If the Mountain West were to find itself needing to add schools, who would be the most likely to be added?

New Mexico State and UTEP would probably be willing to leave C-USA just for the reduced travel.

I have a hard time seeing the Mountain West go into the Central Time Zone as anything other than a last resort. While Louisiana Tech has some history with the WAC's later years as a FBS conference, I doubt either side would be interested. The Texas UAC schools may be a different story, but I think the Mountain West has to lose most of the West Division for that to happen. If UT-Arlington restarts football, I think they could be on the table just because of the ease of flying to Dallas-Fort Worth.

I don't see any viable candidates in the Southland other than perhaps Lamar - which just ran away from the WAC to join the Southland for a third time - and McNeese, which would only be in as a last resort since they are in Louisiana.

A raid or merger on the Missouri Valley Football Conference might be viable, but it pretty much requires the Pac-12 to slice off the correct half of the Mountain West. NDSU and Missouri State might be willing to go to Wyoming or New Mexico, but San Jose and Fresno would likely be a bridge too far.

Some combination of Sacramento State, UC Davis, and Cal Poly would probably be welcome, it's just a question of whether those schools are willing/able to move up. Right now Sacramento State is the only one with a large enough stadium, not that the others are that far behind. Sacramento would also have an easier time leaving the Big Sky rather than the other schools in the more compact Big West - the Hornets are already traveling in the Mountain and Pacific Time Zones in conference play anyway. If Boise State is one of the ones left behind, they will insist on a California presence in the conference. I can't see any other Big West schools moving up barring a "whale" donation.

Montana and Montana State would probably be the best fits from an institutional standpoint, but they passed on moving up before. Does having CFP access change the equation for them?

Idaho and Weber State would likely be ready to move up from the Big Sky - after all, Idaho was FBS not that long ago - but are the schools interested?

Eastern Washington, Portland State, Idaho State, Northern Arizona, and Northern Colorado are out of the question. I also can't see the Mountain West reaching into the bag for Southern Utah or Utah Tech; the Big Sky might also have to be fairly banged up to take them as well, especially since they would be taking Southern Utah back.

University of San Diego would be a huge stretch in that they would need to go from 0 to 85 scholarships (plus any new sports on the women's side), as well as expand the small Torero Stadium (6,000), but at least they have a program. USD might also be willing to get out of Gonzaga's shadow, but is that worth $10 million (or more) each year?

1. Texas State (but only if the AAC doesn't get there first).
2. UTEP
3. La Tech
4. NMSU


I don't see the MW adding FCS programs.

I don't see Texas State being interested in the MWC, even if the MWC media deal is currently better. So atleast UTEP has that going for it.

If desperate enough, the MWC will have to go into the FCS to survive. However, I could see them going after Sam Houston State first before UTEP. Sam Houston is in a better location in the state.

(05-04-2023 08:46 PM)shizzle787 Wrote:  1. Texas State (but only if the AAC doesn't get there first).
2. UTEP
3. La Tech
4. NMSU


I don't see the MW adding FCS programs.

This list is on target. If Texas State backfills SDSU in the MWC, La. Tech will be a top candidate to replace the Bobcats in the SBC.

The MWC is well positioned to restock. You’ve got UTEP and NMSU already in FBS and there if they need them. We also haven’t seen an FCS call up in the West since 1996 so there are plenty of strong FCS schools in the region.

(05-04-2023 08:43 PM)chargeradio Wrote:  If the Mountain West were to find itself needing to add schools, who would be the most likely to be added?

New Mexico State and UTEP would probably be willing to leave C-USA just for the reduced travel.

I have a hard time seeing the Mountain West go into the Central Time Zone as anything other than a last resort. While Louisiana Tech has some history with the WAC's later years as a FBS conference, I doubt either side would be interested. The Texas UAC schools may be a different story, but I think the Mountain West has to lose most of the West Division for that to happen. If UT-Arlington restarts football, I think they could be on the table just because of the ease of flying to Dallas-Fort Worth.

I don't see any viable candidates in the Southland other than perhaps Lamar - which just ran away from the WAC to join the Southland for a third time - and McNeese, which would only be in as a last resort since they are in Louisiana.

A raid or merger on the Missouri Valley Football Conference might be viable, but it pretty much requires the Pac-12 to slice off the correct half of the Mountain West. NDSU and Missouri State might be willing to go to Wyoming or New Mexico, but San Jose and Fresno would likely be a bridge too far.

Some combination of Sacramento State, UC Davis, and Cal Poly would probably be welcome, it's just a question of whether those schools are willing/able to move up. Right now Sacramento State is the only one with a large enough stadium, not that the others are that far behind. Sacramento would also have an easier time leaving the Big Sky rather than the other schools in the more compact Big West - the Hornets are already traveling in the Mountain and Pacific Time Zones in conference play anyway. If Boise State is one of the ones left behind, they will insist on a California presence in the conference. I can't see any other Big West schools moving up barring a "whale" donation.

