Well, I do not have a dog in this fight. but it seems obviously, that no FBS- conference, even the sunbelt, does want to take Liberty as a member. So there is virtually no chance for Liberty to upgrade to FBS, because the NCAA states that you have to be a member of a FBS conference to upgrade. You cannot upgrade as an independent. So what can Liberty do? In my eyes, it is some kind of a monopoly and someone is shut out of the "FBS-Business", because of their religious belief.
If Liberty fulfill all other criteria to be a FBS-School, the NCAA should Liberty allow to upgrade as an independent. Maybe Liberty will have a hard time to schedule other teams, but i think in the long run they will find schools, which are willing to play against them. I wonder, if BYU would a have found a conference today, if they were in the same situation like Liberty. Sorry for my Englsih, it's not my native language. I appreciate your answers, especially from these guys, who know what laws could apply to this case. I indeed see the problem of scorched earth for Liberty, if they going to sue the NCAA, which is nothing less than the other schools, but maybe it is worth a try, if there is no other way to move up.
Everyone assumes that Liberty is shut out because of religious beliefs, but the truth is they are on the radar for the Sun Belt. Patience is a virtue. It took a couple years after both App st and Georgia Southern to get invited and they have very strong football traditions. The BEST thing Liberty can do to make their case stronger is WIN, WIN, and WIN in football. Winning will cure any ills people may perceive.
Who says they are shut out. I haven't seen a credible link that they are shut out. I have seen links that they are being considered.
Liberty may be a bunch of religious nut cases but if they add value in football to the Sun Belt, those nut cases will be overlooked.
The member of a conference rule was actually designed to simplify the process after the five home game rule was adopted.
Previously you had to give the NCAA signed contracts showing you could meet schedule requirements for the next four years but there was no home requirement.
Can Liberty sue? Of course. Can they win? Maybe but most likely NCAA just changes rule to a conference invite OR submit four years worth of signed contracts showing you can meet requirements. Court will hold that is reasonable and wish them good luck finding enough home games.
Sure. And then they can sue Alabama for not scheduling a home game at Liberty.
Personally I fail to see how the NCAA can keep a school down a level.
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(04-05-2013 02:11 PM)uakronkid Wrote: [ -> ]Sure. And then they can sue Alabama for not scheduling a home game at Liberty.
Hard to show discrimination on that one, unless they make it a class action suit.
(04-05-2013 02:07 PM)arkstfan Wrote: [ -> ]The member of a conference rule was actually designed to simplify the process after the five home game rule was adopted.
Previously you had to give the NCAA signed contracts showing you could meet schedule requirements for the next four years but there was no home requirement.
Can Liberty sue? Of course. Can they win? Maybe but most likely NCAA just changes rule to a conference invite OR submit four years worth of signed contracts showing you can meet requirements. Court will hold that is reasonable and wish them good luck finding enough home games.
The home game rule is what would keep them out as an independent, if the "bona fide invitation from a conference" rule weren't in place.
Now one interesting loophole they could exploit is if they were to petition the WAC for an invite. As a "former FBS conference" the WAC qualifies as a conference that can hep establish Liberty as an FBS school. The problem is that the WAC no longer sponsors football.
Except even if NCAA ruled favorably on the WAC deal meeting the schedule requirement is still an issue.
(04-05-2013 02:13 PM)jmufan Wrote: [ -> ]Personally I fail to see how the NCAA can keep a school down a level.
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It's not the NCAA's call. Its The committee in charge of the FCS. They wanted the old moratorium, they wanted the Conference requirement. Its all to prevent the kind of exodus we're seeing right now. The FCS is what's holding more FCS teams from leaving.
(04-05-2013 02:13 PM)jmufan Wrote: [ -> ]Personally I fail to see how the NCAA can keep a school down a level.
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The NCAA has the right to set requirements for membership etc as long as they are not discriminatory. Those regs apply to all fcs schools wanting to move up
(04-05-2013 02:00 PM)jdgaucho Wrote: [ -> ]Liberty may be a bunch of religious nut cases but if they add value in football to the Sun Belt, those nut cases will be overlooked.
Just curious, but in your way of thinking, isn't the term "religious nut cases" redundant, or can one be "religious" without being a "nut case"?
(04-05-2013 02:27 PM)uakronkid Wrote: [ -> ][quote='jmufan' pid='9202607' dateline='1365189212']
Personally I fail to see how the NCAA can keep a school down a level.
They'd argue its a reasonable bylaw to offer student athletes at all member schools a reasonable opportunity to compete at a reasonable level. But I think that's probably shy a "reasonable" or two, so sprinkle some more in wherever you'd like.
Quote: It's not the NCAA's call. Its The committee in charge of the FCS. They wanted the old moratorium, they wanted the Conference requirement. Its all to prevent the kind of exodus we're seeing right now. The FCS is what's holding more FCS teams from leaving.
A Division 1 FCS subdivision committee is part of the NCAA. That's just saying with PART of the NCAA is making the decision ~ and indeed, precisely why they are.
(04-05-2013 02:30 PM)indydoug Wrote: [ -> ] (04-05-2013 02:00 PM)jdgaucho Wrote: [ -> ]Liberty may be a bunch of religious nut cases but if they add value in football to the Sun Belt, those nut cases will be overlooked.
Just curious, but in your way of thinking, isn't the term "religious nut cases" redundant, or can one be "religious" without being a "nut case"?
One can be "religious" without being a "nut case." Passionate about religion while still showing some semblance of sanity or open mindedness.
IMO if they avoid Liberty it will be because they have a reputation as an online college.** Schools like FIU and ULM are in a fierce competition with online schools for students. If an online schools adds D-1A football, it helps to legitimize the whole online college industry. That takes away one of the few remaining perception advantages that smaller, community-oriented state schools currently have over online schools.
**I know that they have a real campus, but it would be one of the smallest in D-1A with only 12,000 enrolled, 40% of whom are commuters. And they don't have the sprawling graduate research labs that other small D-1A schools like Duke and Vanderbilt have.
If Liberty banded together with other FCS schools that also wanted their FBS ticket punched - Lamar, Jax St, Youngstown St, Sam Houston St - in a class action, the NCAA would almost have to relent before it went before a court.
I'm sure if Liberty found seven (preferably 11) schools willing to go with them, they could petition a conference to reorganize as an FBS conference. The problem is that the playoff revenue among the G5 would have to be reallocated among six conferences.
I actually see this being more a problem with the western schools-if a Cal Poly or Eastern Washington wants to move up, what realistic options will thy have? A bloc of Big Sky and Big West schools wanting to move up might have a better case before a jury.
(04-05-2013 05:09 PM)GoApps70 Wrote: [ -> ]Liberty students and fans would not believe that they are an online college, they believe they are a mega-university as this article says.
Virginia’s Liberty transforms into evangelical mega-university
http://www.washingtonpost.com/local/educ...story.html
They can believe what they want, but they're becoming an online college.
If I were a Liberty grad I'd be angry that they're devaluing my degree by handing out tens of thousands of online degrees every year.