Before I begin this post, congrats to CUSA for a good start in basketball. That is a nice bonus added to a very good effort from this football season.
In picking up NIU and MSU, CUSA would gain the second university in each state and in two states with a large population. MSU also brings good basketball; NIU basketball is not much.
CUSA has many good expansion candidates. This proposal in this post is but one of many options available to CUSA as it gets ready for its soon to be tv negotiations. The good football, now followed by a good basketball start, is promising. This two year window for CUSA to renegotiate its tv contract is just right, it is long enough to allow CUSA to establish its new brand but short enough to expand upon its current tv contract:
CUSA/WEST BY TRAVEL PARTNER:
NIU/Missouri State
UTEP/UTSA
UNT/LaTech
Rice/Southern Miss
CUSA/EAST BY TRAVEL PARTNER:
FIU/FAU
ODU/Marshall
WKU/UAB
MTU/Charlotte
Lots of travel for NIU with little upside. Now if the big 12 offered, that's another story but why leave the MAC? If missouri state wants to invest the $, i like them for CUSA or mac with maybe arkansas state.
that would be a downgrade for NIU if anything
(12-03-2013 10:49 AM)john01992 Wrote: [ -> ]that would be a downgrade for NIU if anything
In the short term yes but long term I don't think so. jmho.
I see no reason why NIU would entertain an invite from C-USA. They have a good conference now and should wait for a possible AAC invite down the road. A bit more money and exposure in the AAC.
(12-03-2013 10:54 AM)MinerInWisconsin Wrote: [ -> ] (12-03-2013 10:49 AM)john01992 Wrote: [ -> ]that would be a downgrade for NIU if anything
In the short term yes but long term I don't think so. jmho.
I see no reason why NIU would entertain an invite from C-USA. They have a good conference now and should wait for a possible AAC invite down the road. A bit more money and exposure in the AAC.
NIU is a midwest school whose student body, alumni, peer schools & rivals are located mostly in the midwest.
and until a power conference comes calling its hard to say that they will break away from a midwest based conference
(12-03-2013 11:02 AM)john01992 Wrote: [ -> ] (12-03-2013 10:54 AM)MinerInWisconsin Wrote: [ -> ] (12-03-2013 10:49 AM)john01992 Wrote: [ -> ]that would be a downgrade for NIU if anything
In the short term yes but long term I don't think so. jmho.
I see no reason why NIU would entertain an invite from C-USA. They have a good conference now and should wait for a possible AAC invite down the road. A bit more money and exposure in the AAC.
NIU is a midwest school whose student body, alumni, peer schools & rivals are located mostly in the midwest.
and until a power conference comes calling its hard to say that they will break away from a midwest based conference
Yeah. Not sure they would even go to the AAC which could offer a little more money and exposure than CUSA. NIU is probably where they belong.
Arky State, Texas St, JMU, and Missouri State (already mentioned in the OP) are probably better additions that either fit within or more reasonably expand the current CUSA footprint. Honestly, the best world for everyone, UTEP would get a MW invite, and CUSA could pickup Texas State as a replacement, and then add 2 of MS, JMU, and Arky St to jump to 16. That actually tightens the footprint while expanding it to a couple of new states. MS and Arky State are true number 2's within their state and JMU is an ODU type with a lot of growth potential. JMU, MS, and ArkySt all offer decent basketball as well. Adding Texas State in Texas really ramps of the level of rivalry with schools in all the biggest population areas (Houston, San Antonio, Dallas, and Austin).
I can't think of any benefit to NIU to move to CUSA.
Tallgrass,
You can't be serious
See Marshall on when the last time a MAC shool left for C-USA!
(12-03-2013 11:24 AM)HawaiiMongoose Wrote: [ -> ]I can't think of any benefit to NIU to move to CUSA.
Its a two-way street. I cant think of any benefit CUSA would have in getting NIU. NIU is where they belong. Now Missouri State on the other hand might be a good fit for CUSA down the road.
(12-03-2013 11:16 AM)Attackcoog Wrote: [ -> ] (12-03-2013 11:02 AM)john01992 Wrote: [ -> ] (12-03-2013 10:54 AM)MinerInWisconsin Wrote: [ -> ] (12-03-2013 10:49 AM)john01992 Wrote: [ -> ]that would be a downgrade for NIU if anything
In the short term yes but long term I don't think so. jmho.
