(01-29-2023 07:47 PM)Pony94 Wrote:  

(01-29-2023 07:43 PM)IWokeUpLikeThis Wrote:  

(01-29-2023 07:22 PM)Yosef181 Wrote:  Oh look, another thread where people suggest several Sun Belt teams who weren't interested in the AAC in 2021.

Can you provide the link that "several Sun Belt teams weren't interested in the AAC in 2021"?

Georgia State is the one that supposedly turned us down. All of the others would have given their first born to join.

I'll say what I've been repeating for the last year or so, on many of these threads: if you look in the right places, you'll find the information.

For example, Matt Brown on Georgia State, after tweeting weeks earlier that the AAC's most discussed expansion targets were UAB and Georgia State: https://twitter.com/MattBrownEP/status/1...0069555200

That isn't the only school now in the SBC who chose not to pursue the AAC in 2021. One of them was set on being in a more regional conference, and hated playing a bunch of games in Texas (CUSA forum fans know who this is). There were concerns at other SBC schools about increasing their budgets to the level the AAC wanted.

As for Texas State, don't expect the AAC to add them as long as North Texas is there. I could drop a link for that one, but I've done it before on this forum, and it's somewhat easy to find if you know what you're looking for.


Things could always change, but that's where things stood in 2021, before the AAC announced 43% of their 2023 membership would be C-USA's 2022 members (that number jumps to 46% if SMU leaves).

(01-29-2023 12:33 PM)shizzle787 Wrote:  

(01-29-2023 12:28 PM)IWokeUpLikeThis Wrote:  

(01-29-2023 12:19 PM)ChrisLords Wrote:  

(01-29-2023 11:23 AM)shizzle787 Wrote:  does Navy consider going back to be independent? I don't know if their exit fee would be 7 (football-only) or 10 (all sports) million and if their TV earnings are 5 (football-only) or 7 (all sports) million, but if it is the former, why would they stay in the American?

Houston and SMU would be gone. Those two schools are a big reason why they joined the league in the first place. Yes, there is a potential playoff berth due the American, but without SMU, Cincy, Houston, and UCF, I believe the mantle passes to the Mountain West (even minus SDSU).

Also, unless Navy goes undefeated in the American, they probably lose out on a berth to an undefeated MW or Sun Belt team. Why go 13-0 when you only have to go 12-0? An undefeated independent Navy would get in the playoff if they played about 4 P5 schools.

If SMU leaves..... Say to the P12 with SDSU. So, the AAC only loses one. They'll either add UTEP, or Texas State, and the MWC takes the other, or stay at 13 anticipating future losses.

Navy wants access to states that are generally farther away from the Ocean or in Texas in particular. So I don't think Navy is going any where.

If there were massive losses to the AAC and MWC and they merged, I think that would be even better for Navy with all those land locked former MWC states.

UTEP is unlikely. UTEP isn’t in fertile recruiting ground and El Paso isn’t a strategic market for any members in the league. It unnecessarily stretches the footprint from Philadelphia to effectively New Mexico.

We saw with the last 6 AAC additions that markets and budgets will be prioritized. Texas St (Austin), Georgia St (Atlanta), Old Dominion (Norfolk) would be the schools that follow that template.

Do you think there is a possibility they go to 16 with the additions of Texas State and....Appalachian State and Marshall?

Texas State would move in a heartbeat and i wouldn't blame them. They are on an island in Texas and haven't lived up to their potential at all. Playing in state teams and primary rival UTSA every year might propel them forward.

AAC-SMU is a wash competitively for App and Marshall, and honestly a step down in fan engagement. Memphis and ECU are nice but its only a matter of time until Memphis moves on.

(01-30-2023 08:16 AM)Yosef181 Wrote:  

(01-29-2023 07:47 PM)Pony94 Wrote:  

(01-29-2023 07:43 PM)IWokeUpLikeThis Wrote:  

(01-29-2023 07:22 PM)Yosef181 Wrote:  Oh look, another thread where people suggest several Sun Belt teams who weren't interested in the AAC in 2021.

Can you provide the link that "several Sun Belt teams weren't interested in the AAC in 2021"?

