This was posted by Elton at 11:48 this morning...
Quote:I talked to several media friends Sunday about whether I should vote for Kent State in the weekly AP men's basketball poll. In fact, I frankly got calls from several who said, "Don't do it, yet." Their reasoning was much the same as mine.
Take a step back and understand, teams in the Top 25 lose every week
. For example, the fact Syracuse defeated Georgetown recently does not mean Syracuse is suddenly a Top 25 team, and that Georgetown suddenly is not. That Wake Forest beats Duke does not mean Wake Forest is now Top 25 and Duke is not. It does say, for Syracuse, Wake Forest and now Kent State, "Watch me."
In Syracuse's case, after it beat Georgetown, coach Jim Boeheim's crew continued to be an up and down team in the Big East. Ditto Wake Forest. Now we'll see what Kent State does when it gets back into action.
As for keeping St. Mary's in the Top 25: I think the Gaels' record and quality of wins speak for themselves. It's a mid-major bias (Butler and Drake aside) to say once a mid-major loses, they're out of the Top 25. If the Gaels rebound and win their next two, including a road rematch at Gonzaga, I think that only bolsters Kent's claim for future Top 25 votes, if Kent continues its winning ways.
Kent's accomplishment is not undervalued by not immediately landing in the Top 25.
The Golden Flashes will certainly get their share of votes. But this is not January, when the bottom of the Top 25 can vary from week to week on one game. If Kent had been Top 25 for a month, and lost to a St. Mary's, the same criteria would hold for the Golden Flashes.
Enjoy this team down the stretch, and think what it will be like to have a Top 25 Kent State as the target for the upcoming MAC Tournament in Quicken Loans Arena.
This is the most convoluted thinking I've ever seen regarding ranking teams. I don't have a problem not ranking Kent in the top 25, but this twisted logic leaves me scratching my head. If I understand what he is saying, which I may not since I...well, don't understand what he saying...but...is he saying if we beat BG and Miami, then we should be in the top 25?
And people are calling him and telling him what to do? Should you be accepting advice that influences your vote? I'm not sure I would share that.
I understand what he's saying. Honestly, I probably wouldn't have voted us in the top 25 this week either, even though I'm very happy others have. I'm still a bit shocked. It's been quite a day. All this attention is startling.
I guess if we were ranked 33rd last week (I read that somewhere, I think), and had that huge road win, I don't have a problem with being #23 now.
Much as I think Elton has a bias towards that community college to the west which skews his judgement when it comes to us, I have to agree with him on this one. Wasn't it pretty recently we were all moaning and groaning after a game in Toledo? What good will this win do us if we lose any of the next three? I'm sure the pollsters will be as quick to drop us like a hot potato as they were to "discover" us this week. The attention is nice, but I hope the team can handle the pressure and win out. GO FLASHES!
I don't have a problem with him leaving Kent out of the Top 25; not sure I would put them in the Top 25 at the moment, though darned close.
I just don't understand the Western Kentucky as #24 logic. They haven't won a single game against a Top 100 team. There are probably 25 better choices than WKU.
I can't say I blame him for his thinking either. Not to pee on the parade, but think about how much bigger the bullseye on our chest just got for BG, Miami, and crAkron. These games are part of the MAC East Gauntlet and unfortunately 2 of the 3 are on the road in arguably the two hardest places to play in the MAC (Anderson and the JAR). And, to vault from 33 to 23 is very uncommon. Last week we had 3 votes, all courtesy of our good friend in Idaho, Nick Jezierny. I was honestly shocked to see us vault that high simply based on the fact that most teams have to consistently earn their way (usually a 2-3 week process depending on whom you play) into the Top 25.
While I'm not necessarily hating the fact we're ranked, I wouldn't have minded flying under the radar for another week or two. Let's hope this team builds off of this win and uses the confidence to their advantage. One game at a time boys, one game at a time.
Go Flashes!
If one of our locals doesn't show us any love in a national poll that others do, that says alot about him and his BS justification.
Here is my problem with Elton's reasoning. He says top 25 teams lose every week. Of course they do. He then says Kent, much like Syracuse, does not warrant a top 25 ranking based upon a big win. Ok, I've no issue with that statement. He then says it's time to put Kent State into a 'Watch Me' category.
And that is the rub.
This reasoning makes sense earlier in the season when you still want to see what a team will do in conference play. But at this point, with three games left, after 28 games and months of play, what more will you learn from playing BG, Miami and Akron that will then make you vote for Kent as a Top 25 team? And even if that is acceptable, what about all of the other games and teams that will play games that will put them in a brighter spotlight? Will we really get more votes by beating BG than Wake Forest or Syracuse will by winning their games? If Kent played in a vacuum and you wanted them to finish strong, then you would move them up, ok, I guess. But they don't. Other teams will play great games and get highlights on ESPN. Kent will not get on ESPN when they beat BG and Miami and influence voters.
Another way to look at it is we are not a top 25 team, either way, if we lose one of the last three games. I agree with that. So what difference does it make if we are ranked there now or not? Why wait, as he says. If Elton doesn't think Kent is a top 25 team, that is okay, no problem. I'm still mystified as why it makes sense to wait.
This is certainly not a big deal, I'm just wondering why he felt the need to explain his reasoning. I still enjoy reading his stuff.
