Since a lot of discussion in recent days revolves around finding more ways to make the ACC stronger and more profitable. I found the recent piece on Backing The Pack interesting:

https://www.backingthepack.com/2022/12/1...ll-college

The general premise of the article is that the courent double bye single elimination format does not help the league get more NCAA Tourney bids in the current selection environment. And that the Tourney Format may actually hurt potential NCAA teams. Basically, potential NCAA teams (seeds 5-8) are more likely to hurt their NCAA odds than benefit.

The current format is a 5 round - 14 game tournament stretched over 5 days with all conference members participating. The current setup requires the bottom 6 teams to go on a practically impossible
5 day 5 game winning streak. Along the way the lower round matches are not likely to be considered resume builders.

Imagine if a modified ACC Baseball Tourney Format was used with just the Top 12 league teams using 4 3-team pods, with the pod winners engaging in a single elimination semis and championship. The new format can stay in the same five day period. The new format yields an extra game to sell to the networks. The middle teams get a better chance to add likely Q1 and Q2 victories to their tourney resume.

Keeping the double elimination after pod play 3-4 tourney games, but could be harder to keep in a 5 day time period.

The whole is more potential resume games for ACC bubble teams to boost conference profile. More televised games to boost network tv earnings. Only drawback is ACC bottom teams no longer have Cinderella's chance, which the current ACC format already kills in practical effect.

Any thoughts by others.

The ACC needs to consider any and every way to generate more revenue. Basketball should not be immune to this.

Why not just go to a normal format where the 1st round is 2-15, 3-14, 4-13, ..., 8-9 with only the top seed getting a bye to the QF's? It's an extra game for the #2-4 seeds but they're against the lousy teams in the conference. No one then has to win more than 4 games to win the tournament. To reward seeds 2, 3, and 4, let them play the first day of the tournament and seeds 5-12 the second day. Then the QF's are on the 3rd day. The #1 seed obviously gets a bye vs. the 8-9 winner. The 2 seed (assuming it wins) won't have a bye but will have a day of rest the 7-10 winner won't have. If the 15 seed upsets the 2 seed then they get the day of rest. Same with the 3-14 and 4-13 winners.

Day 1 (Tuesday?)
2 vs. 15, 3 vs. 14, 4 vs. 13

Day 2 (Wednesday?)
5 vs. 12, 6 vs. 11, 7 vs. 10, 8 vs. 9

Day 3 (Thursday?)
1 vs. 8-9, 2-15 vs. 7-10, 3-14 vs. 6-11, 4-13 vs. 5-12

Day 4 (Friday?)
SF

Day 5 (Saturday?)
Championship

(12-20-2022 12:04 PM)schmolik Wrote:  Why not just go to a normal format where the 1st round is 2-15, 3-14, 4-13, ..., 8-9 with only the top seed getting a bye to the QF's? It's an extra game for the #2-4 seeds but they're against the lousy teams in the conference. No one then has to win more than 4 games to win the tournament. To reward seeds 2, 3, and 4, let them play the first day of the tournament and seeds 5-12 the second day. Then the QF's are on the 3rd day. The #1 seed obviously gets a bye vs. the 8-9 winner. The 2 seed (assuming it wins) won't have a bye but will have a day of rest the 7-10 winner won't have. If the 15 seed upsets the 2 seed then they get the day of rest. Same with the 3-14 and 4-13 winners.

Day 1 (Tuesday?)
2 vs. 15, 3 vs. 14, 4 vs. 13

Day 2 (Wednesday?)
5 vs. 12, 6 vs. 11, 7 vs. 10, 8 vs. 9

Day 3 (Thursday?)
1 vs. 8-9, 2-15 vs. 7-10, 3-14 vs. 6-11, 4-13 vs. 5-12

Day 4 (Friday?)
SF

Day 5 (Saturday?)
Championship

This is almost the same as an idea I posted in 2019:
https://accbasketballrx.blogspot.com/201...ament.html

The only difference in my plan was to play the first round at 2 different sites in order to sell more tickets - then have the final 8 teams move to a third site for the quarterfinals, semifinals, and final. (OK, that might be a bit TOO ambitious!)

