(07-22-2021 12:51 PM)TroyTBoy Wrote:  

(07-22-2021 12:45 PM)WhalerFan Wrote:  Name recognition is the key. Big 12 is an established brand. AAC is not. That's why I would bet (which is legal now in Connecticut) that the best of the AAC go to the Big 12 not the other way.

The SWC was an established brand.

The only established brand that matters is ESPN.

Anyone who has followed realignment has observed that the common denominator of leagues that fell off and got poached to death was their contracts ran out and they found themselves on the other side of ESPN's wall.

Agreed. The Big East was a brand, but what mattered was the auto BCS bid and television. Those liking CUSA situation 10 years ago to AAC today are fooling themselves.

(07-22-2021 01:59 PM)Poseidon Wrote:  

(07-22-2021 12:51 PM)TroyTBoy Wrote:  

(07-22-2021 12:45 PM)WhalerFan Wrote:  Name recognition is the key. Big 12 is an established brand. AAC is not. That's why I would bet (which is legal now in Connecticut) that the best of the AAC go to the Big 12 not the other way.

The SWC was an established brand.

The only established brand that matters is ESPN.

Anyone who has followed realignment has observed that the common denominator of leagues that fell off and got poached to death was their contracts ran out and they found themselves on the other side of ESPN's wall.

Agreed. The Big East was a brand, but what mattered was the auto BCS bid and television. Those liking CUSA situation 10 years ago to AAC today are fooling themselves.

They also tend to forget that first raid by the Big East wasn't just UC, UConn, and USF, the catholic 7 were still in as far as most the world knew. Once the split did happen the remaining teams sold off the Big East name, had exit, and entrance fees already built up, and a decimated CUSA to choose from. In this scenario we're the Big Ten watching to see what shakes out, the Big Xii is in the CUSA place and the SEC is playing the ACC role. We'll raid the big Xii after the others finish with them and they are at their weakest take three of those we like best, or the three/one left over and call it a day. They'll do it because while we get the reward, ESPN will be doing the arm twisting.

(07-22-2021 02:53 PM)Foreverandever Wrote:  

(07-22-2021 01:59 PM)Poseidon Wrote:  

(07-22-2021 12:51 PM)TroyTBoy Wrote:  

(07-22-2021 12:45 PM)WhalerFan Wrote:  Name recognition is the key. Big 12 is an established brand. AAC is not. That's why I would bet (which is legal now in Connecticut) that the best of the AAC go to the Big 12 not the other way.

The SWC was an established brand.

The only established brand that matters is ESPN.

Anyone who has followed realignment has observed that the common denominator of leagues that fell off and got poached to death was their contracts ran out and they found themselves on the other side of ESPN's wall.

Agreed. The Big East was a brand, but what mattered was the auto BCS bid and television. Those liking CUSA situation 10 years ago to AAC today are fooling themselves.

They also tend to forget that first raid by the Big East wasn't just UC, UConn, and USF, the catholic 7 were still in as far as most the world knew. Once the split did happen the remaining teams sold off the Big East name, had exit, and entrance fees already built up, and a decimated CUSA to choose from. In this scenario we're the Big Ten watching to see what shakes out, the Big Xii is in the CUSA place and the SEC is playing the ACC role. We'll raid the big Xii after the others finish with them and they are at their weakest take three of those we like best, or the three/one left over and call it a day. They'll do it because while we get the reward, ESPN will be doing the arm twisting.

Exactamundo. ESPN isn't going to have their pockets picked... and the leftovers of the Big 12 have no backer with the power of the WWL.

IMO, this will be a full merger with ESPN pulling the levers.

(07-22-2021 03:05 PM)TroyTBoy Wrote:  IMO, this will be a full merger with ESPN pulling the levers.

I mean, how much would ESPN really care about losing Cincy and UCF to FOX? Seems like they win regardless by bringing in Texas and Oklahoma under their umbrella.

If the Big 12 raided the top members in the AAC then they would also get to re-negotiate their contract and pay the remaining AAC teams a lot less.

Lastly, ESPN could get Cincy or WVU back anytime if the ACC ever decided to expand as well. Not that they would really care about any of that either because it would mean bringing ND into the fold.

