This is totally from a WKU Fans perspective:

Given the state of things in college football and college basketball I will argue it no longer matters to any G-5/Mid-Major School if your not in a Power Conference. Smaller may be better!

G-5 and CUSA Football: The way things are the most we can hope for at seasons end is a bowl game. ESPN no longer matches up G-5 vs P-5 just because they won't risk a negative outcome for a P-5. The only exception currently is the G-5 access game which looks like that is also going away shortly with the "Playoff" shake-up.

Mid-Majors and CUSA Mens/Woman Basketball: We all know that we are unfortunately a one bid league, two once a decade. With the current conference shake-ups occurring around the country most if not all Mid-Major conferences will shortly become One Bid Leagues with the occasionally two. That goes for every single G-5/Mid-Major conference. This is exactly the way the P-5 and ESPN want it. (Don't fool yourself AAC, that ship is sailing away quickly).

So from my prospective things have changed so much for us why would you want to be in a 14,16 or 20 league conference. Its not going to get you any closer to Basketball Post Season, Football National Champions or Huge TV Revenues.

We are better off financially with a strong 9/10 team league. This will allow each school to gather more of the BSC Football Playoff money, as long as that last, NCAA Tournament Monies and what little TV money there is.

I believe WKU and CUSA schools will turn out to be among the best financially and athletically when its all said and done.

Discuss.....

(07-19-2022 06:15 PM)GreekTopper Wrote:  This is totally from a WKU Fans perspective:

Given the state of things in college football and college basketball I will argue it no longer matters to any G-5/Mid-Major School if your not in a Power Conference. Smaller may be better!

G-5 and CUSA Football: The way things are the most we can hope for at seasons end is a bowl game. ESPN no longer matches up G-5 vs P-5 just because they won't risk a negative outcome for a P-5. The only exception currently is the G-5 access game which looks like that is also going away shortly with the "Playoff" shake-up.

Mid-Majors and CUSA Mens/Woman Basketball: We all know that we are unfortunately a one bid league, two once a decade. With the current conference shake-ups occurring around the country most if not all Mid-Major conferences will shortly become One Bid Leagues with the occasionally two. That goes for every single G-5/Mid-Major conference. This is exactly the way the P-5 and ESPN want it. (Don't fool yourself AAC, that ship is sailing away quickly).

So from my prospective things have changed so much for us why would you want to be in a 14,16 or 20 league conference. Its not going to get you any closer to Basketball Post Season, Football National Champions or Huge TV Revenues.

We are better off financially with a strong 9/10 team league. This will allow each school to gather more of the BSC Football Playoff money, as long as that last, NCAA Tournament Monies and what little TV money there is.

I believe WKU and CUSA schools will turn out to be among the best financially and athletically when its all said and done.

Discuss.....

Good post. The only thing that I might see differently is I’m not sure there will even be a P5 group. We know the SEC and Big 10 will be there, but I’m wondering if maybe only one other group survives. Maybe a combination of the ACC and the PAC 12 or Big 12. I think ESPN is only interested in a select few teams anyway even if there ends up being only the 2 super conferences. I think your spot on that fewer is better. A G5 conference with 12 + teams will be of no benefit at all.

(07-19-2022 06:15 PM)GreekTopper Wrote:  This is totally from a WKU Fans perspective:

Given the state of things in college football and college basketball I will argue it no longer matters to any G-5/Mid-Major School if your not in a Power Conference. Smaller may be better!

G-5 and CUSA Football: The way things are the most we can hope for at seasons end is a bowl game. ESPN no longer matches up G-5 vs P-5 just because they won't risk a negative outcome for a P-5. The only exception currently is the G-5 access game which looks like that is also going away shortly with the "Playoff" shake-up.

Mid-Majors and CUSA Mens/Woman Basketball: We all know that we are unfortunately a one bid league, two once a decade. With the current conference shake-ups occurring around the country most if not all Mid-Major conferences will shortly become One Bid Leagues with the occasionally two. That goes for every single G-5/Mid-Major conference. This is exactly the way the P-5 and ESPN want it. (Don't fool yourself AAC, that ship is sailing away quickly).

