The Big East has a huge revenue disparity with the other BCS conferences-especially those at the top. This has created a situation where once again the league is likely to be poached-possibly even destroyed for football and even severely weakened for basketball.
Previously the Big East decided not to go for its own network. Tranghese thought that exposure rather than revenues were what was important for the league. This backfired quite a bit when the Big Ten created a channel and it significantly raised the revenues for those teams -and subsequently the SEC via their deal with ESPN (which was largely done to stave off the threat of their own network/channel).
With possible defections looming again, it is time for drastic measures to attempt to hold together what has been built over the years with this hybrid league. It is time that the Big East with the largest tv market coverage of ANY conference gets paid as such and ends the threat of constant defections-possibly even making the Big East a desirable destination for other BCS league teams. Would it be easy-no--but it could be done.
How? The Big East should create it's own network while continuing deals with networks such as ESPN and CBS.
Recently some posters on a Pitt board put together some numbers that were intriguing--I've put together some numbers based on their premise that show if it could be accomplished a BE network could not only be profitable but put the Big East in line with the best paid BCS conferences.
First, its important to know just how much coverage the Big East already has in the U.S.
from the Big East website:
About BIG EAST Television Agreements
Seven BIG EAST Conference members are located in the top 12 media markets (DMAs), and 12 members are located in the top 34, covering over 25 percent of all U.S. markets – by far, the largest coverage of any conference.
So the Big East right now has coverage in better than 25% of all U.S. markets which translates to 28,716,595.0 tv households.
The % of these households that actually pay for cable according to Neilsen is 56%.
This gives a figure of 16,081,293.2 households in Big East markets actually paying for cable.
Now, if you had a Big East Network/Channel (including all 16 current members aligned as they are now) and used the Big Ten revenue model for this channel-cable providers would pay $1.10 per month per subscriber. This sounds like alot, but it actually translates to only $13.20 per YEAR per subscriber. And this isn't for entire State's necessarily, it is for actual markets BE athletics are already viewed in.
There is a high likelihood viewers in these BE markets would want access to their local teams product which would deliver just what the BTN provides for Big Ten viewers-live football, basketball, and other sports that aren't being broadcast by the networks or are only as pay per view games and special features and replays of classic games. Having Notre Dame in the conference and Big East basketball product to offer as well would help to garner interest in areas such as Philly and NYC that might be more difficult to generate full rates in.
So we take the $13.20 per year X Big East tv households paying for cable and divide this by the number of teams(16) which gives you a dollar amount each team could get. Since football is what needs to get to a certain dollar figure, and bb schools don't currently get a "full share" in the Big East, in my model this is true as well. Divide the above number by two--8 basketball teams get this figure and you add the other half back into what the football teams receive.
Here it is laid out:
# BE tv households (25% of us homes) 28716595
% with cable (56%) 16081293.2
rate of service/month $1.1
x12 $13.20
x BE cable households $212,273,070.24
div. by 16 teams (=teams share before adjustment) $13,267,066.89
half share for bb teams $6,633,533.45
plus half share xtra for football $19,900,600.34
So in my scenario if the current BE created it's own network and was able to obtain $1.10 per subscriber per month in its markets, then adjusted the revenues for football and basketball:
Football teams would receive (from BEN) $19,900,600.34 per year
Basketball teams would receive (from BEN) $6,633,533.45 per year
Add in to this the $4 million football schools currently receive and the $2million the bb schools receive from network contracts (and this would likely be more the next go around as the BE appears underpaid considerably) and not even considering the bowl revenues and you have:
Football teams would receive approx.(from BEN and TV) $23,900,600.34 per year
Basketball teams would receive approx.(from BEN and TV) $8,633,533.45 per year
Even if a lower per subscriber rate was achieved, this scenario isn't taking into account other markets in states with BE teams might offer the network on a higher tier--still delivering significant revenues to the Big East as it does for the Big Ten (i.e carriage in other markets in Ohio other than Cincy, other markets in PA other than Pittsburgh, etc.). Such revenues could be a strong enough boost to keep the revenues in the same ballpark
With such revenues the Big East could be financially on par with the best. If you added a couple of football teams in large markets for extra tv product, the earnings could remain about the same per team or posssibly a bit less but still on par with other leagues. Even Notre Dame could generate enough extra revenues to keep themselves on par with the Big Ten and keep their other sports in the Big East which has worked out well for them.
