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View below if I did this attatchment correctly. If not, assistnace is greatly appreciated. Discuss below.

<a href="http://www.vandelaysports.com/news/2002_06_26.htm" target="_blank">MAC Football Unit Rankings</a>

I can't argue with much since we really don't know how good we are right now but I do have one serious problem with the WR rankings. UCF has a projected top 10 NFL pick at WR (I didn't see any from any other MAC school in the projections). The other projected starter has a full productive year behind him and the tight ends are A+ quality.

How could anyone, including Marshall be ranked ahead of UCF at this position? <img border="0" alt="[Bang Head]" title="" src="graemlins/banghead.gif" />

Looks like a fair assessment, Nick, except that WMU lost most of its secondary, so I'm not sure why their DBs are ranked 5th. Also, you have Miami listed twice under D-Line...

Agree with most of your rankings, but you may have NIU OL a little over-rated. They still have a lot to prove this year. However, leaving NIU's LBs out of the Top 5 is a crime. They have a ton of quality depth at this position.

Doug Gabriel isn't a projected top 10 pick. Mel Kiper (take what he says with a grain of salt) says he's a top 10 senior (ranked 9th).

WR/TE is a position of strength this year (moreso than DB). Marshall is the only team that I think has better receivers. Also, there is no way I can see another team in the MAC having a better D-Line than us, especially one as small as WMU's.

[ June 27, 2002, 12:54 PM: Message edited by: Knight Prowler ]

<blockquote>quote:<hr />Originally posted by Knight Prowler:
Doug Gabriel isn't a projected top 10 pick. Mel Kiper (take what he says with a grain of salt) says he's a top 10 senior (ranked 9th).
<hr /></blockquote>You are correct sir. Even so, my point not only still stands but is not diminished in the slightest. Are you telling me that without Leftwich the Marshall receivers would all be great prospects? Actually that is a question since I really don't know anything about their receivers (no insult intended).

MU's receivers are a talented bunch with or without Byron. Watts is getting all the headlines for his breakaway ability, but IMO it is the depth that will be the killer for many squads the Herd faces. The top 2 to 3 receivers on the Herd's squad (after Watts) would be feature receivers on most any squad in the MAC (or at the mid-major level).

This post is not intended to defame Byron (or Darius Watts for that matter) just to point out that a secondary better bring its "A game" and hope for a great rush up front to stop that squad.

Would Leftwich be as great if he didn't have those great receivers? It works both ways. Doug Gabriel is the only UCF receiver I wouldn't trade for one of their big 3. And that's because he's 6-2, 215 and runs a 4.39 forty.

[ June 27, 2002, 01:09 PM: Message edited by: Knight Prowler ]

Marshall's Darius Watts is a legitimate 1st Team All-American candidate. He was #4 in the country in receptions with 91, #6 in yards with 1,417, and caught 18 TDs. In addition, Marshall's Josh Davis was 38th with 961 yards, 17th in receptions with 79 catches, and had five TD catches. Deniero Merriot (sp?) also distinguished himself with 4 TD catches in one game last season. MUg wins the MAC's #1 receiving corps award until further notice, IMO...

Gotta agree with most, though I too agree with my Huskie counterpart about NIU's LB's. Nick Duffy and Larry Williams were 2 & 4 in MAC tackles last year, and #1 on that list is not returning.

Returning tacklers & 2001 final ranking:
UT: Ward #3, Gardner #17
Miami: Jones #12, Pusateri #15
WMU: Lape #6, Malloy #41
BSU: Scott #5, Beriault #7
BGSU: Haneline #41

There are some excellent LB tandems returning in the MAC, so this may be the most talented spot in the conference, but NIU has one of the top duos (and IMO, the top!!) <img border="0" title="" alt="[Big Grin]" src="biggrin.gif" />

I do expect NIU's OL to be one of the top units, but from last year's group there will be some movement. All in all, it should be much better, and hopefully a top 5 unit.

