(03-22-2016 10:18 AM)GullLake Wrote: [ -> ] (03-22-2016 10:12 AM)Chipdip2 Wrote: [ -> ] (03-22-2016 07:41 AM)GullLake Wrote: [ -> ] (03-21-2016 06:34 PM)brovol Wrote: [ -> ]I fear that kasich is in bed with Trump right now, working for a Veep spot. I would lose respect for him as quickly as I did Carson. And I had more respect for Carson to start with.
It's so hard to prognosticate at this stage. Literally, anything could happen. This is the most entertaining election ever. I'll give Trump credit for that. It's a spectator sport.
I am hoping a brokered convention assembles a Cruz/Kasich ticket, or Kasich/Cruz.
Whichever has the best chance of winning. At this stage, winning in November is all that matters.
Hillary Clinton is as bad - if not worse - then Trump. Her problems are deeper and even more disturbing than Trump's buffoonery, racism and narcissism. She will beat Trump. However, she would not beat either Kasich or Cruz, particularly if they ran together.
Trump will not have enough delegates to win the GOP nomination on the first ballot. After the first ballot, delegates are free to vote for whoever they want.
It will be an interesting convention in Cleveland.
Bottom-line is anyone who would vote for either Clinton or Trump deserves zero respect.
So if it comes down to Trump or Hillary who do you vote for in order to maintain your respect? Maybe you should set this one out.
A 3rd party candidate.
Which is also a vote for Trump or Hillary.
You honestly believe a third party candidate could win? You're naive. Depending on who it was they'd take votes from either Trump or Hill.
Let's say it was Bernie, he takes votes from Hillary and Trump wins.
Let's say it's Romney. He takes votes from Trump and Hillary wins.
(03-22-2016 05:45 AM)brovol Wrote: [ -> ] (03-21-2016 11:19 PM)gobaseline Wrote: [ -> ] (03-21-2016 06:34 PM)brovol Wrote: [ -> ]I fear that kasich is in bed with Trump right now, working for a Veep spot. I would lose respect for him as quickly as I did Carson. And I had more respect for Carson to start with.
It's so hard to prognosticate at this stage. Literally, anything could happen. This is the most entertaining election ever. I'll give Trump credit for that. It's a spectator sport.
Why did you lose respect for Carson?
Same reason I lost some respect for my sister and brother in law when they said they were supporting Trump. I just can't see how someone could see and hear that guy, and read into who and what he has been for years, and then vote for him. I don't think that the debates are the perfect medium to assess a candidate, but they certainly have corobotlrated my worst fears in the case of Trump.
I believed Carson had higher standards than Trump. I thought he was a stonch Constitutionalist, but pairing with Trump suggests he is willing to accept someone who isn't, and that reflects poorly in my book. I'm very disappointed.
I hear you. I detest Trump's style too. I'm not on board with all points or the process to get to them (even if I agreed in principle).
I will also say other than his TV persona I don't really know the man. Is it a clue? Certainly. Is it all there is? I would like to know. I have an open mind.
Though the debates have shed light on all the format and execution didn't allow/promote going more than an 1" deep. I commented shortly before JEB stepped down that I heard lengthy one on one interviews of both Sanders and Bush. Honestly I wasn't even considering either but found the interviews to very helpful in seeing more deeply into each. I appreciated Bush more and have a level of respect for Sanders I didn't anticipate.
Point: With in depth meetings with Trump, Carson stated he found a side to him that isn't commonly known or publically conveyed. The critical questions/issues Carson valued were answered sufficiently. With that cleared up and the goal being to defeat those who'd continue to weaken the US you have to pick someone to run who will win. Apparently, Carson feels the others aren't capable. Do I buy it? Jury is still out. But I do trust Carson's judgement. It wasn't too many elections ago I was a purist. Didn't meet my checklist you didn't have a chance. Do I have some non negotiables? Yes. But I have become more pragmatic. Elections and those elected aren't going to "save" the country. They do give us a fighting chance assuming they do as they say in changing the trajectory. And that's what the next election is for. If Bob or Jane don't measure up ... Buh Bye!