Not going to happen dude.
The Big East should take a look at such a scenario if the league has any intention of staying together and putting the conference on par with the others financially one day. It would take awhile to make it successful but is one of the limited options the BE would ever have of competing on an even level. They have the markets they should use them to their advantage.
Hiring John Marinnato was a signal that the Big East is not going to radically change how it does things.
(03-03-2010 09:53 AM)KnightChris Wrote: [ -> ]Put simply, we don't have enough programming. The Big Ten is full of gigantic state schools that offer every sport imaginable. They're wealthier and can afford it. We can't. Didn't Seton Hall just cut some sports this week? You can only show so many "classic" Syracuse/West Virginia football games after all. Also, we have the misfortune (although I would actually consider it good fortune) of living in the area of the country that is least likely to want to watch women's field hockey at 2 in the afternoon.
The Big East has plenty of programming. Replays of classic football and basketball to start including Notre Dame games (as the BTN does-even replaying other networks games). Live broadcasts of men's bb and women's bb games not currently carried over the air nationally. Live baseball, Lacrosse, mens and womens volleyball-there are plenty of sports several BE teams carry. Additionally you can have campus shows and programming (as the BTN does), behind the scenes reality type shows following BE teams during the season (as the BTN does). There are many other things you can do as well with 16 teams and decades of great games that have been played. Your own network can be like a continuous positive ad for all your member institutions. Using the BTN model-it doesn't actually matter how many people are watching-they get the cable rate in their areas just for having subscribers to the cable system--has nothing to do with viewers. The most difficult part is getting the cable providers to agree to the rate-this is where schools get their alumni and fans to pressure the carriers to put the network on basic cable.
I tend to agree with Chris. We don't have enough sports or history to fill the programming at present. We also don't have enough PROVEN fans to convince the big advertisers to buy commerical air time, and that's where the money is made...
I capitalized PROVEN because at present WVU leads the conference in attendance, and West Virginia isn't Almost Heaven in an advertiser's opinion. When USF, Rutgers, Pitt, UConn, and Louisville approach those numbers, and Syracuse starts filling the dome maybe. But not now...
Now don't take offense that I didn't mention UC, Bearcat fans. But as long as you guys play your games at the Nip, with that tiny capacity, UC is pretty irrelevant when talking about increasing The BEast fanbase. You guys are pretty much maxed out right now, and it doesn't look like the capacity at Nippert Stadium is going to be increased in the foreseeable future...
(03-03-2010 12:10 PM)bitcruncher Wrote: [ -> ]I tend to agree with Chris. We don't have enough sports or history to fill the programming at present. We also don't have enough PROVEN fans to convince the big advertisers to buy commerical air time, and that's where the money is made...
I capitalized PROVEN because at present WVU leads the conference in attendance, and West Virginia isn't Almost Heaven in an advertiser's opinion. When USF, Rutgers, Pitt, UConn, and Louisville approach those numbers, and Syracuse starts filling the dome maybe. But not now...
Now don't take offense that I didn't mention UC, Bearcat fans. But as long as you guys play your games at the Nip, with that tiny capacity, UC is pretty irrelevant when talking about increasing The BEast fanbase. You guys are pretty much maxed out right now, and it doesn't look like the capacity at Nippert Stadium is going to be increased in the foreseeable future...
USF has averaged over 50K 3 years running, I think about 52K last year, so we're getting closer to wvu type numbers.
USF should be averaging more than WVU. They're in a major metropolitain area, and not in a sparsely populated state with the worst economy in the nation like WVU. I figure the Bulls will in time. But for now...