Georgia State is the one that supposedly turned us down. All of the others would have given their first born to join.

I'll say what I've been repeating for the last year or so, on many of these threads: if you look in the right places, you'll find the information.

For example, Matt Brown on Georgia State, after tweeting weeks earlier that the AAC's most discussed expansion targets were UAB and Georgia State: https://twitter.com/MattBrownEP/status/1...0069555200

That isn't the only school now in the SBC who chose not to pursue the AAC in 2021. One of them was set on being in a more regional conference, and hated playing a bunch of games in Texas (CUSA forum fans know who this is). There were concerns at other SBC schools about increasing their budgets to the level the AAC wanted.

As for Texas State, don't expect the AAC to add them as long as North Texas is there. I could drop a link for that one, but I've done it before on this forum, and it's somewhat easy to find if you know what you're looking for.

You’re using some guy’s opinion as fact. Get real. GSU would have jumped at an offer.

(01-30-2023 08:26 AM)Owls9878 Wrote:  

(01-30-2023 08:16 AM)Yosef181 Wrote:  

(01-29-2023 07:47 PM)Pony94 Wrote:  

(01-29-2023 07:43 PM)IWokeUpLikeThis Wrote:  

(01-29-2023 07:22 PM)Yosef181 Wrote:  Oh look, another thread where people suggest several Sun Belt teams who weren't interested in the AAC in 2021.

Can you provide the link that "several Sun Belt teams weren't interested in the AAC in 2021"?

Georgia State is the one that supposedly turned us down. All of the others would have given their first born to join.

I'll say what I've been repeating for the last year or so, on many of these threads: if you look in the right places, you'll find the information.

For example, Matt Brown on Georgia State, after tweeting weeks earlier that the AAC's most discussed expansion targets were UAB and Georgia State: https://twitter.com/MattBrownEP/status/1...0069555200

That isn't the only school now in the SBC who chose not to pursue the AAC in 2021. One of them was set on being in a more regional conference, and hated playing a bunch of games in Texas (CUSA forum fans know who this is). There were concerns at other SBC schools about increasing their budgets to the level the AAC wanted.

As for Texas State, don't expect the AAC to add them as long as North Texas is there. I could drop a link for that one, but I've done it before on this forum, and it's somewhat easy to find if you know what you're looking for.

You’re using some guy’s opinion as fact. Get real. GSU would have jumped at an offer.

In 2021, they didn't.

So I take it there’s no links or credible sources that “several Sun Belt schools discussed in this thread weren’t interested in the AAC”. The only evidence provided is a tweet about Georgia St.

(01-30-2023 08:44 AM)IWokeUpLikeThis Wrote:  So I take it there’s no links or credible sources that “several Sun Belt schools discussed in this thread weren’t interested in the AAC”. The only evidence provided is a tweet about Georgia St.

Online mystery solved … Georgia state lies

(01-29-2023 02:41 PM)bill dazzle Wrote:  With this said, urban locations are a key part of the AAC focus. So the two schools that would make the most sense for the AAC, were SMU to leave — and that would have to strongly consider an invite: Old Dominion and Georgia State.

Reasonable post right up to the end. ODU was a terrible member in C-USA and openly advocated to split the conference while disparaging the western programs. That bad blood will linger. I see too many hard “no” votes for ODU. And Marshall, as another poster suggested.

(01-30-2023 08:48 AM)ESE84 Wrote:  

(01-29-2023 02:41 PM)bill dazzle Wrote:  With this said, urban locations are a key part of the AAC focus. So the two schools that would make the most sense for the AAC, were SMU to leave — and that would have to strongly consider an invite: Old Dominion and Georgia State.

Reasonable post right up to the end. ODU was a terrible member in C-USA and openly advocated to split the conference while disparaging the western programs. That bad blood will linger. I see too many hard “no” votes for ODU. And Marshall, as another poster suggested.

That's bull****. We never disparaged any western schools, you're making that **** up.

We did advocate a split and CUSA would have been better off now if it'd had happened. We definitely weren't the only ones nor the only unhappy eastern team.
Is that indicative e of US being poor conference mates? Seems like it indicates the opposite.