So from my prospective things have changed so much for us why would you want to be in a 14,16 or 20 league conference. Its not going to get you any closer to Basketball Post Season, Football National Champions or Huge TV Revenues.

We are better off financially with a strong 9/10 team league. This will allow each school to gather more of the BSC Football Playoff money, as long as that last, NCAA Tournament Monies and what little TV money there is.

I believe WKU and CUSA schools will turn out to be among the best financially and athletically when its all said and done.

Discuss.....

Several of us have been saying nearly everything you just mentioned. Some see the wisdom of G5 conferences staying smaller and thus stronger. The SBC lived it with just 10 and succeeded in football but has now overestimated their value and made a fatal error expanding to 14. The advantage CUSA 4.0 has is that it will be a football and basketball league. Obviously no one knows what will happen with autbids or how an ex0qnded football playoff will affect us all but staying small is our ticket to building a respectable Conference around a strong core of schools.

For MT, this is the best basketball conference since fun days in the OVC battling Murray State in a packed glass house.

I agree smaller is better. But the original question--- YES... it matters-- just NOT as much as it used to.

Travel expenses and travel time matter. Geographical rivalries matter. Those savings along with a somewhat higher media deal could add up to some significant dollars and don't forget possible CFP dollars which could be more for the better G5's.

You're either a P5 receiving a massive revenue distribution or you are not. That is all that matters at the end of the day.

(07-19-2022 08:01 PM)TruBlu Wrote:  For MT, this is the best basketball conference since fun days in the OVC battling Murray State in a packed glass house.

I said something similar...it'll be the best basketball conference WKU has been in since the SBC pre 1992 when the SBC was a highly respected mid-major basketball conference.

I think "if" conference membership is important... then it is probably important for your entire university. I don't think our university athletic departments are there just to waste money. Some of our universities think of athletics as also being marketing departments for the entire university. But, I think it depends on your universities goals, and also the priorities of your university's local community and the type of student your hoping will attend.

I can only speak for UNT. When North Texas was in the Sun Belt, most casual fans around the state of Texas thought UNT was in the FCS. That conference lacked name recognition and history with the people of Texas, and it didn't help that we were the only SB program in the state either. Not surprisingly, being a member of the Sun Belt didn't inspire excitement in our fan base, and alums felt no need to give back and invest in our athletics. When North Texas played in the SB, we had an enrollment of about 25,000 (because we are located in a very populated area). In Texas, students want to attend a university they feel is on par with other respected (or at least known) universities. UNT got no student recruitment benefit from being in the Sun Belt.

Joining C-USA was a boon to UNT. Conferencing with the like of Rice and even the other Texas programs was a major factor in our ability to raise funds from our supporters and lure more and better students to UNT. In our decade in C-USA, UNT doubled our athletic budget, increased our enrollment to over 42,000, and built more and better facilities (campus-wide) than our university has ever enjoyed (our donors have given more large financial gifts to the university and athletic department in the last decade than in all our years in the Sun Belt).

Moving to the AAC will ensure the continued growth of North Texas. We will still be with Rice, but also enjoy conferencing with highly respected athletic and/or academic universities (SMU, Navy, Temple, Tulane, & Memphis). That matters to prospective students. Based on application and acceptance data, UNT is on track to set another enrollment record this coming year. Since our students are charged a $16 per academic hour athletic fee, our athletic department grows as our university grows. So since our conference affiliation matters to the students choosing to attend UNT, it has to matter to our athletic department. But like I said, I can only speak for UNT.

(07-19-2022 08:28 PM)DogsWin1 Wrote:  You're either a P5 receiving a massive revenue distribution or you are not. That is all that matters at the end of the day.

Yes. You make the obvious and excellent point--- but there is a lot more involved.

