Air Force did it. They're P5.
So is Utah State and UNM. Wow.

(11-16-2023 09:21 AM)quo vadis Wrote:  

(11-16-2023 09:18 AM)shizzle787 Wrote:  Gloria Nevarez did a really good job here.

It looks that way, though IMO we still need to see details.

She's been the best G5 commissioner the past few years I think, and the MW appears to be nicely positioned going forward.

This is the most significant existential threat the Mountain West has faced in its existence, and she weathered it. Good job of keeping the stronger members onboard to support the weaker members, who certainly could have been placed in a more vulnerable position.

That said, Aresco has been facing these challenges for virtually his entire tenure, and has also weathered the storm on more than one occasion.

Quote:If a merger does happen, that will be bad news for the AAC and SBC in terms of their hopes to be the #1 G-conference.

It will be bad news for the AAC from the standpoint that it likely will loosen their death grip on the G5 bid for the NY6, and going forward, the CFP. But I remain far from convinced that the Mountain West will develop a similar death grip. Imho, that is the biggest prize available for the G5, certainly within the court of overall public opinion, at least, and with it standing to convert into an AQ bid within the CFP, that perception likely will only grow stronger.

Makes a lot more sense than the Sun Belt. But unless they think they have a shot at a P4 slot in the next two years it makes more sense to merge now. They can keep assets and basketball credits as part of the merger agreement. The P share of cfp revenues can be negotiated.

(11-16-2023 09:31 AM)shizzle787 Wrote:  

(11-16-2023 09:30 AM)quo vadis Wrote:  IMO, the ultimate goal for WS and OS is not to merge with the MW, it is to get picked up by either the ACC or Big 12.

A two year scheduling alliance gives them breathing space to lobby or somehow work towards that, without committing immediately to forming a new conference with the MW.

This is true, but I don't see either league picking them up: they are the new UConn, USF, and Temple.

I agree, I don't think it happens for them either, but hope springs eternal, LOL.

Good job PAC-2 + MW!

If a name change, post merger in two years, I recommend just "PAC" with no number attached. Or keep it as PAC-12 officially, but use PAC in marketing, etc.

P.S. Unless you can get the WAC name back, of course. But definitely don't use "The WAC PAC." :-)

If the end result is some sort of region of the “Pac-12 Conference” name, can it just be called straight-up the “Pac Conference?” Not “Pacific.” No number. Just, “Pac.”

(11-16-2023 09:36 AM)tf8693 Wrote:  

(11-16-2023 09:21 AM)quo vadis Wrote:  

(11-16-2023 09:18 AM)shizzle787 Wrote:  Gloria Nevarez did a really good job here.

It looks that way, though IMO we still need to see details.

She's been the best G5 commissioner the past few years I think, and the MW appears to be nicely positioned going forward.

This is the most significant existential threat the Mountain West has faced in its existence, and she weathered it. Good job of keeping the stronger members onboard to support the weaker members, who certainly could have been placed in a more vulnerable position.

That said, Aresco has been facing these challenges for virtually his entire tenure, and has also weathered the storm on more than one occasion.

Quote:If a merger does happen, that will be bad news for the AAC and SBC in terms of their hopes to be the #1 G-conference.

It will be bad news for the AAC from the standpoint that it likely will loosen their death grip on the G5 bid for the NY6, and going forward, the CFP. But I remain far from convinced that the Mountain West will develop a similar death grip. Imho, that is the biggest prize available for the G5, certainly within the court of overall public opinion, at least, and with it standing to convert into an AQ bid within the CFP, that perception likely will only grow stronger.

If a merger actually happens, with the full MW incorporated into the PAC shell, then IMO the MW will actually have gotten stronger. Well, the MW will cease to exist, but the MW members will be better off, because they will be in the PAC shell, which has more brand resonance, and with WS and OS, two schools that clearly improve the brand value of the MW schools.

In contrast, regarding the AAC, when you say it has weathered storms over the years, IMO that is true, but in the sense of surviving. Because to me, the AAC has never gotten stronger, its various changes over the years have weakened it, the big blow of course being losing Cincy, UCF and Houston and having to swallow a pile of CUSA teams to satisfy ESPN. That wasn't Aresco's fault of course, there's nothing he could have done to keep them from leaving, but it was a weakening nevertheless.

