When Mizzou announces they are withdrawing from Big 12, the ACC should go ahead and call Notre Dame, before the Big 12 tries to invite WVU. When the answer is no, go ahead and call UConn and WVU. Yes, West Virginia, not Rutgers. We need a football and basketball combo in one school and get the National champs with our other pick. Then the thing's done. If we lose one to the SEC then pick up Rutgers. If we lose another there's always USF or Temple.
ACC probably won't expand anytime soon. Our president seems to have lost her confidence and bravado about joining another conference.
ACC adding West Virginia......never going to happen. While competition wise it would be good for the ACC, this isnt fantasy conference realignment. There are other aspects that go into the decision besides just competitive sports and in those regards WVU does not fit in the ACC at all. Rutgers out of the three probably has the best chance to get in as I dont think it has any particular ACC institutions blocking it.
After Ollie said he'd rather play Air Force and Navy than Syracuse. I say let West Virginia rot in the Big East, get destroyed by Texas in the XII, or get dismantled by every SEC team.
(10-11-2011 06:31 PM)uconnbaseball Wrote: [ -> ]ACC probably won't expand anytime soon. Our president seems to have lost her confidence and bravado about joining another conference.
That is because BC took your application for the ACC and....
(10-11-2011 07:06 PM)Louis Kitton Wrote: [ -> ] (10-11-2011 06:31 PM)uconnbaseball Wrote: [ -> ]ACC probably won't expand anytime soon. Our president seems to have lost her confidence and bravado about joining another conference.
That is because BC took your application for the ACC and....
Boston College is simply afraid of UConn. Going toe-to-toe, in the same conference, UConn would humiliate BC in the long run. It happened in BB and it would happen in FB eventually.
You have to be from New England to understand all of the dynamics involved in that relationship.
(10-11-2011 07:15 PM)UConn-SMU Wrote: [ -> ] (10-11-2011 07:06 PM)Louis Kitton Wrote: [ -> ] (10-11-2011 06:31 PM)uconnbaseball Wrote: [ -> ]ACC probably won't expand anytime soon. Our president seems to have lost her confidence and bravado about joining another conference.
That is because BC took your application for the ACC and....
Boston College is simply afraid of UConn. Going toe-to-toe, in the same conference, UConn would humiliate BC in the long run. It happened in BB and it would happen in FB eventually.
You have to be from New England to understand all of the dynamics involved in that relationship.
I've been to Storrs and I agree BC is just protecting itself out of fear.
I'm thinking Rutgers is more likely as the next Big East school in. New Jersey is a bigger state than Connecticut and no BC issues there.
I think the ACC should ask Notre Dame first. They would most likely say no, then I would offer Rutgers and UConn.
Rutgers and UConn both have good academics. Rutger's is the state university for New Jersey (around 10 million people) so its a big market for TV. It is a really good state for football recruiting.
Connecticut is a smaller state but have pretty good basketball. This would lock down the North East and establish the ACC in prime TV markets.
I do not think WVU has the academics that Rutgers and UConn have.
I don't think any AQ conference other than the BE wants WVU
(10-11-2011 07:43 PM)tj_2009 Wrote: [ -> ]I think the ACC should ask Notre Dame first. They would most likely say no, then I would offer Rutgers and UConn.
Rutgers and UConn both have good academics. Rutger's is the state university for New Jersey (around 10 million people) so its a big market for TV. It is a really good state for football recruiting.
Connecticut is a smaller state but have pretty good basketball. This would lock down the North East and establish the ACC in prime TV markets.
I do not think WVU has the academics that Rutgers and UConn have.
Or....have a little patience and let a few more dominoes fall so that Notre Dame finds itself in a position where it pays off to finally fully join a conference. When they reach that point, which they definitely will, then their obvious choice is the ACC so why give their spot away? Just tell Rutgers privately and informally that the 16th spot is theirs but they have to wait as the 15th spot belongs to Notre Dame. Rutgers would wait for that.
In that light, inviting UConn really is just settling and acting too quickly.