Other factors:

Travel time-- which affects classroom time

Travel cost--- budgeting for more transportation, lodging, meals, etc.

Rivalries---- example-- WKU would rather play Marshall than UTEP if given the choice



CFP share--- currently higher ranked G5's get a bigger cut

Media deal--- although not huge-- an extra million or two every year helps

ALL these preceding points accumulate to a significant (although not world changing) difference between one G5 and another.

For us it is huge to enter FBS through CUSA. SBC has long been considered the bottom league in Alabama and we enter a step up from the bottom. The image this gives JSU is a big boost to recruits.

(07-19-2022 09:53 PM)TOPSTRAIGHT Wrote:  

(07-19-2022 08:28 PM)DogsWin1 Wrote:  You're either a P5 receiving a massive revenue distribution or you are not. That is all that matters at the end of the day.

Yes. You make the obvious and excellent point--- but there is a lot more involved.

Other factors:

Travel time-- which affects classroom time

Travel cost--- budgeting for more transportation, lodging, meals, etc.

Rivalries---- example-- WKU would rather play Marshall than UTEP if given the choice





CFP share--- currently higher ranked G5's get a bigger cut That’s nonsense the Sunbelt has never got a BCS or NY6 Bowl. Now with 14 teams the CFP share for the Sunbelt schools will be less than a 9 team CUSA. You don’t realize that?

BSMedia deal--- although not huge-- an extra million or two every year helps

ALL these preceding points accumulate to a significant (although not world changing) difference between one G5 and another.

Media Deal - I have yet to any see supporting information of the 400% increase deal for the Sunbelt. Besides the moronic JMU writer that is confusing CFP revenue sharing with a media deal (what an idiot)

WKUYG brought up an excellent point if the Sunbelt was getting a 400% increase every AD in the Sunbelt would be bragging about the increase.

But not one single Sunbelt AD has mentioned a media deal increase. I wonder why? Because it’s total BS

You may find out the details of the SBC deal at media day soon. Hard to imagine school leaders willing to go from 12 to 14 members without compensation.

Any difference in 10 vs 14 payout will be more than compensated by increases in attendance from visitors (and attractiveness of rivals) as well as the decreases in travel costs for non revenue sports especially with the eastern members of the SBC.

(07-20-2022 12:46 AM)JackedUp Wrote:  

(07-19-2022 09:53 PM)TOPSTRAIGHT Wrote:  

(07-19-2022 08:28 PM)DogsWin1 Wrote:  You're either a P5 receiving a massive revenue distribution or you are not. That is all that matters at the end of the day.

Yes. You make the obvious and excellent point--- but there is a lot more involved.

Other factors:

Travel time-- which affects classroom time

Travel cost--- budgeting for more transportation, lodging, meals, etc.

Rivalries---- example-- WKU would rather play Marshall than UTEP if given the choice





CFP share--- currently higher ranked G5's get a bigger cut That’s nonsense the Sunbelt has never got a BCS or NY6 Bowl. Now with 14 teams the CFP share for the Sunbelt schools will be less than a 9 team CUSA. You don’t realize that?

BSMedia deal--- although not huge-- an extra million or two every year helps

ALL these preceding points accumulate to a significant (although not world changing) difference between one G5 and another.

Media Deal - I have yet to any see supporting information of the 400% increase deal for the Sunbelt. Besides the moronic JMU writer that is confusing CFP revenue sharing with a media deal (what an idiot)

WKUYG brought up an excellent point if the Sunbelt was getting a 400% increase every AD in the Sunbelt would be bragging about the increase.

But not one single Sunbelt AD has mentioned a media deal increase. I wonder why? Because it’s total BS

I come in peace, lol!

First, I do not know what the media deal is. I think few people do at this point, but that pretty much goes for all conferences, which has much more to do with NDA’s than being ashamed of the deal, etc. Either way, Gill has said publicly that he will be announcing what our deal is next week, and that it will be ‘positive’ news.