(07-22-2021 03:34 PM)UCbball21 Wrote:  I mean, how much would ESPN really care about losing Cincy and UCF to FOX? Seems like they win regardless by bringing in Texas and Oklahoma under their umbrella.

If the Big 12 raided the top members in the AAC then they would also get to re-negotiate their contract and pay the remaining AAC teams a lot less.

Lastly, ESPN could get Cincy or WVU back anytime if the ACC ever decided to expand as well. Not that they would really care about any of that either because it would mean bringing ND into the fold.

There will be no "Big 12"... The buzzards are already circling. What's left after the carcass is picked over will be absorbed into the American Conference, where the money people (the WWL) are going to protect their interests.
The length of the American deal is key here. They'll get the Big 12 leftovers for much less than they are getting now. Much less. However, the structure of the AAC, with its teams in most major markets in the Eastern half of the country, gives its structure value to the WWL.
Again, it will be FULL merger - including what will be left of the Big 12 side. The SEC going to 16 changed things concerning juggling larger memberships.

The benefit for the AAC (which not many people are talking about) is the most likely programs that will be left (TCU, BU) will be great for the AAC basketball tournament.

Aresco leaving Providence for Texas and putting the conference tournament in Fort Worth will pay dividends with the new membership structure.

Trade out ECU, Tulsa, Tulane, Temple and Wichita for TT, OSU, TCU, Kansas and BYU.

(07-22-2021 05:03 PM)TroyTBoy Wrote:  The benefit for the AAC (which not many people are talking about) is the most likely programs that will be left (TCU, BU) will be great for the AAC basketball tournament.

Aresco leaving Providence for Texas and putting the conference tournament in Fort Worth will pay dividends with the new membership structure.

You love ESPN. I finally understand what your doing here

(07-22-2021 05:13 PM)swagsurfer11 Wrote:  Trade out ECU, Tulsa, Tulane, Temple and Wichita for TT, OSU, TCU, Kansas and BYU.

Disagree here.

Smaller conference sizes are now going to be the exception. The AAC will grow big. Keeping Philly, New Orleans, Carolina, Oklahoma, and Kansas teams will be more important to the future landscape than you realize.

The membership of the AAC is actually optimal for the remaining Big 12 survival without the tentpoles of UT/OU.

(07-22-2021 05:18 PM)billybobby777 Wrote:  You love ESPN. I finally understand what your doing here

Anyone who has studied realignment of collegiate athletics conferences understands the puppet master ESPN has been in EVERYTHING.

None of this is random.

ESPN's deal with the AAC makes them the biggest voice in the room. These are all great developments for the AAC position.

(07-22-2021 12:34 PM)FrancisDrake Wrote:  

(07-22-2021 12:27 PM)CoastalJuan Wrote:  

(07-22-2021 11:35 AM)TroyTBoy Wrote:  There is no replacing UT/OU and they have NO TV DEAL with the leftovers.

Not sure I buy that. One could argue that their remaining properties are as strong as ours.

Perception though. Do you want to be a conference that got weaker or a conference that got stronger?

(07-22-2021 01:56 PM)Eichorst Wrote:  

(07-22-2021 12:43 PM)TroyTBoy Wrote:  

(07-22-2021 12:27 PM)CoastalJuan Wrote:  Not sure I buy that. One could argue that their remaining properties are as strong as ours.

The only real 'strength' per se is access to TV sets/eyeballs.

Period.

The leftovers in the Big 12 based their strength on playing UT/OU. They are in bad markets and they no longer have the cachet of being in the same standings as those "tent pole" programs. That identity alone was crucial to recruiting... And...

The Big 12 leftovers used to be able to sell their games to networks based on their Home/Away games against OU/UT.

It's significant the AAC and ESPN married into a long term deal. The AAC is already based in large markets and has established itself as an entity without an OU/UT.

If the teams from the AAC & remaining Big 12 do get together.... ESPN will be a BIG FACTOR... and the WWL will be negotiating from the side of the American.

Will Fox outbid ESPN???? Doubtful.

Who is going to bid "Big 12 games" up without UT/OU in the portfolio? Nobody. The value of that property has sunk like a stone. Those schools need life vests. They simply don't have any stability (no TV partner) to be anyone else's life raft.

I see the Sunbelt just announced an ESPN extension. Coupled with ESPN's new UT/OU inventory, there just aren't any windows for the Big 12 leftovers there.

