The premise:
- FCS teams that have publicly stated they desire FBS membership
- Relative stability with FBS conferences
- Options for FCS teams; wait for invite, petition for indy, litigation
Do you support a revision to the current invite only rule?
Indianpolis is cold this time of year, I like it here despite the rain in recent days (my first thought when reading the title).
But seriously, independent life is no longer viable and you have zero leverage when it comes to scheduling unless you're a military academy or a major denominational religious school (e.g. Notre Dame, BYU to a lesser extent).
The only school I could see moving up that would do okay as an independent is Coast Guard, who is way down in D-III, or if they separate the Marines from Navy and the Marines start a football program. Everyone else may as well some poor private school or directional school not named USC.
(03-11-2016 02:23 PM)_C2_ Wrote: [ -> ]Indianpolis is cold this time of year, I like it here despite the rain in recent days (my first thought when reading the title).
But seriously, independent life is no longer viable and you have zero leverage when it comes to scheduling unless you're a military academy or a major denominational religious school (e.g. Notre Dame, BYU to a lesser extent).
The only school I could see moving up that would do okay as an independent is Coast Guard, who is way down in D-III, or if they separate the Marines from Navy and the Marines start a football program. Everyone else may as well some poor private school or directional school not named USC.
Agreed with the current rules and regs. The only viable indy route would seem to be a complete revamp that would include a transition schedule of FCS and FBS games. Put the responsibility of indy schools to meet scheduling requirements to be eligible for post season play. No post season eligibility until XX of FBS games played. Granted with bowl tie ins it would be a long and difficult haul. But those FCS teams stuck may have no other options. It's going to be interesting to see what poll voters feel is the best option.
I went with Indy status. Imagine how many North Dakota State games be shown on ESPN? It could help schools like U. Mass. Idaho and New Mexico State teams to schedule each year. I could see NDSU, SDSU, Northern Iowa, Missouri State, Wichita State, UTRGV, Jacksonville State, Lamar, Eastern Kentucky and some others to be up at FBS level. Some D2 schools could move up to FCS for three years before going to FBS in their 4th year. North Alabama, West Texas A&M and Azusa Pacific are closer to the mark. West Texas A&M is building a new stadium that seats 12,000, but could expand to 22,000 on campus. North Alabama could get to 15,000. Azusa Pacific could add 5,000 more seatings, and West Florida could be at 15,000 seat stadium that would be completed next year.
If you are crazy, or bold, enough to make the jump then the lack of a conference invite shouldn't stop you.
I actually prefer the model because it forces programs to take a good look at reality. An ill conceived jump could cost a program a lot.
(03-11-2016 03:43 PM)HeartOfDixie Wrote: [ -> ]If you are crazy, or bold, enough to make the jump then the lack of a conference invite shouldn't stop you.
I actually prefer the model because it forces programs to take a good look at reality. An ill conceived jump could cost a program a lot.
Jacksonville State is better than a lot of the G5 schools in football. They could hold their own. Same with Portland State last year. We already have seen schools that got invites are truely not ready to be in FBS. I can say the same thing with Coastal Carolina. They got beaten by a large amount to Colorado a few years ago, but schools like Sacramento State could beat Colorado.
(03-11-2016 03:48 PM)DavidSt Wrote: [ -> ] (03-11-2016 03:43 PM)HeartOfDixie Wrote: [ -> ]If you are crazy, or bold, enough to make the jump then the lack of a conference invite shouldn't stop you.
I actually prefer the model because it forces programs to take a good look at reality. An ill conceived jump could cost a program a lot.
Jacksonville State is better than a lot of the G5 schools in football. They could hold their own. Same with Portland State last year. We already have seen schools that got invites are truely not ready to be in FBS. I can say the same thing with Coastal Carolina. They got beaten by a large amount to Colorado a few years ago, but schools like Sacramento State could beat Colorado.
There is a different between a one-off game and staying power.
Those programs do not have the resources to compete in a higher league, even if the team they field every now and then is better.
It takes money to compete on a consistent basis.
(03-11-2016 03:50 PM)HeartOfDixie Wrote: [ -> ] (03-11-2016 03:48 PM)DavidSt Wrote: [ -> ] (03-11-2016 03:43 PM)HeartOfDixie Wrote: [ -> ]If you are crazy, or bold, enough to make the jump then the lack of a conference invite shouldn't stop you.
I actually prefer the model because it forces programs to take a good look at reality. An ill conceived jump could cost a program a lot.
