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If conferences expand again and two teams are taken from ACC (Tech and State), who replaces them to get to 16? We all assume Uconn and Rutgers would be next but who would be the other two?

Notre Dame
Cincy
Louisville (before the Big 12 takes them)
Temple
Ohio U
Memphis
Umass
Just throwing out names.

Before ECU fan jumps in, I'll go ahead and throw them in the mix. The ACC could just become the North Carolina and friends conference.

Ohio U does not have the facilities to be considered to be in the ACC. Also, their general following isn't there and lord help them if tOSU is playing at the same time.


peden stadium, capacity: 24,000

Unless the ACC were to lose two North Carolina schools (with those being UNC and Duke), only then would ECU go from a 0% chance to a 1% chance of getting into the ACC. IMO, the ACC could lose some combination of Clemson/Florida St/GA Tech to the Big 12 and VA Tech / NC State to the SEC. At that point the ACC, raids the BE again and takes UConn/Rutgers and if 16 is the goal (Cincinnati / Louisville (unless Louisville is B12 w/BYU then replace with Temple or USF). Then, hands down the ACC regains the status as the best basketball conference in the country with UNC,Duke, Syracuse, Pitt, Conn, Cincy, Louis (Temple). If this were the case and the BE wanted to remain viable as a FB/BB conference, it would have almost no option but to take an ECU, USM, Marshall, elsewise it should go ahead and change its name to the nBE (Non Big East Conference).

Notre Dame stays independent.

1....the ACC will not lose anybody.

2....NEXT ridiculous subject.

Of the names thrown out there by the OP, only Notre Dame has any chance of becoming an ACC member, and that's only if the Irish are forced there...

The ACC will not go to 16. No current available team offers enough value to go to 16.

(03-18-2012 10:19 AM)XLance Wrote: [ -> ]1....the ACC will not lose anybody.

2....NEXT ridiculous subject.

3....IF the ridiculous happens and they lose two, they'd stay at 12 before adding anyone.

4....IF a gun was held to their head and they were forced to add two schools to get back to 14, they'd add UConn and Rutgers.

5....IF another gun was pointed at their head and they were forced to add two more to get to 16, they'd probably just let the gunman pull the trigger.

Do these threads ever stop there is no point of these 16 team mega because all they lead to is suicide. 14 is even pushing it in my opinion, the SEC only did it because a team like Texas A&M is the type of school who makes a conference not a school looking for one. And the ACC only did it because they suck anyway in football and it doesn't matter if the schools ever play each other. It was just an attempt to 1 up the Big East in basketball thinking they would add a bunch of teams like Boise and ECU and not Memphis and Temple.

The ACC will eventually expand again (sooner rather than later), and I believe it will be Connecticut and Rutgers.

1. Adding Connecticut and Rutgers eat up the last expandable entites on the East Coast. It also destroys their main rival (Big East) on the east coast and prevents the B1G from taking those schools as part of their expansion to the Eastern Seaboard.

2. Adding 2 schools up north also allows a nice easy North-South Split that goes on the border between North Carolina and Virginia. Here would be the 2-division format:
North: Boston College, Connecticut, Syracuse, Pittsburgh, Rutgers, Maryland, Virginia, Virginia Tech
South: North Carolina, North Carolina St., Duke, Wake Forest, Clemson, Georgia Tech, Florida St., Miami

There's an fairly easy 4-Pod alignment that can be either used for scheduling unofficially, or with a rule-change officially.
New England: Boston College, Connecticut, Syracuse, Pittsburgh
Mid-Atlantic: Rutgers, Maryland, Virginia, Virginia Tech
North Carolina: North Carolina, NCSU, Duke, Wake Forest
Deep South: Clemson, Georgia Tech, Florida St., Miami

(03-18-2012 09:49 AM)Old Dominion Navy Wrote: [ -> ]If conferences expand again and two teams are taken from ACC (Tech and State), who replaces them to get to 16? We all assume Uconn and Rutgers would be next but who would be the other two?

Notre Dame
Cincy
Louisville (before the Big 12 takes them)
Temple
Ohio U
Memphis
Umass
Just throwing out names.

The only one of these schools that the ACC would take would be Notre Dame (obviously), U Mass (if they have a competitive FBS football program) and maybe - but only maybe- Louisville. Temple, Memphis, Cincy, have no chance for obvious reasons. Ohio would have to change its philosophy to have a chance, but they don't have the inherent no-chance of the group above.

