(08-06-2023 07:45 PM)bullet Wrote:  

(08-06-2023 07:32 PM)UIWElite Wrote:  

(08-06-2023 04:48 PM)Tigersmoke4 Wrote:  

(08-06-2023 03:18 PM)UofMstateU Wrote:  

(08-06-2023 03:10 PM)Stugray2 Wrote:  Canzano says the four Pac-12 are trying to rebuild rather than merge (go to MWC). I don't know how committed Stanford is to this.

https://twitter.com/johncanzanobft/statu...7440036864

Supposedly according to some reports the plan on Friday was to invite three schools, which certainly included San Diego State and SMU, probably also Colorado State. Tulane seems to get the most press, then UNLV, Boise State and Rice.

I really wonder where they think they can get a media deal, where all the schools not named SMU can round up the cash quick for exit fees, and how much these schools believe in George Kliavkoff to deliver. If they succed, it's the power of the logo.

The short answer is that their media deal will suck. Because the entire issue with the PAC's media deal (sans the complete ineptness of the PAC leadership) was the fact that all schools were pidgeon-holed to the far west.

WHen your media deal was suckage due to all of the western teams, you're not going to fix that suckage by adding more western and MWC teams. People in the central time zone who watch football are not going to stay up late at night to watch Wash St vs Boise St. They will stay up late and watch a regional team play in the late night slot, because they do that now.

It's amazing how so many people are completely overlooking this most important fact. You rebuild with the best teams available in the best new timezones available. Everything else is bullcrap at this point.

Yes, but every conference has had ample time to get replacements. Pac 12 is Pac 4 in 11 months. The Pac 4 could add UMass, Army, and maybe UConn for next year. All the attractive, and that is a loose term, teams all require big exit fees and long term notices.

So you would be asking schools to pay big bucks to leave their current conferences, and for what? Whatever media deal they can cobble together? Apparently Apple was the only one interested in the Pac 12 and you think that the Pac 4 plus Memphis is what the networks were really looking for? Come on.

Independents require big bucks to get out of their game deals. Its MORE difficult for them with short notice.

I doubt that. I’m sure any AD worth a damn had provisions built into the game contracts that allow for easier rescheduling/cancellation if they join a conference.

(08-06-2023 07:47 PM)UIWElite Wrote:  

(08-06-2023 07:45 PM)bullet Wrote:  

(08-06-2023 07:32 PM)UIWElite Wrote:  

(08-06-2023 04:48 PM)Tigersmoke4 Wrote:  

(08-06-2023 03:18 PM)UofMstateU Wrote:  The short answer is that their media deal will suck. Because the entire issue with the PAC's media deal (sans the complete ineptness of the PAC leadership) was the fact that all schools were pidgeon-holed to the far west.

WHen your media deal was suckage due to all of the western teams, you're not going to fix that suckage by adding more western and MWC teams. People in the central time zone who watch football are not going to stay up late at night to watch Wash St vs Boise St. They will stay up late and watch a regional team play in the late night slot, because they do that now.

It's amazing how so many people are completely overlooking this most important fact. You rebuild with the best teams available in the best new timezones available. Everything else is bullcrap at this point.

Yes, but every conference has had ample time to get replacements. Pac 12 is Pac 4 in 11 months. The Pac 4 could add UMass, Army, and maybe UConn for next year. All the attractive, and that is a loose term, teams all require big exit fees and long term notices.

So you would be asking schools to pay big bucks to leave their current conferences, and for what? Whatever media deal they can cobble together? Apparently Apple was the only one interested in the Pac 12 and you think that the Pac 4 plus Memphis is what the networks were really looking for? Come on.

Independents require big bucks to get out of their game deals. Its MORE difficult for them with short notice.

I doubt that. I’m sure any AD worth a damn had provisions built into the game contracts that allow for easier rescheduling/cancellation if they join a conference.

But you have to pay.

(08-06-2023 07:58 PM)bullet Wrote:  

(08-06-2023 07:47 PM)UIWElite Wrote:  

(08-06-2023 07:45 PM)bullet Wrote:  

(08-06-2023 07:32 PM)UIWElite Wrote:  

(08-06-2023 04:48 PM)Tigersmoke4 Wrote:  It's amazing how so many people are completely overlooking this most important fact. You rebuild with the best teams available in the best new timezones available. Everything else is bullcrap at this point.

