Watching the debate. They all just went on record saying that undocumented immigrants should get INSTATE TUITION RATES.
In other words if you are a U.S. citizen, live in Indiana and want to go to Western Michigan University you will pay the higher outstate tuition rates, but if you're an illegal immigrant you get instate rates.
I'll take anyone in that field over Comrade Bernie. His fiscal plan should scare the bejesus out of anyone with an Econ 101 or higher sensibility.
I'd be interested to see Biden up there if he threw his hat in the ring. At the very least, he'd be entertaining and come equipped with good zingers.
When you go on record with that tuition policy, you open the door for a ton anti immigrant fodder, and a bunch of sound bite commercials.
They're going to regret going on record with that issue.
(10-13-2015 10:09 PM)Chipdip2 Wrote: [ -> ]When you go on record with that tuition policy, you open the door for a ton anti immigrant fodder, and a bunch of sound bite commercials.
They're going to regret going on record with that issue.
Bad policy, bad politics.
I hope that the voters hand them their lunch on that issue alone. It's infuriating.
That is consistent with the rest of the dem platform. When Bernie again proudly concerned that he is a socialist and received a round of hearty applause, the rest essentially jumped on the bandwagon, only slightly distinguishing themselves from what he wants to do.
Honestly, I know most on this board are Democrats, and I truely respect the philosophical debates we have had. But John F Kennedy would vomit if he saw what his party and his country has become. What has happened that American beliefs, values and ways have fallen so hard that our presidential candidates smile and get applause for the things that they say now.
Trust me, I vomit when I hear Donald Trump too. Maybe even worse. And most candidates from both parties look like polititions and talk like polititions. Carson right now looks best to me. But I must say, while I don't agree with many things he says, rubio is looking like a decent option too.
OK. Here come the attacks. Lol
Every election is difficult for me. I tend to side more with Republicans when it comes to fiscal and spending matters, and with Democrats on social issues and foreign policy. It's rare finding a major party candidate that really fits this.
The fact that Donald Trump and Bernie Sanders are such rock stars among their respective bases is troubling.
Honestly, I think this is a similar situation to when Obama won 7 years ago. People were so fed up with Bush and the Republicans that ANY Democrat they put in front of the people was going to win. Just so happened he was also a black man so minorities came out of the woodwork and voted for the first time simply because of the mans skin color (which is also wrong IMO). I didn't vote against him because he was black, you shouldn't vote for someone for that reason.
But I think this coming election is a similar story. People realize that Obama has been an absolute failure and are fed up with him. So if the Republicans can put any sort of respectable person on the ticket, they are going to win. UNLESS, Hilary gets the nomination and women come out of the woodwork and vote simply because she is a woman.....also wrong.
Vote for the person you think is the best candidate......... Then again, I think they are ALL crooks that don't give a rats @$$ about any of us, so I'm really not sure it matters.
(10-14-2015 07:46 AM)WheresWaldo42 Wrote: [ -> ]A) So if the Republicans can put any sort of respectable person on the ticket,
B) they are going to win.
1) Good luck with A.
2) If A does happen, the wing-nut anti-establishment types will ensure he/she will not win.
Just to be truthful, Hilary didn't exactly say she supports giving in-state tuition to illegal immigrants. She did say however that her immigration plan would not stand in the way of any state that wanted to allow that. It's almost the same, but not exactly what is being represented here. She actually kind of non-answered whether she personally supported this.
(10-14-2015 07:42 AM)Motown Bronco Wrote: [ -> ]Every election is difficult for me. I tend to side more with Republicans when it comes to fiscal and spending matters, and with Democrats on social issues and foreign policy. It's rare finding a major party candidate that really fits this.
The fact that Donald Trump and Bernie Sanders are such rock stars among their respective bases is troubling.
I'm the same way, but the party system kills any chance of a fiscally responsible socially progressive candidate. You have to either be far right or far left to win the nomination. I think removing the ability to declare a party would force american citizens to actually look at the individual candidate's policies, and not just vote R or D.