That's the past though. We're not leaving the SB east for the AAC. Best of luck to you but that's not for us. Maybe someday we'll advocate for the AAC to split too, but we won't be in that conference when we do it.

(01-30-2023 08:44 AM)IWokeUpLikeThis Wrote:  So I take it there’s no links or credible sources that “several Sun Belt schools discussed in this thread weren’t interested in the AAC”. The only evidence provided is a tweet about Georgia St.

THere were several reports at the time, and from Ga State sources.

Logically speaking it fits. The AAC wanted big market urban research schools with a commitment to facilities and budgets.

Georgia State vs UNCC on AAC requirements:
1. Atlanta > Charlotte TV market
2. R1 (Georgia State) > R2 (UNCC)
3. Facilities (Georgia State has brand new bball arena and updated FB stadium vs nice, but small FB stadium and multipurpose bball arena with indoor track and attached student rec center at UNCC.
4. budgets < UNCC by about 15%

so, if you were the president of a current AAC school, you're telling me you eschewed the better academic school with better facilities in the bigger TV market by choice?

(01-30-2023 08:44 AM)IWokeUpLikeThis Wrote:  So I take it there’s no links or credible sources that “several Sun Belt schools discussed in this thread weren’t interested in the AAC”. The only evidence provided is a tweet about Georgia St.

https://247sports.com/college/georgia-st...173428537/

(01-30-2023 08:48 AM)ESE84 Wrote:  

(01-29-2023 02:41 PM)bill dazzle Wrote:  With this said, urban locations are a key part of the AAC focus. So the two schools that would make the most sense for the AAC, were SMU to leave — and that would have to strongly consider an invite: Old Dominion and Georgia State.

Reasonable post right up to the end. ODU was a terrible member in C-USA and openly advocated to split the conference while disparaging the western programs. That bad blood will linger. I see too many hard “no” votes for ODU. And Marshall, as another poster suggested.

They were a divisive member. They were the only member of a conference not to play during the pandemic. I'm surprised the SBC was anxious to have them.

(01-30-2023 09:45 AM)ballantyneapp Wrote:  

(01-30-2023 08:44 AM)IWokeUpLikeThis Wrote:  So I take it there’s no links or credible sources that “several Sun Belt schools discussed in this thread weren’t interested in the AAC”. The only evidence provided is a tweet about Georgia St.

THere were several reports at the time, and from Ga State sources.

Logically speaking it fits. The AAC wanted big market urban research schools with a commitment to facilities and budgets.

Georgia State vs UNCC on AAC requirements:
1. Atlanta > Charlotte TV market
2. R1 (Georgia State) > R2 (UNCC)
3. Facilities (Georgia State has brand new bball arena and updated FB stadium vs nice, but small FB stadium and multipurpose bball arena with indoor track and attached student rec center at UNCC.
4. budgets < UNCC by about 15%

so, if you were the president of a current AAC school, you're telling me you eschewed the better academic school with better facilities in the bigger TV market by choice?

All this is true and worth noting. Good points.

However — and also worth noting: Charlotte has a history of sharing a league with current AAC members Memphis, East Carolina, Tulane and South Florida. Those previous relationships offer value to any prospective addition/member. They likely did for Charlotte.

In addition, Charlotte has achieved a modest level of "national notoriety" in one of the two major sports — men's hoops — having been to 11 NCAA tourneys (including a Final Four) and seven NITs (including as runner-up).

In contrast, Georgia State (if memory serves) has not previously shared a league home with any current AAC members and remains a relative unknown in both football and men's hoops.

Furthermore, Georgia State shares Atlanta with Georgia Tech. Charlotte is the only university with DI-A athletics in the Queen City.

So, yes, and to answer your question: Charlotte may have been (I'm not certain but I'm simply trying to be objective) the preferred choice over Georgia State.

Having said that, Georgia State would be a fine addition to the AAC. The school is worthy.