This is the physical numerical evolution of the ACC basketball tournament.

21 - 13 league teams 26 school tourney
22 - 19 league teams 26 school tourney
23 - 21 league teams 16 school tourney
24 - 21 league teams 22 school tourney
25 - 22 league teams 16 school tourney
26 - 22 league teams 14 school tourney
27 - 21 league teams 16 school tourney
28 - 23 league teams 16 school tourney
29 - Same
30 - Same
31 - Same
32 - Same
Future SEC 13 pull out
33 - 10 league teams 8 school tourney
34 - Same
35 - Same
36 - Same
37 - Same
38 - 16 league teams 8 school tourney
39 - Same
40 - Same
41 - Same
42 - Same
43 - Same
44 - Same
45 - Same
46 - Same
47 - Same
48 - Same
49 - Same
50 - Same
51 - 17 league teams - 8 team tourney
52 - Same
53 - Same
Future ACC 7 pull out
54 - 8 league teams - 8 team tourney - it would stay this way until 1972 unless a team was on probation and did not play.

IIRC there is evidence to suggest that the battle to win the ACC tourney has a very negative effect on the NCAA performance of the two finalists.

When the ACC Tournament mattered it mattered.

How about this:

Monday Night - Always in Greensboro 10/9 and 14/5
Tuesday Night - Always in Charlotte 11/8, 12/7, and 13/6
Wed Rest

Thursday - Quarters
Friday - Semi
Saturday - Final

The final 7 games location rotates to Atlanta, NYC, DC, etc., could be in Charlotte or Greensboro but no more than once every 4 years.

(12-20-2022 08:02 PM)SouthernConfBoy Wrote:  IIRC there is evidence to suggest that the battle to win the ACC tourney has a very negative effect on the NCAA performance of the two finalists.

When the ACC Tournament mattered it mattered.

How about this:

Monday Night - Always in Greensboro 10/9 and 14/5
Tuesday Night - Always in Charlotte 11/8, 12/7, and 13/6
Wed Rest

Thursday - Quarters
Friday - Semi
Saturday - Final

The final 7 games location rotates to Atlanta, NYC, DC, etc., could be in Charlotte or Greensboro but no more than once every 4 years.

Changing locations during the tournament does not seem like a cost effective solution, and more likely to generate more costs than revenue benefits. I think 5 days in one location is better unless the ACC tourney is spread across two weekends.

Spreading the tournament across two weekends could be interesting because is may allow for better overall attendence, by not starting in the middle of a work week. Combine that with favorable winter destinations. That may be profitable.

If you want to help the league with hoops revenue go back to a double round robin against regional foes as the core of the schedule.

Home and home against 6 or 7 teams. Play everybody else once. However, given what a disaster picking 3 permanent rivals was in football, I don't have much confidence in the current ACC being able to do a good job of this.

(12-20-2022 09:27 PM)AeroWolf Wrote:  

(12-20-2022 08:02 PM)SouthernConfBoy Wrote:  IIRC there is evidence to suggest that the battle to win the ACC tourney has a very negative effect on the NCAA performance of the two finalists.

When the ACC Tournament mattered it mattered.

How about this:

Monday Night - Always in Greensboro 10/9 and 14/5
Tuesday Night - Always in Charlotte 11/8, 12/7, and 13/6
Wed Rest

Thursday - Quarters
Friday - Semi
Saturday - Final

The final 7 games location rotates to Atlanta, NYC, DC, etc., could be in Charlotte or Greensboro but no more than once every 4 years.

Changing locations during the tournament does not seem like a cost effective solution, and more likely to generate more costs than revenue benefits. I think 5 days in one location is better unless the ACC tourney is spread across two weekends.

Spreading the tournament across two weekends could be interesting because is may allow for better overall attendence, by not starting in the middle of a work week. Combine that with favorable winter destinations. That may be profitable.

If you spread the tournament over two weekends, does it really matter if it is in two locations or one? The travel is the same for most schools.