Montana and Montana State would probably be the best fits from an institutional standpoint, but they passed on moving up before. Does having CFP access change the equation for them?

Idaho and Weber State would likely be ready to move up from the Big Sky - after all, Idaho was FBS not that long ago - but are the schools interested?

Eastern Washington, Portland State, Idaho State, Northern Arizona, and Northern Colorado are out of the question. I also can't see the Mountain West reaching into the bag for Southern Utah or Utah Tech; the Big Sky might also have to be fairly banged up to take them as well, especially since they would be taking Southern Utah back.

University of San Diego would be a huge stretch in that they would need to go from 0 to 85 scholarships (plus any new sports on the women's side), as well as expand the small Torero Stadium (6,000), but at least they have a program. USD might also be willing to get out of Gonzaga's shadow, but is that worth $10 million (or more) each year?

1. UTEP
2. NMSU
3 . Texas State
3. Sacramento State
4. Montana/Montana State
5. NDSU/SDSU

(05-04-2023 08:43 PM)chargeradio Wrote:  Montana and Montana State would probably be the best fits from an institutional standpoint, but they passed on moving up before. Does having CFP access change the equation for them?

Montana and MSU didn't move up before because when the WAC offered them they only wanted Montana, not MSU. We are a package deal. In terms of backfill scenarios:

1). NMSU and UTEP: Fit the geographical footprint, an In State Rival and have history with MWC teams.

2). UTEP and Texas State/UTA (if they start Football): Both AF and CSU have openly mentioned wanting more games in Texas, this would solve this.

3). Big Sky call ups. Montana and MSU have the facilities and fan support to be in the upper echelons of the MWC along with fitting the geographical footprint and being State Flagship Universities. Best 2 options for the MWC.

After that the best options would be Sac State (would have to upgrade basketball facility, may face pushback from Fresno), UC-Davis (would have to upgrade facilities) and NAU being my dark horse pick. Lumberjacks would get the MWC into Arizona and they'd also fit geographically well, but have to upgrade their facilities.

The rest of the Conference either would saturate an existing media market (Weber State and Idaho) or don't have the facilities or funds to make the move.

4). Other FCS Callups/FBS options. Sam Houston State, SFA, NDSU and SDSU. Both Texas schools could be backups if one or more Texas schools don't pan out (huge mistake of the MWC not going after UTSA). NDSU and SDSU are the bluebloods of FCS football currently and consistently. They would bring some attention to the MWC.

(05-04-2023 08:43 PM)chargeradio Wrote:  If the Mountain West were to find itself needing to add schools, who would be the most likely to be added?

New Mexico State and UTEP would probably be willing to leave C-USA just for the reduced travel.

I have a hard time seeing the Mountain West go into the Central Time Zone as anything other than a last resort. While Louisiana Tech has some history with the WAC's later years as a FBS conference, I doubt either side would be interested. The Texas UAC schools may be a different story, but I think the Mountain West has to lose most of the West Division for that to happen. If UT-Arlington restarts football, I think they could be on the table just because of the ease of flying to Dallas-Fort Worth.

I don't see any viable candidates in the Southland other than perhaps Lamar - which just ran away from the WAC to join the Southland for a third time - and McNeese, which would only be in as a last resort since they are in Louisiana.

A raid or merger on the Missouri Valley Football Conference might be viable, but it pretty much requires the Pac-12 to slice off the correct half of the Mountain West. NDSU and Missouri State might be willing to go to Wyoming or New Mexico, but San Jose and Fresno would likely be a bridge too far.

Some combination of Sacramento State, UC Davis, and Cal Poly would probably be welcome, it's just a question of whether those schools are willing/able to move up. Right now Sacramento State is the only one with a large enough stadium, not that the others are that far behind. Sacramento would also have an easier time leaving the Big Sky rather than the other schools in the more compact Big West - the Hornets are already traveling in the Mountain and Pacific Time Zones in conference play anyway. If Boise State is one of the ones left behind, they will insist on a California presence in the conference. I can't see any other Big West schools moving up barring a "whale" donation.

Montana and Montana State would probably be the best fits from an institutional standpoint, but they passed on moving up before. Does having CFP access change the equation for them?

Idaho and Weber State would likely be ready to move up from the Big Sky - after all, Idaho was FBS not that long ago - but are the schools interested?

Eastern Washington, Portland State, Idaho State, Northern Arizona, and Northern Colorado are out of the question. I also can't see the Mountain West reaching into the bag for Southern Utah or Utah Tech; the Big Sky might also have to be fairly banged up to take them as well, especially since they would be taking Southern Utah back.

