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http://www.mlive.com/broncos/index.ssf/2...n_mic.html

More than just words, we're seeing the action.

Maturing here. I like the vibe I'm hearing and feeling.

I'm not a happy talker, never have been.

Point being, this team needs to continue to amp it up. Take it to the next level. And I think they can.

Started a thread earlier based on Akron's Dambrodt reportedly looking to try and get a high brow Bracket buster match up, even going on the road, to make up for their own deficit of not having any quality road wins.

So back to the point. Though the West is not even won, nor the anything above that, I like the idea of "chumming the water" and challenging the kids with the big fish.

Throw some bait out there. Say your trying it.

I understand the angst about home games. I appreciate the concern about the welfare of the freshman. Neither are in the best interest of the programs development.

You don't want to plateau. Then don't. But if your'e not striving you will plateau.

So chum the water. Run it up the flag pole. Let the kids know you believe in them. Use a lil psychology on the BB deciders. Go to them and say we'll travel but only to WSU, SDSU, or whomever. Knowing they may not bite you may still get a marquee name coming to UA. Keep your mouth shut? You plateau. You settle.
This group needs the accelerator pushed down some more.

Right now WMU has two bigs that are starting to realize that both individually and as a unit are thee factor here. Not in a selfish manner but in confident self assured way. Also I getting a vibe that they feel "responsible" to "pick it up" and not just occupy space.

Nate continues to play D and hasnt shown signs of discombobulating because he cant jack up 20 shots. He still makes a hairbrained decision now and then but isnt going off half cocked most of the time.

I think Brandon is playing with less pressure as D Brown is making significant contributions and the result for Pokely is a better floor game and letting shot opportunities come to him. Not pressing.

We all are seeing DB embracing this add'l chance to play. It's cool to watch him experience it. It's almost as cool to see the results.

I know some may feel the PG is the weak link. Maybe it is. But every team has at least one weak link in their chain. For some, it's no bench depth. That is proving not to be the case for WMU. I feel both Jared and AR will continue to be fine. AR is playing with a little more "swerve". He's feeling he doesnt have to have 44 to be a factor. Jared still trying to find his spot but you know in the back of his mind he remembers OU and that he more than held his own. In time, it'll come.

"The freshman". LOL. They're sophomores now. Let the dogs loose. Play with some OU abandon. A lil swagger. Quit coddling.

They gave you the cue at USF. They don't scare. They manned up. I know USF blows but nobody knew it then and they responded when all they knew was that it was a BE prograrm. The kids didnt blink. They threw a haymaker and it landed.

For their sake dont go back to a neutral corner and let the mind set come back that we want to win the MAC West. Please dont go there. 03-puke
WMU doesn't gain much by taking this game on the road IMO.

Would seem silly to do so:
- Currently in the midst of a nice winning streak.
- Finally starting to amp up home attendance again and renewed interest in the program.
- They've got a couple of nice road wins (@USF, @High Point, @Miami, @CMU) - a.k.a. they've proved they're capable.
- WMU fans just got done complaining about having one home game in 41 days (rightfully so).

If you're WMU, you take these 'exciting' home games when you can get them.
(02-03-2013 04:17 PM)gobaseline Wrote: [ -> ]For their sake dont go back to a neutral corner and let the mind set come back that we want to win the MAC West. Please dont go there. 03-puke

I only see winning the MAC West as a step on the way to winning in Cleveland.

Agree with Persky on keeping the BB game a home game.
(02-03-2013 04:33 PM)BrianPersky Wrote: [ -> ]WMU doesn't gain much by taking this game on the road IMO.

Would seem silly to do so:
- Currently in the midst of a nice winning streak.
- Finally starting to amp up home attendance again and renewed interest in the program.
- They've got a couple of nice road wins (@USF, @High Point, @Miami, @CMU) - a.k.a. they've proved they're capable.
- WMU fans just got done complaining about having one home game in 41 days (rightfully so).

If you're WMU, you take these 'exciting' home games when you can get them.

