For 20 schools 4-5/5/5 ?

Are there other options?

How about for quantities up to 24, 36, or more?

While trying to keep years at 9 or less.

(09-02-2022 05:14 PM)Skyhawk Wrote:  For 20 schools 4-5/5/5 ?

Are there other options?

How about for quantities up to 24, 36, or more?

While trying to keep years at 9 or less.

Why does it need to be divisible by prime numbers?

1/8 and you get everyone at least 4/9 years. 2/7 and you get them 7/18. 3/6 and you get them 1/3 years.

At 20 schools you are probably going to 10 games.

I expect if we ever get there (to 20), it wont be exactly that, at least not in a widely separated conference like the B1G. They may well treat a geographically isolated west coast as separate, with a different scheduling model from the others.

Example, the current B1G at 16 makes most sense to treat USC and UCLA as their own group, play each other and over the course of the next 7 years host each of the other 14 schools twice and visit them twice. Thus everyone gets four trips to LA over seven years. You can go with whatever model you want with the other 14, with 3-6 most likely.

In general you want the fewest locked in rivalries as possible, to built cohesion by schedule rotation. For 18, 3-7 would work well for example. 3-7 is a little weird with 20, but comes close to an even rotation over 7 years (49 games for 16 opponents, so three times each with one extra game in there). That's not really frequent enough but it's even enough. 2-8 might skip a bunch of rivalries. But then again Alabama only needs Tennessee and Auburn permanently on the schedule, Auburn needs Alabama and Georgia, Georgia needs Auburn and Florida, Texas needs Texas A&M and Oklahoma, ... basically I think that could work.You'd be pretty close with 16 games for 17 schools every other year. Just one school would be out of your rotation every two years.

It's a challenge but doable. Rivalries matter more than balance in college.

Whatever it'll be a challenge.

5 rivals + 5/5 meaning you play everyone in 2 years, home and home in 4 years. There is no other answer.

When I typed 4-5/5/5 for 20, I clearly needed to pay more attention - math is apparently hard : )

Anyway, there are a lot of interesting 9-game options you all have shown.

I wonder if an 8-game format is still possible at 20?

Or do we have to go to 24 for that?

Asymmetry. There is no reason that Minnesota can't have 4 fixed rivals while Rutgers has 1. The B1G is going to hire a scheduling consultant to handle this anyway. I might try my hand at the math and make a post about it.

(09-02-2022 07:30 PM)OhioBoilermaker Wrote:  Asymmetry. There is no reason that Minnesota can't have 4 fixed rivals while Rutgers has 1. The B1G is going to hire a scheduling consultant to handle this anyway. I might try my hand at the math and make a post about it.

so everyone could be at 8 or 9, with X number of rivals of their choice, likely no more than Y.

that would give each room to decide on in-conference rivals and ooc ones.

interesting

(09-02-2022 07:34 PM)Skyhawk Wrote:  

(09-02-2022 07:30 PM)OhioBoilermaker Wrote:  Asymmetry. There is no reason that Minnesota can't have 4 fixed rivals while Rutgers has 1. The B1G is going to hire a scheduling consultant to handle this anyway. I might try my hand at the math and make a post about it.

so everyone could be at 8 or 9, with X number of rivals of their choice, likely no more than Y.

that would give each room to decide on in-conference rivals and ooc ones.

interesting

Right. Sure, Ohio State would play Minnesota slightly less frequently. But it's a small price to pay for the fixed rivalries that make college football great and drive revenue.

Also, the B1G isn't going to stick Rutgers with anyone other than Maryland.

With 9 conference games

3 fixed rivals you play every year
4 teams you play once every 2 years
12 teams you play once every 3 years.

With 10 conference games

3 fixed rivals you play every year
10 teams you play once every 2 years
6 teams you play once every 3 years

The below options allow you to see every school every 4 years at a minimum and seeing rivals / long-time opponents more often.

9 Games:
3 Annual Rivals
4 Odd Years, 4 Even Years
2 Year A, 2 Year B, 2 Year C, 2 Year D

10 Games:
5 Annual Rivals
3 Odd Years, 3 Even Years
2 Year A, 2 Year B, 2 Year C, 2 Year D

(09-02-2022 07:30 PM)OhioBoilermaker Wrote:  Asymmetry. There is no reason that Minnesota can't have 4 fixed rivals while Rutgers has 1. The B1G is going to hire a scheduling consultant to handle this anyway. I might try my hand at the math and make a post about it.