University of San Diego would be a huge stretch in that they would need to go from 0 to 85 scholarships (plus any new sports on the women's side), as well as expand the small Torero Stadium (6,000), but at least they have a program. USD might also be willing to get out of Gonzaga's shadow, but is that worth $10 million (or more) each year?

FBS CUSA
UTEP
NMSU

FCS BSC
Montana & Montana State
*Package Deal

Sac St.
*CA replacement for SDSU

Weber St.
*Regional Fit
*Travel partner for USU

I think that NMSU is getting over valued here simply because ‘they’re already FBS’. They don’t add any real value to the MWC in terms of tv revenue, recruiting, football competitiveness, or too good to pass up value in any other sport. Realignment history would show that you need at least one of these attributes to be considered. I also think the Lobos would fight tooth and nail to keep them out.

1. UTEP - not sure that they add much more than NMSU, but they at least have a pulse in football some years and are in Texas and a more populated area.

2. Big Sky team/s of choice - I don’t think a call-up from FCS is below the MWCs status. A school that is committed to athletics even at a lower level tends to be more successful than an established school that has had time to build a program at FBS and is still terrible most years. Which school or schools they pick is debatable, but Montana, Montana St, Sac St seem most likely. Idaho is NMSUs northern brother so it’d be silly of me to include them after what I said about the Aggies. NAU and Weber need some work but I think long term could make the jump successfully.

Some combination of Utep,NMSU,Texas State and Sam Houston State.

First tier:
1. Texas State (if the AAC doesn’t invite them first), possibly paired with UT Arlington as a non-football travel partner - Would get the MWC back into the Texas Triangle
2. UTEP - Good geographic fit and extensive past history with current MWC members

Second tier:
3. New Mexico State - Solid hoops program and good travel partner for UTEP
4. Montana paired with Montana State - Top two FCS programs in the western third of the country

Third tier:
5. Sam Houston State - Logical invitee for an expanded Texas presence
6. North Dakota State - Might be attractive as a football-only addition

Break glass in case of emergency:
7. UC Davis - Need to expand their football stadium
8. Sac State - Need to build a basketball arena
9. Idaho - Welcome back to FBS!

(05-05-2023 03:57 AM)HawaiiMongoose Wrote:  First tier:
1. Texas State (if the AAC doesn’t invite them first), possibly paired with UT Arlington as a non-football travel partner - Would get the MWC back into the Texas Triangle
2. UTEP - Good geographic fit and extensive past history with current MWC members

Second tier:
3. New Mexico State - Solid hoops program and good travel partner for UTEP
4. Montana paired with Montana State - Top two FCS programs in the western third of the country

Third tier:
5. Sam Houston State - Logical invitee for an expanded Texas presence
6. North Dakota State - Might be attractive as a football-only addition

Break glass in case of emergency:
7. UC Davis - Need to expand their football stadium
8. Sac State - Need to build a basketball arena
9. Idaho - Welcome back to FBS!

I think it's important to remember that university Presidents make these decisions not athletic directors or coaches.

My point being that the MWC likely won't invite schools that have no history, no fanbase, don't own their market, etc. Just because they are in Texas likely won't mean squat. Recruiting certainly does play a part in conference affiliation as does having travel partners however adding schools in Texas isn't going to get your more recruits from that area if no one cares about the team that is playing there.

(05-05-2023 09:13 AM)NDSUguy Wrote:  

(05-05-2023 03:57 AM)HawaiiMongoose Wrote:  First tier:
1. Texas State (if the AAC doesn’t invite them first), possibly paired with UT Arlington as a non-football travel partner - Would get the MWC back into the Texas Triangle
2. UTEP - Good geographic fit and extensive past history with current MWC members

Second tier:
3. New Mexico State - Solid hoops program and good travel partner for UTEP
4. Montana paired with Montana State - Top two FCS programs in the western third of the country

Third tier:
5. Sam Houston State - Logical invitee for an expanded Texas presence
6. North Dakota State - Might be attractive as a football-only addition

Break glass in case of emergency:
7. UC Davis - Need to expand their football stadium
8. Sac State - Need to build a basketball arena
9. Idaho - Welcome back to FBS!

I think it's important to remember that university Presidents make these decisions not athletic directors or coaches.

My point being that the MWC likely won't invite schools that have no history, no fanbase, don't own their market, etc. Just because they are in Texas likely won't mean squat. Recruiting certainly does play a part in conference affiliation as does having travel partners however adding schools in Texas isn't going to get your more recruits from that area if no one cares about the team that is playing there.

