con SOS. The last two years were 247 and 283. That's going to have to change, and it doesn't matter nearly as much who we play as it does THAT we play teams with a respectable RPI. SEC, G5 -- whoever will play us that can improve our chances of an at large needs to be on the schedule starting right now.
Thank you for the stats..........but just wait, there'll soon be some JP apologist or just someone who hates continually on Tubby that will completely ignore the downward scheduling trend under JP and instead blame it all on Tubby. And BTW, no wonder folks don't fill the seats to see that exciting 250+ SOS home OOC schedule.
(06-16-2017 04:03 PM)Stammers Wrote: [ -> ] (06-16-2017 09:20 AM)macgar32 Wrote: [ -> ] (06-13-2017 06:55 AM)Tiger1983 Wrote: [ -> ] (06-13-2017 12:46 AM)snowtiger Wrote: [ -> ] (06-12-2017 08:22 PM)bluebacker Wrote: [ -> ]Very reasonable. the 4 additional losses I have are New Orleans, @UAB, UCF, and @ECU. Otherwise the same.
Some losses are expected and respectable. I would really like to steal a victory.
I see three additional defeats - UCF, @UAB, Tulsa.
Do you see any additional wins?
Do you think we are going to lose to every top 100 RPI team we play and lose to 199 UAB?
On paper the team is going to be horrible, and not this isn't a slam at the players for two reasons...
1. It's not their fault, they can only be expected to perform at their level of ranking.
2. It isn't just that we have only 2 players returning, it is the fact that none of the players are highly ranked, whenever you have all new faces it takes a while for players to get it, first year players take a long time to adjust and Juco players almost never play well their first season
I wouldn't be surprised if we win 10 games and I wouldn't be surprised if we win 20 games. On paper almost every team we play will be better than us.
You appear to be giving Tubby a lot of coaching credit...
(06-16-2017 04:35 PM)memtigbb Wrote: [ -> ] (06-16-2017 03:39 PM)Atlanta Wrote: [ -> ] (06-15-2017 11:07 PM)memtigbb Wrote: [ -> ] (06-13-2017 02:45 PM)Tiger87 Wrote: [ -> ] (06-12-2017 06:12 PM)memtigbb Wrote: [ -> ]It took an absolute collapse to not win 20 last season and that was with the Lawson's killing the team (as is said on this board over and over). I have said all along that there was no chance at all that we would have a losing season this year. I have said time and time again we should have a 20 win season with the crappy schedule we have, same as we should have had a 20 win season last year.
So compared to the end of Pastner's tenure...trending up!
I mean last year was a better record than the previous 2, and you're saying this year will be better than that.
So even with losing all these great players, and the mediocre recruiting and lack of a competent staff, we're getting better.
This may be very difficult for you to understand so I will try and break it down in an example that you might can grasp...
Chuck Stobart had 3 straight 6-5 seasons. In my opinion his 6-5 seasons were some of the best I have seen in football mainly because of the competition we face during those seasons. Now, he might have been able to win 8 or 9 games if he dumbed down his schedule and you probably would have thought he was the greatest coach of all time. Tubby is playing an incredibly weak schedule so winning 20 games is like winning 13 games vs a good schedule.
Where have you been? The MBB schedule - especially the home OOC schedule, has been woefully weak through virtually the entire period since when JP began doing the scheduling. Some of you guys who are continually pounding on Tubby seem to have such a focus on 'all things are Tubby's fault', 'Tubby's the wrong guy', etc, etc that you don't seem to be able to look at any aspect of the MBB program objectively. Maybe another approach might work better for the program - support it, the players, the recruits & the coaching staff. I always thought that is what fans did - JMO.
This is the last time I am responding on this thread since it is clear you guys just want to argue...
We SHOULD HAVE WON 20 GAMES LAST SEASON!
WE SHOULD HAVE WON 20 GAMES THE SEASON BEFORE!
WE SHOULD WIN 20 GAMES THIS SEASON!
The past handful of schedules have been AWFUL!