Silly or smart depending on your perspective and experience. I understand your points. They have some logic to it. But I purposefully proposed it to stir the pot regarding those who would rather play it safe.

My perspective is to grow the program, not satisfy the non-existing and timid fan base.

My counter is as follows:
1. Worried about a loss and stopping a streak? What significance outside of making a handful of locals feel good is a winning streak if it doesnt take you any where? So WMU wins out the regular season. The program gets puffy chested and loses to (fill in the blank) in the MACC game. Who else besides a few WMU fans care? How does it advance the program?

2. Question! Why arent fans coming in droves now? Will playing My lil buddy U exite the drunk sleeping in students to wake up and attend. Will it get Joe or Jane Buffbody out of the Rec area and quit working on their bod for a couple hours and attend a game?

Will you as a "fan" be upset if they go to Creighton and beat McDermott like a rented mule or will you curl up in fetal position and lay in corner :baby: if the 18K that attended their last home game send home the boys with soiled shorts?

The upside is that WMU gets energized by the opportunity and win. The downside is the kids realize that "THAT is what it takes to get to that level". It's a win/win.

3. So the road wins you listed have proven something? Are you on the selection committee? Have a family member on such? If not, who with any importance to move the program forward is impressed with beating Low Point? USF? CMU? Who?

4. Question! Would WMU fans rather see the team beat IUPUIthreetimesinthemiddleofthenight at UA or go to Creighton in front of 18K cawing bluejay fans only to have Hawk being interviewed after the game wiping Bluejay feathers from his beak and suit describing how good that treat tasted?

I mean really.

The whole point from the article is that these kids arent just talking the talk they're starting to walk the walk.

I don't question that WMU could still lose at UT, BSU and BGSU on the road and even lose to KSU at home. This is still a work in progress.

But given the opportunity or even more insightful, initiating to create the opportunity to showcase your talent you'd chose to stay home to play a nobody in front of 2,300 fans than get prime time?

Margie, where are my balls?
Nobody at home if I have to call it that.

Keep my balls fully wrapped and protected and safe.

Save my juice for Cleveland.
(02-03-2013 05:40 PM)Dirty Ernie Wrote: [ -> ]Nobody at home if I have to call it that.

Keep my balls fully wrapped and protected and safe.

Save my juice for Cleveland.

How would playing a Creighton or Wichita State diminish your juice for Cleveland?

Oh yeah, I got the text from Margie.03-2thumbsup
We haven't beaten anyone of consequence yet, until we do, the fans aren't going to believe that this team is legit and they're going to delay or just not get behind them. Rightfully so.

Not sure about these guys going on the road and most likely getting their clock cleaned again by a high profile OOC program. I see your logic to a point, and agree about playing competition, but I don't think it applies to these "young players" and to our guys in suits on the bench.
(02-03-2013 09:29 PM)DesertBronco Wrote: [ -> ]We haven't beaten anyone of consequence yet, until we do, the fans aren't going to believe that this team is legit and they're going to delay or just not get behind them. Rightfully so.

Not sure about these guys going on the road and most likely getting their clock cleaned again by a high profile OOC program. I see your logic to a point, and agree about playing competition, but I don't think it applies to these "young players" and to our guys in suits on the bench.

Not gonna happen. Just taking the temp. Interested in knowing the DNA of the fans. I understand the hesitency and the logic.

What I find fascinating is on the one hand how as a collective base we disrespect "others" while at the same exact time we are really no better (off). When will expectations actually be raised to match what in reality would need to be done to merit the chest pounding?

Sat with a number of guys today after church talking and eating and the BCS grads were asking about IU, Wiskey, UI, Kansas and Kansas State now that Weber is there. Already talking seeding for the tourney.
They know me. Never once asked how "we" were doing. Then it dawned on me, "Why the heck would they?"
We lost to NCST and used to wipe the floor by U of M.
"Ahh, we beat High Point twice, bounced the Chips in Mt. Pee and took the USF tournament beating USF on their floor!"
Their reply, "Great, so who's tournament is that? USF, what do they sell or make? Did they hold that at Western?"

