(12-08-2020 08:25 PM)lion1983 Wrote:  

(12-08-2020 08:16 PM)army56mike Wrote:  

(12-08-2020 04:46 PM)lion1983 Wrote:  

(12-08-2020 03:38 PM)army56mike Wrote:  

(12-08-2020 02:45 PM)lion1983 Wrote:  So I speculate that the ASUN targets are, EKU, UCA, JSU, Chattanooga, West Florida.
With the 4 Louisiana football schools as associates.

Everything you said minus the LA schools sounds great.

But it would not directly affect Liberty.... so what's the problem?

The only problem is with my attitude toward them. I just have no interest in being associated with those schools at this point. I am sure they are good schools with a desire to succeed. I wish them the best. I just figured the ASUN was aiming for a more eastern footprint.

My scenario was for football only.... FCS... so Liberty would have no real association with them....

I know this isnt the board for this, but Liberty fans help me understand something....

Liberty was put out as an associate membership in the Big South because yall moved football out....

Why does Presbyterian, who just moved football out, not have to go to associate membership?

Seems like a lawsuit waiting to happen to me...

Honestly, it's probably all about the money & politics of it all. Liberty was moving their football team up to FBS, while Presbyterian is just making a lateral or lesser move for football.

If you as an FCS conference have the power to keep more money in conference & keep it away from the FBS team, why not go for it? Add to it that Jerry was really starting to reveal just how much of a jerk he was, & the Big South said fine, you're no longer recognized as an equal here.

Presbyterian, on the other hand, has never been a threat to the stability of the conference, & they need the Big South's money. Add to it that their president is good buddies with the other presidents, so they were willing to look out for one of their own.

Maybe there's more to the story there, but this seems most likely...

(12-09-2020 12:46 AM)army56mike Wrote:  

(12-08-2020 11:31 PM)lion1983 Wrote:  

(12-08-2020 10:39 PM)GE and MTS Wrote:  I don't know, I guess beggars can't be choosers but with all things being equal, I'd rather expand the footprint into an untouched area rather than doubling down on an existing one.

I agree, but that may be easier said than done.

FL - FGCU / Stetson / North Florida / Jacksonville
GA - Kennesaw St.
AL - North Alabama / Jacksonville St.
VA - Liberty
TN - Lipscomb / Chattanooga
KY - Bellarmine / EKU
NC - NCCU / W. Carolina
SC -Charleston So.
AR - C. Arkansas

Alright, so here's a crazy thought: what if our commissioner has been hearing about the WAC expansion in to Texas for some time, & this is why he reached out to Central Arkansas? UCA is less of an awkward fit if Louisiana is also becoming part of the equation.

Again, could be totally crazy, but might also make the puzzle pieces fit.

(12-10-2020 09:37 AM)Keswick_Crusaders_Forever51 Wrote:  

(12-09-2020 12:46 AM)army56mike Wrote:  

(12-08-2020 11:31 PM)lion1983 Wrote:  

(12-08-2020 10:39 PM)GE and MTS Wrote:  I don't know, I guess beggars can't be choosers but with all things being equal, I'd rather expand the footprint into an untouched area rather than doubling down on an existing one.

I agree, but that may be easier said than done.

FL - FGCU / Stetson / North Florida / Jacksonville
GA - Kennesaw St.
AL - North Alabama / Jacksonville St.
VA - Liberty
TN - Lipscomb / Chattanooga
KY - Bellarmine / EKU
NC - NCCU / W. Carolina
SC -Charleston So.
AR - C. Arkansas

Alright, so here's a crzy thought: what if our commissioner has been hearing about the WAC expansion in to Texas for some time, & this is why he reached out to Central Arkansas? UCA is less of an awkward fit if Louisiana is also becoming part of the equation.

Again, could be totally crazy, but might also make the puzzle pieces fit.

That has crossed my mind...

(12-10-2020 09:53 AM)lion1983 Wrote:  

(12-10-2020 09:37 AM)Keswick_Crusaders_Forever51 Wrote:  

(12-09-2020 12:46 AM)army56mike Wrote:  

(12-08-2020 11:31 PM)lion1983 Wrote:  

(12-08-2020 10:39 PM)GE and MTS Wrote:  I don't know, I guess beggars can't be choosers but with all things being equal, I'd rather expand the footprint into an untouched area rather than doubling down on an existing one.