WVU will never be allowed into the ACC. They care too much about academics to let WVU in to their conference.
I'm not trying to rip on WVU, but if they're not the very worst BCS school in academics, they're close to it.
(10-11-2011 07:46 PM)He1nousOne Wrote: [ -> ] (10-11-2011 07:43 PM)tj_2009 Wrote: [ -> ]I think the ACC should ask Notre Dame first. They would most likely say no, then I would offer Rutgers and UConn.
Rutgers and UConn both have good academics. Rutger's is the state university for New Jersey (around 10 million people) so its a big market for TV. It is a really good state for football recruiting.
Connecticut is a smaller state but have pretty good basketball. This would lock down the North East and establish the ACC in prime TV markets.
I do not think WVU has the academics that Rutgers and UConn have.
Or....have a little patience and let a few more dominoes fall so that Notre Dame finds itself in a position where it pays off to finally fully join a conference. When they reach that point, which they definitely will, then their obvious choice is the ACC so why give their spot away? Just tell Rutgers privately and informally that the 16th spot is theirs but they have to wait as the 15th spot belongs to Notre Dame. Rutgers would wait for that.
In that light, inviting UConn really is just settling and acting too quickly.
That's a good point. The one question that I have is why is 16 a limit for the size of the conference. If the ACC gets to 16 and then Notre Dame wants to join they they will obviously say yes.
I am thinking that ESPN probably told the ACC that they will re-negotiate the TV deal and give an increase in $$$ per school for Syracuse and Pittsburgh but they said they would not do it for UConn or Rutgers. I realize BC said no to UConn but if the TV $$$ were really favorable then the others in the ACC would vote to add Uconn regardless of BC.
(10-11-2011 07:55 PM)tj_2009 Wrote: [ -> ] (10-11-2011 07:46 PM)He1nousOne Wrote: [ -> ] (10-11-2011 07:43 PM)tj_2009 Wrote: [ -> ]I think the ACC should ask Notre Dame first. They would most likely say no, then I would offer Rutgers and UConn.
Rutgers and UConn both have good academics. Rutger's is the state university for New Jersey (around 10 million people) so its a big market for TV. It is a really good state for football recruiting.
Connecticut is a smaller state but have pretty good basketball. This would lock down the North East and establish the ACC in prime TV markets.
I do not think WVU has the academics that Rutgers and UConn have.
Or....have a little patience and let a few more dominoes fall so that Notre Dame finds itself in a position where it pays off to finally fully join a conference. When they reach that point, which they definitely will, then their obvious choice is the ACC so why give their spot away? Just tell Rutgers privately and informally that the 16th spot is theirs but they have to wait as the 15th spot belongs to Notre Dame. Rutgers would wait for that.
In that light, inviting UConn really is just settling and acting too quickly.
That's a good point. The one question that I have is why is 16 a limit for the size of the conference. If the ACC gets to 16 and then Notre Dame wants to join they they will obviously say yes.
I am thinking that ESPN probably told the ACC that they will re-negotiate the TV deal and give an increase in $$$ per school for Syracuse and Pittsburgh but they said they would not do it for UConn or Rutgers. I realize BC said no to UConn but if the TV $$$ were really favorable then the others in the ACC would vote to add Uconn regardless of BC.
First reason for capping at 16 is scheduling. As it stands with NCAA rules the two division set up is the only one that is sanctioned and has championships so currently the only outlook that conferences have is to set up two division conferences.
With two divisions of 8 you have 7 of your 12 games in your division. That leaves only 5 left and having only one game against the other division means that basically they are two separate 8 team conferences that claim to have a connection for a championship game. That means that in a 16 team conference two games against the opposite division is a Must and that leaves only 3 OOC games to schedule.
If a Conference went to 18 teams for football that leaves 8 games to play in division and two games against the other division and only two OOC games. I dont see ANY programs in these major conferences wanting to go below 3 OOC games so in that sense 16 team conferences is the cap.
