It looks like a 9 man rotation. This is better than the rotations we have had in recent years. I see Wilson, Simmons and Jocobi as the odd men out. Davis is redshirting.

I tried to watch the game but couldn't. It just looked weird for lack of a better word. As mentioned above, I don't know what we learned from this, and maybe it's more about building chemistry and getting to know each other. They could get a better game from a top Toledo high school IMO.

#22 looks like a bulky guy but I don't know who he is. It all looked kind of laid back but maybe I didn't watch enough. It won't be long until we really find out what we have. I'm optimistic, but this is Toledo.

Cochran is #23 and Maddox is #21. I do not believe there is a #22 on the team.

(08-13-2022 01:30 PM)Rocket75 Wrote:  Cochran is #23 and Maddox is #21. I do not believe there is a #22 on the team.

(08-13-2022 01:46 PM)Screwball Wrote:  

(08-13-2022 01:30 PM)Rocket75 Wrote:  Cochran is #23 and Maddox is #21. I do not believe there is a #22 on the team.

According to the BIO pictures that looks like Cochrane.

(08-13-2022 02:22 PM)rocketpaul Wrote:  

(08-13-2022 01:46 PM)Screwball Wrote:  

(08-13-2022 01:30 PM)Rocket75 Wrote:  Cochran is #23 and Maddox is #21. I do not believe there is a #22 on the team.

According to the BIO pictures that looks like Cochrane.

definitely Cochran. yeah, only so much to gather from a game like this. the refs were homers and the PR team was happy to gun away from deep.

rotation looks like 9 deep for sure. the last 3, wilson, jacobi and simmons each could earn minutes too. jacobi is physically much stronger but still misses a lot of bunnies inside and his jumper is just as ugly. wilson is always in the right place but doesn't always make the play when he's there. simmons needs time to get comfortable but physically he's MAC ready.

Thanks

There is not a lot you can take from the 3 blowout wins in Puerto Rico other than the fact that we have the potential of going 8 or 9 deep with our 4 returning starters (Shumate, Milner, Dennis, Moss) and then a combination of Maddox, Cochran, Farmer, Edu, and Lorentson. That added depth is something that we did not have the luxury of packing in our suitcase the past 2 post season trips to Cleveland. Now that doesn’t guarantee anything this upcoming season, but if sure feels a lot better knowing that we will be in a better position to “mix and match” our lineups depending on particular matchups or game situations. This is something that we have collectively been wanting, and it will be exciting to see how it all comes to fruition and whether it will make a difference for The Rockets come next March!

(08-14-2022 09:10 PM)Basketball Jones Wrote:  There is not a lot you can take from the 3 blowout wins in Puerto Rico other than the fact that we have the potential of going 8 or 9 deep with our 4 returning starters (Shumate, Milner, Dennis, Moss) and then a combination of Maddox, Cochran, Farmer, Edu, and Lorentson. That added depth is something that we did not have the luxury of packing in our suitcase the past 2 post season trips to Cleveland. Now that doesn’t guarantee anything this upcoming season, but if sure feels a lot better knowing that we will be in a better position to “mix and match” our lineups depending on particular matchups or game situations. This is something that we have collectively been wanting, and it will be exciting to see how it all comes to fruition and whether it will make a difference for The Rockets come next March!

I think you would have to add Simmons to that list. He has some size and bulk and the coaching staff has talked about him being in the mix this year.

(08-15-2022 07:33 AM)DetroitRocket Wrote:  

(08-14-2022 09:10 PM)Basketball Jones Wrote:  There is not a lot you can take from the 3 blowout wins in Puerto Rico other than the fact that we have the potential of going 8 or 9 deep with our 4 returning starters (Shumate, Milner, Dennis, Moss) and then a combination of Maddox, Cochran, Farmer, Edu, and Lorentson. That added depth is something that we did not have the luxury of packing in our suitcase the past 2 post season trips to Cleveland. Now that doesn’t guarantee anything this upcoming season, but if sure feels a lot better knowing that we will be in a better position to “mix and match” our lineups depending on particular matchups or game situations. This is something that we have collectively been wanting, and it will be exciting to see how it all comes to fruition and whether it will make a difference for The Rockets come next March!

I think you would have to add Simmons to that list. He has some size and bulk and the coaching staff has talked about him being in the mix this year.

