According to this Johnson City Press article
http://www.johnsoncitypress.com/article/...ially-gone
First he says
Quote:In our world, it comes down to wins and losses and competing for championships,” Sander said. “Over the last three or four years, our won-loss record in the conference hasn’t been great. At ETSU, we feel like we ought to compete for championships, and we really haven’t done that.”
Sounds good.
But then talking about Bartow's contract.
Quote:If he doesn’t take another job for the remainder of the contract, ETSU’s hit would be $360,000. The current contract, signed last April, ends on April 1, 2017.
If you weren't happy with the direction the program was going for the last 2-3 years (subtracting this past year from his quote) Why in the hell did you extend Bartow two years and give him a raise after last season????
If you remember, most everyone was happy with Bartow after last season. He took a team that most people thought didnt have much talent and beat expectations.
(03-15-2015 07:19 AM)etsubuc Wrote: [ -> ]If you remember, most everyone was happy with Bartow after last season. He took a team that most people thought didnt have much talent and beat expectations.
Look at the quotes. Sander said they weren't happy with Bartow's win-loss record in the conference for the past few years, if you weren't happy with his performance why extend him?
I'm with Rod. Why in the world did they extend MuBar's contract? A 360k blunder.
(03-15-2015 07:38 AM)ETSUfan1 Wrote: [ -> ]I'm with Rod. Why in the world did they extend MuBar's contract? A 360k blunder.
So Sander extended his contract? I noticed that and was to lazy to check dates after reading it.
Its my understanding that the contract rolled over automatically if he hit certain benchmarks and that was set up BEFORE Sander got there.
(03-14-2015 11:41 PM)RodShaw2 Wrote: [ -> ]According to this Johnson City Press article
http://www.johnsoncitypress.com/article/...ially-gone
First he says
Quote:In our world, it comes down to wins and losses and competing for championships,” Sander said. “Over the last three or four years, our won-loss record in the conference hasn’t been great. At ETSU, we feel like we ought to compete for championships, and we really haven’t done that.”
Sounds good.
But then talking about Bartow's contract.
Quote:If he doesn’t take another job for the remainder of the contract, ETSU’s hit would be $360,000. The current contract, signed last April, ends on April 1, 2017.
If you weren't happy with the direction the program was going for the last 2-3 years (subtracting this past year from his quote) Why in the hell did you extend Bartow two years and give him a raise after last season????
My feelings exactly. Throughout this whole ordeal I have wondered and wondered how in the world he could have been extended. I assumed that Mullins had done it as last blow against us. But now the water is muddy. In either case we are now better off. The energy that the new coach will bring will generate much more than the buy out will take.
I don't know. On the surface, the decision to extend Bartow's contract seems like a blunder. At the same time, except for wins and losses, I'm not privy to the myriad considerations Dr. Sander must account for. Maybe Bartow's connections and supporters locally and nationally influenced Dr.Sander's to extend his contract with strings.
In my profession, I am critized for decisions that, on the surface, seem misguided (and some are). However, those decisions often developed from a great deal of time, effort, and consultation. For me this conversation is a moot point - the corrective action took place. To use a banking metaphor, Dr. Sander's deposits far outweigh this withdraw.
(03-15-2015 10:27 AM)Bucfaithful Wrote: [ -> ]I don't know. On the surface, the decision to extend Bartow's contract seems like a blunder. At the same time, except for wins and losses, I'm not privy to the myriad considerations Dr. Sander must account for. Maybe Bartow's connections and supporters locally and nationally influenced Dr.Sander's to extend his contract with strings.
In my profession, I am critized for decisions that, on the surface, seem misguided (and some are). However, those decisions often developed from a great deal of time, effort, and consultation. For me this conversation is a moot point - the corrective action took place. To use a banking metaphor, Dr. Sander's deposits far outweigh this withdraw.
In other words "it is worth it".
(03-15-2015 11:14 AM)bucfan81 Wrote: [ -> ] (03-15-2015 10:27 AM)Bucfaithful Wrote: [ -> ]I don't know. On the surface, the decision to extend Bartow's contract seems like a blunder. At the same time, except for wins and losses, I'm not privy to the myriad considerations Dr. Sander must account for. Maybe Bartow's connections and supporters locally and nationally influenced Dr.Sander's to extend his contract with strings.
