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Figured some may want to have further discussions about Dark Knight rises without having to tiptoe around the plots.

Thoughts? Things you'd like differently?

Last warning, don't scroll down unless you want spoilers...






























One of my main ones was the very end, the scene with Alfred. I personally think they took it too far by actually showing Bruce. They already had the scene showing he fixed the auto-pilot. I think the scene would have been much better if Alfred sat down at the table, looked up, and then smiled, leaving it at that.

Another thing a friend just asked me, is why weren't the cops all scruffy faced from being underground for 5 months? Maybe they were sent shaving supplies too? Not sure.
At the beginning of the movie, Bruce has to walk with a cane. DR. told him he had NO cartilage in his knees and elbows. Had to use some sort of "bionic" leg brace.

Somehow, in prison he "rehabs" his body (including the no cartilage knees) and climbs the unclimbable.
Suspension of disbelief.

Intro to Movies 101, Sat. 9a-11a

#1989
Yeah, then there was just no need to introduce that silly tidbit. Just chalk up his cane to being lazy and atrophied.
(07-23-2012 09:02 AM)salukiblue Wrote: [ -> ]Yeah, then there was just no need to introduce that silly tidbit. Just chalk up his cane to being lazy and atrophied.

Seriously, my mother had the same cartilage issue, and a knee replacement fixed the problem.
(07-23-2012 07:38 AM)MemTigerFan Wrote: [ -> ]One of my main ones was the very end, the scene with Alfred. I personally think they took it too far by actually showing Bruce. They already had the scene showing he fixed the auto-pilot. I think the scene would have been much better if Alfred sat down at the table, looked up, and then smiled, leaving it at that.

I think that Nolan didn't want to pull another Inception ending with Michael Caine. That's is exactly what you would have gotten with that.

You got your wish on that type of ending with John Blake (who I thought being named Robin was cheesy - I really wish his real name would have been really Tim Drake or Dick Grayson or something) and seeing the bat gear rise in the Bat Cave. You never saw what John Blake saw but you knew.

If Alfred smiled, but you didn't see Bruce:

1) You don't know if he saw Bruce or just smiled because of a good thought
2) Would not know Bruce and Selena Kyle started a new life together
3) Wouldn't have that definite closure.

Most importantly, Bruce and Alfred had a big falling out, and it was good to see Bruce fulfilled Alfred's wish for him.

Quote:Another thing a friend just asked me, is why weren't the cops all scruffy faced from being underground for 5 months? Maybe they were sent shaving supplies too? Not sure.

Also why did the Stock Market chase change day to night?
(07-23-2012 08:29 AM)salukiblue Wrote: [ -> ]At the beginning of the movie, Bruce has to walk with a cane. DR. told him he had NO cartilage in his knees and elbows. Had to use some sort of "bionic" leg brace.

Somehow, in prison he "rehabs" his body (including the no cartilage knees) and climbs the unclimbable.

Maybe the brace worked as a "cast" to get the leg back in walking condition because you never saw the brace under this clothes.

And maybe he had the brace in the prison because he was still wearing long pants.
(07-23-2012 09:06 AM)Latilleon Wrote: [ -> ]
(07-23-2012 08:29 AM)salukiblue Wrote: [ -> ]At the beginning of the movie, Bruce has to walk with a cane. DR. told him he had NO cartilage in his knees and elbows. Had to use some sort of "bionic" leg brace.

Somehow, in prison he "rehabs" his body (including the no cartilage knees) and climbs the unclimbable.

Maybe the brace worked as a "cast" to get the leg back in walking condition because you never saw the brace under this clothes.

And maybe he had the brace in the prison because he was still wearing long pants.

Maybe the brace was surgically implanted in his leg.
I loved the Batman Begins callbacks, especially how he revealed to Gordon who he was the same way he revealed to Rachel in the first movie.
(07-23-2012 09:11 AM)Latilleon Wrote: [ -> ]I loved the Batman Begins callbacks, especially how he revealed to Gordon who he was the same way he revealed to Rachel in the first movie.

I liked that too
(07-23-2012 09:05 AM)Latilleon Wrote: [ -> ]
(07-23-2012 07:38 AM)MemTigerFan Wrote: [ -> ]One of my main ones was the very end, the scene with Alfred. I personally think they took it too far by actually showing Bruce. They already had the scene showing he fixed the auto-pilot. I think the scene would have been much better if Alfred sat down at the table, looked up, and then smiled, leaving it at that.

I think that Nolan didn't want to pull another Inception ending with Michael Caine. That's is exactly what you would have gotten with that.

You got your wish on that type of ending with John Blake (who I thought being named Robin was cheesy - I really wish his real name would have been really Tim Drake or Dick Grayson or something) and seeing the bat gear rise in the Bat Cave. You never saw what John Blake saw but you knew.

If Alfred smiled, but you didn't see Bruce:

1) You don't know if he saw Bruce or just smiled because of a good thought
2) Would not know Bruce and Selena Kyle started a new life together
3) Wouldn't have that definite closure.

Most importantly, Bruce and Alfred had a big falling out, and it was good to see Bruce fulfilled Alfred's wish for him.

