Actually I still believe it is. However, its amazing how many similar schools have added, or are in the process of adding football- South Alabama, Georgia State, UTSA, Charlotte, FIU, FAU, UAB, etc. are ones that come quickly to mind. Is Little Rock that much different than all those Southern cities? I still think it is. I think Chris is too rational a person to go out on the limb with football. Maybe a future AD won't be.
(09-17-2010 01:50 PM)mjs Wrote: [ -> ]Actually I still believe it is. However, its amazing how many similar schools have added, or are in the process of adding football- South Alabama, Georgia State, UTSA, Charlotte, FIU, FAU, UAB, etc. are ones that come quickly to mind. Is Little Rock that much different than all those Southern cities? I still think it is. I think Chris is too rational a person to go out on the limb with football. Maybe a future AD won't be.
It might happen someday, but I think it's doubtful. Too much hogism here in Little Rock. We're about the only state where the major university won't play other state schools. I also don't think that being part of the hogism system, that the chancellor of Little Rock would ever have the guts to ever propose anything. If it even happened, I think the state legislature would have to pass the necessary legislation to have it done. Probably too much hogism in the legislature for that to happen anytime soon. And if it did, I don't think it would ever draw much.
I don't know if Gene(DollarBill)actually coined the word "hogism", but he's the only one I've ever heard use it. Thanks Gene, I like it, and it fits perfectly.
Man, that headline was just plain mean-spirited. Got my hopes up!
(09-17-2010 02:02 PM)LRTrojan Wrote: [ -> ]I don't know if Gene(DollarBill)actually coined the word "hogism", but he's the only one I've ever heard use it. Thanks Gene, I like it, and it fits perfectly.
I don't know where it originated. I thought I made it up but that was over ten years ago so I can't say.
Well, LRTrojan, you have backed me into the corner. I now have to admit to plagiarism. I would say going back at least 40 years, a reporter named Randy Galloway of the Dallas-Ft Worth area while responding to all the hog B.S.coming out of Arkansas, referred to such loyalty as "HOGISM". I didn' begin using the term until about 2 years ago on this board. But, I will say, for those of who do not want to be led and indocrinated by what comes from NW Arkansas, it seems to be an appropriate term.
(09-17-2010 01:50 PM)mjs Wrote: [ -> ]Actually I still believe it is. However, its amazing how many similar schools have added, or are in the process of adding football- South Alabama, Georgia State, UTSA, Charlotte, FIU, FAU, UAB, etc. are ones that come quickly to mind. Is Little Rock that much different than all those Southern cities? I still think it is. I think Chris is too rational a person to go out on the limb with football. Maybe a future AD won't be.
I can't see football happening at UALR anytime soon, however, should wealthy business folks in the community and entities like the Convention and Visitors Bureau decide it would be in the best interest of Central Arkansas to have a football program that could develop into something that would eventually bring people into Little Rock-North Little Rock six or seven weekends a year, that's when it could happen. Assume they could schedule most of their games and price them reasonably on weekends when the Razorbacks were out of state. If we could field a decent team we could possibly develop a following.
Some have mentioned that having a large stadium could be a detriment.
I disagree. Having a ready made stadium right down the street means the investment to have a team would be significantly less than if we had to also build a stadium. The Razorbacks are pricing themselves out of business to the ordinary folks, but a team right here in Little Rock that could offer tickets at reasonable prices could make some inroads. Will it happen? Who can say. But who thought we'd ever have Alltel (Verizon
Arena?) Not many of us old timers. And then who ever thought we'd have an on campus arena like the Stephens Center? Probably none of us. So let's not say never to football. If it happens, great. If it doesn't, no big deal. Everyone on this board loves the basketball program, but if we add football, so much the better.
(09-20-2010 08:49 AM)outsideualr Wrote: [ -> ]I can't see football happening at UALR anytime soon, however, should wealthy business folks in the community and entities like the Convention and Visitors Bureau decide it would be in the best interest of Central Arkansas to have a football program that could develop into something that would eventually bring people into Little Rock-North Little Rock six or seven weekends a year, that's when it could happen. Assume they could schedule most of their games and price them reasonably on weekends when the Razorbacks were out of state.
If we could field a decent team we could possibly develop a following.
We've had some pretty good basketball teams over the years, and what kind of following have we developed? About 2,000 pretty loyal fans, who'll support the team whether they're worth a **** or not. By the way, that 2,000 fans was somewhat higher twenty years ago, but unfortunately, people eventually die. I don't know what will happen twenty years down the road when some of us older fans are gone. Will that 2,000 be down to maybe 1,500 or even worse, 1,000?
The administration at UALR needs to put some effort into developing the best basketball program we can be(which they've not done a very good job of), and not even consider being a doormat for other schools and their football teams.