I see no reason why NIU would entertain an invite from C-USA. They have a good conference now and should wait for a possible AAC invite down the road. A bit more money and exposure in the AAC.
NIU is a midwest school whose student body, alumni, peer schools & rivals are located mostly in the midwest.
and until a power conference comes calling its hard to say that they will break away from a midwest based conference
Yeah. Not sure they would even go to the AAC which could offer a little more money and exposure than CUSA. NIU is probably where they belong.
Arky State, Texas St, JMU, and Missouri State (already mentioned in the OP) are probably better additions that either fit within or more reasonably expand the current CUSA footprint. Honestly, the best world for everyone, UTEP would get a MW invite, and CUSA could pickup Texas State as a replacement, and then add 2 of MS, JMU, and Arky St to jump to 16. That actually tightens the footprint while expanding it to a couple of new states. MS and Arky State are true number 2's within their state and JMU is an ODU type with a lot of growth potential. JMU, MS, and ArkySt all offer decent basketball as well. Adding Texas State in Texas really ramps of the level of rivalry with schools in all the biggest population areas (Houston, San Antonio, Dallas, and Austin).
Good analysis Coog. I agree with everything you said.
I'm fine with that expansion plan for CUSA. But I really don't see it happening.
(12-03-2013 10:54 AM)MinerInWisconsin Wrote: [ -> ] (12-03-2013 10:49 AM)john01992 Wrote: [ -> ]that would be a downgrade for NIU if anything
In the short term yes but long term I don't think so. jmho.
I see no reason why NIU would entertain an invite from C-USA. They have a good conference now and should wait for a possible AAC invite down the road. A bit more money and exposure in the AAC.
I can see where it may be worth it for both NIU and the AAC but only under certain conditions. If somehow the AAC can convince Army to join then I think NIU coming in with them would be the perfect offset.
The AAC can offer better TV money, significantly more TV exposure, recruiting ties into Florida and Texas, and will bring them into a conference with more of a national and less regional perception over the MAC. I think next season will be big for NIU with the loss of Jordan Lynch to see how much of the teams success was directly attributed to him.
AAC East
UConn
Army
Navy
Temple
ECU
USF
UCF
AAC West
Cincinnati
NIU
Memphis
Tulane
Tulsa
SMU
Houston
That’s not a bad line up going into the TV contract negotiations, but it only makes sense if Army agreed to join as well, otherwise stay at 12.
Northern Illinois should hold out for the AAC.
Missouri State might be a good one though for CUSA in an attempt to improve their hoops profile.
(12-03-2013 01:45 PM)NYCTUFan Wrote: [ -> ] (12-03-2013 10:54 AM)MinerInWisconsin Wrote: [ -> ] (12-03-2013 10:49 AM)john01992 Wrote: [ -> ]that would be a downgrade for NIU if anything
In the short term yes but long term I don't think so. jmho.
I see no reason why NIU would entertain an invite from C-USA. They have a good conference now and should wait for a possible AAC invite down the road. A bit more money and exposure in the AAC.
I can see where it may be worth it for both NIU and the AAC but only under certain conditions. If somehow the AAC can convince Army to join then I think NIU coming in with them would be the perfect offset.
The AAC can offer better TV money, significantly more TV exposure, recruiting ties into Florida and Texas, and will bring them into a conference with more of a national and less regional perception over the MAC. I think next season will be big for NIU with the loss of Jordan Lynch to see how much of the teams success was directly attributed to him.
AAC East
UConn
Army
Navy
Temple
ECU
USF
UCF
AAC West
Cincinnati
NIU
Memphis
Tulane
Tulsa
SMU
Houston
That’s not a bad line up going into the TV contract negotiations, but it only makes sense if Army agreed to join as well, otherwise stay at 12.
I would also make VCU and UMass Olympic-sports-only additions in the above example to put the finishing touches on the AAC. That would strengthen the conference on TV, on the field, and on the court. Other schools with future AAC potential are FIU (47K student body), Arky St (true number 2 in the state), UMass (if they ever commit to football), Texas State (3rd largest student body in Texas at 35K located 20 minutes from Austin and 40 minutes from San Antonio), ODU (large market and AAC sized budget), and UTSA (31K student body and off to a good start in a large market with no pro football).