Re: WRs and Leftwich

Leftwich is a stud, and so are his WRs, at least 4 deep. Give our QB, whoever he ends up being, Marshall's WRs, and I would emphatically predict NIU to win the MAC West. Right now, our QB is a ? and our WRs aren't world beaters to make it easier for him, so there's still some questions to be answered.

So you know, our 4yr QB Finlen was decent, but his NFL drafted WRs McCareins and Hill MADE him look better than he really was. Leftwich is good, and so are his WRs. IMO, this is a great example of everything coming together at once (see Penn State in '94 with Collins, Engram, Carter and Brady) for UM's O. <img border="0" alt="[Bow]" title="" src="graemlins/bow.gif" />

I agree you have to give Marshall the top WR UNIT ranking.

How can the great OHIO be given a number #4 ranking at the RB position. We are number #1, with that option.

Please Vandelay, get with the program, we are OHIO. And Miami is Miami(OH). I know Miami fans hate the (OH), but Bob fans hate the inclusion of University.

KC

Kit-Cat: OU had no RB (or QB, for that matter) in the top 100 rushers in the country last season:
<a href="http://www.mlive.com/football/spnet.ssf?/default.asp?c=advance&page=cfoot/stat/ncaa-rushing.htm" target="_blank">Top 100 rushers of 2001</a>

With all due respect to OU's overall rushing yardage, that's a product of the system, not necessarily of quality backs. Also, with all respect to C. Brinker, it remains to be seen if he's the same player he was. CMU's Terrance Jackson broke 1,000 yards, good for #23 in the nation. His backups, K. Lawhorne and R. Mixon, are both starting quality, and both averaged over 4 ypc last season.

For Kit-Cat

Ohio would have been higher had Chad Brinker returned at full stregnth. OU has a lot of good RBs, but so doe the teams I have listed. If Brinker does return to 100% and Byrum is as good as advertised, I'll move the Bobcats up accordingly for my year end unit rankings. As of right now, few returning RBs for Ohio made the top 20 returning MAC rushers vs other MAC schools.

For UCF Fans

I know all about Gabriel, but I am not as familiar with the other WRs. One thing for sure, Miami, BG, WMU & EMU all have high quality receiving corps.

For NIU Fans

I amy have missed the Huskies. NIU has a quality group of LBs returning, led by Nick Duffy.

<blockquote>quote:<hr />Originally posted by Knight Prowler:
Also, there is no way I can see another team in the MAC having a better D-Line than us, especially one as small as WMU's.<hr /></blockquote>I checked out the depth charts comparing WMU and UCF at the DL position. On the size issue UCF's starting DL's have a 7.5lb average advantage over WMU here's how they compared.
Pos.,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,WMU,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,, UCF
DE,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,37 Allsbury (Sr.) 6-2 253,,,,,,,,,,,,,,35 Patterson (Jr.) 6-3 275
DE,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,97 Browning (Sr.) 6-2 235,,,,,,,,,,,,,90 Jeanty (Fr.) 6-2 220
DT,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,93 Babin (Jr.) 6-4 265,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,95 McKibben (Sr.) 6-2 255
NG,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,, 99 Westgate (Sr.) 6-5 267,,,,,,,,,,,92 Brown (So.) 6-2 300

Many MAC fans may remember the WMU DL from the past(all but Babin startrd last year). BTW, Athlon listed the WMU DL as an honorable mention for it's unit rankings (5 were listed in alphabetical order).

[ June 27, 2002, 03:24 PM: Message edited by: klordway ]

Klordway: WMU's issues are more likely to be on offense. That defense will keep you in some games. However, if the offense can't get up to speed, that small DL may wear down against good running teams. UCF: watch out, if your running game can't keep WMU's D honest...