(09-20-2010 10:25 AM)LRTrojan Wrote: [ -> ] (09-20-2010 08:49 AM)outsideualr Wrote: [ -> ]I can't see football happening at UALR anytime soon, however, should wealthy business folks in the community and entities like the Convention and Visitors Bureau decide it would be in the best interest of Central Arkansas to have a football program that could develop into something that would eventually bring people into Little Rock-North Little Rock six or seven weekends a year, that's when it could happen. Assume they could schedule most of their games and price them reasonably on weekends when the Razorbacks were out of state.
If we could field a decent team we could possibly develop a following.
We've had some pretty good basketball teams over the years, and what kind of following have we developed? About 2,000 pretty loyal fans, who'll support the team whether they're worth a **** or not. By the way, that 2,000 fans was somewhat higher twenty years ago, but unfortunately, people eventually die. I don't know what will happen twenty years down the road when some of us older fans are gone. Will that 2,000 be down to maybe 1,500 or even worse, 1,000?
The administration at UALR needs to put some effort into developing the best basketball program we can be(which they've not done a very good job of), and not even consider being a doormat for other schools and their football teams.
I agree that we need to focus on developing the fan base for our basketball program, but it's possible that there would be more people interested in coming into Little Rock for a few weekend football games with all the tailgating, etc. And I would only consider it if there was outside funding for the program where the university wouldn't have to bear the financial burden. Probably won't happen anytime soon, but when I think of Stephens Arena, I think anything is possible.
(09-20-2010 11:25 AM)outsideualr Wrote: [ -> ]I agree that we need to focus on developing the fan base for our basketball program, but it's possible that there would be more people interested in coming into Little Rock for a few weekend football games with all the tailgating, etc. And I would only consider it if there was outside funding for the program where the university wouldn't have to bear the financial burden. Probably won't happen anytime soon, but when I think of Stephens Arena, I think anything is possible.:cheers:
It's already been proven that having a palace(Stephens Center)to play in doesn't produce championship basketball teams. You've got to have the players to do that. It's pretty obvious that we don't have the coach that's able to recruit those type players.
(09-20-2010 11:40 AM)LRTrojan Wrote: [ -> ] (09-20-2010 11:25 AM)outsideualr Wrote: [ -> ]I agree that we need to focus on developing the fan base for our basketball program, but it's possible that there would be more people interested in coming into Little Rock for a few weekend football games with all the tailgating, etc. And I would only consider it if there was outside funding for the program where the university wouldn't have to bear the financial burden. Probably won't happen anytime soon, but when I think of Stephens Arena, I think anything is possible.:cheers:
It's already been proven that having a palace(Stephens Center)to play in doesn't produce championship basketball teams. You've got to have the players to do that. It's pretty obvious that we don't have the coach that's able to recruit those type players.
We don't know that for sure. We know it hasn't happened thus far, but in all fairness Steve still has at least this year and maybe more to prove he can recruit the type of players who win championships. Only when his tenure here is over will we actually know the true answer to that question. For everyone's sake, I hope you're wrong on this one. If you're correct, it will be another year or two of frustration. But hey. I'm beginning to think like Scotto (scary thought). Have a regular season team to root for (UALR), and pick a tournament team to root for.
That way you won't be too disappointed. Not a bad philosophy. Realistically the odds on any team in our league winning a championship is something like 12-1 against. I wouldn't want to be betting into those odds in a game of chance. If the coach can't get it done in 12 years, then I think maybe you have a valid argument. Just five more years to go to see how it works out.
(09-20-2010 12:54 PM)outsideualr Wrote: [ -> ] (09-20-2010 11:40 AM)LRTrojan Wrote: [ -> ] (09-20-2010 11:25 AM)outsideualr Wrote: [ -> ]I agree that we need to focus on developing the fan base for our basketball program, but it's possible that there would be more people interested in coming into Little Rock for a few weekend football games with all the tailgating, etc. And I would only consider it if there was outside funding for the program where the university wouldn't have to bear the financial burden. Probably won't happen anytime soon, but when I think of Stephens Arena, I think anything is possible.:cheers:
It's already been proven that having a palace(Stephens Center)to play in doesn't produce championship basketball teams. You've got to have the players to do that. It's pretty obvious that we don't have the coach that's able to recruit those type players.
We don't know that for sure. We know it hasn't happened thus far, but in all fairness Steve still has at least this year and maybe more to prove he can recruit the type of players who win championships. Only when his tenure here is over will we actually know the true answer to that question. For everyone's sake, I hope you're wrong on this one. If you're correct, it will be another year or two of frustration. But hey. I'm beginning to think like Scotto (scary thought). Have a regular season team to root for (UALR), and pick a tournament team to root for.