(03-18-2012 12:33 PM)EdisonDoyle Wrote: [ -> ]

(03-18-2012 09:49 AM)Old Dominion Navy Wrote: [ -> ]If conferences expand again and two teams are taken from ACC (Tech and State), who replaces them to get to 16? We all assume Uconn and Rutgers would be next but who would be the other two?

Notre Dame
Cincy
Louisville (before the Big 12 takes them)
Temple
Ohio U
Memphis
Umass
Just throwing out names.

The only one of these schools that the ACC would take would be Notre Dame (obviously), U Mass (if they have a competitive FBS football program) and maybe - but only maybe- Louisville. Temple, Memphis, Cincy, have no chance for obvious reasons. Ohio would have to change its philosophy to have a chance, but they don't have the inherent no-chance of the group above.

I think Cincy has much more of a chance than Ohio. Already BCS, in a major metro area, and have a billion dollar endowment.

For the Big 12 I think part of the problem is they do not want a repeat of what began to happen with it's previous two divisions, the Southern one dominating the Northern one. If Louisville and cincy/Byu are invited it will be even worse than it was before. That is why I think all the talk about adding some of these "littles" isn't going anywhere because the Big 12 over all would rather stick to 10 and have most of their games in the Texas Oklahoma region.

It is going to take some serious names joining the Big 12 for them to agree to go back to having divisions.

(03-18-2012 10:19 AM)XLance Wrote: [ -> ]1....the ACC will not lose anybody.

2....NEXT ridiculous subject.

I think you are correct with one exception. The ACC might choose to give up two teams to create a situation for its own expansion to be accommodative. For example lets say that Notre Dame wanted to join but only if UConn and Texas came with them. Texas has one state supported school which its legislature wants the Longhorns to take with them, Texas Tech. The ACC stands at 14 with Syracuse and Pitt. If it truly wanted to move to 16 and wanted to accommodate ND and Texas in order to obtain two powerhouse programs financially and academically, but had to take UConn & TTU in order to make it happen then what should they do? The SEC wants a North Carolina market and a Virginia market and the ACC & SEC will likely partner as the B1G and PAC have, so why not encourage NCState & Va Tech to move. Their addtion to the SEC would allow them to receive more money and yet help to raise more money for the state schools they leave behind in the ACC. It's a win, win. The ACC gives up no television market, or state. They gain a much larger share of the New England, & New York market plus Texas. But they still have a problem. Texas wants to be in a Western pod of at least 4 schools in their area so their travel is not as great. What do you do?

The ACC expands to 18 teams. Ultimately their are 73 worthy programs that need to be located to avoid, or at least diminish lititgation, if a move to 4 superconferences is made. Tulane or Rice would be great academic adds, but don't bring in the football dollars. TCU & SMU have better football and SMU is at least on par with Clemson academically, but both have small followings. I think OU and Baylor become your two additions for the pod of 4. OU gets to move if OSU is taken care of. WVU and OSU make 18 for the SEC and the problem is solved. WVU gets its annual rivalry with Pitt, OU with OSU, Texas & A&M are back on the menu, and the mirror continues with UGA & Tech, UVA & VaTech, NCst & NC, FSU & Fla, Clemson & USC, you get the picture. Everybody makes out like bandits with the TV revenue. But, there is one last problem. The 6 year grant of rights for the Big 12 TV contract. OU, OSU, Baylor, TTU, Texas, & WVU are all taken care of by the SEC & ACC. That leaves 4 to move to the PAC. I know that KState, Kansas, Iowa State, & TCU aren't ideal, but have you checked out the PAC's other options? If it gets done at all, ever, it will happen something like that.

The new ACC would consist of a Northern Division of: Syracuse, Pitt, Boston College, Connecticut, Notre Dame, and Maryland.
a Central Division of: Virginia, North Carolina, Duke, Wake Forest, Clemson, and Georgia Tech.
a Southern Division of: Florida State, Miami, Texas, Baylor, Oklahoma, and Texas Tech.

Your three division champions and the remaining team with the best record make up your four playoff teams for the conference championship.

Ditto the SEC, & PAC. The B1G takes Rutgers, Army, Navy, and Air Force or no one at all. Why would they even consider the academies? One reason federal defense contract research money given out in the form of grants to research universities.

Such a conference would greatly enhance its football. If you substituted Kansas for Baylor it would make for a killer basketball addition. The problem with Kansas is that without them the PAC may not take the other three. All of the 10 Big 12 schools have to be accounted for to have a smooth transition out of the 6 year grant of rights. Eight schools might be enough to kill it, but with all ten the networks would go along.

