Let me first say I love what Lewis has done for the Bengals.
I do have to say though that I was scratching my head with drafting Perry. We have a starter that looked awesome last year. I know we need RB depth, but we could have taken care of that later in the draft with the depth of the RB position in the draft. I was hoping they would trade down (if possible) and get Jake Grove early in the second round and pick up another pick. They did trade down a little bit, but went for Perry. We have a center that is 900 years old and need a quality center bad. We lost out on Grove to the Raiders, but hopefully they are high on Stepanovich, Lackey or the guy from Purdue and we get one of them.
Ratliff seems to be a good choice since he was an All American in college. He's a little short (which was a knock against him), but seems to be a big playmaker. I like this one.
The next one with the S from Maryland with Starks still on the board at the DT position. We have needed depth here and we go for S?
I know Lewis has said that he goes for the best player at any position, but I'm not sure the kid from Maryland fits this bill.
I guess I have to trust in Lewis' expertise here (as he has done far more research than I have), but I was scratching me head on a couple of these picks...
JMHO
I like the pick of Perry ... I think hes a good fit as a 3rd down back to compliment Rudi because he can catch and block pretty well.
SELECTED BY CINCINNATI , ROUND 3, PICK 17, OVERALL PICK 80
ILB | (6'3", 222, 4.66) | ARKANSAS | COLLEGE STATS
Data from Scouts, Inc.
Grade: 53
Alerts: (B: BULK/SIZE) Lacks size/bulk for position
Comments: Miller is a tough, blue-collar player. Good height, plus speed. Best on a straight-line/when coming forward. Instinctive, very good recognition. Excellent angles in pursuit, closing burst to ballcarrier. Shoots gaps quickly, great at finding the ball, makes a lot of plays behind the line. Plays bigger and stronger than measurables indicate. Slips blocks, does good job of using his hands to get through traffic. Solid open-field tackler with good power for his size. Great leadership skills, work ethic. Excellent weight-room strength. Limited by inability to keep bulk on his frame and below-average athleticism. Plays too high. Lacks agility. Struggles to recover if he takes poor angles. Too high in drops, lacks range in coverage. Stiff hips. Struggles vs. quicker running backs in man coverage. Miller started from 2001-2003. He had surgery to fix a hernia injury in 2001 and also has had shoulder problems, but he is a tough player who played through injuries and did miss a start in his last three seasons. Miller has very good size potential and plus speed, but he is not a great athlete. He is a classic overachiever and has a great motor. He is an intelligent, instinctive player with a tremendous work ethic. But his upside is limited by his fluid hips and inability to keep weight on. Miller does not have the tools of a Day 1 prospect, but he's worth drafting in the fourth or fifth rounds because he should develop into a great backup and special-teams player.
* Player biographies are provided by Scouts Inc.
His speed is a big plus, but it seems they are limiting him to being a special teams player due to his lack of ability to keep on weight. I sure hope we can find a way to put weight on him so he may be able to contribute as an every down type player. I hate the piece that talks about him being a 4th or 5th round player.
With their last pick in the fourth round at 123, the Bengals went for Mississippi tackle Stacy Andrews. The 6-6, 339-pound Andrews is a huge, strong guy who didn't play high school football and only 70 snaps in college. But he's fast and strong and holds three Ole Miss records for throwing in a track career that could have taken him to the Olympics if he chose. . .
This one is the most interesting selection. He played his first college football season his senior year in college. With his size, he ran a 4.9 40, so he seems to have great feet. This is from the NFL's draft site:
One of the best-kept secrets in the game of football, Andrews' awesome athletic ability has made him a "must see" for pro scouts arriving on the Ole Miss campus … Never competed in football until his senior year at Mississippi … Standout track performer who garnered All-America honors as a weight man.
ANALYSIS
Positives: Rare-sized individual with a barrel chest, wide shoulders with excellent upper body thickness, huge arms and an athletic lower frame, with muscular definition and mass throughout … Incredibly quick for a player his size (4.96 in the 40-yard dash) … Flexible with quick feet and good balance in his kick slide … Does a nice job of getting his hands up quickly to lock on, steer and gain leverage over the defender … Shows exceptional explosion when running to the second level and has the field awareness to stalk and neutralize the linebackers working in space … Despite his size, he stays low in his pads with a wide leg base, which makes it very tough for defenders to rock him back on his heels … Works well with the guard on combo blocks, keeping his head on a swivel while looking for secondary targets to hit.
Negatives: Very raw, experience-wise, with only five games of football experience under his belt … Needs to develop a nastier attitude, as he's too laid back on the field (must show a killer mentality).
