Didn't get to watch tonight, sucks to see we wasted a rare strong start/first half. I wouldn't be surprised to see CAA refs give JMU the short end of the stick, sure CAA isn't these refs' only conference but they do work for the specific conferences right? I sure thought teams like VCU got every little call when they were hoping for an at large or higher seed and their wins were good for the conference. I'll never forget the phantom foul Maynor got in 09 to tie it with 7 seconds left.

But yeah, like I said I didn't get to see this one. I did think they were pretty bad at Hofstra. Either way it is what it is, keep getting better as a team and control what we can control.

Bummer year…..

(02-07-2022 09:40 PM)Hart Foundation Wrote:  Well, we got some clarification after the game. Coach By was claiming the refs are against JMU because JMU is leaving the CAA. After last game I thought he as just referring to not getting calls on the road. But tonight he was more clear in saying there is intentional wrongdoing by the refs since JMU is leaving.

Poor form. Not what I want to see from a head coach trying to make excuses for his team’s poor play.

JMU is losing games it shouldn’t be losing. Tonight, I’m sure JMU was the underdog on the road. But once they led 28-16 at the half, they had leverage and a large buffer.
The home losses earlier in the CAA schedule were the beginning of the end.

Yeah, that's one of those situations where you better have s ome inside info before making a statement that bold. That's not going to endear refs to you in the future and could lead to some unwanted changes in the demeanor of your players. I definitely don't think it has done the latter; only talking in the hypothetical.

I saw most of the first half and none of the second. Watched some VA/Duke instead, as that first half was tough to watch. Was stunned when I checked my phone to see that Drexel put up 56 in the second half after scoring only 16 or so in the first half.

Bart Torvik site shows JMU among the very worst teams in the country in two point shot defense (355 out of 358 in giving up 57% shooting from two point range). That's unbelievable to say the least.

Sounds like Byington is getting desperate if he's attacking referees in his post game presser. He's still in somewhat of a honeymoon phase, but things are unraveling quickly.

You don't build a $140M arena for this level of results. He's had some injuries, but those are going to happen. The defense is atrocious and the team just isn't that talented, which I indicated at the beginning of the season and some on here felt quite differently. This team has plenty of experience, although perhaps they haven't played together as a group that long. Molson was a big loss and now Falden is missing. The CAA is also much better this year than it was a year ago and the league is well coached. Byington is going to have to rethink how he builds rosters and how his teams play, since this isn't working at a high enough level. The two biggest issues, to me, are the porous defense and the total lack of production from the freshman class that was supposed to be good. Ihenacho seems to be the key building block going forward, but he's limited by his inability to shoot with consistency at this point.

Byington certainly fits the culture of JMU, and perhaps that was his biggest selling point, but he has yet to show an ability to put together top 100 caliber teams. The team is probably closer to a turnaround than currently meets the eye, but there's going to have to be some reassessment following the season, as well as roster turnover. Rick Pitino, a quick turnaround artist, is sitting at 19-4 in his second season at Iona.

So JMU beat UVA.
UVA beat Duke at Cameron Indoor Stadium
JMU > Duke

Do I have that right?

(02-08-2022 12:05 AM)Dukes84 Wrote:  I saw most of the first half and none of the second. Watched some VA/Duke instead, as that first half was tough to watch. Was stunned when I checked my phone to see that Drexel put up 56 in the second half after scoring only 16 or so in the first half.

Bart Torvik site shows JMU among the very worst teams in the country in two point shot defense (355 out of 358 in giving up 57% shooting from two point range). That's unbelievable to say the least.

Sounds like Byington is getting desperate if he's attacking referees in his post game presser. He's still in somewhat of a honeymoon phase, but things are unraveling quickly.

You don't build a $140M arena for this level of results. He's had some injuries, but those are going to happen. The defense is atrocious and the team just isn't that talented, which I indicated at the beginning of the season and some on here felt quite differently. This team has plenty of experience, although perhaps they haven't played together as a group that long. Molson was a big loss and now Falden is missing. The CAA is also much better this year than it was a year ago and the league is well coached. Byington is going to have to rethink how he builds rosters and how his teams play, since this isn't working at a high enough level. The two biggest issues, to me, are the porous defense and the total lack of production from the freshman class that was supposed to be good. Ihenacho seems to be the key building block going forward, but he's limited by his inability to shoot with consistency at this point.