Ideally the ACC should go back to the championship on Sunday like the Big Ten and SEC so the semifinals are on SF as it gives them two rounds on the weekends. But I've found the NCAA often doesn't care about Sunday final results. Of course, I find the NCAA doesn't care about tournament results at all. Last year, Virginia Tech won the ACC and got a #11 seed. 2021 Georgia Tech was a #9 seed.

(12-21-2022 10:30 AM)schmolik Wrote:  

(12-20-2022 09:27 PM)AeroWolf Wrote:  

(12-20-2022 08:02 PM)SouthernConfBoy Wrote:  IIRC there is evidence to suggest that the battle to win the ACC tourney has a very negative effect on the NCAA performance of the two finalists.

When the ACC Tournament mattered it mattered.

How about this:

Monday Night - Always in Greensboro 10/9 and 14/5
Tuesday Night - Always in Charlotte 11/8, 12/7, and 13/6
Wed Rest

Thursday - Quarters
Friday - Semi
Saturday - Final

The final 7 games location rotates to Atlanta, NYC, DC, etc., could be in Charlotte or Greensboro but no more than once every 4 years.

Changing locations during the tournament does not seem like a cost effective solution, and more likely to generate more costs than revenue benefits. I think 5 days in one location is better unless the ACC tourney is spread across two weekends.

Spreading the tournament across two weekends could be interesting because is may allow for better overall attendence, by not starting in the middle of a work week. Combine that with favorable winter destinations. That may be profitable.

If you spread the tournament over two weekends, does it really matter if it is in two locations or one? The travel is the same for most schools.

Ideally the ACC should go back to the championship on Sunday like the Big Ten and SEC so the semifinals are on SF as it gives them two rounds on the weekends. But I've found the NCAA often doesn't care about Sunday final results. Of course, I find the NCAA doesn't care about tournament results at all. Last year, Virginia Tech won the ACC and got a #11 seed. 2021 Georgia Tech was a #9 seed.

I agree that spreading out the tourney games over two weekends makes multiple locations more feasible.

I thought the main reason the ACC tournament changed it's Sunday Final to Saturday was a concession to media partner ESPN so they could run their Selection Sunday programming. I think it would be better to go back to a Sunday finish, but we would have to get the mouse to agree.

(12-21-2022 10:30 AM)schmolik Wrote:  

(12-20-2022 09:27 PM)AeroWolf Wrote:  

(12-20-2022 08:02 PM)SouthernConfBoy Wrote:  IIRC there is evidence to suggest that the battle to win the ACC tourney has a very negative effect on the NCAA performance of the two finalists.

When the ACC Tournament mattered it mattered.

How about this:

Monday Night - Always in Greensboro 10/9 and 14/5
Tuesday Night - Always in Charlotte 11/8, 12/7, and 13/6
Wed Rest

Thursday - Quarters
Friday - Semi
Saturday - Final

The final 7 games location rotates to Atlanta, NYC, DC, etc., could be in Charlotte or Greensboro but no more than once every 4 years.

Changing locations during the tournament does not seem like a cost effective solution, and more likely to generate more costs than revenue benefits. I think 5 days in one location is better unless the ACC tourney is spread across two weekends.

Spreading the tournament across two weekends could be interesting because is may allow for better overall attendence, by not starting in the middle of a work week. Combine that with favorable winter destinations. That may be profitable.

If you spread the tournament over two weekends, does it really matter if it is in two locations or one? The travel is the same for most schools.

Ideally the ACC should go back to the championship on Sunday like the Big Ten and SEC so the semifinals are on SF as it gives them two rounds on the weekends. But I've found the NCAA often doesn't care about Sunday final results. Of course, I find the NCAA doesn't care about tournament results at all. Last year, Virginia Tech won the ACC and got a #11 seed. 2021 Georgia Tech was a #9 seed.

Thats because the selection committee still considers heavily, a teams overall body of work and not just the conference tourney results. Those years GT had 8 losses in a shortened season and VT had 12 losses for the season. Having 12 losses in a season, a team should be happy to even be selected.

The ACC moved to Saturday beginning in 2015. My assumption was it is a replacement for the Big East.

https://www.syracuse.com/orangebasketbal...night.html

Currently that other conference has the 1pm ET Sunday slot on ESPN. Maybe they could air on ABC.