The Big 10 is the one conference that has done this. Purdue and Indiana play each other cross-division every year. Nobody else has a fixed cross-division rival.

That means everyone else gets IU/PU 1/3 of the time and the rest of the other division just less than half the time.

(09-02-2022 07:05 PM)Scoochpooch1 Wrote:  5 rivals + 5/5 meaning you play everyone in 2 years, home and home in 4 years. There is no other answer.

A lot of schools would care to disagree with you, as nobody is currently even contemplating a 10 game schedule.

(09-03-2022 12:50 AM)bullet Wrote:  

(09-02-2022 07:30 PM)OhioBoilermaker Wrote:  Asymmetry. There is no reason that Minnesota can't have 4 fixed rivals while Rutgers has 1. The B1G is going to hire a scheduling consultant to handle this anyway. I might try my hand at the math and make a post about it.

The Big 10 is the one conference that has done this. Purdue and Indiana play each other cross-division every year. Nobody else has a fixed cross-division rival.

That means everyone else gets IU/PU 1/3 of the time and the rest of the other division just less than half the time.

I thought that Nebraska had played tOSU every year since 2016. I just assumed they were a "rivals" matchup and scheduled to play every year, that's very weird if not.

(09-03-2022 12:50 AM)bullet Wrote:  

(09-02-2022 07:30 PM)OhioBoilermaker Wrote:  Asymmetry. There is no reason that Minnesota can't have 4 fixed rivals while Rutgers has 1. The B1G is going to hire a scheduling consultant to handle this anyway. I might try my hand at the math and make a post about it.

The Big 10 is the one conference that has done this. Purdue and Indiana play each other cross-division every year. Nobody else has a fixed cross-division rival.

That means everyone else gets IU/PU 1/3 of the time and the rest of the other division just less than half the time.

That's not exactly true. The Big Ten set up "parity scheduling" with 6-year rotations. Where every team got a fixed cross-division rival for 6 years straight from 2016-2021

OSU-Neb
Mich-Wisc
PSU-Iowa
MSU-NW
MD- Minn
Rut-ILL
Ind-Pur

Then in 2022 they started a new 6-Year rotation that was supposed to last from 2022-2027 with new fixed rivals that you play 6 years straight.

OSU-Wisc
Mich-Neb
PSU-ILL
MSU-Minn
MD-NW
Rut-Iowa
Ind-Pur

This schedule will obviously get thrown out in 2024, which makes Iowa very happy because they were not happy having to play Rutgers every year.

This parity scheduling was not what most people first envisioned when the Big Ten went to 9 conference games. Most people thought it meant you would play everybody except Ind-and Purdue about 50% of the time as cross division opponents. Don't overestimate the ability of the Big Ten to put together a schedule. They are not as bright as you would expect.

(09-02-2022 05:14 PM)Skyhawk Wrote:  For 20 schools 4-5/5/5 ?

Are there other options?

How about for quantities up to 24, 36, or more?

While trying to keep years at 9 or less.

Dynamic scheduling. With division-less play the most important consideration is strength of schedule. Secondary are rivalry games and some frequency of play.

This is different from the NFL where the goal is to have common opponents within divisions.

Divide the conference up into groups based on strength.

With 16 schools, four in each tier. With 20 schools in each tier. With 24 schools in each tier. With numbers that aren't a multiple of four, there will be some differences (example with 17: it might be 4,5,4,4)

With larger numbers they will likely go to 10 games. It is more important to play teams in your conference every few years, than the buy game against East Bugtussle Polytechnic.

Teams in Tier 1, play 3 games in Tier 1, 2 against Tier 2, 2 against Tier 3, 3 against Tier 4.

Teams in Tier 2, play 2 games against Tier 1, 3 games in Tier 2, 3 games against Tier 3, and two games against Tier 4.

Rivalry games will be scheduled. For example, if Wisconsin is Tier 2, and Minnesota is Tier 3, that game will be played as one of the Tier 2/Tier 3 games. Games against teams that have not been played in several years (or never) can be prioritized. Swapping of home games from previous seasons, particularly the last season.

There will need to be some tweaks if not a multiple of four schools.