(01-30-2023 09:51 AM)Yosef181 Wrote:  

(01-30-2023 08:44 AM)IWokeUpLikeThis Wrote:  So I take it there’s no links or credible sources that “several Sun Belt schools discussed in this thread weren’t interested in the AAC”. The only evidence provided is a tweet about Georgia St.

https://247sports.com/college/georgia-st...173428537/

I'm not sure this proves with 100 percent certainty that Georgia State was "officially" not interested in the AAC. However, I do put full stock in Matt's reporting. He's a pro. So, yes, GSU admins may very well have been not interested. In contrast, the article suggests many fans were extremely hopeful of an AAC invite. That's worth a lot.

(01-30-2023 09:58 AM)bill dazzle Wrote:  

(01-30-2023 09:45 AM)ballantyneapp Wrote:  

(01-30-2023 08:44 AM)IWokeUpLikeThis Wrote:  So I take it there’s no links or credible sources that “several Sun Belt schools discussed in this thread weren’t interested in the AAC”. The only evidence provided is a tweet about Georgia St.

THere were several reports at the time, and from Ga State sources.

Logically speaking it fits. The AAC wanted big market urban research schools with a commitment to facilities and budgets.

Georgia State vs UNCC on AAC requirements:
1. Atlanta > Charlotte TV market
2. R1 (Georgia State) > R2 (UNCC)
3. Facilities (Georgia State has brand new bball arena and updated FB stadium vs nice, but small FB stadium and multipurpose bball arena with indoor track and attached student rec center at UNCC.
4. budgets < UNCC by about 15%

so, if you were the president of a current AAC school, you're telling me you eschewed the better academic school with better facilities in the bigger TV market by choice?

All this is true and worth noting. Good points.

However — and also worth noting: Charlotte has a history of sharing a league with current AAC members Memphis, East Carolina, Tulane and South Florida. Those previous relationships offer value to any prospective addition/member. They likely did for Charlotte.

In addition, Charlotte has achieved a modest level of "national notoriety" in one of the two major sports — men's hoops — having been to 11 NCAA tourneys (including a Final Four) and seven NITs (including as runner-up).

In contrast, Georgia State (if memory serves) has not previously shared a league home with any current AAC members and remains a relative unknown in both football and men's hoops.

Furthermore, Georgia State shares Atlanta with Georgia Tech. Charlotte is the only university with DI-A athletics in the Queen City.

So, yes, and to answer your question: Charlotte may have been (I'm not certain but I'm simply trying to be objective) the preferred choice over Georgia State.

Having said that, Georgia State would be a fine addition to the AAC. The school is worthy.

True. I think UNCC was kicked out of CUSA 1.0 circa early 2000s? How many admins are left that remember them? Maybe the shared history was worth something to the sitting presidents.

True also that UNCC has a more robust basketball history, but its just that, history. Uncc hasn't been to the dance in coming on 20 years and Ga State has been 3 of the last 5 (probably 6 since they don't look good this year). Take away their cinderella 1977 run and they have a handful of tourney bids and round of 32s, pretty comparable to Ga State really.

i'm happy if its true that AAC took UNCC instead of a willing Ga State. They made the AAC worse on average and let the SBC keep their own "potential giant".

(01-30-2023 08:47 AM)pablowow Wrote:  

(01-30-2023 08:44 AM)IWokeUpLikeThis Wrote:  So I take it there’s no links or credible sources that “several Sun Belt schools discussed in this thread weren’t interested in the AAC”. The only evidence provided is a tweet about Georgia St.

Online mystery solved … Georgia state lies

That's a little unfair. The Georgia State thing was reported on be Matt Brown, who is usually correct. It was also reported by Georgia State's own media people..

The disinterest from GSU was mostly financial. There was hesitation to raise budgets to AAC levels coming off the 2 years of Covid, along with the fact that the new AAC schools were only getting around 2m compared to the 7m the other AAC members receive annually. Add in the fact the Sunbelt was also planning to expand and ESPN was going to boost revenues for the entire conference. By the time GSU paid exit fees and entrance fees, the financials just wouldn't make sense..

Now, if they were approached again, the answer could be different now that things are back to normal, but who knows..