(10-14-2015 03:38 PM)texasbronco1 Wrote: [ -> ]Just to be truthful, Hilary didn't exactly say she supports giving in-state tuition to illegal immigrants. She did say however that her immigration plan would not stand in the way of any state that wanted to allow that. It's almost the same, but not exactly what is being represented here. She actually kind of non-answered whether she personally supported this.
Sanctuary States for tuition?
Quote:In other words if you are a U.S. citizen, live in Indiana and want to go to Western Michigan University you will pay the higher outstate tuition rates, but if you're an illegal immigrant you get instate rates.
I didn't watch the debate (only news highlights of Trump in the Repub debates) -- but I'm assuming they mean in-state for what you're (illegally) residing in. Not go-anywhere for in-state.
I think it's referencing Dick Durbin's amendment to the Dream Act:
Quote:As currently written, Durbin's amendment would permit illegals to "earn" their citizenship through either enrolling in college or entering the military. If the amendment passes — even without the mandatory tuition break for illegals — expect many states to act on their own to extend in-state tuition to illegals. As Heritage reports, 10 states are already granting such benefits to illegals — in blatant violation of federal law.
This comes from a Conservative site that one can obviously see in it's wording, but the point is -- if you're an illegal living in MI, you'll be allowed to get in-state tuition here in MI. Not anyone from Indiana or California, etc.
Basically like a squatter living on a piece of land for a long time undisturbed being able to claim it as their residence. Basically as overstaying your welcome coming into the country as a non-citizen, if you "squatted" in that state for a long time, you can get in-state tuition on your way to becoming a true citizen. IMO, that's OK if you can show evidence of staying in the state, brought here as a kid, being in the state growing up for years. *IF* we are going to employ the dream act, to have someone earn their stripes to be a citizen, you would want them to be a college grad at the end of the day, right? Already with Way over-priced college tuition, no need to make it more expensive with out-of-state tuition costs.
IMO, it'd be part of the process of "It's okay to stay" aka Dream Act, IF that applies to you. I think the debate rages on in the conditions to have people stay VS kicking them out of the bar.
Hot Canadian chicks are always welcome to stay.
(10-14-2015 03:38 PM)texasbronco1 Wrote: [ -> ]Just to be truthful, Hilary didn't exactly say she supports giving in-state tuition to illegal immigrants. She did say however that her immigration plan would not stand in the way of any state that wanted to allow that. It's almost the same, but not exactly what is being represented here. She actually kind of non-answered whether she personally supported this.
True, but in a nutshell she covets the potential vote of an illegal more than that of a U.S. Citizen. They all endorsed the practice of states (there are currently 7) giving instate tuition to illegals.
(10-14-2015 03:07 PM)Charm City Bronco Wrote: [ -> ] (10-14-2015 07:46 AM)WheresWaldo42 Wrote: [ -> ]A) So if the Republicans can put any sort of respectable person on the ticket,
B) they are going to win.
1) Good luck with A.
2) If A does happen, the wing-nut anti-establishment types will ensure he/she will not win.
Good luck with A?
Let me get this straight. An affurmed socialist/communist nut, and a woman whose biggest accomplishment is marrying a president and sticking with him as he treats her like a doormat, are your version of great candidates?
Even the candidates at the children's table, Jindal, Petacki, etc. are all more accomplished than the four clowns I watched this week.
Everyone was applauding Hillary's performance. What was she up against. Chaffee stuttered through every answer, Web spent all of his time complaining that he wasn't getting enough time. And Hugo Chavez II was trying to double our 18 trillion dollar debt by giving everyone more "free stuff."
Now I know Chipdip has lost his mind. Listen the circus clown car of GOP candidates aren't fit to run a lemonade stand let alone this country. Do you want any of them to have their hand on the nuclear button? Yeah vote for them if you want to see a war with Iran, more US boots in Syria and any where else where we're likely to fail.