Now you can poke fun at someone for not knowing who USF is and I understand. But my point all along is why are we worried about ending a winning streak or if the freshman will be damaged psychologically when the rest of world wouldn't know or care to know.

But since we do care and since the lead horse, Akron is reportedly asking to move up just to hopefully improve their chances to get into the tournament, I'd thougth I'd pose the question.

DB, we disagree and agree on a lot. And this isnt anything else other than an agreement, the Suit.

Winning streaks, irate fans, home schedule and freshman psyche be damned. All pap. Self serving. Small minded. West division centric.

But DB you got a point. The suit. Not sure if he is up to the challenge. Not sure he wants the challenge. Better to play it safe. Hang a WD banner, get an extension and hope lightening strikes and everything falls into place in the near future.

But wait, Shayne graduates next year. DB can go down any play and Darius, poor Darius. Who's he gonna pass to after SW graduates?
Seth Dugan?
Do you remember what Shayne was like his freshman year? His RS year? His true junior year? Not until this year, his 4th year in the program is he showing signs. By the time Seth Dugan hits his 3rd year DP will be long gone and the cycle just continues.
My feeling is we're not getting an at-large bid regardless of who we beat in the Bracket Buster. The game is meaningless. It's a break in the conference season... and for what? It means something if we're legitimately looking for another win to boost at-large stock. Otherwise, I just see it as a needless game that risks injury, etc. to your players in the midst of conference season.

If this was similar to 2003-04, or even 2004-05, I could see the logic in going out of our way to play up and going all in trying to win. It just doesn't make sense to me in a season like this. It would be great to beat a good out of conference team. But my feeling is, if you find yourself down 10+ with 10 minutes to play, go to the bench and save your players for the stretch. I never understood why Hawk played Kool 35+ minutes in a Bracket Buster game at SIU where we were down double-digits the entire second half and lost by 17 I think. You have nothing to gain from that. Winning the conference tourney gets us to the NCAA tournament this season. Having one more quality out of conference win doesn't.

I see your logic in taking the shot at a bigger/better opponent, and I agree to a certain extent. Testing this team and seeing what they're made of is something that's important- not just now, but in the long run. I just don't like the timing of the Bracket Buster in general. If it were played at the beginning of conference play, I'd be more inclined to want to play somebody big. I just think there's more to risk and less to gain without an at-large bid to play for.
Quote:DB, we disagree and agree on a lot. And this isnt anything else other than an agreement, the Suit.

Winning streaks, irate fans, home schedule and freshman psyche be damned. All pap. Self serving. Small minded. West division centric.

But DB you got a point. The suit. Not sure if he is up to the challenge. Not sure he wants the challenge. Better to play it safe. Hang a WD banner, get an extension and hope lightening strikes and everything falls into place in the near future.

He's a really good fit with our fan base.
Our bad loss to 8th place (Missouri Valley) Illinois State, will keep us from getting a top level mid major in the Bracket Busters.
(02-03-2013 11:53 PM)dunkface Wrote: [ -> ]My feeling is we're not getting an at-large bid regardless of who we beat in the Bracket Buster. The game is meaningless. It's a break in the conference season... and for what? It means something if we're legitimately looking for another win to boost at-large stock. Otherwise, I just see it as a needless game that risks injury, etc. to your players in the midst of conference season.

If this was similar to 2003-04, or even 2004-05, I could see the logic in going out of our way to play up and going all in trying to win. It just doesn't make sense to me in a season like this. It would be great to beat a good out of conference team. But my feeling is, if you find yourself down 10+ with 10 minutes to play, go to the bench and save your players for the stretch. I never understood why Hawk played Kool 35+ minutes in a Bracket Buster game at SIU where we were down double-digits the entire second half and lost by 17 I think. You have nothing to gain from that. Winning the conference tourney gets us to the NCAA tournament this season. Having one more quality out of conference win doesn't.