Yes, but every conference has had ample time to get replacements. Pac 12 is Pac 4 in 11 months. The Pac 4 could add UMass, Army, and maybe UConn for next year. All the attractive, and that is a loose term, teams all require big exit fees and long term notices.

So you would be asking schools to pay big bucks to leave their current conferences, and for what? Whatever media deal they can cobble together? Apparently Apple was the only one interested in the Pac 12 and you think that the Pac 4 plus Memphis is what the networks were really looking for? Come on.

Independents require big bucks to get out of their game deals. Its MORE difficult for them with short notice.

I doubt that. I’m sure any AD worth a damn had provisions built into the game contracts that allow for easier rescheduling/cancellation if they join a conference.

But you have to pay.

Not here - https://www.wralsportsfan.com/unc-libert.../20350081/

No mention of costing anyone money here - https://fbschedules.com/duke-liberty-can...ll-series/

Cal and Stanford could invite the 5 UCs from the Big West to join them in the PAC and they’d have sufficient numbers to accommodate most of their sports. FBS independence for football would then be in order, or some schedule alliance with another league.

(08-06-2023 08:07 PM)UIWElite Wrote:  

(08-06-2023 07:58 PM)bullet Wrote:  

(08-06-2023 07:47 PM)UIWElite Wrote:  

(08-06-2023 07:45 PM)bullet Wrote:  

(08-06-2023 07:32 PM)UIWElite Wrote:  Yes, but every conference has had ample time to get replacements. Pac 12 is Pac 4 in 11 months. The Pac 4 could add UMass, Army, and maybe UConn for next year. All the attractive, and that is a loose term, teams all require big exit fees and long term notices.

So you would be asking schools to pay big bucks to leave their current conferences, and for what? Whatever media deal they can cobble together? Apparently Apple was the only one interested in the Pac 12 and you think that the Pac 4 plus Memphis is what the networks were really looking for? Come on.

Independents require big bucks to get out of their game deals. Its MORE difficult for them with short notice.

I doubt that. I’m sure any AD worth a damn had provisions built into the game contracts that allow for easier rescheduling/cancellation if they join a conference.

But you have to pay.

Not here - https://www.wralsportsfan.com/unc-libert.../20350081/

No mention of costing anyone money here - https://fbschedules.com/duke-liberty-can...ll-series/

All the contracts have buyouts. Usually pretty steep.
There may be occassions when it is mutually cancelled. But on short notice, not very often.

(08-06-2023 07:32 PM)UIWElite Wrote:  

(08-06-2023 04:48 PM)Tigersmoke4 Wrote:  

(08-06-2023 03:18 PM)UofMstateU Wrote:  

(08-06-2023 03:10 PM)Stugray2 Wrote:  Canzano says the four Pac-12 are trying to rebuild rather than merge (go to MWC). I don't know how committed Stanford is to this.

https://twitter.com/johncanzanobft/statu...7440036864

Supposedly according to some reports the plan on Friday was to invite three schools, which certainly included San Diego State and SMU, probably also Colorado State. Tulane seems to get the most press, then UNLV, Boise State and Rice.

I really wonder where they think they can get a media deal, where all the schools not named SMU can round up the cash quick for exit fees, and how much these schools believe in George Kliavkoff to deliver. If they succed, it's the power of the logo.

The short answer is that their media deal will suck. Because the entire issue with the PAC's media deal (sans the complete ineptness of the PAC leadership) was the fact that all schools were pidgeon-holed to the far west.

WHen your media deal was suckage due to all of the western teams, you're not going to fix that suckage by adding more western and MWC teams. People in the central time zone who watch football are not going to stay up late at night to watch Wash St vs Boise St. They will stay up late and watch a regional team play in the late night slot, because they do that now.

It's amazing how so many people are completely overlooking this most important fact. You rebuild with the best teams available in the best new timezones available. Everything else is bullcrap at this point.

Yes, but every conference has had ample time to get replacements. Pac 12 is Pac 4 in 11 months. The Pac 4 could add UMass, Army, and maybe UConn for next year. All the attractive, and that is a loose term, teams all require big exit fees and long term notices.

So you would be asking schools to pay big bucks to leave their current conferences, and for what? Whatever media deal they can cobble together? Apparently Apple was the only one interested in the Pac 12 and you think that the Pac 4 plus Memphis is what the networks were really looking for? Come on.