NUI seems to be doing just fine in the MAC.
I don't see any reason that NoILL would make a jump to C-USA (which is competitively a current step down and long-term, a parallel move at best). Frankly, I can't see any MAC school taking such a suggestion seriously. C-USA is increasingly a southeast/Texas conference. Our most southernly member is in SW Ohio.
I also don't think that NoILL has the fan base size the AAC wants - and frankly it doesn't mean much of a bump for NoILL's bottom line either. It's a huge increase in travel costs and a small bump in $$. It's also a big risk increase: if/When Cincinnati and UConn get invited elsewhere, it would probably be a very bad financial move for NoILL as they would be out on an island in a largely southern conference.
MissouriSt however, I could see fitting into several different conferences because of geography. They are adjacent to the MAC, to C-USA, to the SunBelt. If I were them, I would weigh all my options carefully. When you're an unknown, several conferences may take a chance on you developing. But once you are established, (especially if you come off as a disappointment), you're kind of stuck where you landed.
(12-03-2013 03:52 PM)nert Wrote: [ -> ]I don't see any reason that NoILL would make a jump to C-USA (which is competitively a current step down and long-term, a parallel move at best). Frankly, I can't see any MAC school taking such a suggestion seriously. C-USA is increasingly a southeast/Texas conference. Our most southernly member is in SW Ohio.
I also don't think that NoILL has the fan base size the AAC wants - and frankly it doesn't mean much of a bump for NoILL's bottom line either. It's a huge increase in travel costs and a small bump in $$. It's also a big risk increase: if/When Cincinnati and UConn get invited elsewhere, it would probably be a very bad financial move for NoILL as they would be out on an island in a largely southern conference.
MissouriSt however, I could see fitting into several different conferences because of geography. They are adjacent to the MAC, to C-USA, to the SunBelt. If I were them, I would weigh all my options carefully. When you're an unknown, sevral conferences may take a chance on you developing. But once you are established, (especially if you come off as a disappointment), you're kind of stuck where you landed.
All great points, but I think what also needs to be considered is that if NIU has a long term desire to end up in a place like the Big 12 it would be a much easier ride from a place like the AAC (proven to be a stepping stone to the P5) than it would be from the MAC.
(12-03-2013 04:00 PM)NYCTUFan Wrote: [ -> ] (12-03-2013 03:52 PM)nert Wrote: [ -> ]I don't see any reason that NoILL would make a jump to C-USA (which is competitively a current step down and long-term, a parallel move at best). Frankly, I can't see any MAC school taking such a suggestion seriously. C-USA is increasingly a southeast/Texas conference. Our most southernly member is in SW Ohio.
I also don't think that NoILL has the fan base size the AAC wants - and frankly it doesn't mean much of a bump for NoILL's bottom line either. It's a huge increase in travel costs and a small bump in $$. It's also a big risk increase: if/When Cincinnati and UConn get invited elsewhere, it would probably be a very bad financial move for NoILL as they would be out on an island in a largely southern conference.
MissouriSt however, I could see fitting into several different conferences because of geography. They are adjacent to the MAC, to C-USA, to the SunBelt. If I were them, I would weigh all my options carefully. When you're an unknown, several conferences may take a chance on you developing. But once you are established, (especially if you come off as a disappointment), you're kind of stuck where you landed.
All great points, but I think what also needs to be considered is that if NIU has a long term desire to end up in a place like the Big 12 it would be a much easier ride from a place like the AAC (proven to be a stepping stone to the P5) than it would be from the MAC.
Yes and No.
It was the BigEast that was a proven stepping stone. We'll have to see if the AAC is going to have that reputation. The vast majority of this conference (Temple, Navy, ECU, Memphis, UCF, Tulane, SMU, Houston, Tulsa) were teams that filled the void left by those teams that jumped to the next level (WVirginia, L'ville, Pitt, Syracuse, Rutgers). Remember - only 3 former BigEast schools (USF, Cincinnati and UConn) are in the AAC for more than a waiting year. The one-year members (L'ville and Rutgers) were on their way out before the conference even existed.