This is a pick I like a lot. He will have time to develop since we have our tackle positions to taken care of and hopefully in another year, can provide some really good depth for us. He seems to have unlimited potential.
Matthias Askew
Position: Defensive Tackle/End
College: Michigan State
Height: 6-5
Weight: 308
Hometown: Ft. Lauderdale, Fla.
Analysis | Agility | High School | Personal
OVERVIEW
Talented athlete who has that rare combination of size, speed and power to be equally effective at any position on the defensive line … Developing talent who is very physical on the field … "Matthias is a big guy that can run," Spartans defensive line coach Steve Stripling said. "He made great strides as a pass rusher last season. The best thing about Matthias is that he's a big body that can defend the middle and take on double-team blocks, plus, he has the ability to pressure the quarterback." … Started 19 of 35 games during his career, recording 144 tackles (99 solos) with seven sacks for minus-45 yards, 18½ stops for losses of 73 yards, 24 quarterback pressures, an interception and eight pass deflections.
ANALYSIS
Positives: Has a large, proportional athletic build with good muscle definition … Has good initial quickness off the snap, showing urgency in his burst into the backfield … Has above-average balance and strength to make plays down the line … Shows the ability to defeat double teams, using his hand technique and power to split the blocks … Recovers off blocks quickly and is very disruptive coming from the back side … Can close down the line of scrimmage due to his excellent change-of-direction agility … Strong wrapup tackler who stays low in his pads while delivering a solid blow … His pad level also allows him to work past blockers when lined up over the edge (takes good angles in pursuit) … Delivers a strong hand punch and shows very good hand placement to prevent blockers from attacking his body surface … Can accelerate and close on the quarterback instantly when uncontested … Has outstanding ability to recover and make the play … His frame and strength have proven very effective in clogging the middle of the field, as he searches, stalks and wraps up the lead blocker to close the rush lanes … Still developing his pass-rush moves, relying more on sheer power right now, but shows very good upside.
Negatives: Needs to develop a quick swim move (relies more on strength to defeat blocks) … Tends to run out of gas as the game goes on … Usually in position to make the head-up, knockout tackle, but gets a little frustrated when his initial move does not work … Will usually stay low in his pads, but when he gets high in his stance, he struggles to gain separation.
I like this pick as well...I read on another site that if he would have stayed for his senior year, he would have been a first round pick. Since we will have 3 DT's, he can mature another year and still give us some depth at the DT position.
So, IMHO, I like our choices in the 4th round!
I am still wondering when we are going to address our lack of depth at the C postion...
Sorry to keep posting, but I just love following the draft...
I like this pick...he seems to have speed to burn and great coverage skills. His height (like Ratliff) seems to be his biggest drawback. His speed and coverage skills though should be a potential plus for us...
Greg Brooks
Position: Cornerback
College: Southern Mississippi
Height: 5-10
Weight: 179
Hometown: Harvey, La.
Analysis | Agility | High School | Personal
OVERVIEW
Big playmaker who is regarded as one of the best deep-coverage cornerbacks in the collegiate game … Despite only two full seasons as a starter, he holds the school's career record with 35 pass deflections, surpassing the previous mark of 31 by Patrick Surtain (1994-97) … Started 25 of 35 games for the Golden Eagles since transferring to the school from the University of Michigan … To date, he recorded 96 tackles (74 solos) with a fumble recovery, a sack, four stops behind the line of scrimmage and six interceptions.
ANALYSIS
Positives: Has the ability to learn and retain football well, quickly diagnosing the plays … Shows a smooth backpedal with above-average foot quickness and body control … Plants and breaks on the ball sharply and shows an explosive closing burst … Has excellent open field acceleration and can easily turn and run with the receivers on deep routes … Drops back into his zone assignment with good vision awareness and stalks the receivers tight on short area and underneath routes … Has good timing and leaping ability competing for the ball … Takes proper angles in pursuit and can turn and jump on the ball, making proper body adjustments to get to the ball at its highest point … Has dependable hands for the interception, displaying the agility to track and locate the ball over his head … While he needs to be more aggressive in run support, he has good drag-down tackling technique.
Negatives: Has good awareness and tackling ability, but needs to be more consistent in showing his physical nature … Must do a better job of extending his arms to keep defenders off his chest when working through trash … Has excellent quickness, but needs to show better hip swerve when attempting to maintain contact on the receiver moving laterally (appears to gather himself a bit breaking out of his backpedal) … Needs to add at least 10 pounds to his frame, displaying only adequate muscle mass in the chest area.