I never said "The PAC 4 and Memphis "you did. I said "Best teams available ". There's no more big dollars available in the least important least watched Pacific time zone left. Strategy says ish rolls down hill,,,so wipe out your closest competitor which would be the AAC by taking the last teams that add value Memphis, USF, Tulane, SMU, Navy. Isn't that what the big12 just did to the pac12? Those are the schools basically holding up the value of the conference. It would force ESPN to renegotiate the AAC contract down to pennies on the dollar and negotiate with the pac12 (with an eastern wing draws eyeballs and attention). There is your entry back into linear talks. Now you'd have the ability to get Stanford, CAL, OSU, WSU on some daytime slots that should optimize viewership. Apple will still be there also because you just added Tampa, New Orleans, Dallas, Memphis fan bases (places that actually care about college football) to your roster. Then expand with SDSU, Boise, Colorado State the next year when their gor becomes reasonable.

(08-06-2023 08:53 PM)Fighting Muskie Wrote:  Cal and Stanford could invite the 5 UCs from the Big West to join them in the PAC and they’d have sufficient numbers to accommodate most of their sports. FBS independence for football would then be in order, or some schedule alliance with another league.

They could do that, but while that would accommodate most of their sports it would still relegate them to a status that really doesn't support football independence. And, their past success in those Olympic sports won't be sustained. Their ability to recruit elite athletes in all sports was very much tied to their being a member of a prestigious athletic conference, the PAC 12. Stanford and Cal have little to no athletics value in their own right. Even if they were to hold their noses and join the Mountain West, their days as an Olympic sports powerhouse are over. Their only hope in retaining that status is joining USCLA, UW and OU in the Big Ten.

(08-06-2023 08:53 PM)Fighting Muskie Wrote:  Cal and Stanford could invite the 5 UCs from the Big West to join them in the PAC and they’d have sufficient numbers to accommodate most of their sports. FBS independence for football would then be in order, or some schedule alliance with another league.

I think what they end up doing is something like that and then some kind of either scheduling alliance or FB only membership in either the MWC or AAC.

(08-06-2023 01:21 PM)esayem Wrote:  It was reported ESPN/ACC were working out a deal when the Big Ten swooped in.

The ACC could still be in play.

(08-06-2023 03:10 PM)Stugray2 Wrote:  Canzano says the four Pac-12 are trying to rebuild rather than merge (go to MWC). I don't know how committed Stanford is to this.

https://twitter.com/johncanzanobft/statu...7440036864

Supposedly according to some reports the plan on Friday was to invite three schools, which certainly included San Diego State and SMU, probably also Colorado State. Tulane seems to get the most press, then UNLV, Boise State and Rice.

I really wonder where they think they can get a media deal,

Excellent question, I have no idea.

Quote:where all the schools not named SMU can round up the cash quick for exit fees,

PAC-12 can front them the money from this year's conference revenue. Puts 2/3 of the cost on the departing schools that way.

Quote:and how much these schools believe in George Kliavkoff to deliver.

awkward_collar_tug.GIF

Quote:If they succed, it's the power of the logo.

And the CFP money the PAC is still in line for in 2024 and 2025. They're still a Contract Bowl Conference -- the Rose Bowl isn't going to bother to rework the contract, they're getting CFP Quarterfinal with the Big Ten champ hosting.

I don't know that the Comcast bill is left on the remaining schools. The conference owes the money, but as of today all 12 should be on the hook for it. Bailing out shouldn't change that.

#9 Close down the football program and join the WCC

(08-06-2023 02:09 PM)Aztecgolfer Wrote:  

(08-06-2023 01:52 PM)TrojanCampaign Wrote:  

(08-06-2023 01:21 PM)RUScarlets Wrote:  The safest option is to negotiate a merger but give Cal Stanford dramatically reduced exit fees to the Mountain Pacific Conference. Think it’s a fair trade off.

Does not sound like a fair deal to me.

At this point SDSU has just as much of a chance as Stanford to get into a power conference. And what if SDSU wanted to join the AAC? They would love the chance to leave with reduced exit fees.

Same going for Boise State.

There is still a possibility that SDSU will be invited to the B12, but my source told me not to get my hopes up. If the B12 decides to expand into California, then they would need to take 2 schools for it to make sense.

Where do you now see SDSU in 2024-25 and 2025-26? would it even make sense to pay the exit fees to join P-4 in 2025-26?