(03-03-2010 12:10 PM)bitcruncher Wrote: [ -> ]I tend to agree with Chris. We don't have enough sports or history to fill the programming at present. We also don't have enough PROVEN fans to convince the big advertisers to buy commerical air time, and that's where the money is made...
I capitalized PROVEN because at present WVU leads the conference in attendance, and West Virginia isn't Almost Heaven in an advertiser's opinion. When USF, Rutgers, Pitt, UConn, and Louisville approach those numbers, and Syracuse starts filling the dome maybe. But not now...
Now don't take offense that I didn't mention UC, Bearcat fans. But as long as you guys play your games at the Nip, with that tiny capacity, UC is pretty irrelevant when talking about increasing The BEast fanbase. You guys are pretty much maxed out right now, and it doesn't look like the capacity at Nippert Stadium is going to be increased in the foreseeable future...
That's why it'd be really fantastic if that semi-pro team downtown would let us use their stadium more than once every five years or so without trying to gouge us for doing so. We've obviously got Oklahoma there this season, but outside of that I don't know of any other game scheduled there for the future, which is sad, because of exactly why you said, bit. And it's not just a hinderance for expanding the conference base, but our own growing base as well.
(03-03-2010 12:42 PM)CD11 Wrote: [ -> ] (03-03-2010 12:10 PM)bitcruncher Wrote: [ -> ]I tend to agree with Chris. We don't have enough sports or history to fill the programming at present. We also don't have enough PROVEN fans to convince the big advertisers to buy commerical air time, and that's where the money is made...
I capitalized PROVEN because at present WVU leads the conference in attendance, and West Virginia isn't Almost Heaven in an advertiser's opinion. When USF, Rutgers, Pitt, UConn, and Louisville approach those numbers, and Syracuse starts filling the dome maybe. But not now...
Now don't take offense that I didn't mention UC, Bearcat fans. But as long as you guys play your games at the Nip, with that tiny capacity, UC is pretty irrelevant when talking about increasing The BEast fanbase. You guys are pretty much maxed out right now, and it doesn't look like the capacity at Nippert Stadium is going to be increased in the foreseeable future...
That's why it'd be really fantastic if that semi-pro team downtown would let us use their stadium more than once every five years or so without trying to gouge us for doing so. We've obviously got Oklahoma there this season, but outside of that I don't know of any other game scheduled there for the future, which is sad, because of exactly why you said, bit. And it's not just a hinderance for expanding the conference base, but our own growing base as well.
It's going to be a hindrance in your ability to retain a coach too. The more butts you put in the seats, the more income you have incoming. Incoming income can be crucial in contract negotiations with a successful coach...
(03-03-2010 08:57 AM)MichaelSavage Wrote: [ -> ]Hiring John Marinnato was a signal that the Big East is not going to radically change how it does things.
And that a certain group of member schools are still in control.
I've been really pleased with the mtn in terms of programming and branding. The MWC only highlight and preview shows are great and really help develop the leagues brand. It's like a specialty shop for the conference.
The biggest negative for a conference based network:
The ramp up period. It is outright painful and the bigger the market, the more difficult it is to get on cable. And even if you get on, providers are really getting less and less aggressive with programming and more aggressive with limiting cost, so you can go black, as what has happened with Versus and D-TV. It really, really stinks to not have access to your games that are on TV, and the MWC was close to mutiny before the D-Tv deal was forged.
10 years ago when there was a programming arms race between cable and satellite, you could almost name your own price. But now it seems like the providers are balking at all the specialty sports channels. Pretty sure the MWC wouldn't have started its own network in retrospect. Great that they did, but it was rough. Obviously the BE has a lot of advantages and its not an apples to apples comparison, but when the NFLNetwork can't even get a deal with Time Warner, it makes you wonder how many more specialty sports networks providers can stomach.