I agree, but that may be easier said than done.

FL - FGCU / Stetson / North Florida / Jacksonville
GA - Kennesaw St.
AL - North Alabama / Jacksonville St.
VA - Liberty
TN - Lipscomb / Chattanooga
KY - Bellarmine / EKU
NC - NCCU / W. Carolina
SC -Charleston So.
AR - C. Arkansas

Alright, so here's a crzy thought: what if our commissioner has been hearing about the WAC expansion in to Texas for some time, & this is why he reached out to Central Arkansas? UCA is less of an awkward fit if Louisiana is also becoming part of the equation.

Again, could be totally crazy, but might also make the puzzle pieces fit.

That has crossed my mind...

Nov 16 tweet from NSUDemonfans Twitter mentions that Northwestern St was in the ASUN before the Southland. Then says Return?

(12-10-2020 09:53 AM)lion1983 Wrote:  

(12-10-2020 09:37 AM)Keswick_Crusaders_Forever51 Wrote:  

(12-09-2020 12:46 AM)army56mike Wrote:  

(12-08-2020 11:31 PM)lion1983 Wrote:  

(12-08-2020 10:39 PM)GE and MTS Wrote:  I don't know, I guess beggars can't be choosers but with all things being equal, I'd rather expand the footprint into an untouched area rather than doubling down on an existing one.

I agree, but that may be easier said than done.

FL - FGCU / Stetson / North Florida / Jacksonville
GA - Kennesaw St.
AL - North Alabama / Jacksonville St.
VA - Liberty
TN - Lipscomb / Chattanooga
KY - Bellarmine / EKU
NC - NCCU / W. Carolina
SC -Charleston So.
AR - C. Arkansas

Alright, so here's a crzy thought: what if our commissioner has been hearing about the WAC expansion in to Texas for some time, & this is why he reached out to Central Arkansas? UCA is less of an awkward fit if Louisiana is also becoming part of the equation.

Again, could be totally crazy, but might also make the puzzle pieces fit.

That has crossed my mind...

Yeah, I wasn't sure if you were saying that or saying that because we've pursued UCA, we should also pursue the LA schools, so I figured I'd throw this one out in case it was the other way around.

Looks like the ASUN will go to divisions...

Just looked at UNAs baseball schedule, we are only playing the northern ASUN schools, with "crossover games" against a couple of Florida schools in Nashville.

So if the expansion happens, we will more than likely have North and South divisions...

Bellarmine, EKU, Liberty, UCA, Lipscomb, UNA in the North

JSU, KSU, UNF, JU, Stetson and FGCU in the South


They could also do division in the Big South football side

ASUN division
EKU, JSU, UCA, UNA, JSU, KSU (RMU)

Big South division
NCA&T, Hampton, Charleston Southern, Campbell, Gardner Webb, (Monmouth)

There is no rule against an FCS conference having a championship game and still playing in the playoffs.

I had no idea the University of New Orleans was public.

(12-12-2020 09:20 PM)army56mike Wrote:  I had no idea the University of New Orleans was public.

Why the intrest?

Somebody mentioned it on the Expansion board.

(12-12-2020 05:38 PM)lion1983 Wrote:  Looks like the ASUN will go to divisions...

Just looked at UNAs baseball schedule, we are only playing the northern ASUN schools, with "crossover games" against a couple of Florida schools in Nashville.

So if the expansion happens, we will more than likely have North and South divisions...

Bellarmine, EKU, Liberty, UCA, Lipscomb, UNA in the North

JSU, KSU, UNF, JU, Stetson and FGCU in the South


They could also do division in the Big South football side

ASUN division
EKU, JSU, UCA, UNA, JSU, KSU (RMU)

Big South division
NCA&T, Hampton, Charleston Southern, Campbell, Gardner Webb, (Monmouth)

There is no rule against an FCS conference having a championship game and still playing in the playoffs.

There's no rule against it, but there's also no time to pull it off unless you forgo a buy week or shorten your regular season by a game in most years. It's one of those things that is not technically a rule in a de jure sense, but it is in a de facto sense.

For years it had been the policy of the SWAC as a conference that their teams are allowed to accept FCS playoff bids if available. But the problem is that their conference title game typically conflicts with the first round, and therefore no team that wins their division of the conference is available to accept a bid, and given that the SWAC is terrible, no team that doesn't win their division is remotely good enough to receive a bid.