Jacksonville State is better than a lot of the G5 schools in football. They could hold their own. Same with Portland State last year. We already have seen schools that got invites are truely not ready to be in FBS. I can say the same thing with Coastal Carolina. They got beaten by a large amount to Colorado a few years ago, but schools like Sacramento State could beat Colorado.
There is a different between a one-off game and staying power.
Those programs do not have the resources to compete in a higher league, even if the team they field every now and then is better.
It takes money to compete on a consistent basis.
Jacksonville State would be like another Georgia Southern and Appalachian State if they move up. They have been in the playoffs in the past several years. I am not worry about them or North Dakota State. I would not worry about Eastern Washington either. Coastal Carolina, Georgia State, UTSA, Charlotte will be at the very bottom of the FBS G5. The schools I mentioned is better than them, and could be sustain at the higher levels.
(03-11-2016 04:08 PM)DavidSt Wrote: [ -> ] (03-11-2016 03:50 PM)HeartOfDixie Wrote: [ -> ] (03-11-2016 03:48 PM)DavidSt Wrote: [ -> ] (03-11-2016 03:43 PM)HeartOfDixie Wrote: [ -> ]If you are crazy, or bold, enough to make the jump then the lack of a conference invite shouldn't stop you.
I actually prefer the model because it forces programs to take a good look at reality. An ill conceived jump could cost a program a lot.
Jacksonville State is better than a lot of the G5 schools in football. They could hold their own. Same with Portland State last year. We already have seen schools that got invites are truely not ready to be in FBS. I can say the same thing with Coastal Carolina. They got beaten by a large amount to Colorado a few years ago, but schools like Sacramento State could beat Colorado.
There is a different between a one-off game and staying power.
Those programs do not have the resources to compete in a higher league, even if the team they field every now and then is better.
It takes money to compete on a consistent basis.
Jacksonville State would be like another Georgia Southern and Appalachian State if they move up. They have been in the playoffs in the past several years. I am not worry about them or North Dakota State. I would not worry about Eastern Washington either. Coastal Carolina, Georgia State, UTSA, Charlotte will be at the very bottom of the FBS G5. The schools I mentioned is better than them, and could be sustain at the higher levels.
Based on what? Give us a little more than 1-0 series with team A or team B.
The intent of the post is how, if in any way, would/could a FCS school achieve FBS without an invite. There are at least 4 FCS schools that could play in the SBC or the MAC or the CUSA. Sure they would take their initial lumps, unlike exceptions to the rule GaSo or App St. But those select FCS schools with the resources and the budget, and the facilities, with the commitment and no place to go, could compete in the lower level FBS leagues.
If the incentive to move up to FBS in class is purely to get a piece of the CFP pot of gold, then I don't really care how many schools move up as long as the rest of the G5 is willing to split their share with them. Keep in mind that many schools are only in D-I for basketball to leech off the NCAAT. Now some of them want to leech off the CFP.
The major conferences that generate the wealth aren't going to share any more of that out of the goodness of their hearts. Nor should they.
(03-11-2016 07:43 PM)ken d Wrote: [ -> ]If the incentive to move up to FBS in class is purely to get a piece of the CFP pot of gold, then I don't really care how many schools move up as long as the rest of the G5 is willing to split their share with them. Keep in mind that many schools are only in D-I for basketball to leech off the NCAAT. Now some of them want to leech off the CFP.
The major conferences that generate the wealth aren't going to share any more of that out of the goodness of their hearts. Nor should they.
This.
We hear incessant whining that the power conference teams keep most of the money from the playoffs. But the moment they share it with lower conference teams, you get lower-tier schools wanting to move up & steal a piece of the pie (despite not adding anything measurable to the size of said pie). It's happened in basketball and now we have 350+ teams in D1. And now it's starting to happen in football too.
(03-11-2016 07:43 PM)ken d Wrote: [ -> ]If the incentive to move up to FBS in class is purely to get a piece of the CFP pot of gold, then I don't really care how many schools move up as long as the rest of the G5 is willing to split their share with them. Keep in mind that many schools are only in D-I for basketball to leech off the NCAAT. Now some of them want to leech off the CFP.
The major conferences that generate the wealth aren't going to share any more of that out of the goodness of their hearts. Nor should they.
Exactly and only about 40-50 schools run the show, the rest, while not necessarily leeches, just don't have the pull. Ohio State alone is figuratively and possibly financially more viable than all of the MAC. We're talking about basketball as well, which would also include Kansas and Kentucky.
It's no wonder the major bowls
hate drawing the obligatory G5 team and love a Notre Dame or Michigan, even if they're only 8-4.