Let's see what ESPN wants in regards to this scenario.

You get it. The Big XII's remaining schools are in trash markets with aging fanbases. I do not envy the ADs of those schools today.

The AAC is (potentially) very well positioned for this next age of CFB.

(07-22-2021 05:03 PM)TroyTBoy Wrote:  The benefit for the AAC (which not many people are talking about) is the most likely programs that will be left (TCU, BU) will be great for the AAC basketball tournament.

Aresco leaving Providence for Texas and putting the conference tournament in Fort Worth will pay dividends with the new membership structure.

(07-22-2021 05:13 PM)swagsurfer11 Wrote:  Trade out ECU, Tulsa, Tulane, Temple and Wichita for TT, OSU, TCU, Kansas and BYU.

Nobody is getting kicked out. Don’t start that- add the remaining B12 schools and you’ve got a darn good league. We already have the 6th best and it will be the 5th best when the B12 dissolves. The AAC is primed to really benefit if OU/Tx actually pull this off- which I still doubt they will. Politics will stop it just like the last time—

If Kansas somehow winds up in the AAC, at least we can stop arguing over who the new UConn is.

(07-22-2021 07:11 PM)Chappy Wrote:  If Kansas somehow winds up in the AAC, at least we can stop arguing over who the new UConn is.

Call them nUConn.

(07-22-2021 07:11 PM)Chappy Wrote:  If Kansas somehow winds up in the AAC, at least we can stop arguing over who the new UConn is.

I think the B1G will go after Kansas. The PAC will go after some Big 12 schools too... this back and forth of who will absorb whom is pointless.
The Big12 will die without UT/OK. Kansas and Baylor could slip off to the B1G, Ok State/TCU to the PAC ...just using examples here.
There wouldn't be 8 schools left...there might be 3-4 schools homeless after the raiding ends...which is why the AAC has to jump in and start enticing schools like Iowa State, Baylor, Texas Tech, Kansas State, TCU, or Baylor the second after UT and OU leave to get schools that would boost the AAC profile, and for us to be seen as a power league.

A full merger orchistrated by ESPN would be an interesting--though unlikely--outcome. It would make some sense--but it cant really happen without the left over Big-12 teams giving up all the left behind exit fees and NCAA credits---so, the only way it could happen is if the AAC merges with the Big12 under the Big12 banner. Unfortunatlely---thats bad for ESPN because they would lose HALF of the newly created conference content to FOX and would essentially end up with less content than they started with. That said, if there is a way to do it where the merger under the AAC banner does not forfeit the right to those exit fees and NCAA credits---it could make sense.

Hope everyone likes **** sandwiches. Regardless of what transpires in the B12, you can't change physics; the AAC will get screwed over much worse then the B12. Everyone here has forgotten that **** rolls down hill and we are at the bottom.

Do you k ow something Troy? I needed positive words here. I love this conference, but then again you all know this… sign the GOR

(07-22-2021 12:45 PM)WhalerFan Wrote:  

(07-22-2021 12:34 PM)FrancisDrake Wrote:  

(07-22-2021 12:27 PM)CoastalJuan Wrote:  

(07-22-2021 11:35 AM)TroyTBoy Wrote:  There is no replacing UT/OU and they have NO TV DEAL with the leftovers.

Not sure I buy that. One could argue that their remaining properties are as strong as ours.

Perception though. Do you want to be a conference that got weaker or a conference that got stronger?

Name recognition is the key. Big 12 is an established brand. AAC is not. That's why I would bet (which is legal now in Connecticut) that the best of the AAC go to the Big 12 not the other way.

Oldsmobile was an established brand. So was Pontiac, and Studebaker, and Hudson, and Nash, and Packard, ad infinitum. The Big XII was also an established brand, until it wasn't. Serious illness set in when Texas A&M, Colorado, Nebraska, and Missouri left. If UT and OU bolt for the SEC, the Big XII is dead.

Climbing in a coffin to rub shoulders with the dead is a fool's errand.

(07-22-2021 05:13 PM)swagsurfer11 Wrote:  Trade out ECU, Tulsa, Tulane, Temple and Wichita for TT, OSU, TCU, Kansas and BYU.

Temple will not be part of any of these conference realignment moves. We get it. But watching the Cincy fans melt down after being rejected again is going to be epic.