Now the SWAC and the MEAC both forgo the playoffs in favor of the Celebration Bowl.

Also, if we're going to have 7 teams on each side of football anyway, why not just be two separate conferences so you can get two automatic bids out of it? You could even have a cross conference scheduling agreement between the two if anyone were really interested in that sort of thing.

(12-13-2020 11:48 AM)eku05 Wrote:  Also, if we're going to have 7 teams on each side of football anyway, why not just be two separate conferences so you can get two automatic bids out of it? You could even have a cross conference scheduling agreement between the two if anyone were really interested in that sort of thing.

That's 6 on one side 7 on the other.

I dont think it would be long before both Monmouth and RMU will go to the Patriot league and ask for football memberships. So the Big South wouldn't have to go to divisions long. Unless more schools were added. In the ASUNs case, if more schools are added, wouldn't be playing football in the ASUN.

(12-13-2020 11:46 AM)eku05 Wrote:  

(12-12-2020 05:38 PM)lion1983 Wrote:  Looks like the ASUN will go to divisions...

Just looked at UNAs baseball schedule, we are only playing the northern ASUN schools, with "crossover games" against a couple of Florida schools in Nashville.

So if the expansion happens, we will more than likely have North and South divisions...

Bellarmine, EKU, Liberty, UCA, Lipscomb, UNA in the North

JSU, KSU, UNF, JU, Stetson and FGCU in the South


They could also do division in the Big South football side

ASUN division
EKU, JSU, UCA, UNA, JSU, KSU (RMU)

Big South division
NCA&T, Hampton, Charleston Southern, Campbell, Gardner Webb, (Monmouth)

There is no rule against an FCS conference having a championship game and still playing in the playoffs.

There's no rule against it, but there's also no time to pull it off unless you forgo a buy week or shorten your regular season by a game in most years. It's one of those things that is not technically a rule in a de jure sense, but it is in a de facto sense.

For years it had been the policy of the SWAC as a conference that their teams are allowed to accept FCS playoff bids if available. But the problem is that their conference title game typically conflicts with the first round, and therefore no team that wins their division of the conference is available to accept a bid, and given that the SWAC is terrible, no team that doesn't win their division is remotely good enough to receive a bid.

Now the SWAC and the MEAC both forgo the playoffs in favor of the Celebration Bowl.

You wouldn't have to use a bye week


You can simply have a championship week the last week of the regular season. Have #1 play #1(championship game) #2 vs #2 and so on.

You would never get ADs and Presidents to go for a system in which teams don't know how many home games they have at the time the season starts. It's a promotional nightmare, it's a fiscal planning nightmare, and it's a season ticket management nightmare.

(12-13-2020 01:00 PM)eku05 Wrote:  You would never get ADs and Presidents to go for a system in which teams don't know how many home games they have at the time the season starts. It's a promotional nightmare, it's a fiscal planning nightmare, and it's a season ticket management nightmare.

They would know how many games... everyone will play that week. You just wouldn't know who until that week.

If you want an extra home game, do good enough to earn it.

(12-13-2020 01:08 PM)lion1983 Wrote:  

(12-13-2020 01:00 PM)eku05 Wrote:  You would never get ADs and Presidents to go for a system in which teams don't know how many home games they have at the time the season starts. It's a promotional nightmare, it's a fiscal planning nightmare, and it's a season ticket management nightmare.

They would know how many games... everyone will play that week. You just wouldn't know who until that week.

If you want an extra home game, do good enough to earn it.

I understand they would know the number of total games, but my point was about home games specifically.

Also, if we're talking about one division with 7 and one with 6 then doesn't at least one team potentially get left out?

But back to my original point...how are you "earning" the home game? if #2 is playing #2 then who has earned it? What is the criteria?

Finally, what I will say in terms of ticket sales is that it's one thing to get somebody to buy season tickets to a preset number of games. But to sell the idea of buying tickets individually to an added on game that, for most teams in the league, would be pretty meaningless is not as easy. Even if you get a home game you may well end up losing out here financially.