I hope you are right. While he obviously has long term potential, you never know how a Freshman is going to adjust when the bright lights come on for the first time. If he and Edu can contribute quality minutes to help out Milner and Shumate inside, we are going to a be tough matchup for anyone in the MAC with what we got on the perimeter!

This will be a very very good team. This team may put up more points than last year and it is very experienced.

Wilson is also developing. He got 7 MPG last year and even with added depth he will see the floor. His shot is coming along nicely.

Jacobi's situation is a bit of a mystery. He may not see many minutes with new additions.

Edu will only score on a few put backs but he will add height and depth to front court where it is truly needed

Go Rockets !

I do not recall Coach K ever having a rotation at Toledo 9 or 10 deep. We will see if he feels comfortable using the bench a lot or if he reverts to the 7 or 8 man rotation of recent season.

(08-18-2022 09:11 AM)Rocket75 Wrote:  I do not recall Coach K ever having a rotation at Toledo 9 or 10 deep. We will see if he feels comfortable using the bench a lot or if he reverts to the 7 or 8 man rotation of recent season.

Good point. I think you just stated what every aware UT men's basketball fan senses and that is that TK is a short bench coach. Even with talent he may still play only his 8 best. Let's hope the 8 are better than last year if he is tied to this bench coaching lean. I think he'd like to use a deeper bench but he's likely entrenched. It will be interesting to see if Jacobi, Wilson, and Simmons get meaningful minutes. I'm not a fan of Farmer's game like some on this board. I didn't see Farmer hit a jump shot all last season. Nothing but bricks. I'm still not sure what he brings to the table. "D" perhaps....dunno. I thinks it great that we have players like Jacobi that actually got 10+ MPG and this coming season could potentially be sparsely used bench players. I hope he and Wilson get minutes.

It sounded like Davis is actually on scholarship per the last podcast. He stated he was offered by UT. I thought he was a walk-on. Does offer mean a preferred walk-on scholarship? Isn't a preferred walk-on offer rather meaningless? Does it provide any actual benefits?

Moss at the point to spell Dennis is an interesting position idea. TK needs that since UT does not have another true PG on roster even with addition of Cochran and Maddox. That means both are hard 2's.

Go Rockets!

As you may all recall, Saunders was the LAST scholarship player off the bench at the start of the season. As it turned out, he was really the only guy off the bench who could score and by the end of the year he was the first guard to sub in. Let's hope the bench can actually contribute some offense this season.

(08-18-2022 01:38 PM)Rocket75 Wrote:  As you may all recall, Saunders was the LAST scholarship player off the bench at the start of the season. As it turned out, he was really the only guy off the bench who could score and by the end of the year he was the first guard to sub in. Let's hope the bench can actually contribute some offense this season.

I'll be happy with defense. If they can keep the other team from fast scores, the net is the same but IMO, more wearing on the other team. And I think that's what K recruited, defense. With just enough offense to spread it around, mitigating hopefully any match-up problems in the middle.

K started last year deeper before settling into a short rotation. Perhaps it was necessary. Here's hoping he can keep to the deeper bench so it gells by tournament time.

(08-18-2022 01:38 PM)Rocket75 Wrote:  As you may all recall, Saunders was the LAST scholarship player off the bench at the start of the season. As it turned out, he was really the only guy off the bench who could score and by the end of the year he was the first guard to sub in. Let's hope the bench can actually contribute some offense this season.

He averaged 3.5 a game. Not much help.

(08-18-2022 11:38 AM)IamN2daRockets! Wrote:  

(08-18-2022 09:11 AM)Rocket75 Wrote:  I do not recall Coach K ever having a rotation at Toledo 9 or 10 deep. We will see if he feels comfortable using the bench a lot or if he reverts to the 7 or 8 man rotation of recent season.

Good point. I think you just stated what every aware UT men's basketball fan senses and that is that TK is a short bench coach. Even with talent he may still play only his 8 best. Let's hope the 8 are better than last year if he is tied to this bench coaching lean. I think he'd like to use a deeper bench but he's likely entrenched. It will be interesting to see if Jacobi, Wilson, and Simmons get meaningful minutes. I'm not a fan of Farmer's game like some on this board. I didn't see Farmer hit a jump shot all last season. Nothing but bricks. I'm still not sure what he brings to the table. "D" perhaps....dunno. I thinks it great that we have players like Jacobi that actually got 10+ MPG and this coming season could potentially be sparsely used bench players. I hope he and Wilson get minutes.