(03-03-2010 12:10 PM)bitcruncher Wrote: [ -> ]I tend to agree with Chris. We don't have enough sports or history to fill the programming at present. We also don't have enough PROVEN fans to convince the big advertisers to buy commerical air time, and that's where the money is made...
I capitalized PROVEN because at present WVU leads the conference in attendance, and West Virginia isn't Almost Heaven in an advertiser's opinion. When USF, Rutgers, Pitt, UConn, and Louisville approach those numbers, and Syracuse starts filling the dome maybe. But not now...
Now don't take offense that I didn't mention UC, Bearcat fans. But as long as you guys play your games at the Nip, with that tiny capacity, UC is pretty irrelevant when talking about increasing The BEast fanbase. You guys are pretty much maxed out right now, and it doesn't look like the capacity at Nippert Stadium is going to be increased in the foreseeable future...
Not sure I'm following the programming? The Big East has been going for decades in bb--that is decades worth of basketball. As far as football, the BTN shows PSU games from before them joining the Big Ten on occasion. If current BE teams can obtain rights to classic games they could do the same. BE games with the previous defectors losing to current members (haha) might also be shown.
Largely the BTN doesn't carry live programming. The Big East has more basketball product to offer than does the BTN and even on the BTN sometimes they have just one live football game on on a weekend. They put on campus produced programming of an informational nature which the BE schools could also provide and they produce several studio and "reality" type shows which don't take a huge budget to create (1 or two crews shooting-edit at HQ) There are various mens and womens sports in significant numbers to provide many hours of live programming that don't currently see the light of day for the Big East, but do in the Big Ten.
Obviously something would have to be worked out with ND/NBC since they would own much of Notre Dames classic content-perhaps NBC could partner with the league in creating the channel in some way as Fox did with the BTN.
(03-03-2010 01:39 PM)Frog in the Kitchen Sink Wrote: [ -> ]I've been really pleased with the mtn in terms of programming and branding. The MWC only highlight and preview shows are great and really help develop the leagues brand. It's like a specialty shop for the conference.
The biggest negative for a conference based network:
The ramp up period. It is outright painful and the bigger the market, the more difficult it is to get on cable. And even if you get on, providers are really getting less and less aggressive with programming and more aggressive with limiting cost, so you can go black, as what has happened with Versus and D-TV. It really, really stinks to not have access to your games that are on TV, and the MWC was close to mutiny before the D-Tv deal was forged.
10 years ago when there was a programming arms race between cable and satellite, you could almost name your own price. But now it seems like the providers are balking at all the specialty sports channels. Pretty sure the MWC wouldn't have started its own network in retrospect. Great that they did, but it was rough. Obviously the BE has a lot of advantages and its not an apples to apples comparison, but when the NFLNetwork can't even get a deal with Time Warner, it makes you wonder how many more specialty sports networks providers can stomach.
This is the challenge. The Big Ten's ramp up period was also very tough for the conference and you're talking about schools that have true leverage in their home markets (i.e. Ohio State, Michigan, etc.). It paid off in the end, but it's not for the faint of heart. Certainly, a Big East Network can work at some levels, although football is the main driver and Bit's correct that the marquee school for the conference is WVU, which also happens to have the smallest market. The difference for the Big Ten is that Ohio State, Michigan and Penn State are marquee schools that also deliver huge states at the same time - that's where you get a lot of pressure from fans who AREN'T alums to get a network onto cable.
That's the biggest issue for the Big Ten in terms of it looking at Big East schools (not to try to turn this into an expansion/split thread): do any of the schools in the largest markets on paper like Rutgers and Syracuse have enough leverage to get the Big Ten Network onto basic cable? This is a question for the Big East, too, especially when the New York market is saturated with sports networks already like YES, MSG and SNY.
(03-03-2010 04:13 PM)Frank the Tank Wrote: [ -> ] (03-03-2010 01:39 PM)Frog in the Kitchen Sink Wrote: [ -> ]I've been really pleased with the mtn in terms of programming and branding. The MWC only highlight and preview shows are great and really help develop the leagues brand. It's like a specialty shop for the conference.