Beyond that, I agree that a P2/MW merger will not guarantee that this conference will gain a death-grip on the expanded CFP playoff spot. But, IMO it makes them more formidable in competing for it, which therefore weakens the AAC (already badly weakened if this season's performance is any indication) and SBC.

(11-16-2023 09:08 AM)Frank the Tank Wrote:  

(11-16-2023 09:03 AM)solohawks Wrote:  Im sure the MWC is getting compensated for this OR it is the beginning of the path towards some form of full time unison between the Pac2 and the MWC 12

Getting this ironed out well take the time pressure off of OSU and WSU

Yes - the full story is now up and it’s actually both: “lucrative” compensation for the MWC, an intent for a full merger in 2 years, and financial penalties if the Pac-2 attempt to poach individual MWC schools:

https://sports.yahoo.com/oregon-state-wa...33816.html

Okay, not that I had any doubts about this but Nevarez is obviously about 50x the leader Klownkoff was.

(11-16-2023 09:41 AM)PlayBall! Wrote:  Good job PAC-2 + MW!

If a name change, post merger in two years, I recommend just "PAC" with no number attached. Or keep it as PAC-12 officially, but use PAC in marketing, etc.

P.S. Unless you can get the WAC name back, of course. But definitely don't use "The WAC PAC." :-)

Beat me to it.

(11-16-2023 09:36 AM)bullet Wrote:  Makes a lot more sense than the Sun Belt. But unless they think they have a shot at a P4 slot in the next two years it makes more sense to merge now. They can keep assets and basketball credits as part of the merger agreement. The P share of cfp revenues can be negotiated.

Until the litigation around the Pac-12 is completely resolved, it’s effectively impossible to have a merger. A merger realistically requires neither party to have any material encumbrances and that certainly isn’t the case on the Pac-12 side as of now. I see the interim alliance as being as much about allowing the litigation to play out (meaning that OSU/WSU aren’t forced into a long-term legal decision that is suboptimal due to a non-legal short-term football scheduling issue) as anything else since the chances of those two schools getting into the P4 are close to zero.

(11-16-2023 09:46 AM)Michael in Raleigh Wrote:  If the end result is some sort of region of the “Pac-12 Conference” name, can it just be called straight-up the “Pac Conference?” Not “Pacific.” No number. Just, “Pac.”

I vote for the Premier Athletic Conference

(11-16-2023 09:46 AM)b0ndsj0ns Wrote:  

(11-16-2023 09:08 AM)Frank the Tank Wrote:  

(11-16-2023 09:03 AM)solohawks Wrote:  Im sure the MWC is getting compensated for this OR it is the beginning of the path towards some form of full time unison between the Pac2 and the MWC 12

Getting this ironed out well take the time pressure off of OSU and WSU

Yes - the full story is now up and it’s actually both: “lucrative” compensation for the MWC, an intent for a full merger in 2 years, and financial penalties if the Pac-2 attempt to poach individual MWC schools:

https://sports.yahoo.com/oregon-state-wa...33816.html

Okay, not that I had any doubts about this but Nevarez is obviously about 50x the leader Klownkoff was.

If this merger happens, she may get the commissioner's job for the new league, even if it is under the PAC name.

(11-16-2023 09:36 AM)tf8693 Wrote:  

(11-16-2023 09:21 AM)quo vadis Wrote:  

(11-16-2023 09:18 AM)shizzle787 Wrote:  Gloria Nevarez did a really good job here.

It looks that way, though IMO we still need to see details.

She's been the best G5 commissioner the past few years I think, and the MW appears to be nicely positioned going forward.

This is the most significant existential threat the Mountain West has faced in its existence, and she weathered it. Good job of keeping the stronger members onboard to support the weaker members, who certainly could have been placed in a more vulnerable position.

That said, Aresco has been facing these challenges for virtually his entire tenure, and has also weathered the storm on more than one occasion.

Quote:If a merger does happen, that will be bad news for the AAC and SBC in terms of their hopes to be the #1 G-conference.