(12-13-2020 01:00 PM)eku05 Wrote:  You would never get ADs and Presidents to go for a system in which teams don't know how many home games they have at the time the season starts. It's a promotional nightmare, it's a fiscal planning nightmare, and it's a season ticket management nightmare.

Even years Division A is home, odd years Division B is home.

(12-13-2020 02:38 PM)GE and MTS Wrote:  

(12-13-2020 01:00 PM)eku05 Wrote:  You would never get ADs and Presidents to go for a system in which teams don't know how many home games they have at the time the season starts. It's a promotional nightmare, it's a fiscal planning nightmare, and it's a season ticket management nightmare.

Even years Division A is home, odd years Division B is home.

That could at least potentially work depending on how many cross-divisional games are being scheduled for the regular season. When you play 8 conference games (like we do in the OVC) it doesn't leave as much room for home-and-home series as most of us wish it did.

In a typical season it leaves three games to play with. Often one of those is a game in which we are buying someone out of a return (D2, NAIA, or non-scholarship FCS). We often have to do that because at least one, and often both, of our other non-conference games are on the road against FBS teams. At best, one of our 11 games outside of normally scheduled conference play is part of a home-and-home series.

Now, if you capped regular season conference play at 7 games this could work, but that creates a problem of its own. If, hypothetically we are already playing 6 games in division then that means playing only one across division lines. That would create a quality-of-schedule imbalance within each division based on who that one random cross-division opponent is in a given year.

It would also at least raise the very occasional situation of possibly play two of your 5-6 home games against the same team which is a little odd, but I guess doable.

I suppose the other option would be to have no cross-division games in the regular season and make the final weekend the only time that happens. But if that's the case, I'd probably go back to the idea of making sure you at least 7 teams on both sides (even if an associate is necessary) and just being two separate conferences so that two teams out of the group are getting automatic playoff berths rather than just one.

(12-13-2020 02:55 PM)eku05 Wrote:  

(12-13-2020 02:38 PM)GE and MTS Wrote:  

(12-13-2020 01:00 PM)eku05 Wrote:  You would never get ADs and Presidents to go for a system in which teams don't know how many home games they have at the time the season starts. It's a promotional nightmare, it's a fiscal planning nightmare, and it's a season ticket management nightmare.

Even years Division A is home, odd years Division B is home.

That could at least potentially work depending on how many cross-divisional games are being scheduled for the regular season. When you play 8 conference games (like we do in the OVC) it doesn't leave as much room for home-and-home series as most of us wish it did.

In a typical season it leaves three games to play with. Often one of those is a game in which we are buying someone out of a return (D2, NAIA, or non-scholarship FCS). We often have to do that because at least one, and often both, of our other non-conference games are on the road against FBS teams. At best, one of our 11 games outside of normally scheduled conference play is part of a home-and-home series.

Now, if you capped regular season conference play at 7 games this could work, but that creates a problem of its own. If, hypothetically we are already playing 6 games in division then that means playing only one across division lines. That would create a quality-of-schedule imbalance within each division based on who that one random cross-division opponent is in a given year.

It would also at least raise the very occasional situation of possibly play two of your 5-6 home games against the same team which is a little odd, but I guess doable.

I suppose the other option would be to have no cross-division games in the regular season and make the final weekend the only time that happens. But if that's the case, I'd probably go back to the idea of making sure you at least 7 teams on both sides (even if an associate is necessary) and just being two separate conferences so that two teams out of the group are getting automatic playoff berths rather than just one.

Of course the simple fix would be to give the two others (RMU and Monmouth) incentives to move on. Then you can just have regular conference play.

You either play 11 or 12 games a regular season. In the ASUN division, you would have 5 division games, so that leaves 6 spots. An example of a schedule

EKU 202?

@FBS
Morehead
@FBS
William and Mary
@NCA&T*(CROSS DIVISION)
UNA*
@Campbell*(CROSS DIVISION)
JSU*
KSU*
@UCA*
CHAMPIONSHIP WEEK

On a 12 game year just add another OOC game.

Yeah, that would probably work. I still think you'd get some push back on the uncertainty but maybe not enough to keep it from happening.

I think those 3 v. 3 games and 5 v. 5 games sound fine to those passionate enough to post on a message board, but I bet the actual attendance at them would be fairly low. With that said, if it were predetermined at the start of the season if you would be home or not then at least you could include them in the season ticket package and get sales that way.