Byington certainly fits the culture of JMU, and perhaps that was his biggest selling point, but he has yet to show an ability to put together top 100 caliber teams. The team is probably closer to a turnaround than currently meets the eye, but there's going to have to be some reassessment following the season, as well as roster turnover. Rick Pitino, a quick turnaround artist, is sitting at 19-4 in his second season at Iona.

Should have spent $1mill a year on a coach to get the Pitinos of the world.

(02-07-2022 09:40 PM)Hart Foundation Wrote:  Well, we got some clarification after the game. Coach By was claiming the refs are against JMU because JMU is leaving the CAA. After last game I thought he as just referring to not getting calls on the road. But tonight he was more clear in saying there is intentional wrongdoing by the refs since JMU is leaving.

Poor form. Not what I want to see from a head coach trying to make excuses for his team’s poor play.

JMU is losing games it shouldn’t be losing. Tonight, I’m sure JMU was the underdog on the road. But once they led 28-16 at the half, they had leverage and a large buffer.
The home losses earlier in the CAA schedule were the beginning of the end.

What I saw was poor coaching vs good coaching after halftime. Drexel made adjustments in their defense and in how they attacked the zone on offense. Meanwhile JMU on offense reverted to "chuck and duck" and defensively went back to a man defense which we've all seen doesn't work. Byington also mismanaged the guys he does have available. Savage isn't a scorer and finished with no points and tied for team lead with 4 turnovers in 17 minutes of play. Hodge meanwhile had 5 points with no turnovers and had less time on the court. Don't blame the refs. The coaching has to get better.

(02-08-2022 07:18 AM)Bawlmer Duke Wrote:  

(02-08-2022 12:05 AM)Dukes84 Wrote:  I saw most of the first half and none of the second. Watched some VA/Duke instead, as that first half was tough to watch. Was stunned when I checked my phone to see that Drexel put up 56 in the second half after scoring only 16 or so in the first half.

Bart Torvik site shows JMU among the very worst teams in the country in two point shot defense (355 out of 358 in giving up 57% shooting from two point range). That's unbelievable to say the least.

Sounds like Byington is getting desperate if he's attacking referees in his post game presser. He's still in somewhat of a honeymoon phase, but things are unraveling quickly.

You don't build a $140M arena for this level of results. He's had some injuries, but those are going to happen. The defense is atrocious and the team just isn't that talented, which I indicated at the beginning of the season and some on here felt quite differently. This team has plenty of experience, although perhaps they haven't played together as a group that long. Molson was a big loss and now Falden is missing. The CAA is also much better this year than it was a year ago and the league is well coached. Byington is going to have to rethink how he builds rosters and how his teams play, since this isn't working at a high enough level. The two biggest issues, to me, are the porous defense and the total lack of production from the freshman class that was supposed to be good. Ihenacho seems to be the key building block going forward, but he's limited by his inability to shoot with consistency at this point.

Byington certainly fits the culture of JMU, and perhaps that was his biggest selling point, but he has yet to show an ability to put together top 100 caliber teams. The team is probably closer to a turnaround than currently meets the eye, but there's going to have to be some reassessment following the season, as well as roster turnover. Rick Pitino, a quick turnaround artist, is sitting at 19-4 in his second season at Iona.

Should have spent $1mill a year on a coach to get the Pitinos of the world.

I’d like to see us try to fund something like that creatively. Like if JMU came to me with a specific funding ask with a tangible result (e.g. X coach for $1M a year), I would be interested in supporting it. To get from Byington’s salary to a Pitino-level salary, we need about 10 annual donors at $50k or 20 annual donors at $25k (tax deductible).

I’ve heard of other schools doing that sort of thing, but it seems like it’s not really something JMU has attempted to the best of my knowledge. I would certainly contribute if JMU’s leadership were willing to attempt that sort of bold play.

In my opinion, JMU needs to consider going big to hit reset on this basketball program. The facilities are top notch, but we’re still taking half measures on the coaching front.

The wheels have certainly fallen off after the month long COVID break.

In last night's game, Drexel made 29.6% (8/27) of its shots from three and 59% (13/22) from two. Also, a huge difference in free throw attempts (10 for JMU and 30 for Drexel), which would seem to indicate that Drexel worked the ball inside significantly more. JMU with 26 fouls to Drexel's 15, hence Byington's complaint.

I don't think I'm as deep in the Kool aid as some might think. But I believe starting the year our team talent was above average for CAA. Molson I believe was out best all around player. Also , experienced. Huge loss of more experience w Falden going down.

I don't think anything about this program is as far off as others. Savage is a much better defender than Hodge.....which is why he got the minutes. Not great...but much better than Hodge.

