CSNbbs

Full Version: Linebacker U?
You're currently viewing a stripped down version of our content. View the full version with proper formatting.
Pages: 1 2
I thought about this as I watched Toledo - NIU. The Huskies have a tradition of great running backs. I began to think about what the perceptions are around the league regarding each school and their strengths in producing players. They don’t necessarily have to be NFL players, just great players within the MAC.

Whether you’ve followed MAC football for 4 years or 40 years, we all have either made our own conclusions or have heard from others regarding school “X” and the fact that they usually have great ________.

We most likely won’t reach concensus but this could be an interesting discussion. For the purpose of this thread, we are looking for trends over time (1 guy does not make a trend).

What position(s) do you believe each school is known for producing great prospects:


I’ll start by giving you a few of my picks off the top of my head. On some, I’m unsure.


Akron

Ball St

BGSU - QB, receivers

Buffalo

CMU - O and D linemen, LB

EMU

KSU - DB and LB

Miami - RB

NIU - RB, O and D linemen

Ohio - DB, LB

Temple - O and D linemen

Toledo - QB, DB, receivers

WMU - QB, receivers, DB




So, what are YOUR thoughts? I'm sure I missed something in my list.
You're too kind about our D linemen, they haven't been that good until recently. I made up an NIU all-decade team awhile ago and was hard pressed to come up with many exceptional players on the D line. Running backs and O linemen are a different story. NIU is kind of an assembly line for those guys.
Hard to do unless you specify era (decade). Miami's past heritage would be LB's (Bob Babich) and defensive players (CB, nose tackle Brad Cousineau) I would say, but we've been thin on D (and O) the last few years. We've had one great QB (Big Ben), and some good running backs, but few have been successful in the pro's. (going way back Sherm Smith and Rob Carpenter were very good NFL backs in the 80's).
I think Toledo has to be known for running backs. Wasean Tait was first. 1,905 yards rushing as a junior and talk about being a Hesiman candidate going into his senior year, then tore up his knee in the opener of that senior year.....otherwise he would have been in the NFL. Next was Chester Taylor, and his backup Antwan McRay played a year for the Pittsburgh Steelers. Not bad being the #2 RB on a team for your career and signing a free agent contract and playing a year with the Steelers. Taylor of course has been a very good RB in the NFL. Next was Scooter McDougle. We all know about the allegations, but boy was he great for Toledo in 2004. He messed his knee up in the 2004 MACC Game, and was never the same, but Toledo doesn't win the MAC in 2004 without him. Then was Jalen Parmele, whom I believe is with the Ravens right now. After Parmele was DaJuane Collins. Collins just graduated last year. He was a pretty good back that had a good YPC average on a team that threw the ball a lot instead of running.

If you go way back, there's guys like NFL Hall of Famer Emlen Tunnell and Mel Triplett, whom also played in the NFL.


Toledo's got two former running backs that are still currently playing in the NFL. NIU probably has a better tradition of RB's as they have a long streak of 1000 yard rushers and a couple of NFL RB's themselves, but Toledo's done pretty good too.
Good point, Brian. Can't believe that I forgot about Taylor and the others. BTW, Parmele was from my H.S. - a half million years after I left there.

As far as eras go, I'd just say let's not worry so much about the era. Coaches change, systems change, etc.

I nearly put QB as one for UT, as you had some great ones - Ealey, Gradkowski. Same for CMU - Hogeboom, LaFevour.

While discussing your own school is easy and valuable to this discussion, I am interested in your perceptions about other schools and what are their strengths.
Not so sure about WMU and QBs. I suppose it depends on what your criteria is. I think it's hard to claim that you produce good players when you've never had one actually in the NFL. You've had some solid QBs over the years, but I don't think of QBs when I think about Western. I would however put TE in there for Western.
My thoughts:

NIU is running backs.
BG is QB's. Some very good ones over the years, not just since 2000.
WMU is WR's.

Outside of those three and Toledo, I really can't say that the other MAC schools have stood out to me at any one position.
(11-11-2010 01:26 PM)eich41 Wrote: [ -> ]Not so sure about WMU and QBs. I suppose it depends on what your criteria is. I think it's hard to claim that you produce good players when you've never had one actually in the NFL. You've had some solid QBs over the years, but I don't think of QBs when I think about Western. I would however put TE in there for Western.

Playing in the NFL isn't really a good indicator of a good QB at the college level. Chuck Ealey never lost a college game, but didn't play in the NFL. The NFL wanted him as a DB, so he went to the CFL. After Ealey, Toledo had Gene Swick. He held the career passing record at Toledo for a long time until Gradkowski broke it. Swick finished 8th or 10th or something in the Heisman voting in 1975. He was one of the best QB's to ever play at Toledo, yet he never played in the NFL.
CMU has had some very good OL over the years. As of right now I believe there are 3 or 4 OL in the league.
(11-11-2010 01:30 PM)BrianNowicki Wrote: [ -> ]
(11-11-2010 01:26 PM)eich41 Wrote: [ -> ]Not so sure about WMU and QBs. I suppose it depends on what your criteria is. I think it's hard to claim that you produce good players when you've never had one actually in the NFL. You've had some solid QBs over the years, but I don't think of QBs when I think about Western. I would however put TE in there for Western.

Playing in the NFL isn't really a good indicator of a good QB at the college level. Chuck Ealey never lost a college game, but didn't play in the NFL. The NFL wanted him as a DB, so he went to the CFL. After Ealey, Toledo had Gene Swick. He held the career passing record at Toledo for a long time until Gradkowski broke it. Swick finished 8th or 10th or something in the Heisman voting in 1975. He was one of the best QB's to ever play at Toledo, yet he never played in the NFL.