I am not saying this scedule is WORSE THAN THE PAST HANDFUL!!! (QUOTE ME ON WHERE I COMPARED THIS SCHEDULE TO ANY OTHER SCHEDULE) NOT ONE TIME DID I SAY THAT. I SAID THIS YEAR'S SCHEDULE IS TERRIBLE! THAT IS COMPLETELY INDEPENDANT OF ANY OTHER YEAR'S SCHEDULE! But you 3 guys are so busy trying so hard to argue every little thing to show your undying love for all things TUBBY (IN TUBBY WE TRUST) that you are just making up things to argue and attack posters about...........
Actually no, at least speaking for myself & I think others who have argued for balance, I don't think any of us are Tubby lovers. Rather the term I have used is ambivalence towards Tubby - means neither for or against. But I am a Tiger MBB fan, so I attempt to pull of the program, for the team, its players, its recruits, the coaches - and against all odds root for the team to win each & every game. Sure there are things I'd like to see different in the program but I'm not going to spend my every post being critical of the coach, the AD, etc. and find something negative to post about every aspect of the MBB program. If there is one criticism of the program that I have posted consistently for years, it is about the weak home OOC schedule. I believe it is as much to blame for the attendance fall-off as wins & losses - JMO. Fans come if the teams wins consistently but fans also come to see good BB & tough opponents provide that aspect even if our program is down. Memphis fans are MBB fans even when our program is not at its top.
(06-16-2017 05:35 PM)MTigerBlue Wrote: [ -> ] (06-16-2017 04:39 PM)FlyingTiger2016 Wrote: [ -> ] (06-16-2017 04:35 PM)memtigbb Wrote: [ -> ]This is the last time I am responding on this thread since it is clear you guys just want to argue...
We SHOULD HAVE WON 20 GAMES LAST SEASON!
WE SHOULD HAVE WON 20 GAMES THE SEASON BEFORE!
WE SHOULD WIN 20 GAMES THIS SEASON!
The past handful of schedules have been AWFUL!
I am not saying this scedule is WORSE THAN THE PAST HANDFUL!!! (QUOTE ME ON WHERE I COMPARED THIS SCHEDULE TO ANY OTHER SCHEDULE) NOT ONE TIME DID I SAY THAT. I SAID THIS YEAR'S SCHEDULE IS TERRIBLE! THAT IS COMPLETELY INDEPENDANT OF ANY OTHER YEAR'S SCHEDULE! But you 3 guys are so busy trying so hard to argue every little thing to show your undying love for all things TUBBY (IN TUBBY WE TRUST) that you are just making up things to argue and attack posters about.
I've looked at the KenPom SOS numbers from 2005-2017. You might be disappointed.
We pretty much are anywhere between 50 - 130. I think the hardest schedule was 2012 or 2013.
I would've thought 2014 was the toughest SOS because of our changing leagues and actually beating a few Top 25 teams, but you're right. 2014's SOS, per Pomeroy, was 53, but 2012's was 51. I had forgotten that we played plenty of Top 25 teams -- we just never won! That year we played Michigan, Louisville, and Georgetown twice because of a pre-season tournament. Of course, we lost them all, but hey, our OOC SOS was 5 -- better than any Cal year.
But that was not the norm. Under Cal, the OOC (the part you can control) SOS averaged 29.4 for his last seven years. Under Pastner for the same period, it averaged 116.5, and we got way worse after 2015. Before that, our worst in 15 years was 2010's 186 non-con SOS. The last two years were 247 and 283. That's going to have to change, and it doesn't matter nearly as much who we play as it does THAT we play teams with a respectable RPI. SEC, G5 -- whoever will play us that can improve our chances of an at large needs to be on the schedule starting right now.
Yep. The non-conference was better under Cal. But I don't expect us to have to schedule like that anymore. Nor do I think it is possible without being on the road for the entire non-conference block.
(06-17-2017 06:56 AM)macgar32 Wrote: [ -> ] (06-16-2017 04:03 PM)Stammers Wrote: [ -> ] (06-16-2017 09:20 AM)macgar32 Wrote: [ -> ] (06-13-2017 06:55 AM)Tiger1983 Wrote: [ -> ] (06-13-2017 12:46 AM)snowtiger Wrote: [ -> ]Some losses are expected and respectable. I would really like to steal a victory.
I see three additional defeats - UCF, @UAB, Tulsa.
Do you see any additional wins?
Do you think we are going to lose to every top 100 RPI team we play and lose to 199 UAB?