However - I do believe the next two to be called up will come from a very small group that includes 2 AAC schools (which are also former BigEast schools): UConn, Cincinnati and BYU. After that, I think dreams of being called-up become pretty far fetched fantasies.
(12-03-2013 04:00 PM)NYCTUFan Wrote: [ -> ] (12-03-2013 03:52 PM)nert Wrote: [ -> ]I don't see any reason that NoILL would make a jump to C-USA (which is competitively a current step down and long-term, a parallel move at best). Frankly, I can't see any MAC school taking such a suggestion seriously. C-USA is increasingly a southeast/Texas conference. Our most southernly member is in SW Ohio.
I also don't think that NoILL has the fan base size the AAC wants - and frankly it doesn't mean much of a bump for NoILL's bottom line either. It's a huge increase in travel costs and a small bump in $$. It's also a big risk increase: if/When Cincinnati and UConn get invited elsewhere, it would probably be a very bad financial move for NoILL as they would be out on an island in a largely southern conference.
MissouriSt however, I could see fitting into several different conferences because of geography. They are adjacent to the MAC, to C-USA, to the SunBelt. If I were them, I would weigh all my options carefully. When you're an unknown, sevral conferences may take a chance on you developing. But once you are established, (especially if you come off as a disappointment), you're kind of stuck where you landed.
All great points, but I think what also needs to be considered is that if NIU has a long term desire to end up in a place like the Big 12 it would be a much easier ride from a place like the AAC (proven to be a stepping stone to the P5) than it would be from the MAC.
Great point.
(12-03-2013 04:20 PM)nert Wrote: [ -> ] (12-03-2013 04:00 PM)NYCTUFan Wrote: [ -> ] (12-03-2013 03:52 PM)nert Wrote: [ -> ]I don't see any reason that NoILL would make a jump to C-USA (which is competitively a current step down and long-term, a parallel move at best). Frankly, I can't see any MAC school taking such a suggestion seriously. C-USA is increasingly a southeast/Texas conference. Our most southernly member is in SW Ohio.
I also don't think that NoILL has the fan base size the AAC wants - and frankly it doesn't mean much of a bump for NoILL's bottom line either. It's a huge increase in travel costs and a small bump in $$. It's also a big risk increase: if/When Cincinnati and UConn get invited elsewhere, it would probably be a very bad financial move for NoILL as they would be out on an island in a largely southern conference.
MissouriSt however, I could see fitting into several different conferences because of geography. They are adjacent to the MAC, to C-USA, to the SunBelt. If I were them, I would weigh all my options carefully. When you're an unknown, sevral conferences may take a chance on you developing. But once you are established, (especially if you come off as a disappointment), you're kind of stuck where you landed.
All great points, but I think what also needs to be considered is that if NIU has a long term desire to end up in a place like the Big 12 it would be a much easier ride from a place like the AAC (proven to be a stepping stone to the P5) than it would be from the MAC.
Yes and No.
It was the BigEast that was a proven stepping stone. We'll have to see if the AAC is going to have that reputation. The vast majority of this conference (Temple, Navy, ECU, Memphis, UCF, Tulane, SMU, Houston, Tulsa) were teams that filled the void left by those teams that jumped to the next level (WVirginia, L'ville, Pitt, Syracuse, Rutgers). Remember - only 3 former BigEast schools (USF, Cincinnati and UConn) are in the AAC for more than a waiting year. The one-year members (L'ville and Rutgers) were on their way out before the conference even existed.
However - I do believe the next two to be called up will come from a very small group that includes 2 AAC schools (which are also former BigEast schools): UConn, Cincinnati and BYU. After that, I think dreams of being called-up become pretty far fetched fantasies.
That was his point. The reason only 3 BE football schools are left is because that has been the primary incubator for P-5 schools. The MW has been the other. The AAC/Big East has been the 6th best conference and continues to be so. I suspect that the AAC and MW will continue to be the P-5 holding tank for future additions. The MAC, reminds me a lot of the SWC conference in that it may be too regional for its own good. The tight footprint is great for rivalries and travel costs, but it also severely limits the attractiveness of the league to national TV networks.