It will be bad news for the AAC from the standpoint that it likely will loosen their death grip on the G5 bid for the NY6, and going forward, the CFP. But I remain far from convinced that the Mountain West will develop a similar death grip. Imho, that is the biggest prize available for the G5, certainly within the court of overall public opinion, at least, and with it standing to convert into an AQ bid within the CFP, that perception likely will only grow stronger.

This is not meant as a shot at her, she's clearly good at her job, but she only "weathered it" because the PAC was all time incompetent. They had every chance to add SDSU, and SDSU would have always taken that offer. Now she did some very good things along the way to position themselves once things fell apart they way they did, but same as Aresco the "weathering the storm" part of not losing members to a power conference she had no control over.

(11-16-2023 09:49 AM)quo vadis Wrote:  

(11-16-2023 09:46 AM)b0ndsj0ns Wrote:  

(11-16-2023 09:08 AM)Frank the Tank Wrote:  

(11-16-2023 09:03 AM)solohawks Wrote:  Im sure the MWC is getting compensated for this OR it is the beginning of the path towards some form of full time unison between the Pac2 and the MWC 12

Getting this ironed out well take the time pressure off of OSU and WSU

Yes - the full story is now up and it’s actually both: “lucrative” compensation for the MWC, an intent for a full merger in 2 years, and financial penalties if the Pac-2 attempt to poach individual MWC schools:

https://sports.yahoo.com/oregon-state-wa...33816.html

Okay, not that I had any doubts about this but Nevarez is obviously about 50x the leader Klownkoff was.

If this merger happens, she may get the commissioner's job for the new league, even if it is under the PAC name.

Very clearly she should. Considering the actions of Klownkoff working with the departing 10 no chance he's around even if you ignored every other place he failed along the way.

So far…

2024

Oregon St
- Washington St
- MWC: Boise St
- OOC: Idaho St, Purdue

Washington St
- Oregon St
- MWC: San Diego St, San Jose St
- OOC: Portland St

2025

Oregon St
- Washington St
- MWC: Fresno St
- OOC: Portland St, Texas Tech

Washington St
- Oregon St
- MWC: San Diego St
- OOC: Idaho, North Texas

(11-16-2023 08:58 AM)Nerdlinger Wrote:  Interesting! So OSU and WSU each would get 6 games per year from the MW. They each have 3 existing OOC games scheduled for 2024 and 2025, so for the last 3 games they could either play each other once and add 2 more OOCs or play each other home and away and add just 1 more OOC.

This would give OSU and WSU six G5 games and six P4 games.

OSU and FSU would play each other annually plus the opportunity to play five P4 teams in nonconference play. This is a 50/50 split between Power teams and G5 teams, not a bad outcome.

It probably can be assumed that the OSU/OU and WSU/WU series will continue.

Playing at Hawaii gives WSU and OSU an opportunity to schedule another P4 game if the rule that playing @Hawaii allows a team to schedule an 13th game as in the past.

(11-16-2023 09:52 AM)b0ndsj0ns Wrote:  

(11-16-2023 09:36 AM)tf8693 Wrote:  

(11-16-2023 09:21 AM)quo vadis Wrote:  

(11-16-2023 09:18 AM)shizzle787 Wrote:  Gloria Nevarez did a really good job here.

It looks that way, though IMO we still need to see details.

She's been the best G5 commissioner the past few years I think, and the MW appears to be nicely positioned going forward.

This is the most significant existential threat the Mountain West has faced in its existence, and she weathered it. Good job of keeping the stronger members onboard to support the weaker members, who certainly could have been placed in a more vulnerable position.

That said, Aresco has been facing these challenges for virtually his entire tenure, and has also weathered the storm on more than one occasion.

Quote:If a merger does happen, that will be bad news for the AAC and SBC in terms of their hopes to be the #1 G-conference.

It will be bad news for the AAC from the standpoint that it likely will loosen their death grip on the G5 bid for the NY6, and going forward, the CFP. But I remain far from convinced that the Mountain West will develop a similar death grip. Imho, that is the biggest prize available for the G5, certainly within the court of overall public opinion, at least, and with it standing to convert into an AQ bid within the CFP, that perception likely will only grow stronger.

This is not meant as a shot at her, she's clearly good at her job, but she only "weathered it" because the PAC was all time incompetent. They had every chance to add SDSU, and SDSU would have always taken that offer. Now she did some very good things along the way to position themselves once things fell apart they way they did, but same as Aresco the "weathering the storm" part of not losing members to a power conference she had no control over.