(08-06-2023 02:35 PM)HawaiiMongoose Wrote:  If I’m the Pac-4, I invite SMU, Rice, and Tulane for 2024, and SDSU, UNLV, and Colorado State for 2025.

The AAC’s exit fees aren’t as steep as the MWC’s, and SMU, Rice, and Tulane are all wealthy enough to handle the expense on short notice.

Having only seven members for just one season won’t jeopardize the conference’s FBS status, thanks to the NCAA’s two-year grace period for FBS conferences that fall below the eight-member minimum. Scheduling would be a bit of a challenge in 2024-25 but the members could temporarily load up with extra OOC games.

The additional year given to the three MWC schools until exiting would give them sufficient time to pull together their $17 million exit fees.

The new Pac-10 would be academically up-to-snuff, and while far from a juggernaut in football or basketball, reasonably competitive on the field.

AAC's exit fees are $10M with 27 months notice. UC UCF and Hou paid roughly $18 to leave 1 year early. I don't see how P-4 can realistically do anything conference affiliation-wise except merge with MWC

(08-06-2023 04:09 PM)UIWElite Wrote:  Imagine being a fan of college football and basketball and then choosing Rice over Boise St and UNLV because they have good academics.

That's exactly what P-4 would do and why they're a P-4, so yeah that's the P-12 elites for you.

(08-07-2023 07:38 AM)ken d Wrote:  

(08-06-2023 08:53 PM)Fighting Muskie Wrote:  Cal and Stanford could invite the 5 UCs from the Big West to join them in the PAC and they’d have sufficient numbers to accommodate most of their sports. FBS independence for football would then be in order, or some schedule alliance with another league.

They could do that, but while that would accommodate most of their sports it would still relegate them to a status that really doesn't support football independence. And, their past success in those Olympic sports won't be sustained. Their ability to recruit elite athletes in all sports was very much tied to their being a member of a prestigious athletic conference, the PAC 12. Stanford and Cal have little to no athletics value in their own right. Even if they were to hold their noses and join the Mountain West, their days as an Olympic sports powerhouse are over. Their only hope in retaining that status is joining USCLA, UW and OU in the Big Ten.

You’re working from the assumption that Cal and Stanford have a choice in the matter. The only way to fully sustain their programs at the current level is to land a spot in a P4. If they can’t do that, and so far things don’t look particularly promising that they will, they are going to have to resort to picking from among a list of options they don’t particularly like.

The UCs are all AAU so that checks the academic boxes. They also sponsor a lot of the niche, boutique sports Cal and Stanford sponsor—that’s another box checked. They are all on the West Coast for easy travel—box checked. It would give them games in the LA area and San Diego—that’s a nice plus too.

It’s not a solution for football but I can help alleviate some of their problems.

Maybe they will play double round robin among the 4 football schools to fill half the schedule for a couple years. There’s also a lot of schools who are going to have to cancel OOC series with schools they are about to become conference mates with. Maybe they can jump in and pick up some of those.

The point I’m making here is there is a solution that can answer a lot of their problems, so long as they find a separate fix for football.

The remaining 4 PAC members can stay together and invite:

SMU
Tulane
Memphis
UTSA
UTEP
Louisiana

These schools will have an easier time joining the PAC than the the MW schools.

(08-06-2023 12:13 PM)goodknightfl Wrote:  Cusa would be good.

Don't act like Stanford/Cal sharing a conference with Liberty wouldn't be entertaining.

(08-06-2023 03:48 PM)seaking4steel Wrote:  

(08-06-2023 03:39 PM)owl at the moon Wrote:  5-8 is not a “losing record”.
It is a postseason appearance AND
it’s five times more winning than back when we were 1-11.

Five times more winning!
That is what Rice Football brings.

This might as well be Rice's marketing pitch:

"Add Rice! We might've killed every conference we have ever been a part of, but we had damn good baseball"

Without looking, do you know when Rice baseball last had a winning season?

(08-07-2023 09:48 AM)goodknightfl Wrote:  I don't know that the Comcast bill is left on the remaining schools. The conference owes the money, but as of today all 12 should be on the hook for it. Bailing out shouldn't change that.

simple enough. the 4 remains schools are the only ones who vote. pay Comcast before you pay your 2024 distributions.

pay any upcoming expenses in advance out of this year's money. Holiday Bowl lawsuit, the lawsuit from the Pac 12 Network executives who got fired. right now, any bill the PAC pays is at an effective 8/12 discount.