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You have to consider the opponent when determining how well the offense and defense played. FWIW, I don't care if we score 3 or 10, we still scored less than them. If we kicked a FG to aboid the shoutout, that doesn't make me feel better. They were always going to be difficult to score on and turning the ball over 4 times isn't going to win games.

Offensively, we gained 209 yards on 60 plays, which is bad. We are a bad offense facing a great defense. Here are the game logs for Marshalls defense:

114 yards, 2.5 ypp
351 yards, 4.7 ypp
377 yards, 5.1 ypp
421 yards, 7.5 ypp
143 yards, 2.8 ypp
338 yards, 5.4 ypp
247 yards, 3.4 ypp
271 yards, 3.9 ypp
209 yards, 3.5 ypp (us)

Outside of a 3 game stretch, the defense hasn't given up anything of note. They are statistically a top 5 defense in the country and we are somewhere around the 90-100 range.

I disagree that this was one of the best defensive performances. It was ok and giving up only 12 is notable, but they gave up 387 yards and 4.8 ypp to the worst offense in the country. The defense did keep us in the game, but they should have against an offense as pathetic as the Marshall offense.

Our defense is certainly significantly better than the offense, but it needs to improve greatly before we call it anywhere close to a great defense.

Not really trying to knock the defense, its good enough if we have a great offense, but right now we need to improve on both sides of the ball. We are still young and I like the level of talent that Rahne and company have brought in, but it needs to translate on the field next year.

(11-07-2022 03:43 PM)Stat Geek Wrote:  I disagree that this was one of the best defensive performances. It was ok and giving up only 12 is notable, but they gave up 387 yards and 4.8 ypp to the worst offense in the country. The defense did keep us in the game, but they should have against an offense as pathetic as the Marshall offense.

Context matters. The defense was constantly being put in awful positions by the offense, given short breaks (we only had the ball for 21 minutes, had 5 three and outs, and turned it over on 3 drives that had fewer than 4 plays) and continued to keep Marshall out of the endzone. The defense and our special teams is the only reason why we were still in the game in the 4th Quarter. The only comparable games in our FBS history are Charlotte in 2017 and EMU in 2014.

We shut Charlotte out, only scored 6 points on offense and held them to 231 yards. But that Charlotte team was atrocious, only managed 1 win on the season and were held to 7 or fewer points 5 times. We also outgained them by almost 100 yards, and owned the time of possession battle in that game, holding the ball for 39 of the 60 minutes.

Against EMU, we held them to 3 points, 215 yards, and turned them over 4 times. But we also scored 17, moved the ball extremely well and outgained them by 160 yards. That EMU team was also atrocious, they went 2-10 and were held under 10 points 5 times. Time of possession was fairly close in this one with ODU having the ball for 28 of the 60 minutes.

The performance against Marshall stands up with the best we have ever had on defense.

We put the defense in bad spots a couple times for sure, but the defense also gave up:

14 plays for 76 yards, chewing up 6:28
9 plays for 63 yards, chewing up 3:59

Neither one of those are the offenses fault. I don't expect the defense to completely shut down the offense all together, but Marshalls offense is so bad, that we should have been better.

I cant call giving up 387 yards and 20 first downs against a poor offense with a backup QB all that great.

Last year against Florida Atlantic, we gave up 308 yards and 13 first downs. They weren't a great offense but significantly better than Marshalls.

In 2019, we gave up 244 yards and 14 first downs to UVA.

In 2017, we gave up 231 yards and 8 first downs vs. Charlotte. There offense was rated somewhat similar to Marshalls this year

IN 2016, we gave up 342 yards and 21 first downs to an outstanding UTSA offense.

In 2016, they gave up 214 yards and 10 first downs to Marshall

In 2016, they gave up 232 yards and 16 first downs to FIU

Besides the EMU game in 2014, they gave up 326 and 19 first downs to a good LT team.

I cant support it being the best defense when they couldn't get a bad Marshall offense off the field. And Marshall had no need to do anything that carried any risk at all bc they knew we couldn't move the ball.

(11-07-2022 05:29 PM)Stat Geek Wrote:  Last year against Florida Atlantic, we gave up 308 yards and 13 first downs. They weren't a great offense but significantly better than Marshalls.

Our offense scored 30 points, amassed 447 yards, and held the ball for 37 minutes.

In 2019, we gave up 244 yards and 14 first downs to UVA.

The defense gave up 21 points while the offense outgained UVA and held the ball for 35 minutes.