The biggest negative for a conference based network:
The ramp up period. It is outright painful and the bigger the market, the more difficult it is to get on cable. And even if you get on, providers are really getting less and less aggressive with programming and more aggressive with limiting cost, so you can go black, as what has happened with Versus and D-TV. It really, really stinks to not have access to your games that are on TV, and the MWC was close to mutiny before the D-Tv deal was forged.
10 years ago when there was a programming arms race between cable and satellite, you could almost name your own price. But now it seems like the providers are balking at all the specialty sports channels. Pretty sure the MWC wouldn't have started its own network in retrospect. Great that they did, but it was rough. Obviously the BE has a lot of advantages and its not an apples to apples comparison, but when the NFLNetwork can't even get a deal with Time Warner, it makes you wonder how many more specialty sports networks providers can stomach.
This is the challenge. The Big Ten's ramp up period was also very tough for the conference and you're talking about schools that have true leverage in their home markets (i.e. Ohio State, Michigan, etc.). It paid off in the end, but it's not for the faint of heart. Certainly, a Big East Network can work at some levels, although football is the main driver and Bit's correct that the marquee school for the conference is WVU, which also happens to have the smallest market. The difference for the Big Ten is that Ohio State, Michigan and Penn State are marquee schools that also deliver huge states at the same time - that's where you get a lot of pressure from fans who AREN'T alums to get a network onto cable.
That's the biggest issue for the Big Ten in terms of it looking at Big East schools (not to try to turn this into an expansion/split thread): do any of the schools in the largest markets on paper like Rutgers and Syracuse have enough leverage to get the Big Ten Network onto basic cable? This is a question for the Big East, too, especially when the New York market is saturated with sports networks already like YES, MSG and SNY.
The difference I think is that the Big East has this huge number of tv households without having entire states. I can see for example, Cincinnati getting enough support to get on cable in it's market--they don't have to get the entire state and will still bring in their share of the % of BE cable tv households. In the New York market you have Rutgers, Uconn, Syracuse, St. John's--that's four teams and their fanbases. These are basically NY teams seeking carriage on NY tv-not Indiana or Iowa or Minnesota. Add in Notre Dame and you could likely get a big number of cable carriers on board. Philly has long been associated with the Big East and both places seem to like their BE basketball pretty well--can't see those markets having more of a desire to push a Big Ten Network than a Big East one whose schools are much more local to them (other than PSU of course).
If the Big East could push for its markets and achieve success, they would likely be able to get on in other non Big East areas with fans and alumni on higher tiers as the Big Ten has. This could also generate revenues. It certainly would take time and passion to accomplish this for the Big East but it isn't an impossible task.
(03-03-2010 03:26 PM)buckaineer Wrote: [ -> ] (03-03-2010 12:10 PM)bitcruncher Wrote: [ -> ]I tend to agree with Chris. We don't have enough sports or history to fill the programming at present. We also don't have enough PROVEN fans to convince the big advertisers to buy commerical air time, and that's where the money is made...
I capitalized PROVEN because at present WVU leads the conference in attendance, and West Virginia isn't Almost Heaven in an advertiser's opinion. When USF, Rutgers, Pitt, UConn, and Louisville approach those numbers, and Syracuse starts filling the dome maybe. But not now...
Now don't take offense that I didn't mention UC, Bearcat fans. But as long as you guys play your games at the Nip, with that tiny capacity, UC is pretty irrelevant when talking about increasing The BEast fanbase. You guys are pretty much maxed out right now, and it doesn't look like the capacity at Nippert Stadium is going to be increased in the foreseeable future...
Not sure I'm following the programming? The Big East has been going for decades in bb--that is decades worth of basketball. As far as football, the BTN shows PSU games from before them joining the Big Ten on occasion. If current BE teams can obtain rights to classic games they could do the same. BE games with the previous defectors losing to current members (haha) might also be shown.