I also think Byingtons game plan is not bad for the talent he now has. A few more free throws made, less disparity in the calls, and/or a few more misses by Drexel makes by us we walk out of there with a W. It's not like years past where we were overwhelmed and blown out.

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(02-08-2022 02:11 PM)Halz87 Wrote:  I don't think I'm as deep in the Kool aid as some might think. But I believe starting the year our team talent was above average for CAA. Molson I believe was out best all around player. Also , experienced. Huge loss of more experience w Falden going down.

I don't think anything about this program is as far off as others. Savage is a much better defender than Hodge.....which is why he got the minutes. Not great...but much better than Hodge.

I also think Byingtons game plan is not bad for the talent he now has. A few more free throws made, less disparity in the calls, and/or a few more misses by Drexel makes by us we walk out of there with a W. It's not like years past where we were overwhelmed and blown out.

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^^^^This!

(02-08-2022 02:11 PM)Halz87 Wrote:  I don't think I'm as deep in the Kool aid as some might think. But I believe starting the year our team talent was above average for CAA. Molson I believe was out best all around player. Also , experienced. Huge loss of more experience w Falden going down.

I don't think anything about this program is as far off as others. Savage is a much better defender than Hodge.....which is why he got the minutes. Not great...but much better than Hodge.

I also think Byingtons game plan is not bad for the talent he now has. A few more free throws made, less disparity in the calls, and/or a few more misses by Drexel makes by us we walk out of there with a W. It's not like years past where we were overwhelmed and blown out.

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I agree with you about Savage being a better defender. He's also a better rebounder. But the problem was we couldn't score during the long run Drexel had. Regarding the calls, man defense yields more folks and Drexel actual has some inside which will exploit our multitude of guards getting stuck guarding him in the man switch defense. Can't blame the refs for that

It's a lot easier to say "next man up" when you've got 63 or 85 scholarships than 13. Just about any basketball team is going to see some drop off if they lose arguably their best player. On top of that we were also without a couple other guys that are a pretty significant part of our rotation, one of which is also done for the year.

This is still Byington's first normal year, and really it's not totally normal since there's no tournament to look forward to. This program needed a massive turnaround and there's definitely been a pretty solid turnaround so far, but yeah it is a little concerning to see them take such a big step back after the long break and then struggle to bounce back to where they appeared to be earlier. Plus GS fans mention defense as a big issue for their Byington teams so not super encouraging to see that as the big weakness here.

Hope we can put together a fairly strong finish to the season here, but next season is the real measuring stick and I'm not panicking until then. I do hope the bar is fairly high for Byington in the next couple years though. No dragging out mediocrity like with Brady and definitely no bargain bin hire if we do have to move on.

Of all these injuries Molson's was the most serious and noticeable during a game. I'm going to presume that most of this other stuff occurs in practice. Coaches set the practice schedule and the intensity so I'm not falling for the sob story.
And regarding the refs, I didn’t see anyone complaining when JMU had a 12 point lead. Blame and excuses come from people who are either out of answers or are unwilling to take responsibility.

Let me clarify on refs. Your points are spot on. I didn't think it was a huge gotcha job....but I did think we saw the short end of stick overall.

And further clarification. For those that pointed out it was bad form for Coach By mention it like he did in the post game , you were absolutely correct. Hated to hear that. He might be frustrated with our lack of some true bigs and seeing our guys get rejected at point blank range with no calls. It is frustrating. We don't get enough easy baskets. Dropped passes and blocks in the paint on what most teams covert into points at a high rate .

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We just need an interior player or two

It can't be impossible for JMU to attract a center that can catch a basketball

Fortunately Sun Belt basketball might actually suck more than CAA basketball, so we’ll have less of a learning curve than the football team will.

I thought I would venture over here to the Sun Belt boards to bid you all farewell. It seems like there is a lot of animosity both ways as JMU leaves the CAA, but I'll wish you all the best in the Sun Belt (and now that you finished playing Drexel, I'd be happy to see you win out the rest of this season.)

An outsider's perspective, although reading through the thread I get the gloominess after a blown lead, mounting injuries, and a season without a carrot at the end of the stick, but I think there is reason for optimism going forward. There is a good young nucleus with the three freshmen from last year, Amadi, Edwards, and Strickland and now with Ihenacho. They should all have three more years of eligibility if they stay around. Find a big guy to add to the mix and they should have some success. Byington might not be a Pitino or Lefty kind of guy, but I don't think he is a Dillard, Keener, or Rowe either.