(03-19-2012 12:48 AM)JRsec Wrote: [ -> ]

(03-18-2012 10:19 AM)XLance Wrote: [ -> ]1....the ACC will not lose anybody.

2....NEXT ridiculous subject.

I think you are correct with one exception. The ACC might choose to give up two teams to create a situation for its own expansion to be accommodative. For example lets say that Notre Dame wanted to join but only if UConn and Texas came with them. Texas has one state supported school which its legislature wants the Longhorns to take with them, Texas Tech. The ACC stands at 14 with Syracuse and Pitt. If it truly wanted to move to 16 and wanted to accommodate ND and Texas in order to obtain two powerhouse programs financially and academically, but had to take UConn & TTU in order to make it happen then what should they do? The SEC wants a North Carolina market and a Virginia market and the ACC & SEC will likely partner as the B1G and PAC have, so why not encourage NCState & Va Tech to move. Their addtion to the SEC would allow them to receive more money and yet help to raise more money for the state schools they leave behind in the ACC. It's a win, win. The ACC gives up no television market, or state. They gain a much larger share of the New England, & New York market plus Texas. But they still have a problem. Texas wants to be in a Western pod of at least 4 schools in their area so their travel is not as great. What do you do?

The ACC expands to 18 teams. Ultimately their are 73 worthy programs that need to be located to avoid, or at least diminish lititgation, if a move to 4 superconferences is made. Tulane or Rice would be great academic adds, but don't bring in the football dollars. TCU & SMU have better football and SMU is at least on par with Clemson academically, but both have small followings. I think OU and Baylor become your two additions for the pod of 4. OU gets to move if OSU is taken care of. WVU and OSU make 18 for the SEC and the problem is solved. WVU gets its annual rivalry with Pitt, OU with OSU, Texas & A&M are back on the menu, and the mirror continues with UGA & Tech, UVA & VaTech, NCst & NC, FSU & Fla, Clemson & USC, you get the picture. Everybody makes out like bandits with the TV revenue. But, there is one last problem. The 6 year grant of rights for the Big 12 TV contract. OU, OSU, Baylor, TTU, Texas, & WVU are all taken care of by the SEC & ACC. That leaves 4 to move to the PAC. I know that KState, Kansas, Iowa State, & TCU aren't ideal, but have you checked out the PAC's other options? If it gets done at all, ever, it will happen something like that.

The new ACC would consist of a Northern Division of: Syracuse, Pitt, Boston College, Connecticut, Notre Dame, and Maryland.
a Central Division of: Virginia, North Carolina, Duke, Wake Forest, Clemson, and Georgia Tech.
a Southern Division of: Florida State, Miami, Texas, Baylor, Oklahoma, and Texas Tech.

Your three division champions and the remaining team with the best record make up your four playoff teams for the conference championship.

Ditto the SEC, & PAC. The B1G takes Rutgers, Army, Navy, and Air Force or no one at all. Why would they even consider the academies? One reason federal defense contract research money given out in the form of grants to research universities.

Such a conference would greatly enhance its football. If you substituted Kansas for Baylor it would make for a killer basketball addition. The problem with Kansas is that without them the PAC may not take the other three. All of the 10 Big 12 schools have to be accounted for to have a smooth transition out of the 6 year grant of rights. Eight schools might be enough to kill it, but with all ten the networks would go along.

I'm not buying it but I will admit that it is one of the better thought out scenario's presented on this forum thus far. The Research aspect of the academies in the B1G makes sense but unfortunately that is not everything considered. If there is any conference that they would fit in the best with though it is the B1G, I will admit that. Air Force really sticks out like a sore thumb out in the West though.

The part I am not buying though is that you have the Big 12 being the carcass the rest of the Pride feeds upon. A few months ago I would have been agreeing they are the ones but I wouldn't be so sure now.

The chance of the ACC losing teams is the same as the SEC, B1G, etc. If they did lose teams, VT wouldn't be one of them. I could see FSU and/or Clemson possibly going to the SEC. If that were to happen the ACC would sit at 12.

The two more likely scenario is the ACC eventually adds Notre Dame and Rutgers/UConn to get to 16. The other, is the ACC stays at 14.

I have to believe if there was any danger of the ACC losing teams, because of football quality, WVU would have been added. I also believe if there were any danger now, the ACC would be on the phone with WVU.

(03-19-2012 05:49 AM)OrangeCrush22 Wrote: [ -> ]The chance of the ACC losing teams is the same as the SEC, B1G, etc.