Nah. If the terms in the article come to reality, that is a fantastic job of protecting all of her conference’s members.

(11-16-2023 09:56 AM)Tulsa Guy Wrote:  

(11-16-2023 08:58 AM)Nerdlinger Wrote:  Interesting! So OSU and WSU each would get 6 games per year from the MW. They each have 3 existing OOC games scheduled for 2024 and 2025, so for the last 3 games they could either play each other once and add 2 more OOCs or play each other home and away and add just 1 more OOC.

This would give OSU and WSU six G5 games and six P4 games.

OSU and FSU would play each other annually plus the opportunity to play five P4 teams in nonconference play. This is a 50/50 split between Power teams and G5 teams, not a bad outcome.

It probably can be assumed that the OSU/OU and WSU/WU series will continue.

Playing at Hawaii gives WSU and OSU an opportunity to schedule another P4 game if the rule that playing @Hawaii allows a team to schedule an 13th game as in the past.

I have a feeling it’ll be more like 4 P4 games and 8 G5/FCS games.

(11-16-2023 09:46 AM)Frank the Tank Wrote:  

(11-16-2023 09:36 AM)bullet Wrote:  Makes a lot more sense than the Sun Belt. But unless they think they have a shot at a P4 slot in the next two years it makes more sense to merge now. They can keep assets and basketball credits as part of the merger agreement. The P share of cfp revenues can be negotiated.

Until the litigation around the Pac-12 is completely resolved, it’s effectively impossible to have a merger. A merger realistically requires neither party to have any material encumbrances and that certainly isn’t the case on the Pac-12 side as of now. I see the interim alliance as being as much about allowing the litigation to play out (meaning that OSU/WSU aren’t forced into a long-term legal decision that is suboptimal due to a non-legal short-term football scheduling issue) as anything else since the chances of those two schools getting into the P4 are close to zero.

This is what I thought. This effectively buys time to work out the PAC 12 financial issues to have a clean merger. Less we forget, the MW TV contract will up by then and that will play a role how this will work out between the two.

(11-16-2023 09:57 AM)Michael in Raleigh Wrote:  

(11-16-2023 09:52 AM)b0ndsj0ns Wrote:  

(11-16-2023 09:36 AM)tf8693 Wrote:  

(11-16-2023 09:21 AM)quo vadis Wrote:  

(11-16-2023 09:18 AM)shizzle787 Wrote:  Gloria Nevarez did a really good job here.

It looks that way, though IMO we still need to see details.

She's been the best G5 commissioner the past few years I think, and the MW appears to be nicely positioned going forward.

This is the most significant existential threat the Mountain West has faced in its existence, and she weathered it. Good job of keeping the stronger members onboard to support the weaker members, who certainly could have been placed in a more vulnerable position.

That said, Aresco has been facing these challenges for virtually his entire tenure, and has also weathered the storm on more than one occasion.

Quote:If a merger does happen, that will be bad news for the AAC and SBC in terms of their hopes to be the #1 G-conference.

It will be bad news for the AAC from the standpoint that it likely will loosen their death grip on the G5 bid for the NY6, and going forward, the CFP. But I remain far from convinced that the Mountain West will develop a similar death grip. Imho, that is the biggest prize available for the G5, certainly within the court of overall public opinion, at least, and with it standing to convert into an AQ bid within the CFP, that perception likely will only grow stronger.

This is not meant as a shot at her, she's clearly good at her job, but she only "weathered it" because the PAC was all time incompetent. They had every chance to add SDSU, and SDSU would have always taken that offer. Now she did some very good things along the way to position themselves once things fell apart they way they did, but same as Aresco the "weathering the storm" part of not losing members to a power conference she had no control over.

Nah. If the terms in the article come to reality, that is a fantastic job of protecting all of her conference’s members.

If a commish in her position had agreed to that alliance without those terms that would make them an incompetent idiot. Only group stupid enough to form an "alliance" without any contractual assurances of any protection or any tangible benefit to them was the PAC12, and we see what that got them. Having those terms to agree to a deal doesn't make her brilliant, just makes her not a moron.