On paper the team is going to be horrible, and not this isn't a slam at the players for two reasons...
1. It's not their fault, they can only be expected to perform at their level of ranking.
2. It isn't just that we have only 2 players returning, it is the fact that none of the players are highly ranked, whenever you have all new faces it takes a while for players to get it, first year players take a long time to adjust and Juco players almost never play well their first season
I wouldn't be surprised if we win 10 games and I wouldn't be surprised if we win 20 games. On paper almost every team we play will be better than us.
You appear to be giving Tubby a lot of coaching credit...
My evaluation of Tubby is based on what he has done over the last 10 years and what he has done at Memphis so far. I will give Tubby credit for cracking the top 100 of the RPI and signing a top 30-40 class this year.
If he isn't able to accomplish both, we are getting a horrible ROI.
(06-19-2017 08:04 AM)FlyingTiger2016 Wrote: [ -> ] (06-16-2017 05:35 PM)MTigerBlue Wrote: [ -> ] (06-16-2017 04:39 PM)FlyingTiger2016 Wrote: [ -> ] (06-16-2017 04:35 PM)memtigbb Wrote: [ -> ]This is the last time I am responding on this thread since it is clear you guys just want to argue...
We SHOULD HAVE WON 20 GAMES LAST SEASON!
WE SHOULD HAVE WON 20 GAMES THE SEASON BEFORE!
WE SHOULD WIN 20 GAMES THIS SEASON!
The past handful of schedules have been AWFUL!
I am not saying this scedule is WORSE THAN THE PAST HANDFUL!!! (QUOTE ME ON WHERE I COMPARED THIS SCHEDULE TO ANY OTHER SCHEDULE) NOT ONE TIME DID I SAY THAT. I SAID THIS YEAR'S SCHEDULE IS TERRIBLE! THAT IS COMPLETELY INDEPENDANT OF ANY OTHER YEAR'S SCHEDULE! But you 3 guys are so busy trying so hard to argue every little thing to show your undying love for all things TUBBY (IN TUBBY WE TRUST) that you are just making up things to argue and attack posters about.
I've looked at the KenPom SOS numbers from 2005-2017. You might be disappointed.
We pretty much are anywhere between 50 - 130. I think the hardest schedule was 2012 or 2013.
I would've thought 2014 was the toughest SOS because of our changing leagues and actually beating a few Top 25 teams, but you're right. 2014's SOS, per Pomeroy, was 53, but 2012's was 51. I had forgotten that we played plenty of Top 25 teams -- we just never won! That year we played Michigan, Louisville, and Georgetown twice because of a pre-season tournament. Of course, we lost them all, but hey, our OOC SOS was 5 -- better than any Cal year.
But that was not the norm. Under Cal, the OOC (the part you can control) SOS averaged 29.4 for his last seven years. Under Pastner for the same period, it averaged 116.5, and we got way worse after 2015. Before that, our worst in 15 years was 2010's 186 non-con SOS. The last two years were 247 and 283. That's going to have to change, and it doesn't matter nearly as much who we play as it does THAT we play teams with a respectable RPI. SEC, G5 -- whoever will play us that can improve our chances of an at large needs to be on the schedule starting right now.
Yep. The non-conference was better under Cal. But I don't expect us to have to schedule like that anymore. Nor do I think it is possible without being on the road for the entire non-conference block.
Let's discuss the "...have to..." of your statement. I agree there is no need to schedule like Cal did while in CUSA, at least to get in the tourney or get votes for ranking purposes. But Memphis was winning & winning big against all comers - then. And the fans were buying tickets. The AAC schedule provides a much better conference schedule for sure, but also much tougher to win on the road in conference & we aren't winning big (& haven't since the AAC formation). As a result, fans don't come, add to that a 250 SOS home OOC schedule & it simply gives even MBB fans (not just Tigerr fans) little reason to buy tickets & come to the games - and BTW virtually every game is on TV. Solution - schedule some interesting home OOC games (AR, UTK, & other competitive cross-country P5 schools) & win in-conference or at least be very competitive. In summary, I think we do have to schedule like Cal did, if simply for financial reasons & it helps recruiting to be able to tell recruits they will play spotlight games against talent that catches the eye of the NBA.