Will the deal be as much as some hope? Probably not. Will it be as little as others hope? Probably not that either. I think the the vast majority of SBC fans/posters think it will be a hefty increase, but not some unrealistic amount either. Either way we should find out for certain fairly soon.

BTW, since you seem to be so very sure of the amount it is not, what do think it will be? It’d be nice to have it on the record, and I’m too lazy to search thru your old posts to find if you’ve already stated this. Thanks, and

Less and less all the time and fairly soon, no, not at all.

I think that conference affiliation does matter if you can get more exposure for your university. I also think that conference membership is important to universities as they tend to want to associate with similar schools. In UAB’s case, that’s schools in urban settings or research institutions. I am not sure if fans have a whole lot of say in the matter. Although I would say that we have a history with most of the schools in the AAC.

Not trying to be confrontational or anything, but how is the basketball going to be the best in decades? I mean, this league lost every team but Middle who has won a CUSA tournament in this iteration (UAB x2, UNT, Marshall, ODU) and then regular season winners (UNT x2, UAB, ODU, Marshall) while keeping Middle, LaTech, and WKU who have won regular season. I mean, sure you have solid teams left but the top end of the league is cut in half. UAB vs. UNT was the first top 50 matchup in this league since Memphis was still here. Granted, I don’t think CUSA basketball is going to be bad by any means, it’ll probably be solid, I just don’t think it’s going to be the best your teams have experienced in decades. And the general consensus around is that losing the Sun Belt 3 in basketball is what is going to propel this as a wonderful league since there isn’t a horrible bottom end, but those teams just had a down year in 2022. They’ve been pretty darn solid throughout their time in CUSA.

If anything, it’ll just let Middle, LaTech, and Western to have more access to NCAA Tournament runs since less competition for the CUSA tourney title

What is the current SBC payout per-team? When I ask that I'm not looking for a blowhard to explain, well, that's hard to say because this, and this, and this. I'm looking for a dollar amount each SBC school gets paid by espn. Not REVENUE.

Once we have that number then a person can figure out any increase. If its 800k today then that's 8 million a year. If it moves to 11.2 million a year that's not a increase and to get to the 2 million a year espn will need to pay SBC 28 million a year.

As I said before each of the SBC contracts with espn had modest increases in money so that's what I expect. I personally believe that will come in close to 200k for each school which will be 25% (if current is 800k) the highest increase for the SBC.

I also believe any increase will be a loyalty increase. Like the MAC received and like the MAC it will be at the the hands of espn on what they decide to give the SBC because at this point they know for 100% fact, SBC has nowhere else to go. The only card SBC has to play is loyalty to the crown. That's not a putdown to the SBC, its just the way things are...

if those former CUSA schools had not made the awful choice to move to Fox. CUSA would be on the bended knee to the "crown". The only value any of our conference has is CONTENT to fill space the P5 conferences don't want to play. And the real value is to espn streaming content because if they can get 12k in fans from each SBC school or a total of 120,000 to pay their streaming fees....

$860,000 more than covers the cost they are paying the SBC, today

(07-20-2022 07:41 AM)Engblazr Wrote:  Not trying to be confrontational or anything, but how is the basketball going to be the best in decades? I mean, this league lost every team but Middle who has won a CUSA tournament in this iteration (UAB x2, UNT, Marshall, ODU) and then regular season winners (UNT x2, UAB, ODU, Marshall) while keeping Middle, LaTech, and WKU who have won regular season. I mean, sure you have solid teams left but the top end of the league is cut in half. UAB vs. UNT was the first top 50 matchup in this league since Memphis was still here. Granted, I don’t think CUSA basketball is going to be bad by any means, it’ll probably be solid, I just don’t think it’s going to be the best your teams have experienced in decades. And the general consensus around is that losing the Sun Belt 3 in basketball is what is going to propel this as a wonderful league since there isn’t a horrible bottom end, but those teams just had a down year in 2022. They’ve been pretty darn solid throughout their time in CUSA.