It sounded like Davis is actually on scholarship per the last podcast. He stated he was offered by UT. I thought he was a walk-on. Does offer mean a preferred walk-on scholarship? Isn't a preferred walk-on offer rather meaningless? Does it provide any actual benefits?

Moss at the point to spell Dennis is an interesting position idea. TK needs that since UT does not have another true PG on roster even with addition of Cochran and Maddox. That means both are hard 2's.

Go Rockets!

Most college coaches prefer an 8 or 9 man rotation. there's a minority that do line changes, press full court and keep subbing, etc... and play most everyone. there's the argument that your top 5 must not be that good if you finding meaningful minutes for the 11th or 12th guy on the squad. a player who is backing up a backup.

my personal bias has always been to give good minutes to the top few guys off the bench and be willing to use the guys lower, but that's because I was usually between the 5th and 8th best player on the team when I played jr high and high school basketball.

the smart approach is really based on quality and production and spark that your bench gives. a guy who is between the 8th and 12th best player like Wilson will get some looks early but he will only stay in the rotation if he can carve out a role. can he be a total gnat on defense for 2 minutes a half while shooting 40% from deep? i agree farmer missed a lot of shots last year, and it didn't stop him from trying. he's a scorer, but he's got to get those points more efficiently and use his speed to also make plays for his teammates. he's got to learn that he can beat his man left to his strong hand 75% of the time, which is great, but that doesn't mean he should still try to score on the 25% of the times he doesn't. to take fewer quick shots. to keep improving the jumper-he shot pretty well in PR. i'd compare him to a young rian pearson, who played his first year for UT as a 3rd year soph. farmer looked improved in PR. TK says he's the most improved bench guy coming back.

it's also a good bench because you can use it in different ways. you can play maddox and farmer off the bench and have legit scoring. you could play guys like cochran, edu, wilson off the bench and be bigger and tougher defensively. the pivot to moss as a combo guard is smart. he's got a lot of pg type moxie. and you don't have to bring in a pg off the bench when your pg needs a rest.

edu should become a factor at some point, he's relentless. you don't come back from 3 knee surgeries and rehabs to not go all out. when he didn't try to score on anything but an easy dunk or layup-he was great in PR. he got in trouble when he started to do too much. will be interesting to see what he looks like in november with a few solid months of practice and conditioning behind him.

could be a bench where a guy like farmer plays 20 minutes one game and 3 the next. where wilson plays 12 minutes one game and doesn't play the next.

then you got lorentsson who seems to be finding a role. if he can be a scrappy defender he will play, cuz he can make jump shots over people.

jacobi's offense is not really coming along, but he's physically more ready and should be better overall. TK knows he will get great effort out of him.

simmons will have to earn minutes. he's last to the table right now.

this season will be a test of TK's coaching. can he maximize a good bench to make up for the loss of a star?

I am intrigued with a lineup down the stretch with Edu, Lorentzen and Shumate all on the floor together. On offense Andre and JT are among the best 3 point shooters in the conference and on defense the size and mobility of all 3 together could be stifling.

Or ... it could be a total match up disaster against an offense with quick guards but it would make for an interesting experiment during the non-conference schedule.

(08-19-2022 11:07 AM)Sleepy Wrote:  I am intrigued with a lineup down the stretch with Edu, Lorentzen and Shumate all on the floor together. On offense Andre and JT are among the best 3 point shooters in the conference and on defense the size and mobility of all 3 together could be stifling.

Or ... it could be a total match up disaster against an offense with quick guards but it would make for an interesting experiment during the non-conference schedule.

I think I'll take the same position as last year, that a second bid is off the table and it's all in at wining the MACC. Play deep to build this team's depth even if it means some losses so there are more options to put on the floor when difficult match-ups happen and to have a decent plan in event of injury.

This let our five guys beat your 8 guys was risky last year even with a future 2nd rounder on the floor and it still didn't get it done. Doing the same thing over and over again and expecting a different result is the definition of....

Which ever direction K chooses, it should be a fun team to watch. It has a lot to live up to in that regard compared to the previous two efforts.

Off topic but I'll put it here.

Kyle Rowland tweeted Tyler Cochran has been declared eligible.