Largely the BTN doesn't carry live programming. The Big East has more basketball product to offer than does the BTN and even on the BTN sometimes they have just one live football game on on a weekend. They put on campus produced programming of an informational nature which the BE schools could also provide and they produce several studio and "reality" type shows which don't take a huge budget to create (1 or two crews shooting-edit at HQ) There are various mens and womens sports in significant numbers to provide many hours of live programming that don't currently see the light of day for the Big East, but do in the Big Ten.
Obviously something would have to be worked out with ND/NBC since they would own much of Notre Dames classic content-perhaps NBC could partner with the league in creating the channel in some way as Fox did with the BTN.
A decade's worth of programming isn't much when you're talking about 24/7 programming...
(03-03-2010 04:47 PM)bitcruncher Wrote: [ -> ] (03-03-2010 03:26 PM)buckaineer Wrote: [ -> ] (03-03-2010 12:10 PM)bitcruncher Wrote: [ -> ]I tend to agree with Chris. We don't have enough sports or history to fill the programming at present. We also don't have enough PROVEN fans to convince the big advertisers to buy commerical air time, and that's where the money is made...
I capitalized PROVEN because at present WVU leads the conference in attendance, and West Virginia isn't Almost Heaven in an advertiser's opinion. When USF, Rutgers, Pitt, UConn, and Louisville approach those numbers, and Syracuse starts filling the dome maybe. But not now...
Now don't take offense that I didn't mention UC, Bearcat fans. But as long as you guys play your games at the Nip, with that tiny capacity, UC is pretty irrelevant when talking about increasing The BEast fanbase. You guys are pretty much maxed out right now, and it doesn't look like the capacity at Nippert Stadium is going to be increased in the foreseeable future...
Not sure I'm following the programming? The Big East has been going for decades in bb--that is decades worth of basketball. As far as football, the BTN shows PSU games from before them joining the Big Ten on occasion. If current BE teams can obtain rights to classic games they could do the same. BE games with the previous defectors losing to current members (haha) might also be shown.
Largely the BTN doesn't carry live programming. The Big East has more basketball product to offer than does the BTN and even on the BTN sometimes they have just one live football game on on a weekend. They put on campus produced programming of an informational nature which the BE schools could also provide and they produce several studio and "reality" type shows which don't take a huge budget to create (1 or two crews shooting-edit at HQ) There are various mens and womens sports in significant numbers to provide many hours of live programming that don't currently see the light of day for the Big East, but do in the Big Ten.
Obviously something would have to be worked out with ND/NBC since they would own much of Notre Dames classic content-perhaps NBC could partner with the league in creating the channel in some way as Fox did with the BTN.
A decade's worth of programming isn't much when you're talking about 24/7 programming...
BE basketball started in the 80's. You've got games to replay from the 80's, 90's, and 2000's. You can replay football games from before there was a Big East if you want and from the previous edition of the Big East. Mostly you'll have current studio shows, university content (shows done by the universities showing off various persons and aspects of those universities as the BTN does) --and with 16 universities that can be hours and hours of content, and you can have behind the scenes and various "reality" programs produced that show off programs-or could be historical in nature. Not to mention basketball and football coaches shows. Since this is the conferences network, they could really broadcast anything they wanted to, and they have plenty of material to start with as well as many, many live sports broadcasts from lacrosse to track to volleyball, and on and on to display.
Not all games were televised, so it's not a huge amount when you think when you consider 365/24/7 broadcasting...
(03-03-2010 05:02 PM)bitcruncher Wrote: [ -> ]Not all games were televised, so it's not a huge amount when you think when you consider 365/24/7 broadcasting...
There were probably quite a few that were regionally televised which might actually be easier to get rights for. Regardless, with the history of the Big East there is no doubt there would be plenty of historical games to rebroadcast. It's not like that would be the entire days schedule, just part of it. I'm sure producers and directors and the multiple institutions would find content to put on the least of their worries when considering a network.
You're the only one that thinks it'll fly, dude. Give it up...