AGILITY TESTS
Timed at 4.33 (rubber track) and 4.38 (grass field) in the 40-yard dash … 39½-inch vertical jump … 297-pound bench press … 316-pound squat … 31-inch arm length … 9 1/8-inch hands … Right-handed.
Keiwan Ratliff will be the best player to come out of this year Bengals draft. He has speed and the spunk to turn into a shutdown corner. Damn I love this kid. This Maurice Mann kid could turn into a Chad Johnson type player with some work. He has ideal speed and size to be a productive NFL reciever.
I'll give the Bungals a big "F" for the draft. They needed a center. They didn't draft one. They didn't need a running back. They drafted one. Every pick they made is said to be too slow and too small by all the experts. Does Lewis think he knows better than the hundred other folks that follow the draft throughout the year? This draft provided NO STARTERS!!! The Bungals got a bunch of role players that will probably be gone in a year or two. But hey, Mike Brown is happy because these clowns will come cheap...
They did need a running back. I think they drafted a bit high, but I'm gonna wait and see before judging that. I thought the picks were solid, but no clear star, could be looking for team players rather than one guy who stands out. I am concerned about no center being picked, but maybe they have something in the works or plan on signing a kid that didn't get drafted.
While I scratched my head with some of these picks...
They really went after productin early in the draft. Perry, Ratliff and Williams were real producers in college. It seems to me the Bengals didn't put too much stock in combine results when drafting early which I like actually. Football players don't play games with shorts and t-shirts...they play with pads on where some players maintain their speed while others lose a little. This is where I believe Perry, Ratliff and Williams fall in. Their 40 speeds may have not been great (in shorts), but they play fast w/ pads on.
I wasn't sold much on their linebackers in the 3rd round due to their size. However, after hearing Lewis speak on them, I changed my mind a little bit. He referred to Ray Lewis being drafted at 232 lbs coming out of Miami but played very fast. Miller and Johnson both run very well for LB'ers so they will be good players for special teams right away. Marvin talked about them putting on the weight required to play every down in the NFL. So maybe they weren't too bad of selections. Once again, both these guys led their team in tackles so they were producers with pads on.
The 4th round I really liked. Two juniors who are young (Askew and Gathers) who may have been rated very high if they stayed one more year. They both seem to have a high ceiling and the coaches and work with them to get them ready for the next season. The Andrews kid is really interesting. Only played his senior year in college but ran a 4.9 40 while being 6'6", 330 lbs. He can be given some time since we have Jones and Anderson anchoring our tackle positions for a while.
Mann and Brooks seem like they may have very good potential and who knows about Bramlet if he can stick or not.
If people rated production, we did a pretty good job in the draft. But as usual, only time will tell if we were successful or not.
GO BENGALS!!!
LKR,
That Andrews guy is a physical freak. His combine numbers were pretty incredible.
If you look at his numbers against the top OTs in the draft, he beats all of them in the 225 pound bench press. (He did 34 reps!!!! Robert Gallery did 24). His running and vertical numbers are pretty impressive as well. What I really like is that he beat his brother Shawn in every damn category and Shawn was taken 16th overall.
He has played incredibly little football which makes him a big risk. On the other hand he might be the most physically gifted of all the OTs taken.
I absolutely love the pick - he won't have to be thrown into to position. Bring him along slowly for 2 years and then unleash him. The guy is freakin huge.
Oh here are the OT combine numbers:
<a href='http://rivalspro.rivals.com/content.asp?CID=272533' target='_blank'>http://rivalspro.rivals.com/content.asp?CID=272533</a>
This is from the huddle report:
Stacy Andrews OT Mississippi
Strengths
Stacy is 6’6
Snart,
I agree that it is a bummer they didn't get a center. But this draft sucked for centers. Better to take no one than someone who is never going to make it.
I think the Bengals had a pretty good draft. They didn't follow the rules of Kiper and the rest of the "experts", but I wholeheartedly believe Marvin Lewis is an phenomenal judge of talent. Look at how many of his picks last year produced.
What more than anything has destroyed the Bengals chances of winning games over and over again the last 10 years? SPECIAL TEAMS!!!!!!!!!!
Take a look at the guys Lewis brought in like O'Neal and Herrin and then take a look at his CB, S and LB draft picks. These guys are all special team studs!!
The biggest change you will notice this year is the improvement in special teams play. These guys are fast ball hawks and consistent return men. Even if they get zero starters out of this draft, they will get consistently better field field position on returns and hold teams to fewer yards on the kick covers.
That, in my opinion, is much more important right now than one likely starter.
Eastside_J Wrote:LKR,
That Andrews guy is a physical freak. His combine numbers were pretty incredible.