That way you won't be too disappointed. Not a bad philosophy. Realistically the odds on any team in our league winning a championship is something like 12-1 against. I wouldn't want to be betting into those odds in a game of chance. If the coach can't get it done in 12 years, then I think maybe you have a valid argument. Just five more years to go to see how it works out.
If he's here for his 12th year, I won't be. The fact that he's entering his 8th year pretty well tells me that our administration isn't interested in winning championships.
(09-20-2010 12:59 PM)LRTrojan Wrote: [ -> ] (09-20-2010 12:54 PM)outsideualr Wrote: [ -> ] (09-20-2010 11:40 AM)LRTrojan Wrote: [ -> ] (09-20-2010 11:25 AM)outsideualr Wrote: [ -> ]I agree that we need to focus on developing the fan base for our basketball program, but it's possible that there would be more people interested in coming into Little Rock for a few weekend football games with all the tailgating, etc. And I would only consider it if there was outside funding for the program where the university wouldn't have to bear the financial burden. Probably won't happen anytime soon, but when I think of Stephens Arena, I think anything is possible.:cheers:
It's already been proven that having a palace(Stephens Center)to play in doesn't produce championship basketball teams. You've got to have the players to do that. It's pretty obvious that we don't have the coach that's able to recruit those type players.
We don't know that for sure. We know it hasn't happened thus far, but in all fairness Steve still has at least this year and maybe more to prove he can recruit the type of players who win championships. Only when his tenure here is over will we actually know the true answer to that question. For everyone's sake, I hope you're wrong on this one. If you're correct, it will be another year or two of frustration. But hey. I'm beginning to think like Scotto (scary thought). Have a regular season team to root for (UALR), and pick a tournament team to root for.
That way you won't be too disappointed. Not a bad philosophy. Realistically the odds on any team in our league winning a championship is something like 12-1 against. I wouldn't want to be betting into those odds in a game of chance. If the coach can't get it done in 12 years, then I think maybe you have a valid argument. Just five more years to go to see how it works out.
If he's here for his 12th year, I won't be. The fact that he's entering his 8th year pretty well tells me that our administration isn't interested in winning championships.
I think they're interested in winning, but at what cost? I think that's the factor. Money. And as long as players continue to graduate and don't get in trouble with the police, they're happy. Winning championships is probably about #3 on their priority list, behind the first two mentioned.
(09-20-2010 01:07 PM)outsideualr Wrote: [ -> ]Winning championships is probably about #3 on their priority list, behind the first two mentioned.
+1. Seems reasonable.
(09-20-2010 01:07 PM)outsideualr Wrote: [ -> ]I think they're interested in winning, but at what cost? I think that's the factor. Money. And as long as players continue to graduate and don't get in trouble with the police, they're happy. Winning championships is probably about #3 on their priority list, behind the first two mentioned.l.
Jeez, is it that high. You can win running a clean program. You've just got to be able to recognize talent, and be able to convince them to go to your school. No, it's not that easy, but nobody ever said it was. Players want to play for coaches that let them score. You don't find too many NOW DAYS who want to play for a coach who only stresses defense. Even Bobby Knight wasn't winning championships the latter part of his career.
(09-20-2010 01:54 PM)LRTrojan Wrote: [ -> ] (09-20-2010 01:07 PM)outsideualr Wrote: [ -> ]I think they're interested in winning, but at what cost? I think that's the factor. Money. And as long as players continue to graduate and don't get in trouble with the police, they're happy. Winning championships is probably about #3 on their priority list, behind the first two mentioned.l.
Jeez, is it that high. You can win running a clean program. You've just got to be able to recognize talent, and be able to convince them to go to your school. No, it's not that easy, but nobody ever said it was. Players want to play for coaches that let them score. You don't find too many NOW DAYS who want to play for a coach who only stresses defense. Even Bobby Knight wasn't winning championships the latter part of his career.
I believe he want them to score. But he's happy if we score just a minimum of a point or two more than the other team. He favors an offense that tries to either get the ball to the big man inside or penetrate for a close in shot. And there's nothing wrong with that philosophy. But it requires some components such as a big man who can score regularly inside, and players who can get to the basket and score. We have tried to play this style of ball some years when we didn't have those components. Obviously he teaches tough defense, which is good.
There are a lot of schools vying for the good talent, so it is a difficult task signing the best players. But you're right. It does take someone who can sign those kids in order to have a top program.
And in a program such as ours, which is competing for paying customers, you need to be playing a more up tempo game to attract fans. You can't always recruit the top players, but you can play a style of ball that is attractive to both players and fans, and that's the one thing that we have control over, and haven't done. Will it ever change?
Not likely. Coaches develop a style of play with which they're comfortable, and not many can switch horses in midstream. We either win with the style we're playing or we don't. The system is not going to change.