I guess I was thinking that NFL players was a big part of this. Probably because of the thread title. Linebacker U was given to PSU because of all the linebackers they produced that went to the NFL. And while NFL players may not be all that should be considered, I still have a hard time agreeing with a school being "QB (or whatever) U" or even being synonymous with a position if they haven't EVER had a player in the league. Solid but unspectacular play at a position doesn't make me think "(Position) U".
(11-11-2010 01:26 PM)eich41 Wrote: [ -> ]Not so sure about WMU and QBs. I suppose it depends on what your criteria is. I think it's hard to claim that you produce good players when you've never had one actually in the NFL. You've had some solid QBs over the years, but I don't think of QBs when I think about Western. I would however put TE in there for Western.

Remember WMU QB Tim Lester? When he finished, he had 11,299 yards passing, which in 1999 placed him in the top five all time in NCAA stats. Since then, quite a number have passed him by. He also led the Broncos into the MACC against Marshall and Pennington in 1999.

As for TE, I just put receivers, as we've had some great ones at both positions.
Too much coaching turnover in this conference to have "position U"s.
Just your opinion. Tell that to NIU. When Novak left, did they no longer produce good RBs?
Do you want to include coaches? There have been a lot of good coaches coming through our league.
(11-11-2010 01:38 PM)eich41 Wrote: [ -> ]
(11-11-2010 01:30 PM)BrianNowicki Wrote: [ -> ]
(11-11-2010 01:26 PM)eich41 Wrote: [ -> ]Not so sure about WMU and QBs. I suppose it depends on what your criteria is. I think it's hard to claim that you produce good players when you've never had one actually in the NFL. You've had some solid QBs over the years, but I don't think of QBs when I think about Western. I would however put TE in there for Western.

Playing in the NFL isn't really a good indicator of a good QB at the college level. Chuck Ealey never lost a college game, but didn't play in the NFL. The NFL wanted him as a DB, so he went to the CFL. After Ealey, Toledo had Gene Swick. He held the career passing record at Toledo for a long time until Gradkowski broke it. Swick finished 8th or 10th or something in the Heisman voting in 1975. He was one of the best QB's to ever play at Toledo, yet he never played in the NFL.

I guess I was thinking that NFL players was a big part of this. Probably because of the thread title. Linebacker U was given to PSU because of all the linebackers they produced that went to the NFL. And while NFL players may not be all that should be considered, I still have a hard time agreeing with a school being "QB (or whatever) U" or even being synonymous with a position if they haven't EVER had a player in the league. Solid but unspectacular play at a position doesn't make me think "(Position) U".

I understand what you're saying. I just went by the criteria outlined in the original post, which said it didn't have to be NFL players, just great players within the MAC.
(11-11-2010 02:16 PM)Sultan of Euphonistan Wrote: [ -> ]Do you want to include coaches? There have been a lot of good coaches coming through our league.

Yep. And even some really, really bad ones that are popular now as dumb sportscasters on networks like ESPN..........where's that Lee Corso is still an idiot thread when you need it?
(11-11-2010 02:06 PM)MileHighBronco Wrote: [ -> ]
(11-11-2010 01:26 PM)eich41 Wrote: [ -> ]Not so sure about WMU and QBs. I suppose it depends on what your criteria is. I think it's hard to claim that you produce good players when you've never had one actually in the NFL. You've had some solid QBs over the years, but I don't think of QBs when I think about Western. I would however put TE in there for Western.

Remember WMU QB Tim Lester? When he finished, he had 11,299 yards passing, which in 1999 placed him in the top five all time in NCAA stats. Since then, quite a number have passed him by. He also led the Broncos into the MACC against Marshall and Pennington in 1999.

As for TE, I just put receivers, as we've had some great ones at both positions.

I remember Lester, but that's one guy. I wouldn't consider CMU to be known for its QBs, and they've had much more talented QBs over the years than WMU. I just don't think "Man WMU always has great QBs".
(11-11-2010 02:29 PM)BrianNowicki Wrote: [ -> ]
(11-11-2010 02:16 PM)Sultan of Euphonistan Wrote: [ -> ]Do you want to include coaches? There have been a lot of good coaches coming through our league.

Yep. And even some really, really bad ones that are popular now as dumb sportscasters on networks like ESPN..........where's that Lee Corso is still an idiot thread when you need it?

YOU RANG???
(11-11-2010 02:09 PM)MileHighBronco Wrote: [ -> ]Just your opinion. Tell that to NIU. When Novak left, did they no longer produce good RBs?

Are you looking back 4 years or 40? I think that's where we're not seeing eye to eye. If WMU went to the spread for the next 10 years, would it still be known for TEs? Probably not. Schools like Penn State, who can keep their coaching staffs for longer periods of time, would be known to recruits as "your position U".

If MAC ADs had foresight and hired coaches with similar philosophies (like, oh, if Heeke decided CMU would be a spread school from now on) I could see schools becoming "position U." Is this is true with NIU?

Personally I think in the MAC schools that are historically bad would produce the best punters, but I don't have the data.
NIU has had some great kickers over the last decade, a lot of sure foots. Not sure if that is Kicker U, but Azar, Nendick and Salerno were recent money, and Tom Wittum was a NFL Pro-Bowler in the 70's

Reaching, I know.
Pages: 1 2
Reference URL's