If anything, it’ll just let Middle, LaTech, and Western to have more access to NCAA Tournament runs since less competition for the CUSA tourney title

Because top to bottom it’s a better basketball conference. It helps with keeping SOS higher for better seedings in the tournament. Yes we did lose some good basketball schools but man even more important is that we lost a lot of bad ones as well.

(07-20-2022 07:41 AM)Engblazr Wrote:  Not trying to be confrontational or anything, but how is the basketball going to be the best in decades? I mean, this league lost every team but Middle who has won a CUSA tournament in this iteration (UAB x2, UNT, Marshall, ODU) and then regular season winners (UNT x2, UAB, ODU, Marshall) while keeping Middle, LaTech, and WKU who have won regular season. I mean, sure you have solid teams left but the top end of the league is cut in half. UAB vs. UNT was the first top 50 matchup in this league since Memphis was still here. Granted, I don’t think CUSA basketball is going to be bad by any means, it’ll probably be solid, I just don’t think it’s going to be the best your teams have experienced in decades. And the general consensus around is that losing the Sun Belt 3 in basketball is what is going to propel this as a wonderful league since there isn’t a horrible bottom end, but those teams just had a down year in 2022. They’ve been pretty darn solid throughout their time in CUSA.

If anything, it’ll just let Middle, LaTech, and Western to have more access to NCAA Tournament runs since less competition for the CUSA tourney title

By dropping most of the dead weight the conference improves and 3 of the top 5 winningest programs remain. Including the top 2 in Tech and Western. Along with adding a NMST team that has shown more success than any current CUSA school that is leaving. Liberty has more as much, if not more than any CUSA leaving.

So adding to the top and decreasing the bottom. Your view seems to think the best teams are those winning the tourney. Sometimes that's correct but a lot of times, it's not.

(07-20-2022 07:56 AM)WKUYG Wrote:  

(07-20-2022 07:41 AM)Engblazr Wrote:  Not trying to be confrontational or anything, but how is the basketball going to be the best in decades? I mean, this league lost every team but Middle who has won a CUSA tournament in this iteration (UAB x2, UNT, Marshall, ODU) and then regular season winners (UNT x2, UAB, ODU, Marshall) while keeping Middle, LaTech, and WKU who have won regular season. I mean, sure you have solid teams left but the top end of the league is cut in half. UAB vs. UNT was the first top 50 matchup in this league since Memphis was still here. Granted, I don’t think CUSA basketball is going to be bad by any means, it’ll probably be solid, I just don’t think it’s going to be the best your teams have experienced in decades. And the general consensus around is that losing the Sun Belt 3 in basketball is what is going to propel this as a wonderful league since there isn’t a horrible bottom end, but those teams just had a down year in 2022. They’ve been pretty darn solid throughout their time in CUSA.

If anything, it’ll just let Middle, LaTech, and Western to have more access to NCAA Tournament runs since less competition for the CUSA tourney title

By dropping most of the dead weight the conference improves and 3 of the top 5 winningest programs remain. Including the top 2 in Tech and Western. Along with adding a NMST team that has shown more success than any current CUSA school that is leaving. Liberty has more as much, if not more than any CUSA leaving.

So adding to the top and decreasing the bottom. Your view seems to think the best teams are those winning the tourney. Sometimes that's correct but a lot of times, it's not.

Well said. In addition, you really can't put a price on the value of having nearly every school in a conference who actually cares strongly about basketball. Even with the occasional bad hire or down year, you can feel confident they'll work to correct.

WKU, LaTech, MTSU, Liberty, UTEP, and NMSU have consistently fit that mold. FIU seems to even place a higher priority on basketball. JaxSt seems to care about roundball as well as SHSU. Instead of being in a Conference where 25-30% of the league seem to be happy lingering in the 250-300 ratings range, we will likely have near 100% in the 1-200 range. That raises everyone's profile. Obviously, things can always go south quickly, but I'm feeling good about what we have. That in no one is a slight on the valuable basketball programs we lost...i.e. UAB and NT.