If you look at his numbers against the top OTs in the draft, he beats all of them in the 225 pound bench press. (He did 34 reps!!!! Robert Gallery did 24). His running and vertical numbers are pretty impressive as well. What I really like is that he beat his brother Shawn in every damn category and Shawn was taken 16th overall.
He has played incredibly little football which makes him a big risk. On the other hand he might be the most physically gifted of all the OTs taken.
I absolutely love the pick - he won't have to be thrown into to position. Bring him along slowly for 2 years and then unleash him. The guy is freakin huge.
Yeah, he was one guy who has really good combine numbers. Very little football experience, but awesome raw numbers. His power and speed make him a good project choice. We can afford to allow him to sit and learn behind Anderson and Jones.
His brother went in the first round (OT from Arkansas), so his blood has to be good.
Overall, I liked what Lewis did with this draft. Some I wondered about, but overall I did like it...
snart Wrote:I'll give the Bungals a big "F" for the draft. They needed a center. They didn't draft one. They didn't need a running back. They drafted one. Every pick they made is said to be too slow and too small by all the experts. Does Lewis think he knows better than the hundred other folks that follow the draft throughout the year? This draft provided NO STARTERS!!! The Bungals got a bunch of role players that will probably be gone in a year or two. But hey, Mike Brown is happy because these clowns will come cheap...
The bengals didnt need to draft a starter. They already have their starters fro every position. They needed a running back. If Rudi goes down then Skip Hicks is the Bengals RB. I give it a B+.
I like what the Bengals did in getting a lot of picks but after that I think they did a TERRIBLE job of making the picks. They reached on just about EVERY PLAYER.
IF they wanted Perry so bad move down to the beginning of the 2nd Round.
The safety from Maryland wasn't supposed to be drafted until the 5th Round. Ratliff was a reach.
The Bengals had a great draft last year because they went BEST player available as opposed to getting hung up saying we have to get a RB with our 1st pick a DB with our 2nd pick. The same thing that happened to this year is what has happened to them time and time again over the last 13 years with the exception of last year. They REACH on guys like Artrell Hawkins, Charles Fisher, Ratliff, Perry.
I thought I was going to get ill when they picked Perry. He at best will be a good complement back
Many of these guys will produce. I'm still not convinced Rudi is the man, and Perry is a very productive back who will fill in nicely for Rudi. I was very happy with that pick. Ratliff will be a BALLER. 9 interceptions in the SEC! He is a playmaker. Williams and Miller will contribute right away on special teams, and will eventually be starters. Andrews is a BEAST! Those numbers dont lie. Put him in the game at goal line situations at fullback and Rudi or Perry will score every time. I give it a B, because they really didn't answer the O-line, then again, they don't really need to this year. We are still a year away. Give Carson a year under his belt and we'll see Bengals v Cowboys in Super Bowl XL!
Dony forget Greag Brooks from Southern Miss. He was a steal in the 6 round. He was projected as a 2 rounder. I think Marvin is just trying to get guys for his system. Fast, athletic defenders.
HoopsJunky Wrote:I like what the Bengals did in getting a lot of picks but after that I think they did a TERRIBLE job of making the picks. They reached on just about EVERY PLAYER.
IF they wanted Perry so bad move down to the beginning of the 2nd Round.
The safety from Maryland wasn't supposed to be drafted until the 5th Round. Ratliff was a reach.
The Bengals had a great draft last year because they went BEST player available as opposed to getting hung up saying we have to get a RB with our 1st pick a DB with our 2nd pick. The same thing that happened to this year is what has happened to them time and time again over the last 13 years with the exception of last year. They REACH on guys like Artrell Hawkins, Charles Fisher, Ratliff, Perry.
I thought I was going to get ill when they picked Perry. He at best will be a good complement back
HJ, believe it or not, the Bengals had Perry rated as the top RB in the draft. I'm not sure if they are right or wrong, but they had him rated at the top.
As far as Ratliff, the Eagles called to try and get them to trade that 2nd round pick because they wanted to draft Ratliff. They said they were after a playmaker and based on his numbers, is one. I also heard he didn't have the great strait ahead speed, but had the best hips of any CB in the draft which allows him to stay with his guy. Williams was rated the same as Ratliff according to the coaches. They saw both of them in the all star game and rated both of them very high.
I guess it's a little like college recruiting. The college coaches never pay attention to what the so called experts think about recruits, and apparently, the Bengals coaches are the same way.
At first, I had your reaction to most of the picks. After hearing the coaches, maybe they did get the players they really wanted.
Only time will tell whether they did a good job or not.