1) Maybe, but I think most would have known. I knew immediately before they showed Bruce. Plus with Alfred's story of his wish. Just a smile and a nod from him would have been perfect.
2) true
3) In a way, I didn't want definite closure. It's Batman, full of mystery.

Definitely just an opinion, but to me it seemed in your face like "look, I know I just fully spelled it out that he's alive, but here I'll put him on screen just to make sure you're not dumb and didn't pick up on it"
(07-23-2012 09:05 AM)Latilleon Wrote: [ -> ]Also why did the Stock Market chase change day to night?

very good question. I hate when movies do that.
(07-23-2012 09:58 AM)MemTigerFan Wrote: [ -> ]3) In a way, I didn't want definite closure. It's Batman, full of mystery.

Definitely just an opinion, but to me it seemed in your face like "look, I know I just fully spelled it out that he's alive, but here I'll put him on screen just to make sure you're not dumb and didn't pick up on it"

But the TDKR was promoted as the end of Nolan's Batman story. You had to have the heartwarming happy ending. Wayne had given so much for his city that he deserved happiness and I don't see how this story is any different than any other.

Especially since Batman will be rebooted into something else.

So everyone got what they wanted... Batman/Bruce Wayne died and new Bruce Wayne got a fairy tale ending and Batman lived on.

(That must be confusing to anyone who hasn't seen the movie yet).
(07-23-2012 10:01 AM)MemTigerFan Wrote: [ -> ]
(07-23-2012 09:05 AM)Latilleon Wrote: [ -> ]Also why did the Stock Market chase change day to night?

very good question. I hate when movies do that.

My explanation is I don't think you know the time the chase began, and since the chase takes place between September - October (since five months later there is snow on the ground, a frozen bay, and no Christmas decorations), I'm guessing sunset could be around 6 or 7.
The Good:

- The performances were all solid. Michael Caine gave his best performance of the trilogy.
- Hathaway surprised me. I still think she was miscast, but she did a good enough job not to detract from the movie.
- Action scenes, set pieces, pretty much all technical facets of the film were excellent from top to bottom.
- The ending, particularly the setup for John Blake (Robin) to become the next Batman, or perhaps Nightwing. Anybody who follows the comics knows that Robin/Nightwing (Dick Grayson) becomes Batman after Bane breaks the back of Bruce Wayne and later after Wayne "retires". They can now spin off into a Nightwing film or establish Joseph Gordon Levitt as the new Batman for the new DC shared film universe that starts with Man of Steel.


The Bad:

- It's hard to describe, but it didn't really feel like a Batman movie. Reminded me a lot of Superman Returns. Good movie, but bad Superman movie. The same can be said of the TDKR. This movie had to have the smallest amount of screen time for Batman of all 3 Nolan movies.
- I can't think of an arc in the comics that would paint Bruce Wayne as the kind of man that hides from the public for 8 years because he's sad about his (kinda) girlfriend being killed. That's just not Bruce Wayne. How can he be so physically beaten up if he hasn't done anything for 8 years? Why would he show up to confront Bane (not once, but TWICE) without anything other than his fists and feet? Batman is not that stupid.
- The only character in the movie that actually behaves consistently with the character of Batman is John Blake.
- I don't think it is in the nature of Alfred to abandon Bruce Wayne in his most fragile state.
- Bane was just awful. The voice was laughable. How can someone be in such pain (as they say in the movie) and have his entire mouth covered with a mask, yet he sounds like he has a microphone with speakers attached to his shoulders? You can't have a "realistic" movie with a guy who sounds like that (a 90 year old Sean Connery) but is so strong that he can punch holes in marble columns. He was the same height as Wayne and only marginally stronger. Why is it that he could dominate Batman so easily? If they follow the comics, they would have given us a reason. The way it is here, we are just supposed to believe that he's so much stronger than Batman so that we can move the story forward.
- Like most Nolan films, pacing was an issue. There were 2 separate instances where 2 different people were snoring so loud (at a noon showtime) that someone had to wake them up. That's the first time I've seen that at a comic book movie. Nolan "edits" his films on paper, to avoid shooting too much wasted footage. The problem is that leaves him very little room to trim to help pacing.
(07-23-2012 10:39 AM)Latilleon Wrote: [ -> ]
(07-23-2012 10:01 AM)MemTigerFan Wrote: [ -> ]
(07-23-2012 09:05 AM)Latilleon Wrote: [ -> ]Also why did the Stock Market chase change day to night?

very good question. I hate when movies do that.

My explanation is I don't think you know the time the chase began, and since the chase takes place between September - October (since five months later there is snow on the ground, a frozen bay, and no Christmas decorations), I'm guessing sunset could be around 6 or 7.