In my profession, I am critized for decisions that, on the surface, seem misguided (and some are). However, those decisions often developed from a great deal of time, effort, and consultation. For me this conversation is a moot point - the corrective action took place. To use a banking metaphor, Dr. Sander's deposits far outweigh this withdraw.
In other words "it is worth it".
Yes, every penny.
(03-15-2015 12:51 PM)Bucfaithful Wrote: [ -> ] (03-15-2015 11:14 AM)bucfan81 Wrote: [ -> ] (03-15-2015 10:27 AM)Bucfaithful Wrote: [ -> ]I don't know. On the surface, the decision to extend Bartow's contract seems like a blunder. At the same time, except for wins and losses, I'm not privy to the myriad considerations Dr. Sander must account for. Maybe Bartow's connections and supporters locally and nationally influenced Dr.Sander's to extend his contract with strings.
In my profession, I am critized for decisions that, on the surface, seem misguided (and some are). However, those decisions often developed from a great deal of time, effort, and consultation. For me this conversation is a moot point - the corrective action took place. To use a banking metaphor, Dr. Sander's deposits far outweigh this withdraw.
In other words "it is worth it".
Yes, every penny.
I have to disagree, I don't think it was worth 360k to appease Bartow supporters and then fire him.
Tell him he you aren't happy and his contract will not be extended until after the season, based on his performance this year. If he doesn't like it he leaves, we owe him nothing and we hire a new coach. Wasted money.
I think Bartow will find another job by the 2016-17 season. And ETSU gets out for $180k tops. Just a guess.
(03-15-2015 01:16 PM)Bucfaithful Wrote: [ -> ]Not that simple Rod.
Explain, he was under contract to coach though the 2014-15 year. Sander is saying he wasn't happy with the way things were progressing. Why would he be forced extend Bartow's contract 2 years (and give him a raise). Why not say you have this last year to prove yourself. If he didn't like that he could quit, if his "Friends" wanted him to stay then get them to agree to underwrite Bartow's salary.
Even if for some reason he HAD to extend him, why not 1 year?
Anyway you look at it, Sander gambled 360k last year and lost.
Yeah it is much more complex than this. But at this point, I think Sander has earned our trust. We wanted Bartow gone. He's gone. I think we should celebrate! Good days ahead! Go Bucs go!
Whatever, it was a rollover clause left over from Mullins days like Lover seems to think that is one thing, but to extend the contract of an employee that is underperforming is just bad business.
I have no idea if Sander extended his contract to appease a certain consituency. I used that as an example to illustrate that it may be more complicated than you presume. That's my only point. Maybe there was a performance-based provision that said "if you win 18 games and go to the post-season you'll get a second year", which is exactly what happened.
I just don't know ALL the details and neither do you.
Why are we worrying about the nuances of stuff that we have NO inside knowledge of?
We wanted him gone. PRESTO! He's gone. We should celebrate!
Rod's comments sound remarkably armchair quarterback. The intricacies of contracts and job performance and funding and donor bases is all interwoven. Can't just pick one thing and jump up and down about it. Lot of factors influencing this decision beyond a specific number of wins.
(03-15-2015 05:20 PM)CaptainJackAubrey Wrote: [ -> ]Why are we worrying about the nuances of stuff that we have NO inside knowledge of?
We wanted him gone. PRESTO! He's gone. We should celebrate!
Rod's comments sound remarkably armchair quarterback. The intricacies of contracts and job performance and funding and donor bases is all interwoven. Can't just pick one thing and jump up and down about it. Lot of factors influencing this decision beyond a specific number of wins.
No Rod's comments sound remarkably like someone who thinks it was stupid to give Bartow a contract extension if you were having doubts about his performance (Sander, not me said we haven't been competing for the last 3-4 years, NOT ME). If it was a rollover deal he had no control over that is one thing, not his fault. BucFaithful is the one who brought up donor pressure, again not me, I was just saying that is pretty stupid reason as well, if the donor were pressuring him to keep Bartow last year where were those donors this year when he decided to fire him, if the donors were putting pressure on him then he should have put it back on them to underwrite it. No we probably won't know why Bartow was extended but I do think it was waste of 360,000 dollars that ETSU had lots of better uses for. Happy to get rid of Bartow, not happy having to pay him for a new contract that he will not work 1 day of, sounds like a Mullins move.
But you got to love the people who come on here and hint at inside knowledge but never actually share anything until afterwards, then they say yeah I knew all about it.