(03-11-2016 10:37 PM)_C2_ Wrote: [ -> ] (03-11-2016 07:43 PM)ken d Wrote: [ -> ]If the incentive to move up to FBS in class is purely to get a piece of the CFP pot of gold, then I don't really care how many schools move up as long as the rest of the G5 is willing to split their share with them. Keep in mind that many schools are only in D-I for basketball to leech off the NCAAT. Now some of them want to leech off the CFP.
The major conferences that generate the wealth aren't going to share any more of that out of the goodness of their hearts. Nor should they.
Exactly and only about 40-50 schools run the show, the rest, while not necessarily leeches, just don't have the pull. Ohio State alone is figuratively and possibly financially more viable than all of the MAC. We're talking about basketball as well, which would also include Kansas and Kentucky.
It's no wonder the major bowls hate drawing the obligatory G5 team and love a Notre Dame or Michigan, even if they're only 8-4.
The major bowls seem to not mind Boise State, Houston and some of the other G5 schools who could draw fans and viewers. North Dakota State could be the next one on the rise.
As for the concussions/CTE issue in all sports, FCOA and all that? Money would be drain that way, but having schools moving up could be more of a benefit for the P5 and G5 schools. Just add more local games for saving money on travel.
The major bowls don't even really like the best G5's either, which is why they let them drop to whoever is willing to pick them up like the groom throwing the garter at a wedding.
If a team meets the requirements, they should be allowed to make the jump. Liberty should be FBS.
(03-12-2016 01:56 AM)HarmonOliphantOberlanderDevine Wrote: [ -> ]If a team meets the requirements, they should be allowed to make the jump. Liberty should be FBS.
Liberty, UMASS, NMST, Idaho, Army and BYU could all schedule each other along with an FCS team in late October and through November when conference schedules kick in and scheduling gets tough for them. The first four schools would definitely need each other. BYU and Army don't seem to have as many problems scheduling games during those months. As am matter of fact Army's schedule is pretty much booked up through 2020 I believe but BYU has some holes after this coming season and the next year.
Its really simple: if a program (FCS in this case) has the will and invests the money into facilities/scholarships, etc. and wants to move to FBS they should be allowed to.
(03-12-2016 07:06 AM)PA-GAMECOCK Wrote: [ -> ] (03-12-2016 01:56 AM)HarmonOliphantOberlanderDevine Wrote: [ -> ]If a team meets the requirements, they should be allowed to make the jump. Liberty should be FBS.
Liberty, UMASS, NMST, Idaho, Army and BYU could all schedule each other along with an FCS team in late October and through November when conference schedules kick in and scheduling gets tough for them. The first four schools would definitely need each other. BYU and Army don't seem to have as many problems scheduling games during those months. As am matter of fact Army's schedule is pretty much booked up through 2020 I believe but BYU has some holes after this coming season and the next year.
Liberty, UMASS and BYU, heck yeah!
Idaho and NMST, no. Unless they agree to 2-1 scheduling deal. Army shouldn't be traveling to American Moscow or the desert where NMST plays.
(03-12-2016 09:33 AM)HarmonOliphantOberlanderDevine Wrote: [ -> ] (03-12-2016 07:06 AM)PA-GAMECOCK Wrote: [ -> ] (03-12-2016 01:56 AM)HarmonOliphantOberlanderDevine Wrote: [ -> ]If a team meets the requirements, they should be allowed to make the jump. Liberty should be FBS.
Liberty, UMASS, NMST, Idaho, Army and BYU could all schedule each other along with an FCS team in late October and through November when conference schedules kick in and scheduling gets tough for them. The first four schools would definitely need each other. BYU and Army don't seem to have as many problems scheduling games during those months. As am matter of fact Army's schedule is pretty much booked up through 2020 I believe but BYU has some holes after this coming season and the next year.
Liberty, UMASS and BYU, heck yeah!
Idaho and NMST, no. Unless they agree to 2-1 scheduling deal. Army shouldn't be traveling to American Moscow or the desert where NMST plays.
Thought I read somewhere that there are a couple of Army bases out near NMST. Might make a nice trip for the soldiers there like Navy traveling to San Diego for a game and having the full support of navel base personnel there for a home and home series. I could see you having a mind set against the Idaho travel though and requiring a 2 for 1 deal, especially to a 15000 seat indoor stadium that does not fill up unless you had a major scheduling hole. At least the NMST stadium has 30000 seats and is comparable to games played at Wake Forest and Duke - two schools that Army schedules on a regular basis now any way.