Now in my opinion at some point we will see the NCAA pressured into writing rules for four division pod set ups for conferences as that will allow the newly created 16 team conference(s) to be able to provide more opportunities for their member institutions to play all of the institutions in the entire conference. Should those rules ever happen then we might see in the somewhat distant future the possibility of 20 team conferences but I would hate to see that.
The sensible cap to all of this madness is 16 teams per conference, even if we finally get the opportunity to have four pod divisions of four teams that provide for a conference playoff instead of just a conference championship. When that happens, there will be no more need for any conference to expand past 16.
(10-11-2011 07:46 PM)He1nousOne Wrote: [ -> ] (10-11-2011 07:43 PM)tj_2009 Wrote: [ -> ]I think the ACC should ask Notre Dame first. They would most likely say no, then I would offer Rutgers and UConn.
Rutgers and UConn both have good academics. Rutger's is the state university for New Jersey (around 10 million people) so its a big market for TV. It is a really good state for football recruiting.
Connecticut is a smaller state but have pretty good basketball. This would lock down the North East and establish the ACC in prime TV markets.
I do not think WVU has the academics that Rutgers and UConn have.
Or....have a little patience and let a few more dominoes fall so that Notre Dame finds itself in a position where it pays off to finally fully join a conference. When they reach that point, which they definitely will, then their obvious choice is the ACC so why give their spot away? Just tell Rutgers privately and informally that the 16th spot is theirs but they have to wait as the 15th spot belongs to Notre Dame. Rutgers would wait for that.
In that light, inviting UConn really is just settling and acting too quickly.
I agree with your thinking.
The ACC is done until more things happen. They have NO NEED to add right now and aren't going to until more happens with other confrences. With the Big-10 and Pac-12 sitting this round out, the ACC got two that will increase the $$$$, they'll go cash those tv checks and be done.............................for now. If they were going to added more from them BE now, they would've. The ACC more than likely ran the possible additions by ESPN and ESPN said that Pitt and Cuse would get the most money.
(10-11-2011 08:48 PM)miko33 Wrote: [ -> ] (10-11-2011 07:46 PM)He1nousOne Wrote: [ -> ] (10-11-2011 07:43 PM)tj_2009 Wrote: [ -> ]I think the ACC should ask Notre Dame first. They would most likely say no, then I would offer Rutgers and UConn.
Rutgers and UConn both have good academics. Rutger's is the state university for New Jersey (around 10 million people) so its a big market for TV. It is a really good state for football recruiting.
Connecticut is a smaller state but have pretty good basketball. This would lock down the North East and establish the ACC in prime TV markets.
I do not think WVU has the academics that Rutgers and UConn have.
Or....have a little patience and let a few more dominoes fall so that Notre Dame finds itself in a position where it pays off to finally fully join a conference. When they reach that point, which they definitely will, then their obvious choice is the ACC so why give their spot away? Just tell Rutgers privately and informally that the 16th spot is theirs but they have to wait as the 15th spot belongs to Notre Dame. Rutgers would wait for that.
In that light, inviting UConn really is just settling and acting too quickly.
I agree with your thinking.
Now that I think about it you guys are all correct. We should wait for ND to make a decision, but only until they put their non-football sports in the Big 12 or join the Big 10 outright. I guess when I posted this thread I was just anxious for this whole realignment to be done. Hurry up already Mizzou! This has got to start with you guys.
(10-11-2011 08:58 PM)ecumbh1999 Wrote: [ -> ]The ACC is done until more things happen. They have NO NEED to add right now and aren't going to until more happens with other confrences. With the Big-10 and Pac-12 sitting this round out, the ACC got two that will increase the $$$$, they'll go cash those tv checks and be done.............................for now. If they were going to added more from them BE now, they would've. The ACC more than likely ran the possible additions by ESPN and ESPN said that Pitt and Cuse would get the most money.
I wonder who they said would bring the 3rd most money? The 4th? Obviously, those ranks don't include ND.