Obama a failure lets look at the economy he inherited in January 2009 and compare to today. He faced the worst economic crisis since the Great Depression ( actually FDR was bailed out of that one by WWII or it would have lasted much longer). The stimulus money that many of the GOP governors were only too happy to suck up actually improved the US infrastructure like roads. The US today gets about 15% of its energy via renewable resources a good way to tell Iraq and Iran we don't need any thank you. Michigan would have been a ghost town without the restructuring of GM and Chrysler not to mention how many parts suppliers (mostly non union) would have gone out of business. The Michigan GOP would not have anything left to govern without Obama's auto bailout with conditions. Even today in Michigan most job growth is auto related which would never have occurred without Obama. And we could go on about how Obama insisted that loans to banks and Wall Street give the US taxpayer reward for the risk and Dodd Frank. More Americans have medical insurance which means the uninsured costs don't get passed on in increased medical rates to employers. The rate of medical inflation has slowed. Yes after Bush spent billions in corrupt war contracts in Iraq training the military he agreed to a withdraw schedule that Obama stuck to.
Its scary (yes it halloween) to think what McCain/Palin or Milt Romney would have done in Obama's shoes. The majority of American people twice decided that Obama was better than the alternatives handed to them by the GOP. Expect a repeat in 2016.
There's nothing in the GOP platform for the average middle class American. And quick name five major legislative acts that have come out of the US House in the 8 years of GOP control? No you can't count getting rid of Obamacare, shutting the federal government down, endless pandering on immigration (funny how none of the solutions deal with prosecuting the companies that hire illegal immigrants) and of course lets investigate Libya 9 separate times.
Lastly the GOP approval percentage in the US is 32% which by the way is much higher than the Michigan voters give their Michigan GOP legislature which at last count was 20%. All well earned I might add.
(10-16-2015 03:25 PM)Chipdip2 Wrote: [ -> ] (10-14-2015 03:07 PM)Charm City Bronco Wrote: [ -> ] (10-14-2015 07:46 AM)WheresWaldo42 Wrote: [ -> ]A) So if the Republicans can put any sort of respectable person on the ticket,
B) they are going to win.
1) Good luck with A.
2) If A does happen, the wing-nut anti-establishment types will ensure he/she will not win.
Good luck with A?
Let me get this straight. An affurmed socialist/communist nut, and a woman whose biggest accomplishment is marrying a president and sticking with him as he treats her like a doormat, are your version of great candidates?
Even the candidates at the children's table, Jindal, Petacki, etc. are all more accomplished than the four clowns I watched this week.
Everyone was applauding Hillary's performance. What was she up against. Chaffee stuttered through every answer, Web spent all of his time complaining that he wasn't getting enough time. And Hugo Chavez II was trying to double our 18 trillion dollar debt by giving everyone more "free stuff."
And the GOP field is a reality TV star, governors who can't manage their states without some type of scandals, a flat earth religion type and a few megaphone mouths that move the breeze but not the country.
(10-16-2015 03:25 PM)Chipdip2 Wrote: [ -> ] (10-14-2015 03:07 PM)Charm City Bronco Wrote: [ -> ] (10-14-2015 07:46 AM)WheresWaldo42 Wrote: [ -> ]A) So if the Republicans can put any sort of respectable person on the ticket,
B) they are going to win.
1) Good luck with A.
2) If A does happen, the wing-nut anti-establishment types will ensure he/she will not win.
Good luck with A?
Let me get this straight. An affurmed socialist/communist nut, and a woman whose biggest accomplishment is marrying a president and sticking with him as he treats her like a doormat, are your version of great candidates?
Even the candidates at the children's table, Jindal, Petacki, etc. are all more accomplished than the four clowns I watched this week.
Everyone was applauding Hillary's performance. What was she up against. Chaffee stuttered through every answer, Web spent all of his time complaining that he wasn't getting enough time. And Hugo Chavez II was trying to double our 18 trillion dollar debt by giving everyone more "free stuff."
Hilliary and Sanders have years of experience vs filing casino bankruptcy filings and offending Muslims. Maybe someday the GOP won't just consist of angry rich white guys and their wives shaking their jewelry running the party but its not likely.
(10-16-2015 01:07 PM)toddjnsn Wrote: [ -> ]Quote:In other words if you are a U.S. citizen, live in Indiana and want to go to Western Michigan University you will pay the higher outstate tuition rates, but if you're an illegal immigrant you get instate rates.