Exaggeration there.

Quote:If they did lose teams,

Nobody says "If the Big Ten lost teams, Purdue/Minnesota/Ohio State/Penn State/Nebraska/whoever wouldn't be one of them."

Quote:VT wouldn't be one of them. I could see FSU and/or Clemson possibly going to the SEC. If that were to happen the ACC would sit at 12.

See, you just said that you could see the ACC possibly losing teams. Can anyone see the SEC or PAC or Big Ten losing teams? Tell me that Missouri really wanted the Big Ten, and they'd jump if they had the chance. The other 37 teams in the stable conferences are locked in.

Quote:The two more likely scenario is the ACC eventually adds Notre Dame and Rutgers/UConn to get to 16. The other, is the ACC stays at 14.

This. Although "stay at 14" is more likely than "go to 16." Because the ACC doesn't want to risk the SEC or Big Ten going to 16 at their expense.

Quote:I have to believe if there was any danger of the ACC losing teams, because of football quality, WVU would have been added. I also believe if there were any danger now, the ACC would be on the phone with WVU.

No, the ACC just did their replacing in anticipation of an SEC raid.

I don't think that the Big 12 can put together a "blow me away" package to entice FSU and Clemson.

The Big XII can offer Clemson and FSU nearly double the money the ACC can offer. If that doesn't blow anyone away at Clemson, then they're stupider than I thought. Tiger fans all know they won't get more favorable terms from the ACC. As long as UNC is in charge, Clemson is going to get screwed...

(03-19-2012 07:01 AM)johnbragg Wrote: [ -> ]The chance of the ACC losing teams is the same as the SEC, B1G, etc.

Exaggeration there.

No it's not. The only major conferences to lose member, since the BCS, are the Big East and XII. If the SEC could have raided the ACC, they would have by now.

Quote:See, you just said that you could see the ACC possibly losing teams. Can anyone see the SEC or PAC or Big Ten losing teams? Tell me that Missouri really wanted the Big Ten, and they'd jump if they had the chance. The other 37 teams in the stable conferences are locked in.

I don't see the ACC losing teams. I'm playing along with you. If the ACC were to lose teams it'd be Clemson/FSU to the SEC. It doesn't mean I think it will happen.

Quote:This. Although "stay at 14" is more likely than "go to 16." Because the ACC doesn't want to risk the SEC or Big Ten going to 16 at their expense.

The ACC isn't going to 16 without a school like Notre Dame.

bitcruncher Wrote:The Big XII can offer Clemson and FSU nearly double the money the ACC can offer.

Umm, no? Assuming that the weight of rumor and opinion is true, the ACC is going to get bumped to $14M per school. The Big 12 is going to get bumped to $20M per school. $20M is less than 2X $14M.

(03-19-2012 07:37 AM)OrangeCrush22 Wrote: [ -> ]No it's not. The only major conferences to lose member, since the BCS, are the Big East and XII. If the SEC could have raided the ACC, they would have by now.

Not really. The SEC hasn't been proactive in realignment since they went to 12. A&M came to them. Then, with 13 teams, the SEC showed some leg and waited for applications. West Virginia got rejected, Missouri got approved.

To say the SEC couldn't raid the ACC or that the SEC couldn't get Texas, you'd have to see them try and fail, in my opinion. It wouldn't be easy, mind you, but if Mike Silve retired and the SEC presidents hired Larry Scott, for instance, we'd see what the SEC can or can't do.

Quote:See, you just said that you could see the ACC possibly losing teams. Can anyone see the SEC or PAC or Big Ten losing teams? Tell me that Missouri really wanted the Big Ten, and they'd jump if they had the chance. The other 37 teams in the stable conferences are locked in.

I don't see the ACC losing teams. I'm playing along with you. If the ACC were to lose teams it'd be Clemson/FSU to the SEC. It doesn't mean I think it will happen.
[/quote]

Here's a statement not to say to your wife/SO:
"If I were to sleep with one of your friends, honey, it would be Laura. It doesn't mean I think it will happen."

Do you acknowledge that there's different levels of probability for unlikely events?

Whether the probability is 10%, 5% or 0.05%, I think you'd agree that the chances of FSU leaving the ACC are greater than the chances of UNC leaving the ACC. And the chances of UNC leaving the ACC (requires someone to crack open the ACC, setting off chain of raids--unlikely but not practically impossible) are greater than the chances of anyone leaving the Big Ten (requires pretty much the end of big-money college athletics.)