I also believe ESPN played a role. It's hard to believe that only a non-ESPN conference had the best 6 candidates..

(01-30-2023 10:09 AM)Tmac13 Wrote:  

(01-30-2023 08:47 AM)pablowow Wrote:  

(01-30-2023 08:44 AM)IWokeUpLikeThis Wrote:  So I take it there’s no links or credible sources that “several Sun Belt schools discussed in this thread weren’t interested in the AAC”. The only evidence provided is a tweet about Georgia St.

Online mystery solved … Georgia state lies

That's a little unfair. The Georgia State thing was reported on be Matt Brown, who is usually correct. It was also reported by Georgia State's own media people..

The disinterest from GSU was mostly financial. There was hesitation to raise budgets to AAC levels coming off the 2 years of Covid, along with the fact that the new AAC schools were only getting around 2m compared to the 7m the other AAC members receive annually. Add in the fact the Sunbelt was also planning to expand and ESPN was going to boost revenues for the entire conference. By the time GSU paid exit fees and entrance fees, the financials just wouldn't make sense..

Now, if they were approached again, the answer could be different now that things are back to normal, but who knows..

I also believe ESPN played a role. It's hard to believe that only a non-ESPN conference had the best 6 candidates..

not to mention $2MM in SBC east gives you more disposable cash then $2MM in AAC after travel.

Not to mention the threat of SMU & Memphis/USF leaving at the 1st available window. Worst case scenario of having AAC expenses with a vastly reduced buyout and exposure had to show up on the SWOT analysis.

(01-30-2023 10:21 AM)ballantyneapp Wrote:  

(01-30-2023 10:09 AM)Tmac13 Wrote:  

(01-30-2023 08:47 AM)pablowow Wrote:  

(01-30-2023 08:44 AM)IWokeUpLikeThis Wrote:  So I take it there’s no links or credible sources that “several Sun Belt schools discussed in this thread weren’t interested in the AAC”. The only evidence provided is a tweet about Georgia St.

Online mystery solved … Georgia state lies

That's a little unfair. The Georgia State thing was reported on be Matt Brown, who is usually correct. It was also reported by Georgia State's own media people..

The disinterest from GSU was mostly financial. There was hesitation to raise budgets to AAC levels coming off the 2 years of Covid, along with the fact that the new AAC schools were only getting around 2m compared to the 7m the other AAC members receive annually. Add in the fact the Sunbelt was also planning to expand and ESPN was going to boost revenues for the entire conference. By the time GSU paid exit fees and entrance fees, the financials just wouldn't make sense..

Now, if they were approached again, the answer could be different now that things are back to normal, but who knows..

I also believe ESPN played a role. It's hard to believe that only a non-ESPN conference had the best 6 candidates..

not to mention $2MM in SBC east gives you more disposable cash then $2MM in AAC after travel.

Not to mention the threat of SMU & Memphis/USF leaving at the 1st available window. Worst case scenario of having AAC expenses with a vastly reduced buyout and exposure had to show up on the SWOT analysis.

That part isn't brought up enough. App only travels by plane to 1 SBC game per season. The rest of it is by bus. It saves the schools (in both divisions) a ton of money, and it can't be done in the AAC.

(01-30-2023 10:27 AM)Yosef181 Wrote:  

(01-30-2023 10:21 AM)ballantyneapp Wrote:  

(01-30-2023 10:09 AM)Tmac13 Wrote:  

(01-30-2023 08:47 AM)pablowow Wrote:  

(01-30-2023 08:44 AM)IWokeUpLikeThis Wrote:  So I take it there’s no links or credible sources that “several Sun Belt schools discussed in this thread weren’t interested in the AAC”. The only evidence provided is a tweet about Georgia St.

Online mystery solved … Georgia state lies

That's a little unfair. The Georgia State thing was reported on be Matt Brown, who is usually correct. It was also reported by Georgia State's own media people..

The disinterest from GSU was mostly financial. There was hesitation to raise budgets to AAC levels coming off the 2 years of Covid, along with the fact that the new AAC schools were only getting around 2m compared to the 7m the other AAC members receive annually. Add in the fact the Sunbelt was also planning to expand and ESPN was going to boost revenues for the entire conference. By the time GSU paid exit fees and entrance fees, the financials just wouldn't make sense..