I was thinking along the same lines at first until I remembered the 5 months earlier thing, which could mean it was end of summer and long days. I can understand no christmas lights, even if around that time, b/c of what's happening. I guess if 5 months later is in Feb, then October has somewhat early darkness, though that's before daylight savings time so it should be getting dark before 7pm. That makes for 2-3 hours of chasing before the dark shows up.

just one of those things that a ton of movies do.
I thought the Liam Niessen and Cillian Murphy cameos were pretty hokey.
(07-23-2012 12:55 PM)TigerNK Wrote: [ -> ]The Good:

- The performances were all solid. Michael Caine gave his best performance of the trilogy.
- Hathaway surprised me. I still think she was miscast, but she did a good enough job not to detract from the movie.
- Action scenes, set pieces, pretty much all technical facets of the film were excellent from top to bottom.
- The ending, particularly the setup for John Blake (Robin) to become the next Batman, or perhaps Nightwing. Anybody who follows the comics knows that Robin/Nightwing (Dick Grayson) becomes Batman after Bane breaks the back of Bruce Wayne and later after Wayne "retires". They can now spin off into a Nightwing film or establish Joseph Gordon Levitt as the new Batman for the new DC shared film universe that starts with Man of Steel.


The Bad:

- It's hard to describe, but it didn't really feel like a Batman movie. Reminded me a lot of Superman Returns. Good movie, but bad Superman movie. The same can be said of the TDKR. This movie had to have the smallest amount of screen time for Batman of all 3 Nolan movies.
- I can't think of an arc in the comics that would paint Bruce Wayne as the kind of man that hides from the public for 8 years because he's sad about his (kinda) girlfriend being killed. That's just not Bruce Wayne. How can he be so physically beaten up if he hasn't done anything for 8 years? Why would he show up to confront Bane (not once, but TWICE) without anything other than his fists and feet? Batman is not that stupid.
- The only character in the movie that actually behaves consistently with the character of Batman is John Blake.
- I don't think it is in the nature of Alfred to abandon Bruce Wayne in his most fragile state.
- Bane was just awful. The voice was laughable. How can someone be in such pain (as they say in the movie) and have his entire mouth covered with a mask, yet he sounds like he has a microphone with speakers attached to his shoulders? You can't have a "realistic" movie with a guy who sounds like that (a 90 year old Sean Connery) but is so strong that he can punch holes in marble columns. He was the same height as Wayne and only marginally stronger. Why is it that he could dominate Batman so easily? If they follow the comics, they would have given us a reason. The way it is here, we are just supposed to believe that he's so much stronger than Batman so that we can move the story forward.
- Like most Nolan films, pacing was an issue. There were 2 separate instances where 2 different people were snoring so loud (at a noon showtime) that someone had to wake them up. That's the first time I've seen that at a comic book movie. Nolan "edits" his films on paper, to avoid shooting too much wasted footage. The problem is that leaves him very little room to trim to help pacing.

That was a big issue. I'm not a comic book follower, so it would have been helpful to explain bane a bit more.

I frankly didn't really understand why he was such a badass. He wasn't smart or maniacal. And then to be told he was actually in cahoots with the chick (who was ACTUALLY the daughter of ra's) left me with a question of which of those two was actually the head honcho. Was it the girl, and he was just her "meathead muscle?'
(07-23-2012 01:40 PM)salukiblue Wrote: [ -> ]That was a big issue. I'm not a comic book follower, so it would have been helpful to explain bane a bit more.

I frankly didn't really understand why he was such a badass. He wasn't smart or maniacal. And then to be told he was actually in cahoots with the chick (who was ACTUALLY the daughter of ra's) left me with a question of which of those two was actually the head honcho. Was it the girl, and he was just her "meathead muscle?'

Which begs the question...if you are going to make Bane a meathead muscle, why not make him that from the beginning? Why not avoid all the talk about his size, his height, his voice etc. and just hire a really huge guy to be the muscle.

That lets you hire an A-lister to play a modern Penguin that is more of a warlord/crime boss that overthrows the city? The Bane we got and the 10 minutes of Tallia Ah Guhl are just laughable in comparison to The Joker in TDK.

Speaking of The Joker, anyone else fine it odd that there wasn't a single reference to him in the entire movie?
(07-23-2012 02:00 PM)TigerNK Wrote: [ -> ]
(07-23-2012 01:40 PM)salukiblue Wrote: [ -> ]That was a big issue. I'm not a comic book follower, so it would have been helpful to explain bane a bit more.

I frankly didn't really understand why he was such a badass. He wasn't smart or maniacal. And then to be told he was actually in cahoots with the chick (who was ACTUALLY the daughter of ra's) left me with a question of which of those two was actually the head honcho. Was it the girl, and he was just her "meathead muscle?'

Which begs the question...if you are going to make Bane a meathead muscle, why not make him that from the beginning? Why not avoid all the talk about his size, his height, his voice etc. and just hire a really huge guy to be the muscle.

That lets you hire an A-lister to play a modern Penguin that is more of a warlord/crime boss that overthrows the city? The Bane we got and the 10 minutes of Tallia Ah Guhl are just laughable in comparison to The Joker in TDK.

Speaking of The Joker, anyone else fine it odd that there wasn't a single reference to him in the entire movie?

Yeah, especially when they keep reprising Crane in bit roles.

I guess there wasn't really a good way to reference him. Was he one of the escapees from the prison, I wonder?

Oh, and as soon as the cops were released and the Batman signal was shown, why didn't they just blow up the city as promised?

Does catwoman like it dog style?
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