10-25-2017, 08:36 AM
(10-25-2017 06:56 AM)RiceLad15 Wrote: [ -> ](10-25-2017 01:03 AM)tanqtonic Wrote: [ -> ](10-24-2017 11:01 PM)OptimisticOwl Wrote: [ -> ](10-24-2017 05:55 PM)RiceLad15 Wrote: [ -> ](10-24-2017 05:38 PM)OptimisticOwl Wrote: [ -> ]The guy who owns Fred's Tire Center may be a true blue liberal, but when the big guys in Austin and Washington want to tax the "rich" and stop "tax breaks for the rich", it is the guys in the middle, red and blue, who get hurt. The guys in the middle include a lot of small businesses and entrepreneurs. Then they use the excuse that didn't build that. Just adding insult to injury.
The left loves the rich, if they contribute to Democrat candidates. The really rich can avoid the taxes to a large extent, the middle cannot. But who cares?
What about you, JAAO? Do you own your business? If you do, how would you use the tax savings from tax reform?
If you're in the top income tax bracket, you are not in the middle. That's $444,550+ per year (approximately 1% of all couples and 0.1% of singles [https://www.forbes.com/sites/beltway/2016/07/20/what-tax-brackets-are-americans-in/]. So if the owner of Fred's Tires is making almost $500,000 per year, he is doing quite well and is distinctly in the "rich" category and not the middle class category. Good for him, he has earned that income, likely through hard work, but let's not suggest he is middle class when that is closer to a $50,000 combined income per year.
Or maybe I'm confused by your definition of the middle?
If you're talking about corporate tax rates, I'm not 100% sure where the democratic party stands on changes to those rates and small businesses, but I wouldn't be surprised if they wanted to explicitly avoid raising taxes on small businesses.
Where did I say Fred was in the top .1%? Why that assumption?
Plus, where did I say fred was in texas? If Fred is making $500,000 in San Francisco, he might be able to afford a 1500 sq. ft. house. or he might not. Middle class is not the same everywhere.The oldest example of going after rich people and hitting the middle class is the IRA decuction. Originally, this was $2000 that, if put in an IRA account, was deductible from taxable income for everybody. Then the democrats started complaining that it just was not right that millionaires could deduct this pittance. So they decided to phase out the deduction, starting at
$25k income for singles, $40K for couples. Millionaires my ass. How about the Alternative Minimum Tax, enacted to catch about 10 millionaires. How many people paying that now? All millionaires?
Nearly every cap or phaseout designed to hit millionaires sooner or later hits the little guys. Usually sooner.
Just to start --- pretty much anyone who lives in Coastal California, and owns a home. It hits Cali hard since home interest deduction and state piggy bank collection trigger anyone in this category almost as a general rule.
I didnt know a *single* person in California that didnt get AMTed when I was there.
Ironically, the Obama administration indexed the AMT to inflation to help avoid the AMT creep that started gobbling up those types of homeowners and people with lots of kids.
Also, and I didn’t know this as well, the AMT was signed into law by Nixon, and was continually updated to keep up with inflation on a fairly regular basis, until the 2013 indexing by the Obama admin.
After they were already gobbled up, mind you. Damage was already done. Btw, the manual indexing in no way, shape, or form kept up with wages.
But, has happened is that already tens of millions have fallen into it, when it was written specifically to capture 155 people. But that is the story of every aspect of taxation and the unsated appetite for it.