Now, if they were approached again, the answer could be different now that things are back to normal, but who knows..

I also believe ESPN played a role. It's hard to believe that only a non-ESPN conference had the best 6 candidates..

not to mention $2MM in SBC east gives you more disposable cash then $2MM in AAC after travel.

Not to mention the threat of SMU & Memphis/USF leaving at the 1st available window. Worst case scenario of having AAC expenses with a vastly reduced buyout and exposure had to show up on the SWOT analysis.

That part isn't brought up enough. App only travels by plane to 1 SBC game per season. The rest of it is by bus. It saves the schools (in both divisions) a ton of money, and it can't be done in the AAC.

There is a lot of truth in this. I think the net revenue (after travel) from the TV deals is probably about the same, but the AAC offers more well-known brands (Navy, USF, Temple, Memphis, Tulane) than the Sun Belt as a whole.

(01-30-2023 10:27 AM)Yosef181 Wrote:  

(01-30-2023 10:21 AM)ballantyneapp Wrote:  

(01-30-2023 10:09 AM)Tmac13 Wrote:  

(01-30-2023 08:47 AM)pablowow Wrote:  

(01-30-2023 08:44 AM)IWokeUpLikeThis Wrote:  So I take it there’s no links or credible sources that “several Sun Belt schools discussed in this thread weren’t interested in the AAC”. The only evidence provided is a tweet about Georgia St.

Online mystery solved … Georgia state lies

That's a little unfair. The Georgia State thing was reported on be Matt Brown, who is usually correct. It was also reported by Georgia State's own media people..

The disinterest from GSU was mostly financial. There was hesitation to raise budgets to AAC levels coming off the 2 years of Covid, along with the fact that the new AAC schools were only getting around 2m compared to the 7m the other AAC members receive annually. Add in the fact the Sunbelt was also planning to expand and ESPN was going to boost revenues for the entire conference. By the time GSU paid exit fees and entrance fees, the financials just wouldn't make sense..

Now, if they were approached again, the answer could be different now that things are back to normal, but who knows..

I also believe ESPN played a role. It's hard to believe that only a non-ESPN conference had the best 6 candidates..

not to mention $2MM in SBC east gives you more disposable cash then $2MM in AAC after travel.

Not to mention the threat of SMU & Memphis/USF leaving at the 1st available window. Worst case scenario of having AAC expenses with a vastly reduced buyout and exposure had to show up on the SWOT analysis.

That part isn't brought up enough. App only travels by plane to 1 SBC game per season. The rest of it is by bus. It saves the schools (in both divisions) a ton of money, and it can't be done in the AAC.

not to mention putting yourself at a huge competitive disadvantage by signing up to make 33-50% of what your direct competitors make. You would have to be desperate (and everyone in CUSA was) to sign up for that.

(01-29-2023 11:40 AM)bill dazzle Wrote:  

(01-29-2023 11:23 AM)shizzle787 Wrote:  does Navy consider going back to be independent? I don't know if their exit fee would be 7 (football-only) or 10 (all sports) million and if their TV earnings are 5 (football-only) or 7 (all sports) million, but if it is the former, why would they stay in the American?

Houston and SMU would be gone. Those two schools are a big reason why they joined the league in the first place. Yes, there is a potential playoff berth due the American, but without SMU, Cincy, Houston, and UCF, I believe the mantle passes to the Mountain West (even minus SDSU).

Also, unless Navy goes undefeated in the American, they probably lose out on a berth to an undefeated MW or Sun Belt team. Why go 13-0 when you only have to go 12-0? An undefeated independent Navy would get in the playoff if they played about 4 P5 schools.

My understanding is different. Navy seemingly wanted the AAC to have members in Texas (for recruiting purposes). So though Houston is leaving and even if SMU departs, the American will offer Rice, UTSA and North Texas. Will that be sufficient for Navy? I tend to think so.

And other solid enrollment recruiting areas with Tulsa, Memphis, and Tulane.