I see your logic in taking the shot at a bigger/better opponent, and I agree to a certain extent. Testing this team and seeing what they're made of is something that's important- not just now, but in the long run. I just don't like the timing of the Bracket Buster in general. If it were played at the beginning of conference play, I'd be more inclined to want to play somebody big. I just think there's more to risk and less to gain without an at-large bid to play for.

I agree with your point if the at large wasnt in play.

I simply asked the question.

I have seen some suggest the % of chance to run the reg season table at 4% only 1% less than U of M doing the same.

So we run the table, get to the finals maybe even beating OU to get there and we lose to Akron in the finals. Sans the BB that puts us at 22-7 for the regular season. I dont know how many games in the MACC but lets say 3 more, including the Championship. That is 24-8.

So 24-8 with a possible win at Creighton or Wichita State. 25-8 with that win or 25-8 with a win against Western Illinois.

Hot team in the end with a 14 game winning streak including a win over a top 25 team. Vs the same but WIU?

Chances are neither tilts it but no one could argue that the Blue Jays would be definite edge.

So even hypothetically I'm stunned there are no takers.

No one else cares if we win or lose. What's the diff between 24-9 and getting our head handed to us on a platter or having it 25-8 and the only ones that care (outside of WMU) would say we simply pulled an Akron of about 6-7 years ago and derserve to eat cupcakes.
(02-04-2013 12:06 AM)DesertBronco Wrote: [ -> ]
Quote:DB, we disagree and agree on a lot. And this isnt anything else other than an agreement, the Suit.

Winning streaks, irate fans, home schedule and freshman psyche be damned. All pap. Self serving. Small minded. West division centric.

But DB you got a point. The suit. Not sure if he is up to the challenge. Not sure he wants the challenge. Better to play it safe. Hang a WD banner, get an extension and hope lightening strikes and everything falls into place in the near future.

He's a really good fit with our fan base.

I know. And that's the shame of it.

I got my memories. I just wish to heck others could to.
(02-04-2013 12:17 AM)Chipdip Wrote: [ -> ]Our bad loss to 8th place (Missouri Valley) Illinois State, will keep us from getting a top level mid major in the Bracket Busters.

I understand and agree. No argument in the literal sense.

Again, intrigued by Dambrodt's stance. More so his action. And am stunned at the complacency with this fan base.

I know Persky means well. He likely thinks that there is a long road ahead of him and plenty of time.

It's the longer in the tooth fans I'm disappointed in. They know better.
'04 was almost a generation ago. '98 was before YK2.
In 76 we played in black and white, before color was invented.

I'm afraid Brian is going to be deeply and sorely disappointed. And for a very long time.
(02-04-2013 12:25 AM)gobaseline Wrote: [ -> ]
(02-04-2013 12:17 AM)Chipdip Wrote: [ -> ]Our bad loss to 8th place (Missouri Valley) Illinois State, will keep us from getting a top level mid major in the Bracket Busters.

I understand and agree. No argument in the literal sense.

Again, intrigued by Dambrodt's stance. More so his action. And am stunned at the complacency with this fan base.

I know Persky means well. He likely thinks that there is a long road ahead of him and plenty of time.

It's the longer in the tooth fans I'm disappointed in. They know better.
'04 was almost a generation ago. '98 was before YK2.
In 76 we played in black and white, before color was invented.

I'm afraid Brian is going to be deeply and sorely disappointed. And for a very long time.

Oh, I agree. Hawk has never quite set the table recruiting wise to get over the hump of MAC West mediocre to tourney contender. There's always one missing piece.

One need only look at Kent to see how you don't recruit to garner a winning season and a contract extension, you recruit to contend for a MAC title (and it is much much easier in hoops than football). Kent filled needs with immediate help, not 3 year projects. Hawk hates the idea of transfers and has shown himself to be a poor JC recruiter.
(02-03-2013 11:57 PM)Nacho Wrote: [ -> ]Don't they match up the teams by record and rankings for Bracketbuster? I don't see us getting matched up with Creighton, Wichita State, etc. even if we do make a plea to play those "bigger" midmajor schools. Those schools wouldn't agree to it either - what do they have to gain by playing a lesser midmajor opponent in Feb.? NOTHING. The point of the BracketBuster program is to help MidMajor schools boost their resume. The better teams want to be matched up with teams of equal value in order to pad their resume!