<blockquote>quote:<hr />Originally posted by klordway:
<blockquote>quote:<hr />Originally posted by Knight Prowler:
Also, there is no way I can see another team in the MAC having a better D-Line than us, especially one as small as WMU's.<hr /></blockquote>I checked out the depth charts comparing WMU and UCF at the DL position. On the size issue UCF's starting DL's have a 7.5lb average advantage over WMU here's how they compared.
Pos.,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,WMU,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,, UCF
DE,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,37 Allsbury (Sr.) 6-2 253,,,,,,,,,,,,,,35 Patterson (Jr.) 6-3 275
DE,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,97 Browning (Sr.) 6-2 235,,,,,,,,,,,,,90 Jeanty (Fr.) 6-2 220
DT,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,93 Babin (Jr.) 6-4 265,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,95 McKibben (Sr.) 6-2 255
NG,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,, 99 Westgate (Sr.) 6-5 267,,,,,,,,,,,92 Brown (So.) 6-2 300

Many MAC fans may remember the WMU DL from the past(all but Babin startrd last year). BTW, Athlon listed the WMU DL as an honorable mention for it's unit rankings (5 were listed in alphabetical order).<hr /></blockquote>McKibben graduated and is being replaced with a 6-4, 295 pound [and more athletic] player -- DeMarcus Johnson. Rashad Jeanty has put on some weight (now at 235), last year he was a true freshman. He will also be in a run/pass rotation with Roy Williams (6-2, 275). This is how our 2-deep looks:

RE
Rashad Jeanty, 6-3, 235, So
Roy Williams, 6-2, 275, Jr

DT (3-Technique)
DeMarcus Johnson, 6-4, 295, Jr
Ben Brinson, 6-5, 270, So*

NG
Larry Brown, 6-2, 300, Jr*
Thomas Andrews, 6-4, 285, Sr* / Mike Lynche, 6-0, 260, So

LE
Elton Patterson, 6-2, 275, Sr
Brent Bolar, 6-3, 265, Jr*

We have more size and depth. Our starters average 275 lbs.

CMichFan,

Don't worry ... the only way our running game won't keep any D honest is if Alex Haynes gets hurt.

<blockquote>quote:<hr />Originally posted by Knight Prowler:
<blockquote>quote:<hr />Originally posted by klordway:
<blockquote>quote:<hr />Originally posted by Knight Prowler:
Also, there is no way I can see another team in the MAC having a better D-Line than us, especially one as small as WMU's.<hr /></blockquote>I checked out the depth charts comparing WMU and UCF at the DL position. On the size issue UCF's starting DL's have a 7.5lb average advantage over WMU here's how they compared.
Pos.,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,WMU,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,, UCF
DE,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,37 Allsbury (Sr.) 6-2 253,,,,,,,,,,,,,,35 Patterson (Jr.) 6-3 275
DE,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,97 Browning (Sr.) 6-2 235,,,,,,,,,,,,,90 Jeanty (Fr.) 6-2 220
DT,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,93 Babin (Jr.) 6-4 265,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,95 McKibben (Sr.) 6-2 255
NG,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,, 99 Westgate (Sr.) 6-5 267,,,,,,,,,,,92 Brown (So.) 6-2 300

Many MAC fans may remember the WMU DL from the past(all but Babin startrd last year). BTW, Athlon listed the WMU DL as an honorable mention for it's unit rankings (5 were listed in alphabetical order).<hr /></blockquote>McKibben graduated and is being replaced with a 6-4, 295 pound [and more athletic] player -- DeMarcus Johnson. Rashad Jeanty has put on some weight (now at 235), last year he was a true freshman. He will also be in a run/pass rotation with Roy Williams (6-2, 275). This is how our 2-deep looks:

RE
Rashad Jeanty, 6-3, 235, So
Roy Williams, 6-2, 275, Jr

DT (3-Technique)
DeMarcus Johnson, 6-4, 295, Jr
Ben Brinson, 6-5, 270, So*

NG
Larry Brown, 6-2, 300, Jr*
Thomas Andrews, 6-4, 285, Sr* / Mike Lynche, 6-0, 260, So

LE
Elton Patterson, 6-2, 275, Sr
Brent Bolar, 6-3, 265, Jr*

We have more size and depth. Our starters average 275 lbs.

