(06-13-2020 11:19 AM)LatahCounty Wrote:  

(06-13-2020 06:52 AM)quo vadis Wrote:  But remember, we may not be in fundamental disagreement here. Early on, you suggested that the best course of action might be just to drop football entirely.

Maybe. I love college football and I'd be very sad if Idaho dropped the sport. I'd be happy to keep "wasting" money on FBS football -- after all, the vast majority of it isn't coming out of my pocket. At least there is some theoretical PR upside there even if Idaho will very rarely attain it, and the downside of being a bad FBS team is still a lot higher in Idaho's situation than the downside of being a middling or, God forbid, a bad FCS team.

But FCS is nothing but downside for us unless we become North Dakota State, and we're not going to become North Dakota State. And while you're right that we need to wait to see how every dollar shakes out as an FCS school, we see enough to know that the money situation there isn't going to be significantly better. So I don't know what any of it does to help the university.

That's the real issue-the money is coming out of student's pockets, most of whom have little interest in athletics. And so they are coming out of college with more debt.

(06-13-2020 12:36 PM)bullet Wrote:  

(06-13-2020 11:19 AM)LatahCounty Wrote:  

(06-13-2020 06:52 AM)quo vadis Wrote:  But remember, we may not be in fundamental disagreement here. Early on, you suggested that the best course of action might be just to drop football entirely.

Maybe. I love college football and I'd be very sad if Idaho dropped the sport. I'd be happy to keep "wasting" money on FBS football -- after all, the vast majority of it isn't coming out of my pocket. At least there is some theoretical PR upside there even if Idaho will very rarely attain it, and the downside of being a bad FBS team is still a lot higher in Idaho's situation than the downside of being a middling or, God forbid, a bad FCS team.

But FCS is nothing but downside for us unless we become North Dakota State, and we're not going to become North Dakota State. And while you're right that we need to wait to see how every dollar shakes out as an FCS school, we see enough to know that the money situation there isn't going to be significantly better. So I don't know what any of it does to help the university.

That's the real issue-the money is coming out of student's pockets, most of whom have little interest in athletics. And so they are coming out of college with more debt.

Bless your heart.

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(06-13-2020 12:32 PM)quo vadis Wrote:  

(06-13-2020 12:03 PM)panama Wrote:  

(06-09-2020 10:53 PM)quo vadis Wrote:  

(06-09-2020 10:35 PM)IWokeUpLikeThis Wrote:  

Quote:The football program has seen a loss of about 50 percent in ticket revenue and contributions since the move

And that right there is when this ceased to be a debate.

The president lost his job - rightly so.

Donations and football ticket revenue were peanuts at Idaho before the move to FCS, so how can a half a peanut be grounds for firing the President of the university? That's insane.

And the loss of contributions is churlishness on the part of boosters. They should be ashamed. Really, it's not like when they dropped the quality of the schedule declined much. What's the difference between playing Eastern Washington and Montana (as FCS) and say Coastal Carolina and UNLV as FBS? Nothing.

Because the President deep sixed the program in favor of interests from the city of Boise.

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In favor of "interests of Boise"? Do you have super-secret tapes that prove this?

Look, there's no denying that Idaho FBS was an abject failure. It cost a ton of money and it was stink-it-up on the field. So yes, the President did make a gutsy call in doing what *many* other FBS schools probably should do but none had, drop down to FCS. Kudos to him for pulling the plug on a turkey program.

Now FWIW, I don't see Georgia State in that category. You guys are new to FBS so can are still in the building phase. You might become a very strong FBS program.

But Idaho? Come on. The evidence is overwhelming and over a LONG period of time. There was no non-silly argument for Idaho in FBS.

The difference between Boise State and Idaho is institutional support. Period. The powers that be decided that that FBS football was not important over the objections of their fan base. They could have fixed their facilities and conference situation many years ago and decided to do nothing. It's a sad situation.

Regarding the subject of this thread, I have no idea why GSU is even mentioned. Not with what we have invested in facilities the last 5 years and considering we have been to three recent bowls and best Tennessee very publicly last year.

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(06-13-2020 12:49 PM)panama Wrote:  

(06-13-2020 12:32 PM)quo vadis Wrote:  

(06-13-2020 12:03 PM)panama Wrote:  

(06-09-2020 10:53 PM)quo vadis Wrote:  

(06-09-2020 10:35 PM)IWokeUpLikeThis Wrote:  And that right there is when this ceased to be a debate.

The president lost his job - rightly so.

Donations and football ticket revenue were peanuts at Idaho before the move to FCS, so how can a half a peanut be grounds for firing the President of the university? That's insane.

And the loss of contributions is churlishness on the part of boosters. They should be ashamed. Really, it's not like when they dropped the quality of the schedule declined much. What's the difference between playing Eastern Washington and Montana (as FCS) and say Coastal Carolina and UNLV as FBS? Nothing.

Because the President deep sixed the program in favor of interests from the city of Boise.

Sent from my SM-G975U using Tapatalk

In favor of "interests of Boise"? Do you have super-secret tapes that prove this?

Look, there's no denying that Idaho FBS was an abject failure. It cost a ton of money and it was stink-it-up on the field. So yes, the President did make a gutsy call in doing what *many* other FBS schools probably should do but none had, drop down to FCS. Kudos to him for pulling the plug on a turkey program.

Now FWIW, I don't see Georgia State in that category. You guys are new to FBS so can are still in the building phase. You might become a very strong FBS program.

But Idaho? Come on. The evidence is overwhelming and over a LONG period of time. There was no non-silly argument for Idaho in FBS.

The difference between Boise State and Idaho is institutional support. Period. The powers that be decided that that FBS football was not important over the objections of their fan base. They could have fixed their facilities and conference situation many years ago and decided to do nothing. It's a sad situation.

You're kidding, right? In 2016, while in FBS, Idaho poured $12m in "institutional support", meaning transfers from academics, in to Idaho athletics. What did Boise milk their students for their athletics? $13m, a paltry one million more despite a larger student population.

The real difference between Boise and Idaho was ... fan base. Boise drew 32,000 a game for football, Idaho drew 10,000 a game, and let's face, it probably less. Boise has an FBS-level fan base, Idaho didn't have one. They had whiners who moaned when Idaho dropped to FCS, but these same folks obviously didn't put their money where their mouths were like Boise fans did, or if they did, there were far too few of them.

That's really the story at every football program from Alabama and Ohio State down to FCS - fan bases that support their teams have healthy programs, fan bases that are small and/or do not, don't. It's all up to the fans, not the "institution". Heck here at LSU, the football has ridiculous spaceship locker rooms because there is a wild, rabid, wealthy and numerous Tigers fan base that eagerly pours money in to it. I think they are crazy but that's their business. They support the program.

So any Idaho fan who "objected" to the level of Idaho institutional support for football has some nerve, meaning they basically wanted to put *someone else's* money where their mouths were to stay at FBS, and should instead look in the mirror. What did they expect for Idaho admins to do? Milk academics for $25m a year to cover for their failure to actually support the team? Sheesh.