I didn't watch the debate (only news highlights of Trump in the Repub debates) -- but I'm assuming they mean in-state for what you're (illegally) residing in. Not go-anywhere for in-state.
I think it's referencing Dick Durbin's amendment to the Dream Act:
Quote:As currently written, Durbin's amendment would permit illegals to "earn" their citizenship through either enrolling in college or entering the military. If the amendment passes — even without the mandatory tuition break for illegals — expect many states to act on their own to extend in-state tuition to illegals. As Heritage reports, 10 states are already granting such benefits to illegals — in blatant violation of federal law.
This comes from a Conservative site that one can obviously see in it's wording, but the point is -- if you're an illegal living in MI, you'll be allowed to get in-state tuition here in MI. Not anyone from Indiana or California, etc.
Basically like a squatter living on a piece of land for a long time undisturbed being able to claim it as their residence. Basically as overstaying your welcome coming into the country as a non-citizen, if you "squatted" in that state for a long time, you can get in-state tuition on your way to becoming a true citizen. IMO, that's OK if you can show evidence of staying in the state, brought here as a kid, being in the state growing up for years. *IF* we are going to employ the dream act, to have someone earn their stripes to be a citizen, you would want them to be a college grad at the end of the day, right? Already with Way over-priced college tuition, no need to make it more expensive with out-of-state tuition costs.
IMO, it'd be part of the process of "It's okay to stay" aka Dream Act, IF that applies to you. I think the debate rages on in the conditions to have people stay VS kicking them out of the bar.
Hot Canadian chicks are always welcome to stay.
Is there such a thing? Aren't they built like lumberjacks?
(10-16-2015 04:03 PM)emu79 Wrote: [ -> ]Now I know Chipdip has lost his mind. Listen the circus clown car of GOP candidates aren't fit to run a lemonade stand let alone this country. Do you want any of them to have their hand on the nuclear button? Yeah vote for them if you want to see a war with Iran, more US boots in Syria and any where else where we're likely to fail.
Obama a failure lets look at the economy he inherited in January 2009 and compare to today. He faced the worst economic crisis since the Great Depression ( actually FDR was bailed out of that one by WWII or it would have lasted much longer). The stimulus money that many of the GOP governors were only too happy to suck up actually improved the US infrastructure like roads. The US today gets about 15% of its energy via renewable resources a good way to tell Iraq and Iran we don't need any thank you. Michigan would have been a ghost town without the restructuring of GM and Chrysler not to mention how many parts suppliers (mostly non union) would have gone out of business. The Michigan GOP would not have anything left to govern without Obama's auto bailout with conditions. Even today in Michigan most job growth is auto related which would never have occurred without Obama. And we could go on about how Obama insisted that loans to banks and Wall Street give the US taxpayer reward for the risk and Dodd Frank. More Americans have medical insurance which means the uninsured costs don't get passed on in increased medical rates to employers. The rate of medical inflation has slowed. Yes after Bush spent billions in corrupt war contracts in Iraq training the military he agreed to a withdraw schedule that Obama stuck to.
Its scary (yes it halloween) to think what McCain/Palin or Milt Romney would have done in Obama's shoes. The majority of American people twice decided that Obama was better than the alternatives handed to them by the GOP. Expect a repeat in 2016.
There's nothing in the GOP platform for the average middle class American. And quick name five major legislative acts that have come out of the US House in the 8 years of GOP control? No you can't count getting rid of Obamacare, shutting the federal government down, endless pandering on immigration (funny how none of the solutions deal with prosecuting the companies that hire illegal immigrants) and of course lets investigate Libya 9 separate times.
Lastly the GOP approval percentage in the US is 32% which by the way is much higher than the Michigan voters give their Michigan GOP legislature which at last count was 20%. All well earned I might add.
Let me guess. You're supporting Hugo Bernie Sanders Chavez.
stop dreaming, in time the DNC will destroy Bernie quicker than you can say Howard Dean.
As for the MI GOP having a 20%approval rating, tell me then, why do we keep electing Republicans in the senate, house, and governor? Elections, appear to be the only poll that matters.