(10-11-2011 07:46 PM)He1nousOne Wrote: [ -> ] (10-11-2011 07:43 PM)tj_2009 Wrote: [ -> ]ave.
Or....have a little patience and let a few more dominoes fall so that Notre Dame finds itself in a position where it pays off to finally fully join a conference. When they reach that point, which they definitely will, then their obvious choice is the ACC so why give their spot away? Just tell Rutgers privately and informally that the 16th spot is theirs but they have to wait as the 15th spot belongs to Notre Dame. Rutgers would wait for that.
In that light, inviting UConn really is just settling and acting too quickly.
I don't really think that ND is ever going to "reach that point".
I just don't see a four 16 team conference setup or one that would shut ND out of the BCS.
Absent that, ND will always have other options.
(10-11-2011 09:00 PM)ringmaster Wrote: [ -> ] (10-11-2011 08:48 PM)miko33 Wrote: [ -> ] (10-11-2011 07:46 PM)He1nousOne Wrote: [ -> ] (10-11-2011 07:43 PM)tj_2009 Wrote: [ -> ]I think the ACC should ask Notre Dame first. They would most likely say no, then I would offer Rutgers and UConn.
Rutgers and UConn both have good academics. Rutger's is the state university for New Jersey (around 10 million people) so its a big market for TV. It is a really good state for football recruiting.
Connecticut is a smaller state but have pretty good basketball. This would lock down the North East and establish the ACC in prime TV markets.
I do not think WVU has the academics that Rutgers and UConn have.
Or....have a little patience and let a few more dominoes fall so that Notre Dame finds itself in a position where it pays off to finally fully join a conference. When they reach that point, which they definitely will, then their obvious choice is the ACC so why give their spot away? Just tell Rutgers privately and informally that the 16th spot is theirs but they have to wait as the 15th spot belongs to Notre Dame. Rutgers would wait for that.
In that light, inviting UConn really is just settling and acting too quickly.
I agree with your thinking.
Now that I think about it you guys are all correct. We should wait for ND to make a decision, but only until they put their non-football sports in the Big 12 or join the Big 10 outright. I guess when I posted this thread I was just anxious for this whole realignment to be done. Hurry up already Mizzou! This has got to start with you guys.
Well actually I would say that the Big East is probably slated to make the next big moves. They will raid the conferences below them and quickly rise back up to 12 to once again be a viable AQ status conference. Once their process begins we will likely see the intentions of the Big12. If they really do want to remain at 10 then there would be no counter move to take Big East teams before those programs realize that the Big East is going to be more viable then it was before Pitt and Syracuse left.
When the Big East does raid those conferences causing "major damage" to those conference's standing then that is just more legal precedent for Missouri to make their move if they really have the invite sealed up. If not we may see the SEC invite WVU during that Big East revival before WVU realizes they have something really good in that newly invigorated and territorially expanded Big East.
Either way the Big East is going to get a response out of either the SEC or the Big12.
Just my silly little prediction that will be forgotten before any of this happens.
(10-11-2011 09:08 PM)TerryD Wrote: [ -> ] (10-11-2011 07:46 PM)He1nousOne Wrote: [ -> ] (10-11-2011 07:43 PM)tj_2009 Wrote: [ -> ]ave.
Or....have a little patience and let a few more dominoes fall so that Notre Dame finds itself in a position where it pays off to finally fully join a conference. When they reach that point, which they definitely will, then their obvious choice is the ACC so why give their spot away? Just tell Rutgers privately and informally that the 16th spot is theirs but they have to wait as the 15th spot belongs to Notre Dame. Rutgers would wait for that.
In that light, inviting UConn really is just settling and acting too quickly.
I don't really think that ND is ever going to "reach that point".
I just don't see a four 16 team conference setup or one that would shut ND out of the BCS.
Absent that, ND will always have other options.
With expanding conferences that means less OOC scheduling opportunities for schools that Notre Dame regularly plays and considers "Rivalries". Don't think that all the talk of inviting Navy and Air Force into the Big East has Nothing to do with enticing Notre Dame as a full fledged member.