CMichFan,

Don't worry ... the only way our running game won't keep any D honest is if Alex Haynes gets hurt.<hr /></blockquote>Sorry, but I actually got my info from the UCF athletics site.

CmichFan, you're exactly right that we do have issues on offense. If we can figure out our QB issues and get a running game we should be unstoppable in the MAC schedule, aswell as give UM a good game and probably win the other 3 non-conf. games (this is a big "if").

IF CMU's defense improves as much as I have reason to believe, we'll surprise some people this season. We'll actually have a respectable shot at going 3-1, even 4-0, heading into the BC game. Our KR and PR games should also be improved, with fast Derek Holoman (sub 4.4 time) doing the honors. We're hoping for improved QB play, based on experience, if nothing else. Ditto for the receivers (dropping a couple less passes per game would help...).

<blockquote>quote:<hr />Originally posted by Knight Prowler:
<blockquote>quote:<hr />Originally posted by klordway:
<blockquote>quote:<hr />Originally posted by Knight Prowler:
Also, there is no way I can see another team in the MAC having a better D-Line than us, especially one as small as WMU's.<hr /></blockquote>I checked out the depth charts comparing WMU and UCF at the DL position. On the size issue UCF's starting DL's have a 7.5lb average advantage over WMU here's how they compared.
Pos.,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,WMU,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,, UCF
DE,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,37 Allsbury (Sr.) 6-2 253,,,,,,,,,,,,,,35 Patterson (Jr.) 6-3 275
DE,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,97 Browning (Sr.) 6-2 235,,,,,,,,,,,,,90 Jeanty (Fr.) 6-2 220
DT,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,93 Babin (Jr.) 6-4 265,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,95 McKibben (Sr.) 6-2 255
NG,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,, 99 Westgate (Sr.) 6-5 267,,,,,,,,,,,92 Brown (So.) 6-2 300

Many MAC fans may remember the WMU DL from the past(all but Babin startrd last year). BTW, Athlon listed the WMU DL as an honorable mention for it's unit rankings (5 were listed in alphabetical order).<hr /></blockquote>McKibben graduated and is being replaced with a 6-4, 295 pound [and more athletic] player -- DeMarcus Johnson. Rashad Jeanty has put on some weight (now at 235), last year he was a true freshman. He will also be in a run/pass rotation with Roy Williams (6-2, 275). This is how our 2-deep looks:

RE
Rashad Jeanty, 6-3, 235, So
Roy Williams, 6-2, 275, Jr

DT (3-Technique)
DeMarcus Johnson, 6-4, 295, Jr
Ben Brinson, 6-5, 270, So*

NG
Larry Brown, 6-2, 300, Jr*
Thomas Andrews, 6-4, 285, Sr* / Mike Lynche, 6-0, 260, So

LE
Elton Patterson, 6-2, 275, Sr
Brent Bolar, 6-3, 265, Jr*

We have more size and depth. Our starters average 275 lbs.

CMichFan,

Don't worry ... the only way our running game won't keep any D honest is if Alex Haynes gets hurt.<hr /></blockquote>Sorry, but I actually got my info from the UCF athletics site.

CmichFan, you're exactly right that we do have issues on offense. If we can figure out our QB issues and get a running game we should be unstoppable in the MAC schedule, aswell as give UM a good game and probably win the other 3 non-conf. games (this is a big "if").

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Vandelay

Econoknight

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HuskieJ

Knight Prowler

Econoknight

OVERHERD

Knight Prowler

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Kit-Cat

CMichFan

Vandelay

klordway

CMichFan

Knight Prowler

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