Dunbar,AtTheTopOfTheHill Wrote:Here is my problem with Elton's reasoning. He says top 25 teams lose every week. Of course they do. He then says Kent, much like Syracuse, does not warrant a top 25 ranking based upon a big win. Ok, I've no issue with that statement. He then says it's time to put Kent State into a 'Watch Me' category.
And that is the rub.
This reasoning makes sense earlier in the season when you still want to see what a team will do in conference play. But at this point, with three games left, after 28 games and months of play, what more will you learn from playing BG, Miami and Akron that will then make you vote for Kent as a Top 25 team? And even if that is acceptable, what about all of the other games and teams that will play games that will put them in a brighter spotlight? Will we really get more votes by beating BG than Wake Forest or Syracuse will by winning their games? If Kent played in a vacuum and you wanted them to finish strong, then you would move them up, ok, I guess. But they don't. Other teams will play great games and get highlights on ESPN. Kent will not get on ESPN when they beat BG and Miami and influence voters.
Another way to look at it is we are not a top 25 team, either way, if we lose one of the last three games. I agree with that. So what difference does it make if we are ranked there now or not? Why wait, as he says. If Elton doesn't think Kent is a top 25 team, that is okay, no problem. I'm still mystified as why it makes sense to wait.
This is certainly not a big deal, I'm just wondering why he felt the need to explain his reasoning. I still enjoy reading his stuff.
I disagree. I do not really like Elton's coverage, but he has a point. Unlike many other voters, HE WILL know how well/ poorly we play in the next few games (ESPN or no ESPN). His wait and see attitude is not inappropriate. I am not sure I would vote for Kent now, although I like the other votes.
I guess what bothers me is the perception of others. When a local sports writer doesn't see or better yet recognize a local OHIO team but sports writers in Columbus and Cincinnati, and if I recall...three out of four in California, three in Penns. think Kent should be ranked in the top 25, that's an issue. If someone "local" feels this way, maybe others will wonder too.
We have worked long and hard to get recognition-not only for Kent but for the MAC, it seems that it is time to have the PD step up for the conference and Kent. The tournament is in Cleveland isn't it??? How about more recognition and maybe this would give the inquisitive sports fan a reason to come out to see just how good the MAC really is???????
In other parts of the country, Elton would be run out of town on the end of a stick. Loyalty to local teams is not expected, it is demanded. If our locals do not push us a little, the national scene certainly will not.
I really think that we deserve to be a top 25 team. What top 25 team isn't running through their schedule with a bullseye on their back? Kent doesn't need to be afraid of being any more of a target now than we were a week ago as far as I'm concerned. If we keep playing basketball the way we are playing now, we should be fine. I like to believe that our guys have figured out how to play with confidence and that they are good enough to play with dominance. As long as St. Mary's doesn't go to their head I think the Flashes will be alright. Top 25 should mean you can hang with most any team in the country and I think we showed that on Saturday. We went in there and took something no other team has been able to take all year and I think THAT says a lot about why we are ranked at this point. It wasn't just a big win, it was a win against a ranked team that was undefeated at home and won it's last two games by 30 points.
For all of you who don't think we should be top 25, what about BYU who goes from unranked to #25 after going 1-1 last week, beating Utah and losing to San Diego State? We deserve to be there as much as anybody and to have our own local guy not show us any respect is ridiculous.
If I were JC, I would pull out the film from Toledo and watch that thing until the reel broke. If anything, just to remind them where we have been.
And Detroit's loss, those are 2 crushing Ls on our schedule this season.
Whether Elton's reasoning is sound or faulty is almost beside the point. The local voters are EXPECTED to juice up the local teams a little bit, with the knowledge that outsiders may not appreciate those teams. His vote is just further proof of what a current Kent assistant basketball coach told me almost 4 years ago - that in his travels recruiting he noted that Kent is more respected outside of this area than within!
just for a little perspective on our ranking. there is only 5 teams with more wins then us. Tenn, Memphis, NC, Xav and Butler, there are 6 teams that match our win total. Dookies, Kan. UCLA, Vandy, Wisc and Indiana. PRETTY GOOD COMPANY, AND WE HAVE TEN 20WIN SEASONS.
Kent 76 Wrote:Whether Elton's reasoning is sound or faulty is almost beside the point. The local voters are EXPECTED to juice up the local teams a little bit, with the knowledge that outsiders may not appreciate those teams. His vote is just further proof of what a current Kent assistant basketball coach told me almost 4 years ago - that in his travels recruiting he noted that Kent is more respected outside of this area than within!
Very good point, we get more respect in our bordering states than in our own. It seems like Elton is trying to hold us to a higher standard, and everybody everywhere else gives the 'homer' vote when their local team or player is up for recognition so his stance is troubling. When a Boise State or Hawaii in football are doing well and all of the country is doubting them their local media is hyping them up to combat that, but with us we have those people giving us our due, our own local dissing us which then makes some other national media think we can't be all that good if our own locals don't give us our due.
I just read everything that has been placed on here. And I don't have much different to say, but since school is cancled and I don't have to go to work, you guys will hear a lot from me.
My question is when EMU was ranked in 1996, did the Detriolet media screw them over like this?