For Carson three things matter as I understand it.
- A change of course is required or the US will continue on the path to crash and burn. Time is running out.
- To maintain the same trajectory (the current admin or the existing leadership of the Repub. party) doesn't allow for that.
- Considering the world around us a change is
required. Trump may not be the best but the existing alternatives all fail the first two points.
I still think there is time to make a decision. Another candidate? Not likely. If they didn't run earlier, for whatever reason, appointing them by way of delegates only substantiates the opinion that only the elite matter. Would I be open? Yes of course. But they would have to be able to win and do as I would like. Isn't that who you vote for?
(03-22-2016 09:59 PM)Chipdip2 Wrote: [ -> ]You honestly believe a third party candidate could win? You're naive. Depending on who it was they'd take votes from either Trump or Hill.
Let's say it was Bernie, he takes votes from Hillary and Trump wins.
Let's say it's Romney. He takes votes from Trump and Hillary wins.
This is probably true, but I also wonder what happens if let say someone from Republican side ran as third party, might that prompt Sanders to run as independent too, thus creating a four person free for all? Not predicting that, but if something like that was to happen this would be the year, and I would not bet against one of the third party candidates.
(03-22-2016 09:59 PM)Chipdip2 Wrote: [ -> ]You honestly believe a third party candidate could win? You're naive. Depending on who it was they'd take votes from either Trump or Hill.
Let's say it was Bernie, he takes votes from Hillary and Trump wins.
Let's say it's Romney. He takes votes from Trump and Hillary wins.
This isn't 1993, or even 2000 anymore.
In this current political climate, yes, a 3rd party candidate can absolutely win.
I would not be surprised to see multiple candidates, i.e. Bernie, Kasich and/or Cruze.
Many Democrats despise Hillary as much as Republicans despise Trump. No man or woman of principle would vote for either.
This election cycle is a political earthquake and the entire political landscape is changing. The Democrat and Republican Parties are becoming irrelevant and only have themselves to blame.
(03-23-2016 05:46 AM)brovol Wrote: [ -> ] (03-22-2016 09:59 PM)Chipdip2 Wrote: [ -> ]You honestly believe a third party candidate could win? You're naive. Depending on who it was they'd take votes from either Trump or Hill.
Let's say it was Bernie, he takes votes from Hillary and Trump wins.
Let's say it's Romney. He takes votes from Trump and Hillary wins.
This is probably true, but I also wonder what happens if let say someone from Republican side ran as third party, might that prompt Sanders to run as independent too, thus creating a four person free for all? Not predicting that, but if something like that was to happen this would be the year, and I would not bet against one of the third party candidates.
Bernie has been a broke loser most of his life. Sure he could threaten to enter as a 3rd party. Then the Clintons and the DNC would come to him and threaten to expose some dirty secret they have about him ( doesn't even have to be true ) followed by several million in cash bribes, and Bernie will announce that he's not going to do a third-party run .
(03-23-2016 05:43 AM)brovol Wrote: [ -> ]Why not Cruz Gobase?
I think Cruz's staffs action in the middle of the Iowa caucuses and Cruz's explanation and attempt to woo Carson put him off. I recall hearing his comments in reaction to a question about Cruz's attempt as being both apologize and then cut a deal. More of what the Doctor would call the usual political gamesmanship that has brought us to this catastrophic mess. Why would Carson turn from his "we the people" and embrace the past?
http://time.com/4203730/ben-carson-ted-c...ty-tricks/
http://www.thedailybeast.com/articles/20...ricks.html
(03-22-2016 09:59 PM)Chipdip2 Wrote: [ -> ]You honestly believe a third party candidate could win? You're naive. Depending on who it was they'd take votes from either Trump or Hill.
Let's say it was Bernie, he takes votes from Hillary and Trump wins.
Let's say it's Romney. He takes votes from Trump and Hillary wins.
Trump can't beat Clinton.
http://www.msn.com/en-us/news/politics/p...ailsignout
It was former conservative columnist William F . Buckley, Jr. who said he will support "...the most conservative candidate, who can win."