In 2017, we gave up 231 yards and 8 first downs vs. Charlotte. There offense was rated somewhat similar to Marshalls this year

I covered this already but I'll say it again. That Charlotte team was atrocious, only managed 1 win on the season and were held to 7 or fewer points 5 times that season. We also outgained them by almost 100 yards and owned the time of possession battle in that game, holding the ball for 39 of the 60 minutes.

IN 2016, we gave up 342 yards and 21 first downs to an outstanding UTSA offense.

Our offense had 442 yards and won the time of possession battle with 32 minutes. UTSA still managed to score 19 on us and were coming off a P5 game where they had to turn around and travel to Norfolk.

In 2016, they gave up 214 yards and 10 first downs to Marshall

That Marshall team was 3-9, we scored 38 (21 in the first half and 31 in the first three quarters, making them one dimensional on offense), rolled up over 400 yards of offense on them and we held the ball for 35 minutes of the game.


In 2016, they gave up 232 yards and 16 first downs to FIU

FIU still managed to score 28 points in that game, one in which we managed to score 42 and amass over 500 yards of offense.

Besides the EMU game in 2014, they gave up 326 and 19 first downs to a good LT team.

LT scored 27 in that game, ODUs offense had close to 400 yards, 30 points and won the time of possession battle with 33 minutes.

I cant support it being the best defense when they couldn't get a bad Marshall offense off the field. And Marshall had no need to do anything that carried any risk at all bc they knew we couldn't move the ball.

Context matters, rebuttals in bold. More importantly, I never said this was the best defense. I said the Marshall game is arguably the best single game defensive performance we've seen at ODU in FBS. And given we got so little from the offense and that in all of your examples, our offense actually was successful, I stand by it.

(11-08-2022 01:26 PM)ODUDrunkard13 Wrote:  

(11-07-2022 05:29 PM)Stat Geek Wrote:  Last year against Florida Atlantic, we gave up 308 yards and 13 first downs. They weren't a great offense but significantly better than Marshalls.

Our offense scored 30 points, amassed 447 yards, and held the ball for 37 minutes.




In 2019, we gave up 244 yards and 14 first downs to UVA.

[b]The defense gave up 21 points while the offense outgained UVA and held the ball for 35 minutes.

In 2017, we gave up 231 yards and 8 first downs vs. Charlotte. There offense was rated somewhat similar to Marshalls this year

I covered this already but I'll say it again. That Charlotte team was atrocious, only managed 1 win on the season and were held to 7 or fewer points 5 times that season. We also outgained them by almost 100 yards and owned the time of possession battle in that game, holding the ball for 39 of the 60 minutes.

IN 2016, we gave up 342 yards and 21 first downs to an outstanding UTSA offense.

Our offense had 442 yards and won the time of possession battle with 32 minutes. UTSA still managed to score 19 on us and were coming off a P5 game where they had to turn around and travel to Norfolk.

In 2016, they gave up 214 yards and 10 first downs to Marshall

That Marshall team was 3-9, we scored 38 (21 in the first half and 31 in the first three quarters, making them one dimensional on offense), rolled up over 400 yards of offense on them and we held the ball for 35 minutes of the game.


In 2016, they gave up 232 yards and 16 first downs to FIU

FIU still managed to score 28 points in that game, one in which we managed to score 42 and amass over 500 yards of offense.

Besides the EMU game in 2014, they gave up 326 and 19 first downs to a good LT team.

LT scored 27 in that game, ODUs offense had close to 400 yards, 30 points and won the time of possession battle with 33 minutes.

I cant support it being the best defense when they couldn't get a bad Marshall offense off the field. And Marshall had no need to do anything that carried any risk at all bc they knew we couldn't move the ball.

Context matters, rebuttals in bold. More importantly, I never said this was the best defense. I said the Marshall game is arguably the best single game defensive performance we've seen at ODU in FBS. And given we got so little from the offense and that in all of your examples, our offense actually was successful, I stand by it.

I believe it was someone else that said it was the best defense.

There are a lot of other factors that play into number of points given up. Field Position, turnovers, any defensive scores, what the actual score of the game is, etc. For example, UVA had td drives of only around 25 and 50 yards.

Our offense was not good against Marshall by any means, but the defense also could not get off the field. They gave up 300 yards rushing at over 5 yards per carry.

Charlotte was a bad team for sure. But, Marshall is also one of, if not, the worst offenses in the country. It also has to be acknowledged that the defense has to get the offense chances to get on the field as well. Good defenses don't let the opposition get 20 first downs.

Either way, I disagree but see your point of view. We are now the 90th ranked team in F=/- (94th on offense and 85th on defense). I think people assume the gap between the 2 sides of the field are much larger.[/b]