SJSU had no history, no fan base, didn't own their market, and got invited over schools that did.

(05-05-2023 12:06 AM)Utgrizfan Wrote:  

(05-04-2023 08:43 PM)chargeradio Wrote:  Montana and Montana State would probably be the best fits from an institutional standpoint, but they passed on moving up before. Does having CFP access change the equation for them?

Montana and MSU didn't move up before because when the WAC offered them they only wanted Montana, not MSU. We are a package deal. In terms of backfill scenarios:

Would Idaho be a part of that package as well, ala' UNC, NCSU, & UVa??

I wouldn't rule out Washington State and Oregon State depending on what happens to the PAC.

(05-05-2023 03:05 AM)cottager Wrote:  I think that NMSU is getting over valued here simply because ‘they’re already FBS’. They don’t add any real value to the MWC in terms of tv revenue, recruiting, football competitiveness, or too good to pass up value in any other sport. Realignment history would show that you need at least one of these attributes to be considered. I also think the Lobos would fight tooth and nail to keep them out.

1. UTEP - not sure that they add much more than NMSU, but they at least have a pulse in football some years and are in Texas and a more populated area.

2. Big Sky team/s of choice - I don’t think a call-up from FCS is below the MWCs status. A school that is committed to athletics even at a lower level tends to be more successful than an established school that has had time to build a program at FBS and is still terrible most years. Which school or schools they pick is debatable, but Montana, Montana St, Sac St seem most likely. Idaho is NMSUs northern brother so it’d be silly of me to include them after what I said about the Aggies. NAU and Weber need some work but I think long term could make the jump successfully.

Why does this matter when referring to Texas. They might as well be in New Mexico. In fact they're further west than half of New Mexico.

(05-05-2023 09:13 AM)NDSUguy Wrote:  My point being that the MWC likely won't invite schools that have no history, no fanbase, don't own their market, etc. Just because they are in Texas likely won't mean squat. Recruiting certainly does play a part in conference affiliation as does having travel partners however adding schools in Texas isn't going to get your more recruits from that area if no one cares about the team that is playing there.

I have not seen conferences adhere to this principle very often in previous realignments.

I don't know if the MWC would really be interested in Texas State or not, but I don't think the "not" case can be dismissed this way. If they have an opening and they don't select Texas State, I'm confident that this will be used as justification after the fact (probably not by ADs but certainly by fans or posters on this board). It might even be partly true in a given case (even this one).

But you can't assume this is how it will be processed. For the simple reason that it hasn't worked this way (mostly) in the past.

(05-05-2023 10:44 AM)Bobcat2013 Wrote:  

(05-05-2023 03:05 AM)cottager Wrote:  I think that NMSU is getting over valued here simply because ‘they’re already FBS’. They don’t add any real value to the MWC in terms of tv revenue, recruiting, football competitiveness, or too good to pass up value in any other sport. Realignment history would show that you need at least one of these attributes to be considered. I also think the Lobos would fight tooth and nail to keep them out.

1. UTEP - not sure that they add much more than NMSU, but they at least have a pulse in football some years and are in Texas and a more populated area.

2. Big Sky team/s of choice - I don’t think a call-up from FCS is below the MWCs status. A school that is committed to athletics even at a lower level tends to be more successful than an established school that has had time to build a program at FBS and is still terrible most years. Which school or schools they pick is debatable, but Montana, Montana St, Sac St seem most likely. Idaho is NMSUs northern brother so it’d be silly of me to include them after what I said about the Aggies. NAU and Weber need some work but I think long term could make the jump successfully.

Why does this matter when referring to Texas. They might as well be in New Mexico. In fact they're further west than half of New Mexico.

I’m not sure it does. I didn’t mean it to read ‘in Texas’ as in it brings Texas recruiting. Just that if you’re looking at two schools less than 50 miles apart, the one in a different state than any of your current schools is more palatable than the one that is in NM. Not so much a selling point for UTEP, just not a negative.

Edit: none of this may matter. MWC might take both UTEP and NMSU or neither. I just think UTEP is a better candidate than NMSU.

(05-05-2023 03:57 AM)HawaiiMongoose Wrote:  4. Montana paired with Montana State - Top two FCS programs in the western third of the country

Added bonus: State representative Zooey Pataooey comes along for the ride!

(05-05-2023 03:05 AM)cottager Wrote:  I think that NMSU is getting over valued here simply because ‘they’re already FBS’. They don’t add any real value to the MWC in terms of tv revenue, recruiting, football competitiveness, or too good to pass up value in any other sport. Realignment history would show that you need at least one of these attributes to be considered. I also think the Lobos would fight tooth and nail to keep them out.

Even Dave Bliss and Art Briles would advise the MWC to hold off on NMSU for a while