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Time to drop down a division boys. At least we would have a chance to play for a national championship. The big GLIAC schools move up a division and the MAC moves down one. It would make for one hell of a FCS regional conference with a ton of local interest. We should drop the stupid ESPN weekday crap games that have been eroding our fan base.

Let the big boys destroy college football with their semi pro, mega conference strategy. Long term I really believe that will go sideways on them.

We can be part of an old school regional conference that plays football on Saturday afternoons and plays for a national championship opportunity.

We have to differentiate ourselves. We are currently in the “murky middle” to use a marketing term. That’s a tough place to be long term.

(12-29-2023 08:43 AM)bronco89 Wrote:  Time to drop down a division boys. At least we would have a chance to play for a national championship. The big GLIAC schools move up a division and the MAC moves down one. It would make for one hell of a FCS regional conference with a ton of local interest. We should drop the stupid ESPN weekday crap games that have been eroding our fan base.

Let the big boys destroy college football with their semi pro, mega conference strategy. Long term I really believe that will go sideways on them.

We can be part of an old school regional conference that plays football on Saturday afternoons and plays for a national championship opportunity.

We have to differentiate ourselves. We are currently in the “murky middle” to use a marketing term. That’s a tough place to be long term.

ABSOLUTELY POSITIVELY. A lot of us have advocated that for years. Why try to fight the big money that is ruining the chances of anybody not named ALABAMA OR MICHIGAN OR any other big name and big money schools.
Lets have some real competition every game. Not some game that we know going in we are going to lose because we are going to be paid 2 million dollars. Lets go back to the competitive wars with all other schools like us.

Three problems.

First, we need the blood money pay days from Football to fund our "Non-Revenue" sports.

Second - somewhat related - MAC is never going to risk even its "one bid" shot at the March "Big Dance," which might become an issue if Football drops down.

Third, being a D-I school (such as we are) is still a recruiting pitch not just for potential athletes but prospective students.

The answer to all your questions is "Money."

(12-29-2023 03:06 PM)MajorHoople Wrote:  Three problems.

First, we need the blood money pay days from Football to fund our "Non-Revenue" sports.
We don’t need as much given that we won’t give as many scholarship for football. GVSU seems to be doing just fine without blood games and actual added wrestling.

Second - somewhat related - MAC is never going to risk even its "one bid" shot at the March "Big Dance," which might become an issue if Football drops down.
Big East anyone? They don’t have an issue with their teams at a lower level football conference. Eg. Butler plays in the Pioneer League. Not sure what the risk is exactly.

Third, being a D-I school (such as we are) is still a recruiting pitch not just for potential athletes but prospective students.

How is that working out for us? Declining enrollment and weekday games that have fewer fans than most area high school teams. We actually look like a bush league conference with 300 fans in the stands.

The answer to all your questions is "Money."

Nope… we would actually be better off in the long run. Face it, we can’t hang with the big boy and really should try. Time to carve out our own niche.

(12-29-2023 04:57 PM)bronco89 Wrote:  

(12-29-2023 03:06 PM)MajorHoople Wrote:  Three problems.

First, we need the blood money pay days from Football to fund our "Non-Revenue" sports.
We don’t need as much given that we won’t give as many scholarship for football. GVSU seems to be doing just fine without blood games and actual added wrestling.

Second - somewhat related - MAC is never going to risk even its "one bid" shot at the March "Big Dance," which might become an issue if Football drops down.
Big East anyone? They don’t have an issue with their teams at a lower level football conference. Eg. Butler plays in the Pioneer League. Not sure what the risk is exactly.

Third, being a D-I school (such as we are) is still a recruiting pitch not just for potential athletes but prospective students.

How is that working out for us? Declining enrollment and weekday games that have fewer fans than most area high school teams. We actually look like a bush league conference with 300 fans in the stands.

The answer to all your questions is "Money."

Nope… we would actually be better off in the long run. Face it, we can’t hang with the big boy and really should try. Time to carve out our own niche.

There are a few reasons why 99% of programs move up, not down. We are not moving down so just stop. The expanded playoff has not even started yet. Most G5 schools are excited for that.

I like the theory but not the practice.

The regional thing we already had, called the MAC.

Could the story be reworked by just dropping the ESPN midweek connection and just going back to Saturday football? We can get some portal candidates more easily that way. Feature our band and cheer and dance teams, good student participation, those awesome matchups with BG and Miami properly presented on beautiful fall afternoons. Make the MAC magnificent again.

Personally I have no issue with playing the money games. That’s better exposure than playing CMU on a cold Tuesday in November.

(12-28-2023 10:38 PM)Broncodan Wrote:  

(12-28-2023 12:25 PM)Bronco1982 Wrote:  

(12-21-2023 03:43 PM)WMU2013 Wrote:  

(12-21-2023 03:07 PM)Bronco1982 Wrote:  This is 2023 not 2003. The recruiting dynamic has changed. If you are a FBS program you better be a nationwide recruiting program , especially in Michigan. Compare the number Michigan HS football programs even in existence 20 years ago vs today. Florida has over twice the number of HS players just from population growth and Georgia is right there. Who's winning the MAC with a roster of local players? Those days are gone

Fleck came here in 2012 when you all were reciting the radius. Stop it.

Did Fleck have tge Transfer portal breathing down his neck? You think that 2016 Cotton Bowl team would have existed with NIL and Portal options of today? Like I said the dynamic has changed

We may never see a cotton bowl type season for wmu ever again simply because of the portal / NIL.

Sucks.

2016 wouldn’t have happened with today’s structure in place. So we squeezed in at the right moment.

However I don’t think the odds (however slim) have necessarily changed. Instead of a 4 year build, you now just have to get kinda lucky that the portal pieces fall into place for you.

In fact, the odds have actually improved a bit with the AAC powers moving up to the P5. Liberty got in this year without playing one P5 opponent (our 2016 schedule was scrutinized and we beat 2).

Still, regardless of setup, I’m thinking we can all agree that 2016 was a once in a lifetime thing.

I think 2016 would have still happened. That team completely bought into Fleck. The exodus when he left would have been crazy though.

2016 was *probably* a once in a lifetime type deal regardless of the system in place. But while Liberty isn't a direct comparison (I'll stay out of the religious/political aspect but suffice it to say they're a private school paying the coach $4M), Toledo was one play away from an unbeaten regular season and would've likely been playing for a NY6 bowl at the MACC if they had held on against Illinois. So I think to say it's impossible is a little much.