Don't worry folks - a home bracketbuster game is bound to happen against a team like Montana or North/South Dakota State. Murray State would be a good one since they are fairly known in the bball world after their run in the tourney last year.

Agree it depends on if certain teams are home/road but WMU should get a decent OOC team because of our record and at home. Maybe not the best but an RPI top 100 which is the 1/3 of the nation for a midmajor it isn't going to be a bad team. Could be a matchup of a team that made the tournament last year which would be good for adding interest in the students too.

Call me crazy but I would much rather be talking about WMU making a run in the MAC Tournament building interest with a tourney team in Kzoo to get students out than I would watch ANY Big Ten game. Top that off with a big hockey weekend against Miami for the CCHA next weekend. Murray State or Valpo coming to Kalamazoo would be an exciting matchup worth watching here. The teams mentioned are really good but these teams mentioned are teams in the tournament hunt this year and going to test this Bronco team in front of our fans. We beat Oakland here which is something people are forgetting too.
Oakland isn't lighting the world on fire this year. Not forgotten, just put in perspective.
This IS an interesting discussion but considering Europe it has been a long season that DID include shots at more legitimate programs, against whom we saw an inability to be competitive.

Now, if I understand the thrust here, the mlive article demonstrates some level of growth overall, together with the return of DB, we might now go on the road to a Creighton and come up with an improbable win that would propel right into top 50 territory, at large status, whatever.

I understand it is just a question. Maybe you think it represents something about the fans or the coaches. Maybe you are right.

Regardless, I still vote, play out the season as it was structured, one game at a time, protect and nurture what is ours. Play a nice bracket buster at home, sleep in our wn beds, eat home cooking, gather our strength and try to accomplish the amazing victory (s) in Cleveland.

We do that, yeah, damn right, that would be good enough for me. I don't feel a strong need to try to make some improbable point on the road and risk ruining what is becoming a nice vibe just to satisfy some need for a genius leap to a new level.

Let them play Oklahoma or Kansas State in the Dance and then you will know how you stack up in the cold cruel world. Enough time for that later.
In a year where an at large bid for the NIT or the NCAA is out of reach, I see no reason to lobby for a road match up with a top notch mid major. Gaining a win is more important in my mind simply because seeding MIGHT come into play if we reach one of the lessor postseason tournaments. We could possibly host a couple CIT games this year if we continue to perform well and win games. That to me is equally, if not more important for the development of the team. Testing ourselves at Creighton or at Wichita is nice in theory, but the experience we gain isn't worth the possible postseason games at home.

The players returning need to feel what it's like to play in a postseason tournament and WANT more next year. We have 12 non conference game next year before league play starts that can be used as learning tools and growing experiences. We aren't going to jump to Creighton or Wichita or Butler or VCU's level in the next 12 months. I suppose anything is possible, but I would classify that as unlikely.

My expectations for this team is get a #2 or #3 seed in the MAC tournament. Given that, we can realistically expect to win 1 or 2 games in Cleveland. We won't be favored against Ohio if we see them, but I really like our chances against them. Much more so than Akron. After Cleveland, I expect a bid in the CIT or CBI.

The following 3 years should all include postseason tournaments. I'm hopeful we can make at least one NIT appearance and an NCAA appearance. I don't think those expectations or too high, nor are they too low.

If I thought lobbying the BracketBuster people for a high profile road game would help us achieve any of those goals, I would be in favor of doing it. I just see a different importance to our home BracketBuster game.
I'm a little late to the party. But I beleive that WMU needs to absolutely make certain this is a home game. They played the entire month of December on the road and the fans are finally starting to realize that we actually have a Mens Basketball team and that they are pretty good.

Fill the UA!!!!
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